Originally Posted by LH19
My point being is if I am May's husband and she's pursued me for two years trying to get me to end my affair and I end it and think I am trying and she continues to blow up at me I am eventually going to give up. More of the same behavior that I ran from in the first place.

I don't disagree with you at all. And, I didn't blow up at him... that was kind of my point. I would have before. If he'd yelled at me about a GD spoon I would have given it back at him for being an a-hole and would have seethed about it for the next several hours. Instead, I ... didn't care. I said so. That was it, then I went back to my book.

That being said, I know he feels like he's trying and I'm not recognizing it. I'm thinking on this more, particularly in/re WF's post.

And, also, FWIW, something I've just thought of... this response from me made him think and then cry. I don't believe he came to the right conclusion about why I said what I did, and I think the tears were self-pity rather than anything to do with his own contributions towards our situation. But, the other two responses I would have given in the past-- either saying okay sorry and swallowing some $hit-- which to him just confirms that he was right-- or getting angry in response-- which to him confirms that I'm a b*tch-- aren't where I want to be.

Originally Posted by BluWave
May! I think this is the most honest, clear headed and confident thing Iíve read from you. I love it. I was surprised at the last two postersí reactions. You are holding firm on your boundaries and teaching him what is acceptable and what is not. Because this isnít about a dirty spoon! Thatís not what really matters. The power dynamic in the relationship is slowly shifting, and yes it will be uncomfortable, but itís about time. I do not feel sorry for him, not at all. He needs to be broken of his entitlement and selfishness and it doesnít behoove him for you to allow that to continue.

I guess this is how I feel. I am not going to be yelled at about a dirty spoon. (Or, I can't control whether or not he yells, but I can control how I respond, and I just don't care to respond to the yelling.) I'm sorry. I get it bothers him. (It actually bothers me too, but not enough to be rude about it to my husband.) I want a relationship where if I see an accidentally left dirty spoon I'll think oh no! H missed a dirty spoon when he unloaded the dishwasher! And take care of it without feeling anger or resentment in my heart. I got to this place after a lot of work and I don't want to let it go. (To me, that would be going backwards into M1.0). I want the same from him.

What I think happens in his head (which I am familiar with, because this used to happen to me) is a burst of frustration towards me, GD it, she never looks at the spoons before she puts it away, that makes me so frustrated, etc., and it boils over into yelling at me. I don't like that. WHY should a dirty spoon matter more than my relationship with my spouse? How is the extra second it takes to grab a different one worth yelling at someone? I also understand that that road goes both ways-- I could also take that extra second to check the spoon before it goes into the drawer, because I care about him and I don't want him to feel frustrated. I'm actually okay with doing that. But I'm not going to do it because he yelled at me.

Originally Posted by BluWave
Itís so much easier to step up and be Mr Super Dad and H than to dig deep and work on the M problems. He puts on his cape and he cooks, cleans and buys the most perfect gift (only perfect in his design, and so obviously not perfect for you) and then he expects praise and appreciation ó look what a great guy I am tho!!! ... Thatís the easy stuff. .....You know what I want to see? I want to see a man that wants to see you. I mean really, really see YOU. What do you need? How much has he hurt you? Itís not just about him. All the superness doesnít erase the destruction he has caused. And no, you do not have to tell him this explicitly, you already have. He knows.

He can only fake it until he makes it for so long. He will have to really look at what he has done and explore the whys ó itís hard and itís painful to look inside and do that kind of work. I watched my own H and itís a dark place. I have had to do some of that too.

Blu, yes, yes, yes. He is trying in his way, and I do appreciate it. The AoS, the gifts, etc. And he wants it to erase what he did, I think. He does not want to look at me and *see* me and accept the destructiveness of what he did. Maybe he can't. Maybe he will be able to with time. I don't think he can, at this moment, because he can't yet face what that means. He says he is working on all of this in IC, why he did what he did. I don't get the sense he's digging deep, yet, getting to the deep dark corners. I guess where I am right now is... maybe he will get there. I hope that he does, very much. Maybe he won't. Then I have some hard decisions in front of me. But I've let go (and need to continue to let go, sometimes, daily) of any expectation that this will happen today or tomorrow or next week. It will or it won't, and there will be a point if I'll be done if it doesn't happen.

Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs
9/20 - present: R and piecing