Originally Posted by Vapo
This will not be revealed just now and not easily. You have to let go of the need to know why. In all likelihood you did plenty of thing wrong, probably some very wrong. You have to dig inside and own up to your mistakes. Then forgive yourself and start working on yourself to make a better you.

This is a chicken and egg problem. I've asked elsewhere here on DB what the men did when they did their 180s, and how they came to those realizations, and I'm not getting any answers back. I don't want to change how I think I should change; I want to change those things that others see about me. Much different.

One of my new best friends after my WAW left was a man married four times. Four times! He is now a 70-something retired doctor, and he was married three times through age 40. It's not surprising, how many gals want to have a doctor for a husband?

He was able to rationalize away why the first, and then the second, marriages didn't work, didn't last more than 5-10 years. But when the third started falling apart, he was in serious crisis. He knew it was he himself, what was wrong with him? So after his third divorce was final, he and his 3rd ex went into couples counseling together. Finally, he got an unvarnished view of himself, not in a mirror but through the lens of someone who was perhaps incompatible but nevertheless could tell him how we was, not how he perceived he was.

It changed everything. He got married for a fourth time a few years later, to a much different woman than previously; he also now knew what he was doing wrong. He's been married 30 years and he is very happy.

So this was an inspiring story for me. Will my ex ever agree to that? I don't know. But I am logical man and hearing her perspective -- finally -- is something of great interest to me, even if it's colored by her anger.

Originally Posted by Vapo
Originally Posted by tom_h
So there is a lot of ground to plough. I am Christian man, I am commanded to forgive, and I have. I was clear about that before the end of the second month to her, in writing. Yet, forgiveness does NOT mean I take her back! It just means I never hate, and let go of any anger and hurt. In my case, I just felt searing pain. I loved her too much to be angry. But is that love dead? But would I take her back? She is not the person I once knew, and the chances, at this time, would be very very small.
See, this is what I have a problem with. You call yourself a Christian man, yet you cannot wait to date other women. What part of :"In sickness and in health, for better or for worse..." did you not understand?!? This is the worse part, in case you are wondering. "What therefore God hath joined together, let not man put asunder". You are married and it is time to start behaving as one.

Vapo, you seem hung up on this. I'm not married anymore (technically I am but the divorce is almost final). That marriage vow is a human, earthly vow, but man is fallen and oftentimes, 50% in the USA, man does put marriage asunder anyway. Merely because the vow exists, it does not mean that married Christians are immune to crisis, sin, and failure. The Bible frowns on divorce but does not forbid it.

As for "acting like a married man," how can I? She left. She won't talk. She's checked out. She's fighting tooth and nail using lawyers. If I walked around claiming to still be her husband, not only would people look at me askance but I wouldn't be following the principles here on DB to, basically, move on.

Think about it for a minute. My choices at this stage are to choose to be single for a long time or forever, or to explore, slowly and carefully, friendships and other relationships with women. I will probably pursue the latter. I do believe I was made for connection with a woman. That doesn't mean I'm on a quest to bed as many gals as I can before I turn 60; I wasn't even like that in my 20s! I didn't give my heart away easily when I met my wife 30 years ago, and I won't do it this time either.

Dating that other woman was too soon, I now realize, and I learned something important about myself, now that I'm single and much older. No one could possibly say that, after a painful divorce, a man shouldn't spend some time getting about so as to not make a second mistake choosing a mate.