Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 1 of 11 1 2 3 10 11
#2944431 03/19/23 06:43 PM
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
D
DnJ Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
Originally Posted by MikeP
So much for the good frame of mind.

What’s going on Mike?


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Just reflecting on our past. Lots of things I'm realizing weren't good. BD one year anniversary coming up has gotten me thinking about where are now versus BD. I'm starting to question what it is I'm really fighting for. A marriage that wasn't what I thought it was. I was probably as unhappy as W for many years and just kept my head down, doing what I thought was right. I do remember always thinking things would get better if I just stick it out. She will realize I love her and eventually come around. Maybe we should throw in the towel and move on. We both spent a lot of years making the other unhappy. I see how she treats her biological family versus how she always treated me. There's a difference and that difference is stark. Don't take that as she was terrible to me. I just never felt like she was on my team, for lack of a better way to put it. Without a lot of work on both our parts nothing will change and she shows no interest in putting in the work. Maybe she's smarter or more realistic than I am. Not looking for sympathy, not really feeling down. Just thinking about a lot of new things that I've possibly been avoiding.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
D
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
MikeP I swear you read my mind and wrote this about me. They are the reasons why we are now working on ourselves to become better people. To stop sleep walking, wake up, and get a life. with or without them in the end, they gave us a gift.


M:51 W:43
T:17 M:15
S:13 D11
10/2022 BD/IHS
03/2023 W moves out
2 members like this: Ready2Change, MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
It's like I'm being friend zoned. Lots of "love you", no intimacy initiation like before. Happy despite the stress from her parents. Just a feeling that she's happy hanging out at the end of the day for an hour or so and then off to bed. Maybe it's just me. Not dwelling on it, just posting how I feel. I remember LH19 talking about them sliding back into the old R. I don't want her to do that. I need us to eventually talk about some unresolved issues and work on our problems. Not today or tomorrow but at some point. I have been GALing better. Also spending time with d13 working on softball now that bball is over and we're into sb season.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Any thoughts on doing a R temperature check when BD 1 year anniversary gets here in a little over a week? For awhile I had set that day as an unofficial deadline, time to move on if nothing had changed. Not sure that’s the right move now. Is it a mistake to start a conversation about R status at least?


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
Hey Mike,
I have no idea but I really hope for the best for you.I think it makes sense to gain perspectives from this group. Can’t remember, are you also getting IC?
I’m thinking for me a temp check would not be the play at this stage but rather me continuing on in the other direction, moving forward, really GAL, detaching, no pursuit and zero expectations of W.


M:52 W: 51
T:27 M:25
D26 S24 S21 D20
BD:2022
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
Originally Posted by MikeP
Any thoughts on doing a R temperature check when BD 1 year anniversary gets here in a little over a week? For awhile I had set that day as an unofficial deadline, time to move on if nothing had changed. Not sure that’s the right move now. Is it a mistake to start a conversation about R status at least?
Let’s play out a likely scenario if you temp check her.
MP: W it’s been x amount of time since you have returned home and I do not feel we have the same goals moving forward in our marriage.
W: what do you mean I’m home aren’t I.
MP: yes but I don’t feel like you are all in trying to repair our marriage.
W: I am trying but I can’t help they way I feel.

This is likely how it will play out. What would be your final response? If it’s nothing then no sense bring it up. If it’s something then I would like to hear what your response would be.

2 members like this: MikeP, Rockon
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Boat14
Originally Posted by MikeP
Any thoughts on doing a R temperature check when BD 1 year anniversary gets here in a little over a week? For awhile I had set that day as an unofficial deadline, time to move on if nothing had changed. Not sure that’s the right move now. Is it a mistake to start a conversation about R status at least?
Let’s play out a likely scenario if you temp check her.
MP: W it’s been x amount of time since you have returned home and I do not feel we have the same goals moving forward in our marriage.
W: what do you mean I’m home aren’t I.
MP: yes but I don’t feel like you are all in trying to repair our marriage.
W: I am trying but I can’t help they way I feel.

This is likely how it will play out. What would be your final response? If it’s nothing then no sense bring it up. If it’s something then I would like to hear what your response would be.

Yeah, you’re right. In the beginning I set 1 year as a “deadline” for myself. I was very angry then and not thinking correctly. I suppose I’m being impatient. Like I mentioned before, I don’t want her to just ease back into our old R and sweep everything under the rug so to speak. Patience is difficult. Thanks.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Rockon
Hey Mike,
I have no idea but I really hope for the best for you.I think it makes sense to gain perspectives from this group. Can’t remember, are you also getting IC?
I’m thinking for me a temp check would not be the play at this stage but rather me continuing on in the other direction, moving forward, really GAL, detaching, no pursuit and zero expectations of W.

Haven’t been to IC since I retired in January. Money is a little tighter. I’ve been thinking I need to start back. Thanks.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
1 member likes this: Rockon
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
I was learning from someone recently in a situation like ours who said they weren’t getting IC because of the expense. Budget was tight and they hadn’t thought about using funds from their emergency account. Then they realized their situation was an emergency and required appropriate resources. Resonated


M:52 W: 51
T:27 M:25
D26 S24 S21 D20
BD:2022
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
Originally Posted by MikeP
Originally Posted by Boat14
Originally Posted by MikeP
Any thoughts on doing a R temperature check when BD 1 year anniversary gets here in a little over a week? For awhile I had set that day as an unofficial deadline, time to move on if nothing had changed. Not sure that’s the right move now. Is it a mistake to start a conversation about R status at least?
Let’s play out a likely scenario if you temp check her.
MP: W it’s been x amount of time since you have returned home and I do not feel we have the same goals moving forward in our marriage.
W: what do you mean I’m home aren’t I.
MP: yes but I don’t feel like you are all in trying to repair our marriage.
W: I am trying but I can’t help they way I feel.

This is likely how it will play out. What would be your final response? If it’s nothing then no sense bring it up. If it’s something then I would like to hear what your response would be.

Yeah, you’re right. In the beginning I set 1 year as a “deadline” for myself. I was very angry then and not thinking correctly. I suppose I’m being impatient. Like I mentioned before, I don’t want her to just ease back into our old R and sweep everything under the rug so to speak. Patience is difficult. Thanks.
I don’t necessarily think you are being impatient. I am saying that until you get to the point where your current situation isn’t working for you anymore and are ready to take action you should continue to focus on self improvement and GAL like a madman.

Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
Originally Posted by MikeP
Any thoughts on doing a R temperature check when BD 1 year anniversary gets here ...Is it a mistake to start a conversation about R status at least?
Do not initiate R talks until you are firmly in piecing. You are not in piecing. If she initiates, you STFU and listen and validate her emotional states.


So you have been at this for a year. Hopefully you have been making progressive changes to your behavior and the way you interact with women. This should carry over to your W noticing. How would you rate yourself on attractiveness last year? This year?


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
didn't you just tell Rock you were living your life and not focusing on your sitch???

so have you really been working on yourself, changing your behavioral patterns, trying to be a different and better man than the one she BD'd or have you just learned how to stop thinking about her??

the former is standing, the latter is just waiting.

you have nothing to discuss.

this is just another day on the calendar as far as she's concerned, and needs to be the same for you also.

take yourself out to dinner and a movie.

you'll be in better company.


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
2 members like this: MikeP, Dats000
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 604
Likes: 251
K
Member
Offline
Member
K
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 604
Likes: 251
Quote
Any thoughts on doing a R temperature check when BD 1 year anniversary gets here ...Is it a mistake to start a conversation about R status at least?

It’s always a mistake to start or participate in any relationship discussion post BD.

If your partner is thinking of wanting to try again, you’ll DEFINITELY know about it.

If they’re not being obvious about wanting to try again, there’s your answer - either they don’t want to, or they’re not ready to.

In terms of the 1 year timeline/boundary, that was for you - not for her. We don’t set boundaries like “if they don’t want back in after 1 year then I’ll file” as a means to controlling or forcing our spouse.

You chose to stand for 1 year, and now your 1 year is approaching. You choose what you want. Either you decide it’s worth waiting longer, or you decide you can’t be in limbo any more and you file.

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Thanks for the replies. I knew what the consensus would be, guess I just needed to hear it. When I originally decided that a year would be enough and I would end it, I obviously wasn't thinking correctly and was angry. A lot. I really thought then that one year was the magic number and I wouldn't want to continue in limbo. That was silly, just my anger controlling my emotions.

R2C-I have made changes for sure. My attitude is different, more confident. I'm slowly changing my wardrobe. I know that's just a material thing. The change is important because I had become the sweat pants and hoodie guy. 99% of the time that was my outfit in cool weather. Trying to dress like an adult now which helps with my confidence and how people see me. I'm more assertive in our R. Not overbearing or a jerk, just stopped letting her take the lead all the time.

Bttrfly-I really am doing the things I described to Rock. I guess this one year thing was still stuck in my head. I really thought at this point I wouldn't want to continue in limbo. I know that I was fooling myself. I genuinely think I am standing, not waiting. I am definitely a better man than I was at BD. W has commented a few times on the changes I've made. I just say thanks and change the convo without trying to pat myself on the back. I do know that if our R doesn't work out I will be a much better partner if ever enter into another R. I see things I've done wrong that W hasn't even pointed out. I'm trying to be more self aware. I had planned on spending the day walking and hiking at a local place I've been visiting since I was a kid. Thousands of acres and miles of trails. One of my favorite places in the world. I'll let the day come and go. Spending the day outdoors always does me good.

Kind-I wasn't planning on using that day for an ultimatum. I thought I would just move on if things hadn't changed yet. I was wrong. I can continue on as we are. Things are incrementally changing. Sometimes I think too much. Thanks for your response.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
D
DnJ Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
Hello Mike

Standing really starts when one is healed and strong enough to stand down. Until then, standing is kind of one’s default position.

We all start out standing for our spouse and marriage. In time that gets old. Our marriages are in limbo or like myself, divorced. Our spouse hasn’t really turned around and not much reconciliation ongoing. One’s standing shifts towards their convictions. One begins to stand for themselves.

Standing for me. Those default “reasons” being evaporated or no longer felt give rise to questions of why and what is one doing. Concurrently, one usually is organizing their beliefs and values. Strengthening those which serve, crafting ones they aspire to, and altering or discarding those which do not serve. One finds themselves standing for their convictions rather than a piece of paper or memories of what and who once was.

Standing for me, becomes focused on current time rather than past glories and possible future times. “Waiting” for an awakening vs focusing on and living your best life. It’s being in the present and becoming the best version of one’s self.

Interestingly, timelines disappear. Expectations fade. And hope lives. And not for what one likely thinks; those defaults no longer being in the fore. Even limbo fades away as one embraces their stand, beliefs, and life.

When standing becomes a choice, much strength is gained. To uphold one’s deepest convictions. That is the landscape of faith and values. When one’s spiritual, intellectual, emotional, and physical paths are all side by side; when one’s journeys along these individual paths all line up; there is such peace and contentment.

Stand for MikeP! He is a pretty awesome guy, and very much worth it!

D


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by DnJ
Hello Mike

Standing really starts when one is healed and strong enough to stand down. Until then, standing is kind of one’s default position.

We all start out standing for our spouse and marriage. In time that gets old. Our marriages are in limbo or like myself, divorced. Our spouse hasn’t really turned around and not much reconciliation ongoing. One’s standing shifts towards their convictions. One begins to stand for themselves.

Standing for me. Those default “reasons” being evaporated or no longer felt give rise to questions of why and what is one doing. Concurrently, one usually is organizing their beliefs and values. Strengthening those which serve, crafting ones they aspire to, and altering or discarding those which do not serve. One finds themselves standing for their convictions rather than a piece of paper or memories of what and who once was.

Standing for me, becomes focused on current time rather than past glories and possible future times. “Waiting” for an awakening vs focusing on and living your best life. It’s being in the present and becoming the best version of one’s self.

Interestingly, timelines disappear. Expectations fade. And hope lives. And not for what one likely thinks; those defaults no longer being in the fore. Even limbo fades away as one embraces their stand, beliefs, and life.

When standing becomes a choice, much strength is gained. To uphold one’s deepest convictions. That is the landscape of faith and values. When one’s spiritual, intellectual, emotional, and physical paths are all side by side; when one’s journeys along these individual paths all line up; there is such peace and contentment.

Stand for MikeP! He is a pretty awesome guy, and very much worth it!


D

Maybe you should write your own DBing book 😁 You definitely put into words what others can’t. Thank you. You’re correct in that I need to stand for myself. Never quite thought about it that way. Maybe it’s been said by others but didn’t click. I’ve thought more about waiting vs standing and think I’ve been doing some of both. Thanks Bttrfly for making me realize that. I think I am focusing too much on the future. I think I’m afraid that we’re just cruising along with no end to limbo in sight. I don’t stress and worry like before however, it would be nice to be comfortable again with a loving partner that I feel secure with. Things are better for sure between us, probably better than things have been for years. I’m trying to plan my post retirement life and I just have to plan short term for us, long term for me and my children. I know some of my posts seem contradictory. Sometimes I post in the moment without really thinking things through. That’s why I like this forum so much. I can vent and get feedback. Glad to be given grace for my mistakes and being held accountable as well. Thanks again. The feeling that things are getting better for us also makes me nervous if I’m being honest. Trusting the process is hard, as it it should be. It’s too easy to just be angry and not take accountability. If the process was easy we wouldn’t change or grow. As others have said, I wish this never happened but I know in the end I will come out a better person and partner. I already am better, just not the best I can be.

Last edited by DnJ; 03/23/23 08:41 PM. Reason: Corrected typo.

M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
Standing. Interesting concept. Many different views on it.

I cannot and will not stand for a marriage when my spouse is married to someone else. This makes zero sense to me.

I suppose I have the choice, as do we all, to stand by my wedding vows or not.

Wedding vows, by their very nature, are an exchange between two people whose intention is to form a partnership.

A business partnership does not continue once the legal entity is dissolved, therefore it makes zero sense to me to stand by wedding vows for a partnership where I'm the solo participant.

I did not choose to end my marriage.

I did not cheat or break my vows while our marriage was intact, or even during our very long separation.

Why should I be denied companionship now that my divorce has been over and done with for over 6 years?

This makes zero sense to me.

This is not being fair to myself, given that I did all in my power to save my marriage, both before BD and after.

This is not living the life I want to live. I've always wanted a family and a partnership. I'm to be denied that because of the behavior and decisions made by the weakest link in the chain - my MLC exh ??? I don't think so.

If you want to look at the religious aspect of the wedding vows, I've already talked to clergy about that. I have clergy's blessing to date. Clearly defined lines of no hanky-panky per the priest, otherwise I will be guilty of committing adultery. We also discussed annulment, and whether or not there's just cause for that in my case (there could very well be), with advice being don't seek one until or unless you get serious about someone and want to get married again. How I choose to act or not act on the religious aspect is, in my mind, separate from standing.

Again, standing is an interesting concept with many different viewpoints/opinions on its definition.

Best to develop your own when the time comes.

Last edited by bttrfly; 03/23/23 07:32 PM.

M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Bttrfly, are you divorced? I'm sorry I don't remember off the top of my head. I do agree with you. If we were to divorce and she remarried I don't think there would be anything to stand for at that point. If W were to start up with the om or someone else I would be done as well at this point. Not saying we couldn't reconcile in the future, just not going through it again. I guess that is a boundary for me. I asked if you are divorced because of your statement about committing adultery. I've never been a religious person so bear with my ignorance. Thanks.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
See my signature.
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16 Merry Christmas. RME

Yep. Divorced.

From a religious perspective (Catholic), if I slept with another man that is considered adultery, even if I legally married him first.

Kinda strange, coming from an organization that has covered up so many horrific scandals in the past 20 years, but priests are people too, and fallible.

I think the best course of action regarding standing and for how long, is to sit with your own personal sitch, do a deep dive and decide what does and does not make sense to you, as an individual.

It's between you, your conscious and the God of your understanding.

That's my take.


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 28,295
Likes: 112
job Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 28,295
Likes: 112
Mike,

So, the one year anniversary is coming up....what are you planning to do on that day? I would suggest that you have something planned and make sure it is something that you are going to enjoy doing. Toss the calendar out...you are watching it too closely.

As for temperature checks...leave them at the door. Do not sit there watching and waiting to see if she'll wake up. The old saying "a watched pot never boils" is so very true when it comes to situations such as ours. The best thing you can do is just leave them be and continue moving forward. Standing and moving forward is not sitting there and waiting. You've made a lot of progress and I know that this is frustrating as heck because she treats you like a friend at times.

Also, continue to make changes in your life. The changes have to be for you and must become permanent. If you are making the changes just because of something she has said, it will not work.

You, and only you, will know when you have had enough and want to file. For now, I don't think you are ready to do so. I think you still have a lot of hope and determination to continue standing. Do not allow others to sway you from your path.

Continue moving forward. Live your life to the fullest and enjoy today for it is a present. The future will be revealed when it is ready. No one can change the past. All we can do is learn from the past and continue to move forward.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
Originally Posted by MikeP
You’re correct in that I need to stand for myself.
Never quite thought about it that way. Maybe it’s been said by others but didn’t click.
YES

DnJ did not invent that idea but he is absolutely correct that this is the thing to do.

How you make all that look is really up to you.

One of my friends that used to post here was divorced for quite a while and I just learned the he has now remarried his ex-w. I have to say that really surprised me.
So you never know how the story is going to turn out.

Keep moving forward for you.


Me-70, D37,S36
2 members like this: job, MikeP
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
So in my family, no divorces until the 1980s.

Mom's side: 5 divorces, all my generation. One cousin is divorced twice and on wife #3.

Dad's side:

Divorce #1: My Uncle's wife had a MLC and kicked him out 2 weeks before their 25th wedding anniversary. They remained apart for about 15 years. Attended my wedding together in '94. Ended up living together the last decade of their lives. Go figure.

Divorce #2: my cousin's husband cheated on her - divorced at 11 months. annulled actually

Divorce #3: My cousin. This is interesting. He and wife #1 divorced. He much later married wife #2 ... and they also divorced in due course. And married wife #3 (Who is actually wife #1) ... and divorced her a second time. And married wife #4 (who again, is now wife #1 and 3) only to have that blow up some years later and they are now divorced. Yes. He married the same woman 3x. Turns out she had a problem with alcohol. Couldn't stay sober for the long haul. Really sad. If she maintained her sobriety, I'd bet $$$ they'd still be together


Divorce #4: Another cousin ... elder brother to the one who married the same woman 3x

Divorce #5: Another cousin, their sister ...

No idea what was going on there - three of the four kids got divorced. My uncle and aunt were very happily married for 50 years ending in his passing from cancer/stroke and complications due to chemo.

For context, I have 29 first cousins, all but two married.

I had 12 aunts and uncles ...

Last edited by bttrfly; 03/23/23 08:26 PM.

M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
For clarification: I'm not advocating you stop standing. (and really, is it necessary for me to have to clarify this? And yes, taken from the passive aggressive tone of previous posters, it apparently is. Getting really very tired of that. No need to wonder why I and others choose NOT to post here as much any more).

So Mike, I am saying that it's an individual choice when and if to stop standing. And yes, you stand because that's what makes sense to you. You do something else when standing no longer makes sense to you. The decision to stand is about you, but I don't understand standing when the ex is married to someone else. I don't need to understand it, but I'll still say it again, that makes zero sense to me, so I'm not doing it. If someone feels otherwise, more power to them. It's a free country, for the time being at least.

Your sitch has a lot of positives. The date on the calendar is just a number. Again, take yourself to a movie or out to dinner or do something fun. Keep the focus on you. Make the changes for you. Anything you get from w is a bonus.

Others will tell you their stories about when they decided to stop standing or if they still are standing, but in all cases, it's a very personal decision. The only advice I give you or anyone else is to do a very deep dive into your own belief system and into how you want to spend the rest of your life before you make a decision to stay or go. You will absolutely know the right answer for yourself.


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by bttrfly
For clarification: I'm not advocating you stop standing. (and really, is it necessary for me to have to clarify this? And yes, taken from the passive aggressive tone of previous posters, it apparently is. Getting really very tired of that. No need to wonder why I and others choose NOT to post here as much any more).

So Mike, I am saying that it's an individual choice when and if to stop standing. And yes, you stand because that's what makes sense to you. You do something else when standing no longer makes sense to you. The decision to stand is about you, but I don't understand standing when the ex is married to someone else. I don't need to understand it, but I'll still say it again, that makes zero sense to me, so I'm not doing it. If someone feels otherwise, more power to them. It's a free country, for the time being at least.

Your sitch has a lot of positives. The date on the calendar is just a number. Again, take yourself to a movie or out to dinner or do something fun. Keep the focus on you. Make the changes for you. Anything you get from w is a bonus.

Others will tell you their stories about when they decided to stop standing or if they still are standing, but in all cases, it's a very personal decision. The only advice I give you or anyone else is to do a very deep dive into your own belief system and into how you want to spend the rest of your life before you make a decision to stay or go. You will absolutely know the right answer for yourself.

Thanks bttrfly. No need to clarify, I understood what you were saying. Please feel free to post on my thread no matter what you have to say. I like honesty, period. I don't have to like the message, just know that I will always appreciate it. I miss LH and Mach, they were usually blunt and to the point as well. I appreciate everyone's input no matter the delivery. My heart says that I will stand for a long, long time provided there is no evidence of another A. You are correct in that my sitch does have a lot of positives. I feel stupid sometimes posting about my sitch when others have it so much worse. It doesn't change what I've gone through though. Need to count my blessings and remain positive. My plan for BD is to spend the day hiking. There's a local place I've been visiting since I was a little kid, it's my fav place in the world to be honest. Thousands of acres of beautiful forest and trails. I go there a lot. Thanks for your help and please keep steering me in the right direction, I appreciate it.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
1 member likes this: Dats000
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by job
Mike,

So, the one year anniversary is coming up....what are you planning to do on that day? I would suggest that you have something planned and make sure it is something that you are going to enjoy doing. Toss the calendar out...you are watching it too closely.

As for temperature checks...leave them at the door. Do not sit there watching and waiting to see if she'll wake up. The old saying "a watched pot never boils" is so very true when it comes to situations such as ours. The best thing you can do is just leave them be and continue moving forward. Standing and moving forward is not sitting there and waiting. You've made a lot of progress and I know that this is frustrating as heck because she treats you like a friend at times.

Also, continue to make changes in your life. The changes have to be for you and must become permanent. If you are making the changes just because of something she has said, it will not work.

You, and only you, will know when you have had enough and want to file. For now, I don't think you are ready to do so. I think you still have a lot of hope and determination to continue standing. Do not allow others to sway you from your path.

Continue moving forward. Live your life to the fullest and enjoy today for it is a present. The future will be revealed when it is ready. No one can change the past. All we can do is learn from the past and continue to move forward.

Thanks Job. The friend thing is annoying at times, better than being enemies though. You are correct, I'm not ready to file. I will continue on and see where it goes. The only changes I've made because of things she has said are related to how I interact with her. I'm trying to make the changes now that should have been made years ago for me to be a better, happier person. Thanks again.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Cadet
Originally Posted by MikeP
You’re correct in that I need to stand for myself.
Never quite thought about it that way. Maybe it’s been said by others but didn’t click.
YES

DnJ did not invent that idea but he is absolutely correct that this is the thing to do.

How you make all that look is really up to you.

One of my friends that used to post here was divorced for quite a while and I just learned the he has now remarried his ex-w. I have to say that really surprised me.
So you never know how the story is going to turn out.

Keep moving forward for you.

Thanks Cadet. Moving forward and staying positive. Making changes for me. Seems pretty straight forward, easy to get off track though. Thanks again.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
2 members like this: Rockon, Dats000
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Hey Mike....

Some good points raised, and things YOU should be thinking about.....

Standing VS. waiting....


For me, standing was about taking that hard look into the mirror and figuring out what I didn't like about myself....

De-constructing and defining who I was when the lights went out, and making strides to never be that old asshat again...

Taking the time to actually care about who I was as a Father, Friend, Husband, Partner, Son, Lover, and Man.

Working through the hardest time of my life, while NEVER let it define who I was. Learning what Love meant to me, how I felt loved, how I show love, how to communicate, and defining what my vows meant to me. Eventually embracing that my vows actually had zero to do with my (then) wife.

Waiting to me, means that we get to a place (this place in many situations) and place the blame on something, be it MLC, WAS, whatever it is, and we soapbox that THAT is the root of all of our problems. We continue on, and simply live a very similar life to what we once had, (and our spouse walked away from) without ever looking at OUR role in this. Because if we blame someone else, then we get to be the victim and eventually a martyr even though we had REAL issues that we dismissed because of our ego/pride/whatever.

It's easy to read a book, read some veteran posters, learn to wax poetically without making any real changes and soapbox your path, IF you only want to be as deep as the shallow end of the kiddie pool. Your quest should be to go deeper in yourself, and accept that the journey of "Mike" is for Mike, and ONLY Mike.

It's easy to sit back and think that this other person is the cause of all of your marital problems, and blame him for them. When in actuality, things probably weren't going well before him, which led her to him....what are THOSE things ? The deeper things that made her think that having an affair was a better choice than Mike ??



It takes real courage to make changes in the face of a battle.....which reminds me of some posts a few years ago from a dear friend ....

He struggled mightily with his stand, and defining what his stand should look like......

I wanna put some of his words out there for you...

What an amazing f%king dude he is......


Quote
I can only say that this journey up to now has been the most difficult thing in my life and the most amazing.

I am to the point where I have battled the questions and doubts.

And have grown a great deal and I start this phase after the six months I have been here with the goal to be

A man in full. The man I aspire to be.

A put this down for me and anyone who may learn from these words.


As always thank you for listening...

Martyr-
1 : a person who voluntarily suffers death as the penalty of witnessing to and refusing to renounce a religion
2 : a person who sacrifices something of great value and especially life itself for the sake of principle
3.Victim especially : a great or constant sufferer <a martyr to asthma all his life

To be a martyr there has to be someone applying suffering.

Who is this in the LBS's journey?
At first we think it is our spouse.
We suffer because our spouse is doing something to us. Or doing something other than we want them to do.
We have pain and we suffer and we continue this only if we stay. So why be a martyr?

Why not just leave and then we will be a martyr no longer. But the pain remains. We walk away with all those arrows sticking out of us.

But we are no longer a martyr right? Why would we want to be with someone who does not want to be with us?

Only a weak person or a martyr would subject themselves to that. If you take this exit you find a lot of people waiting for you on the off ramp ready to validate that you made the right choice.
You stood up for your own self respect by running away from the person who inflicted the damage to it. And you move on.

BUT

What now? We still hurt. We still have questions. We don't understand why someone who is supposed to love us can treat us this way.

Are we unlovable? We have to find some other person to validate that we are lovable. That we have self respect. So we move on to the next person to trade our love for validation and self respect.

Because we have learned and have confirmed to ourselves that love really doesn't mean what we want it to mean. And our vows really don't hold any value for us because they didn't hold any value to our spouse. If it did then our spouse would have done what they were supposed to do.

So a good idea would to have a card made that you can present to any potential mate

------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted By: Full Marital Disclosure Card
I am looking for validation from you for all my hopes and fears and if you can't fulfill that then I will move on. And I will only love you as long as you behave the way I think you should and give me what I need. If you get confused and scared and act like you don't love me anymore then I will leave because I measure my self respect based on how you treat me.
--------------------------------------------------------

The longer we stay in our marriage the more people think we are a victim, a doormat, a martyr to the marriage. We believe this because we do not know who we are really. We have lost ourselves in our marriage and in self doubt because of the crisis in our life.

So we run away and confirm to ourselves that we are victims and confirm others assessment of us. We run further away from the path to find ourselves. To know who we are. Because when we choose this who we are is what others perceive us to be and when we believe that then we will always be beholden to others for our SELF. We will be defined by others, and live with self doubt, unless we understand otherwise.

We will understand otherwise because it will happen again and again until we do.

Or

We walk further down the path. We detach. We understand that what our spouse is doing is not to us. It is because of their fears and insecurities. It is because in part the way we have behaved. It is because most of all what THEY feel inside.

We understand that we have no control over this.

We set boundaries to protect ourselves and our family.
We don't fully understand why we are walking down this path. We still doubt why we are since we don't understand why our spouse is still making these choices. And we think we will be validated for all the self doubt we still harbor if our spouse comes back. If we could get that to happen then we would be ok.

Time goes on. Our friends and others who have experienced this question why we are still doing this. Why would you want to be with someone who clearly doesn't want to be with you? It is their choice and not about you but why would you want to stay in this because it still is causing you pain.

Why is it still causing you pain? Because you feel still feel that your worth is dependent on your spouse.
And you are still a doormat.

What are we missing?

We all want to feel loved. We think about it, hope for it, fantasize about it, go to great lengths to achieve it, and feel that our lives are incomplete without it. The lack of unconditional love is the cause of most of our anger and confusion.

We learned that love was conditional, that we had to get it from the people around us with our words and behavior. And that is how we perceive it when it is given. We give when expect to get it.



------------------------------------------------------
Originally Posted By: someone other than me
The instant we do anything at all to win the approval or respect of other people with what we say, what we do, how we look we are paying for the attention and affection we receive, and we can't feel genuinely loved.
--------------------------------------------------------

Isn't our marriage based on this? Isn't this where it derailed? Isn't this why we still feel we have to get our spouse back? Otherwise we ARE what we fear we are UNLOVABLE.

How do we need to be loved?

At this point in your journey it is still about how you need to be treated (loved) and yourself worth and respect is still dependent on your spouse and others.

We may decide to leave at this point because of the long suffering we have endured at the hands of our spouse and predicament. If we leave now we confirm our ignorance of what love means and confirm that to our spouse that your love was not real but dependent and conditional.

You confirm again all the self loathing your spouse feels inside because the person that is supposed to love them hasn't and won't and never will.

We then begin to understand

We yearn for a deeper answer. We crave knowledge that has so far been unattainable.

We want to know the mystery of love. The mystery of our marriage. To know ourselves.

To remove self doubt. To know ourselves. To know who we are at our core.

We start to focus on ourselves. To look inside and know who we are.

Find things we don't like. Endeavor to change them. To learn what and who we aspire to be.

Not as someone our spouse wants us to be. We tried that already.
Who we really are.

When you do that you begin to understand why you are standing for your spouse and your marriage.

And you start to learn what real love is.

Unconditional love is caring about the happiness of another without any thought for what we might get for ourselves. It's also when other people care about our happiness unconditionally.

And what it is not

It is not what we have lived in our life and our marriage up to now. It is not controlling. It does not desire and force. It does not depend on action or inaction from our spouse.

And so as we let this soak and it takes hold we discover an amazing thing and it gives life to us and breaths hope into our spirits and that is

Unconditional love is when we love despite the foolish choices of our spouse, when they fail to do what we desire, regardless of any choice they make. This love alone has the power to heal all wounds, deliver self respect and remove all doubt for you and your spouse. It allows love and healing to flourish.

This is how we need to be loved. And this is the paradox.

That we only get this when we give it.

And now is the opportunity.

There is no GREATER opportunity you will ever have in your life then NOW to express this kind of love.

To do this takes greater courage than most people will ever understand and will ever know.

And you have received this wonderful gift only by going through the experience. By the trial.

By the tragedy.

What greater thing could you aspire to do.

EVER.





Mike....

Standing is YOUR choice....

Limbo is YOUR choice....

NOT growing is your choice....

Whatever that choice....just F-ing own it, and don't do it half way.

You are either committed to you, or you aren't.

I'm pretty sure I know what it is, however YOU need to know it also....

Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
Mach this is powerful and cutting. Thank you. Will digest this.


M:52 W: 51
T:27 M:25
D26 S24 S21 D20
BD:2022
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
What do you think it is?


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
Originally Posted by MikeP
Moving forward and staying positive. Making changes for me. Seems pretty straight forward, easy to get off track though. Thanks again.

Search "Jordan Peterson – 8 Lessons Men Learn Too Late In Life". Listen to the whole thing.

This quote easily applies to all the DBing advise:
Originally Posted by JP
Things are tragic and difficult but there's always some stupid thing that you could do that could make it even worse than it has to be

I have had it on repeat over the last couple days.

Lot's of good words of wisdom for women as well.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Ready2Change
Originally Posted by MikeP
Moving forward and staying positive. Making changes for me. Seems pretty straight forward, easy to get off track though. Thanks again.

Search "Jordan Peterson – 8 Lessons Men Learn Too Late In Life". Listen to the whole thing.

This quote easily applies to all the DBing advise:
Originally Posted by JP
Things are tragic and difficult but there's always some stupid thing that you could do that could make it even worse than it has to be

I have had it on repeat over the last couple days.

Lot's of good words of wisdom for women as well.

I watch his stuff on Youtube quite a bit. Thanks


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
Originally Posted by MikeP
I watch his stuff on Youtube quite a bit. Thanks
This one is definitely one of the better ones...Someone has carefully edited it from multiple source clips.

So many good quotes in there:
Originally Posted by JP
Don't sacrifice who you could be for who you are, which means if you have to choose to transform in a positive direction or maintain your current position then it's better to transform in a positive direction.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by MikeP
What do you think it is?

I think that it is what it always is Mike...

Most things that we face in life come from fear, and how that manifests within us is what we aspire towards.

I think that most humans are driven from fear.

I would also assume that many of your decisions in the past were driven from fear. Just like your fear is driving you today.

Fear of failure
Fear of being divorced
Fear of judgement
Fear of losing your future
Fear of losing friends and loved ones
Fear that you cannot rescue her from herself
Fear of defining yourself based on your marital status


And the one that I would assume is the strongest one that you are facing now, is the fear of being successful without her in your life ....

???

Fear of moving too far ahead of her, that she will never be able to catch up. So you tuck yourself into this nice little cocoon so that you are warm and snuggly for when she decides to come to her senses...

THAT....is simply waiting.....

Did you know that the human brain is incapable of thinking in "do" and "don't' subconsciously ?

So let's say that you are on the tee box while golfing, and you have a par 3 over a water hazard, and you stand there and think over and over again... "Don't hit the water , Don't hit the water " your brain is only hearing "Hit the water"....

Yet if you were to think..."Hit the green" , your odds go up significantly of achieving your objective....

When you think in negative, you produce negative results. Change your perspective, change your life....


I think that you want this to work out so bad that you can taste it...


Yet I think that you are having a hard time wrapping your head around the fact that she is a$$hole deep in a depression that is affecting everything in her life, and making her question everything in her life.

And that you are sitting in this invisible fence that you put up, asking how much longer can I do this. Because you still think that "if she would only snap out of this, we would be fine".

Because you are scared that you might lose her IF you get to far ahead, or take this next step forward for yourself......

So, you give her this letter, or ultimatum that she commits or your done, because of a date on the calendar

HOW WOULD YOUR LIFE LOOK SO COMEPLETELY DIFFERENT IF YOU WERE TO DO THAT TODAY ?????

Are you gonna feel either "less" married , or "more" married based on her decision ???

Standing, does NOT mean standing still Mike....

Just because you choose to stand today, doesn't mean you can't change your mind tomorrow either.

I'm not here to talk you into or out of choosing to be married. You have to choose that one...(and don't say it's up to her either). YOU choose to either act married, or not....yet you have to define what that looks like to YOU. Not your spouse or anyone else.

My adopted mantra going through this was simple....

Today is not the day I quit. Maybe I will tomorrow, but let's see what tomorrow brings.... ( and a nickel for anyone that steals that line)

Then rinse , lather, and repeat tomorrow....

Take this time standing, to face down those fears that more than likely created some behavioral patterns in yourself that you don't like.....

Take this time to realize that standing for your marriage has zero to do with her, and more to do with the fact that she has given you a gift, and you can choose what to do with it.

Your path will ultimately not look so different from what she is doing, however it should be a whole lot less destructive.

She isn't doing anything TO you, she is doing it for herself. Yet it can also be for you also....



I see a lot of me in you Mike....one of the reasons I came back to check on you.

I always knew that my marriage would work out, right up to the day that I decided it wouldn't....





Sooooo...

What do you think it is ???

2 members like this: job, Rockon
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Mach, I guess I'm still not quite sure what you mean by asking what do I think it is. Sorry, I guess I'm being dense today.

In regards to what you posted above- I really don't think I'm acting out of fear anymore. The issue with BD anniversary is something I put in my mind much earlier in this journey. I decided awhile ago that BD wasn't going to be the day we decide anything. I was asking the group a question that I really knew the answer to, should I initiate a R talk. I honestly don't think I'm afraid of the things you listed above. Of course, I don't want those things to happen. I think at this point I have accepted that they are all a possibility, and I can't control them. At least not all of them. It's funny you said standing isn't standing still. I was thinking earlier that standing is like waiting but with action.
I know about the do and don't scenario. I learned that while working with girls trying to teach them to hit and field a softball. I try to never say don't when working with them, always do.
You're not wrong about the depression issue and remembering it. I recently have gotten better at reminding myself of that and I think it is why I'm doing better. I am honestly in the best place I've been yet, not 100% detached. Getting closer.

I don't think if she "snaps out of it" we will be fine any longer. We have a lot of work to do if she ever decides to come around. To be honest she has changed so much that sometimes I don't think I like her much. She is colder towards everyone. Her personality has changed. Hopefully that changes back at some point. I am starting to see signs of the old her. She does seem happier most of the time. Maybe it's an act. I'm not saying that I'm watching everything she does for signs, she just seems happier most of the time. I know it doesn't mean anything good or bad, just an observation.

I have been making changes from the get go. Yes in the beginning I was just trying to win her back. That was a few months before I found this place and Michelle's books. I have made changes to be a better person, father, and partner. I'm not the best I can be, definitely better though.

It's hard to describe how I feel about our situation currently. I absolutely want it to work out. I also seem to be more ok with knowing that it might not. That thought doesn't scare me and put a knot in my stomach like it used to. Sometimes I feel pretty ok with whatever happens, happens. Maybe I'm fooling myself. The way I interact with W is so different than before. I don't sit and wonder what she's doing when she's not home. I make my plans and she makes hers. Sometimes we make plans together.

I know you weren't trying to make up my mind for me, I appreciate your input very much. I remember your mantra from past convo's and use it sometimes. I still want to be married and hope, barring another A, to remain so. I know I have a lot of work to do still. I am slowly getting there. Sometimes I post things on here without putting enough thought into them, thus I may seem contradictory at times. I'm not perfect and I hope I don't give off the vibe that I think I am.

One thing about fear that I will admit to. I'm afraid that she is trying to friend zone me or will just try to ease back into the R. That scares me because at that point I will have to push her to do what we would need to do as a couple to start a new R. I don't know that she ever will. Of course we never "know" what someone will do. Just being honest about my thoughts.

I do keep the attitude that this will all work out in the end. Sometimes I have to remind myself though.

I have so many things I want to do with the rest of my life that sometimes I don't know where to start. I want to travel more. That's a big one. I want to take s17 on some fishing trips this summer and on a hog hunt. Still looking for a jeep or truck for s17 and I to mess around with and go off roading. So I do see things in my life that don't include W, just need to get busy living.

Can I also say that I don't agree with all the things you shared from the other dude. We can discuss that if you want. A lot of good things in there though.

Thanks as always Mach.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 28,295
Likes: 112
job Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 28,295
Likes: 112
Mike,

I wouldn't initiate a relationship talk. I would go on about my business and celebrate the anniversary on my own terms, i.e., do something for yourself or an outing with your children. I doubt seriously that she would be honest and truly listen to what you have to say if you did have a relationship discussion. It would confirm her thoughts that you haven't changed and aren't giving her space. Yes, they love their space even when they are living in the same house with you.

If she does wake up and want to reconcile, there will be a lot of work on both sides of the aisle. Neither of you can go back to the old marriage. It would have to be a brand new marriage and the changes that you made would still have to be permanent. Some people tend to slip back into old patterns and the other spouse may rethink coming back into the marriage wasn't the right move. Also, by the time she wakes up, if she does, you may have decided you just want to move forward. The final decision will ultimately be yours to make. However, until that time should come, continue working on you and live your life to the fullest.

Hang in there! Continue to ask questions. When in doubt, sit quietly and the answers will come.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by job
Mike,

I wouldn't initiate a relationship talk. I would go on about my business and celebrate the anniversary on my own terms, i.e., do something for yourself or an outing with your children. I doubt seriously that she would be honest and truly listen to what you have to say if you did have a relationship discussion. It would confirm her thoughts that you haven't changed and aren't giving her space. Yes, they love their space even when they are living in the same house with you.

If she does wake up and want to reconcile, there will be a lot of work on both sides of the aisle. Neither of you can go back to the old marriage. It would have to be a brand new marriage and the changes that you made would still have to be permanent. Some people tend to slip back into old patterns and the other spouse may rethink coming back into the marriage wasn't the right move.
Also, by the time she wakes up, if she does, you may have decided you just want to move forward. The final decision will ultimately be yours to make. However, until that time should come, continue working on you and live your life to the fullest.

Hang in there! Continue to ask questions. When in doubt, sit quietly and the answers will come.

Thanks Job appreciate you taking time to respond. I’ll let the day come pass and stfu. Have plans to spend the day alone at my fav place. We both have a lot of work to do, I just got a head start.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
D
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
11/14/22 What to do? Was your first post. I just read it to get an idea of how far you have come. Without a doubt, in my opinion you have improved. That post was full of doubts, anxiety, worries about any and everything your W did. Your eyes have opened to face your worries and put them aside to concentrate on yourself. You have accepted this process. You’re now on team MikeP and wiling to do what ever it takes to never go back to the type of relationship you had with W. You are not constantly bringing W up, comparing yourself with W, or allowing her to consume all your emotions and energy. Keep it up, I’m sure your kids have already seen your changes and have benefited from them. They are lucky to have you as their dad.

Last edited by Dats000; 03/26/23 03:17 AM.

M:51 W:43
T:17 M:15
S:13 D11
10/2022 BD/IHS
03/2023 W moves out
2 members like this: MikeP, job
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 6,119
Likes: 408
Originally Posted by MikeP
One thing about fear that I will admit to. I'm afraid that she is trying to friend zone me or will just try to ease back into the R. That scares me because at that point I will have to push her to do what we would need to do as a couple to start a new R. I don't know that she ever will. Of course we never "know" what someone will do. Just being honest about my thoughts.

Friend zone - you don't have to allow yourself to be placed there. That you control, not her.

Ease back into the R ... push her to do what you need to do as a couple to start a new R... Mike if your changes are permanent that won't happen because the entire dynamic changes based on how you behave. She will still do whatever she does, but your changes, being permanent, will equate to you interacting with her in a new and different way, thus your relationship becomes something else.

Sometimes we fear our own changes more than anything our spouses dish out.


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
~ Mary Oliver
2 members like this: job, Dats000
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 28,295
Likes: 112
job Offline
Member
Offline
Member
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 28,295
Likes: 112
Here is something to remember: actions speak louder than words. Sometimes they tune us out and do not hear the entire sentence and then they pick and choose what they want to hear and accept. So, instead of having talks, show her how much you have changed and that you are having fun. If you are doing something that may interest her, there is no harm in inviting her to come along. If she says yes, then treat her as a roommate with no expectations. If she says no, accept the answer and go ahead do whatever you have planned to do. It will be her loss, not yours.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
2 members like this: MikeP, Dats000
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
Originally Posted by job
show her how much you have changed and that you are having fun. If you are doing something that may interest her, there is no harm in inviting her to come along. If she says yes, then treat her as a roommate with no expectations. If she says no, accept the answer and go ahead do whatever you have planned to do. It will be her loss, not yours.
This is how I almost always ask my lady out.

Example:
"Would you like to join me Friday night. I am going to see live music at the new local night club"

She is free to join me for a good time. If she says no, I am still going to have a good time without her.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
2 members like this: job, MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by bttrfly
Originally Posted by MikeP
One thing about fear that I will admit to. I'm afraid that she is trying to friend zone me or will just try to ease back into the R. That scares me because at that point I will have to push her to do what we would need to do as a couple to start a new R. I don't know that she ever will. Of course we never "know" what someone will do. Just being honest about my thoughts.

Friend zone - you don't have to allow yourself to be placed there. That you control, not her.

Ease back into the R ... push her to do what you need to do as a couple to start a new R... Mike if your changes are permanent that won't happen because the entire dynamic changes based on how you behave. She will still do whatever she does, but your changes, being permanent, will equate to you interacting with her in a new and different way, thus your relationship becomes something else.

Sometimes we fear our own changes more than anything our spouses dish out.

Thanks bttrfly. I understand what your saying. I do interact with her differently, most of the time. Still a work in progress. The thing is, I catch myself now at times starting to slip into the old ways and am aware enough to stop. I'm an over thinker and that's where a lot of my problems stem from. I allow myself time to process things and then move on now. It's not always easy, at least I'm aware and working on it. You are correct about fearing change. Not easy to teach an old dog new tricks. Not that anything I'm doing is a trick, just for clarity. See what I mean about over thinking? Lol.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Job, R2C- Thanks for the tip. I have been doing that recently. I'll make plans to go eat dinner when the kids are busy. I'll usually let her know and say she's welcome to join me. Usually she does and when she doesn't I just say something like "Ok, enjoy your alone time. Be back later." There are times when I'm glad she declines so I can have some alone time myself.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by MikeP
Mach, I guess I'm still not quite sure what you mean by asking what do I think it is. Sorry, I guess I'm being dense today.

In regards to what you posted above- I really don't think I'm acting out of fear anymore. The issue with BD anniversary is something I put in my mind much earlier in this journey. I decided awhile ago that BD wasn't going to be the day we decide anything. I was asking the group a question that I really knew the answer to, should I initiate a R talk. I honestly don't think I'm afraid of the things you listed above. Of course, I don't want those things to happen. I think at this point I have accepted that they are all a possibility, and I can't control them. At least not all of them. It's funny you said standing isn't standing still. I was thinking earlier that standing is like waiting but with action.
I know about the do and don't scenario. I learned that while working with girls trying to teach them to hit and field a softball. I try to never say don't when working with them, always do.
You're not wrong about the depression issue and remembering it. I recently have gotten better at reminding myself of that and I think it is why I'm doing better. I am honestly in the best place I've been yet, not 100% detached. Getting closer.

I don't think if she "snaps out of it" we will be fine any longer. We have a lot of work to do if she ever decides to come around. To be honest she has changed so much that sometimes I don't think I like her much. She is colder towards everyone. Her personality has changed. Hopefully that changes back at some point. I am starting to see signs of the old her. She does seem happier most of the time. Maybe it's an act. I'm not saying that I'm watching everything she does for signs, she just seems happier most of the time. I know it doesn't mean anything good or bad, just an observation.

I have been making changes from the get go. Yes in the beginning I was just trying to win her back. That was a few months before I found this place and Michelle's books. I have made changes to be a better person, father, and partner. I'm not the best I can be, definitely better though.

It's hard to describe how I feel about our situation currently. I absolutely want it to work out. I also seem to be more ok with knowing that it might not. That thought doesn't scare me and put a knot in my stomach like it used to. Sometimes I feel pretty ok with whatever happens, happens. Maybe I'm fooling myself. The way I interact with W is so different than before. I don't sit and wonder what she's doing when she's not home. I make my plans and she makes hers. Sometimes we make plans together.

I know you weren't trying to make up my mind for me, I appreciate your input very much. I remember your mantra from past convo's and use it sometimes. I still want to be married and hope, barring another A, to remain so. I know I have a lot of work to do still. I am slowly getting there. Sometimes I post things on here without putting enough thought into them, thus I may seem contradictory at times. I'm not perfect and I hope I don't give off the vibe that I think I am.

One thing about fear that I will admit to. I'm afraid that she is trying to friend zone me or will just try to ease back into the R. That scares me because at that point I will have to push her to do what we would need to do as a couple to start a new R. I don't know that she ever will. Of course we never "know" what someone will do. Just being honest about my thoughts.

I do keep the attitude that this will all work out in the end. Sometimes I have to remind myself though.

I have so many things I want to do with the rest of my life that sometimes I don't know where to start. I want to travel more. That's a big one. I want to take s17 on some fishing trips this summer and on a hog hunt. Still looking for a jeep or truck for s17 and I to mess around with and go off roading. So I do see things in my life that don't include W, just need to get busy living.

Can I also say that I don't agree with all the things you shared from the other dude. We can discuss that if you want. A lot of good things in there though.

Thanks as always Mach.




There's been some talk here lately about actions being greater than words.....

And I think that a LOT of the fear that I mentioned is in the actions rather than the thoughts.

Whatever the fear is, it is what is keeping you from moving your life forward.

What's stopping you from traveling ? Fishin' ? , going on a Hog hunt ? An old truck ?

Point is Mike....

Sometimes we get so busy and wrapped up merely "surviving" that we forget that we should be "thriving"....

Surviving is just going through the motions of what our life used to be. Being "wounded" by our surroundings (even if we don't think that they are). Our situations are defining who we are , and what we want to be.

Thriving is being open to whatever possibilities lie ahead of us, and attacking them with a vigor for life....

Would you say that you are you surviving ?

Or are you thriving ???

1 member likes this: DnJ
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
Mike I agree with Mach and speaks to me too.


M:52 W: 51
T:27 M:25
D26 S24 S21 D20
BD:2022
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Mach1
Originally Posted by MikeP
Mach, I guess I'm still not quite sure what you mean by asking what do I think it is. Sorry, I guess I'm being dense today.

In regards to what you posted above- I really don't think I'm acting out of fear anymore. The issue with BD anniversary is something I put in my mind much earlier in this journey. I decided awhile ago that BD wasn't going to be the day we decide anything. I was asking the group a question that I really knew the answer to, should I initiate a R talk. I honestly don't think I'm afraid of the things you listed above. Of course, I don't want those things to happen. I think at this point I have accepted that they are all a possibility, and I can't control them. At least not all of them. It's funny you said standing isn't standing still. I was thinking earlier that standing is like waiting but with action.
I know about the do and don't scenario. I learned that while working with girls trying to teach them to hit and field a softball. I try to never say don't when working with them, always do.
You're not wrong about the depression issue and remembering it. I recently have gotten better at reminding myself of that and I think it is why I'm doing better. I am honestly in the best place I've been yet, not 100% detached. Getting closer.

I don't think if she "snaps out of it" we will be fine any longer. We have a lot of work to do if she ever decides to come around. To be honest she has changed so much that sometimes I don't think I like her much. She is colder towards everyone. Her personality has changed. Hopefully that changes back at some point. I am starting to see signs of the old her. She does seem happier most of the time. Maybe it's an act. I'm not saying that I'm watching everything she does for signs, she just seems happier most of the time. I know it doesn't mean anything good or bad, just an observation.

I have been making changes from the get go. Yes in the beginning I was just trying to win her back. That was a few months before I found this place and Michelle's books. I have made changes to be a better person, father, and partner. I'm not the best I can be, definitely better though.

It's hard to describe how I feel about our situation currently. I absolutely want it to work out. I also seem to be more ok with knowing that it might not. That thought doesn't scare me and put a knot in my stomach like it used to. Sometimes I feel pretty ok with whatever happens, happens. Maybe I'm fooling myself. The way I interact with W is so different than before. I don't sit and wonder what she's doing when she's not home. I make my plans and she makes hers. Sometimes we make plans together.

I know you weren't trying to make up my mind for me, I appreciate your input very much. I remember your mantra from past convo's and use it sometimes. I still want to be married and hope, barring another A, to remain so. I know I have a lot of work to do still. I am slowly getting there. Sometimes I post things on here without putting enough thought into them, thus I may seem contradictory at times. I'm not perfect and I hope I don't give off the vibe that I think I am.

One thing about fear that I will admit to. I'm afraid that she is trying to friend zone me or will just try to ease back into the R. That scares me because at that point I will have to push her to do what we would need to do as a couple to start a new R. I don't know that she ever will. Of course we never "know" what someone will do. Just being honest about my thoughts.

I do keep the attitude that this will all work out in the end. Sometimes I have to remind myself though.

I have so many things I want to do with the rest of my life that sometimes I don't know where to start. I want to travel more. That's a big one. I want to take s17 on some fishing trips this summer and on a hog hunt. Still looking for a jeep or truck for s17 and I to mess around with and go off roading. So I do see things in my life that don't include W, just need to get busy living.

Can I also say that I don't agree with all the things you shared from the other dude. We can discuss that if you want. A lot of good things in there though.

Thanks as always Mach.




There's been some talk here lately about actions being greater than words.....

And I think that a LOT of the fear that I mentioned is in the actions rather than the thoughts.

Whatever the fear is, it is what is keeping you from moving your life forward.

What's stopping you from traveling ? Fishin' ? , going on a Hog hunt ? An old truck ?

Point is Mike....

Sometimes we get so busy and wrapped up merely "surviving" that we forget that we should be "thriving"....

Surviving is just going through the motions of what our life used to be. Being "wounded" by our surroundings (even if we don't think that they are). Our situations are defining who we are , and what we want to be.

Thriving is being open to whatever possibilities lie ahead of us, and attacking them with a vigor for life....

Would you say that you are you surviving ?

Or are you thriving ???

Honestly, surviving with a goal of thriving. That’s a good way of looking at it. Thanks for challenging me to look at myself. I’m in a weird place right now. Since retiring in January I’ve been mostly working around the house. I drop off and pick up d13 from school, then mess around at home. Been fishing some and actively searching for a truck or Jeep. Looking at places to go on a hog hunt, just haven’t booked anything yet. I’ve definitely been in a big of a rut, procrastinating. Part of it is just being lazy for a few months and enjoying retirement. I think part of it is also just surviving. Something to think about. Thanks.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
BD anniversary came and went, honestly put it out of my mind. Everyone had their own plans and I spent most of the day just staying busy. Finished the day by mowing my in-laws grass, father in law is still in rehab due to his recent health issues. Kids are on spring break this week so we will have lots of time together. Going to ride go carts one day and planning to go watch a baseball game with some friends one night.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
1 member likes this: job
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
One day at a time Mike.....


Today is not the day that I quit...

Maybe I will tomorrow, yet I will wait to see what tomorrow brings......



How's the truck hunt coming along ???

Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Mach1
One day at a time Mike.....


Today is not the day that I quit...

Maybe I will tomorrow, yet I will wait to see what tomorrow brings......



How's the truck hunt coming along ???

Slowly. Old car and truck prices are crazy. Looking at a nice Late 70's Dodge not far from me. Someone down the road from me has a Jeep in their backyard I'm thinking about stopping and asking about. Needs a lot of work but I need a project. Thanks for asking. How are things in your world?


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Mach, you asked me earlier what are some of my fears. While reading a response today on another posters thread, someone said that DBing is a 3-5 year journey. I got to thinking about that and realized another fear. I don't want to spend 3-5 years with someone that doesn't want to be with me. I don't want to wake up at 55-56 years old and have no-one. I am a person that enjoys my alone time, maybe too much. I also really love having someone to come home to. I'm not looking to walk away today. I guess it's the fear of the unknown. I can't dictate the outcome of this. At least not without giving up. I want to finish out my years with someone that can love me and wants to be with me. I know too many people that are alone and unhappy, my favorite uncle being one of them. He actually surprised me by saying he wishes he weren't alone and that I should do what I can to stay with my W. He was always a guy that did his own thing and was an "alpha" before we knew what that was. Now in his late 60's he's lonely. That stinks. Just posting my thoughts today while they are fresh. Thanks.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
Mike, I was in my late 40s, about to be 49 in my sitch. I had the same thoughts. I was going to give her one year past BD or I was going to go for myself. I always tell LBSs to decide how long they are willing to wait then set a drop dead date. You don't tell her the date, it is for you and you alone. Life is too short. There are plenty of fish in the sea for an older gentleman. Especially if you are in good shape and take care of yourself! So figure out the timing for you then stick to it.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 604
Likes: 251
K
Member
Offline
Member
K
Joined: Dec 2019
Posts: 604
Likes: 251
Quote
I got to thinking about that and realized another fear. I don't want to spend 3-5 years with someone that doesn't want to be with me. I don't want to wake up at 55-56 years old and have no-one.

That’s the thing about fear, isn’t it?

We fear things not necessarily because they are something bad, but because it’s something unfamiliar.

There’s every possibility that by the time you’re 55 … you’re single, happier, confident and thriving in your work, your relationships, with your kids. Or alternatively, by the time you’re 55 - perhaps you’re in a new, loving, non-codependent relationship.

Just because something is unknown, doesn’t mean it should be feared.

I started my divorce like you - terrified I’d be on my own, and no idea what it was going to look like. Four years on, I’ve re-partnered and I’m happier than I ever was with my ex. What I feared, turned out to be joyous. And even better than that, I’ve learnt my self worth, my independence and my confidence. If my current relationship ended tomorrow, I’d be totally fine and happy being me.

That’s the power of DB.

If you focus on you, all the other details will fall into place.

Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
D
DnJ Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
Hello Mike

I’ve been sans wife for six and a half years. The kids moved out over the years, with daughter (the youngest) being the last one to leave. Been on my own for three years now.

Living alone does not automatically lead to unhappiness or loneliness. A person by themselves can be very fulfilled. Conversely, a person in a room full people can feel utterly lonely. And I have experienced both ends of that spectrum.

Depression brings about feelings of loneliness and unhappiness regardless of how many folks are around you. Depression is having one’s feelings crushing inward. Very little external inputs will have much affect upon that. It is the person themselves that needs to find acceptance to whatever their loss, grief, and/or cause of the depression is. Certainly, external things do help ease and distract our mind; yet one still needs to find their peace for lasting calm and contentment.

Loneliness and unhappiness: Feelings. Fleeting unless reinforced.

Living alone: Just one’s situation. Once accepted.

Something to remember, decisions based mostly upon emotions often lead to regret.

Grief is a hodgepodge of emotions. Even indifference - the numbness or absence of feeling - is a feeling. It takes time to work and walk your way through all that. I guarantee, you will feel differently in a few years. I certainly did.

I never made or set a drop dead date. For nothing kills hope like a deadline or expectation. Yet, I didn’t wait around either. I started out standing, then on to standing for me, which morphs into just life.

Strengthen that which serves, craft that which you aspire to, and alter or discard that which does not or no longer serves. When one organizes and realizes their beliefs and convictions, and lives them, things fall into place.

Beliefs take time. Invest into that. Invest into yourself. There is no better or greater opportunity or reason for one’s investment. And whatever you put in will pay out much more. To yourself and to others.

Make life decisions based upon beliefs and values. Those deep convictions are excellent life headings. Noble and good. Worthy and fulfilling.

Let go the fear and embrace the unknown. For the future is unwritten and unknown, the very ideals and realm where possibilities live and thrive. And I believe in possibilities.

My current life is excellent! Sure, my situation is not what I had planned or had any inclining that it would come about. Yet, here I am. We all have to play the cards we’re dealt. And believe me the game unfolds in ways one cannot foresee. Embrace the uncertainty and all the potential it holds.

You’ve not got to decide anything today. And likely shouldn’t.

Have faith. Discover and become you.

D


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by Mike
How are things in your world?

Things are doin okay. I'm still looking for my balance in it all, and there are days when I have to force my outlook to be positive. Taking some time to let go of some things and starting to look forward to making some decisions about where I am headed now.

My project is on the road now, and I'm thinking of some new things to incorporate into it. Those old trucks didn't have the conveniences of today's vehicles. : )

There's nothing quite like driving around in an old truck ....



Originally Posted by MikeP
Mach, you asked me earlier what are some of my fears. While reading a response today on another posters thread, someone said that DBing is a 3-5 year journey. I got to thinking about that and realized another fear. I don't want to spend 3-5 years with someone that doesn't want to be with me. I don't want to wake up at 55-56 years old and have no-one. I am a person that enjoys my alone time, maybe too much. I also really love having someone to come home to. I'm not looking to walk away today. I guess it's the fear of the unknown. I can't dictate the outcome of this. At least not without giving up. I want to finish out my years with someone that can love me and wants to be with me. I know too many people that are alone and unhappy, my favorite uncle being one of them. He actually surprised me by saying he wishes he weren't alone and that I should do what I can to stay with my W. He was always a guy that did his own thing and was an "alpha" before we knew what that was. Now in his late 60's he's lonely. That stinks. Just posting my thoughts today while they are fresh. Thanks.

I get it....

Let me ask you this though....

Would you be willing to give that time if you were guaranteed that you would have that relationship with your current spouse ?

Would you be willing to give that time if YOU were to come out of it a better Husband, Father, Son, Friend ??

Even if it meant that you weren't married to your current spouse at the end ???

I dunno....to me...

Marriages ebb and flow continuously through good times and bad times.

Anyone can do the good times, it takes a special person to make it through the bad times.

I'm sure that you've had the good ones, and I know you are dealing with a bad time right now. Yet I would venture that it isn't the first "worst" time that you've dealt with. And I'm sure that your wife had been the one to carry you BOTH through one of those times.

I always looked at it that way. That my spouse carried the marriage on her back more than once throughout our years together. And maybe, just maybe, it was MY turn to carry the FULL weight of it for a while.

That's what it's sposed to be about .....right ???

In my next relationship....

I never wanted to be a widower at 54, even though I knew once her diagnosis was there, what our "end game" was....

And "it" won, for many months now. The fear...

However, I am taking it back. Little by little, day by day, inch by inch....


The fear....???

It's always gonna be there in some regard..

Fear is good, it means that we are alive and cognizant of our surroundings....

We fuel our fear through indecision and uncertainty.



Yet it isn't what we are afraid of...

It's how we face it, that ultimately matters in our lives.


This particular fear of yours seems to be tied to this....

You are trying to define yourself by whether or not you are married.....

And that is a LOT of your power to give away to her. It's also a lot of pressure to place on her by essentially holding her accountable for your feelings and emotions over it.

You are basically telling her that you cannot be successful unless you come through this whole...

That you can't be happy unless you have a Woman by your side, completing you as a person....



Do you always want to live with that fear ??

Kicking it's a$$ to the curb is hard....

Living with it always hanging around is harder...

You get to choose your "hard"



DBing is about become that "whole" person, regardless the outcome of your marriage....

Facing the fears that hunt you down, and stopping the monsters from playing in your head.

Cause I can tell you this for certain....

When you invest in Mike....

None of that other crap will have the power that you fear it has ....

I will also say that you are further down the road than you think that you are....so keep going...


Today is not the day that I quit.....

4 members like this: Rockon, MikeP, Cadet, job
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
C
Member
Offline
Member
C
Joined: Nov 2009
Posts: 13,533
Likes: 78
Originally Posted by Mach1
You are basically telling her that you cannot be successful unless you come through this whole...

What Mach and I both know and have experienced is that you WILL come out whole.

How long it is going to take - that is to be determined.

DB'ing as Mach said is getting to that place.

Keep taking one step at a time.

You can only eat an elephant one bite at a time.


Me-70, D37,S36
2 members like this: Rockon, MikeP
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by Cadet
Originally Posted by Mach1
You are basically telling her that you cannot be successful unless you come through this whole...

What Mach and I both know and have experienced is that you WILL come out whole.

As long as YOU do the work ....

Just simply "waiting" won't change you a bit....

Mirror work is vital unless you want to be the same exact guy in your next relationship....

Mirror work is vital to keep from failing back into old patterns

Mirror work is vital to kill the triggers that cause poor relationship skills.....

2 members like this: MikeP, Cadet
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Thanks all for the replies. Sorry I didn't get back sooner. Been pretty busy the last couple of days. Applied for several jobs and hanging out with the kids.

First thing is, I didn't mean to imply that I was considering making any decisions based on the fear I posted about. I think it is more a fear of her hanging around but not really wanting to be here. She built up the nerve to leave once, not sure she would do it again. She may just suffer through because it's the "right" thing to do. She seems to be slowly returning to a lot of her old self. What do I do if she just eases back into us and nothing is ever said or worked on? I don't see how we make it work by just ignoring what happened.

To answer your questions Mach-yes, yes, and yes. I have also tried to tell myself that at times she carried the marriage. Probably heard it from you before. I guess I just don't want to waste anymore of my life waiting to be happy. I fell into that trap along time ago of thinking the next thing or milestone was going to bring happiness. I can be happy without her, as much as it hurts to think about it, and I am trying to be happy now. It makes me sad to think about what she is going through in her mind and that she might stay even if it's not what she truly wants.

Steve-I initially thought I had set a time limit of 1 year as well. I don't know that I need a certain amount of time now, just continued progress in how things are going. Things do seem better and she seems happier. Could be an act though.

Gotta run, she just got home and I'm in the living room on our old computer. Finish my response later. Thanks.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
My point is you are worried about the time you have left and limbo has a tendency to last a longtime. So how kind are you willing to wait. 55 turns into 60. 60 into 65. Decide how long you willing to give her then stick to that timeline.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
D
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
Originally Posted by MikeP
I think it is more a fear of her hanging around but not really wanting to be here. She built up the nerve to leave once, not sure she would do it again. She may just suffer through because it's the "right" thing to do. She seems to be slowly returning to a lot of her old self. What do I do if she just eases back into us and nothing is ever said or worked on? I don't see how we make it work by just ignoring what happened.

Advice sounds a bit complicated. Don’t get a temperature check and don’t wait around forever to see if she wants to reconcile. Sounds like you have to weigh out the pros and con and make sure you make a decision to get out before you realize your back in the same situation you were before BD. Are you finding a way to incorporate an IC into the process? This would help keep you in a healthy mindset with everything else you are doing.

Originally Posted by mikep
Gotta run, she just got home and I'm in the living room on our old computer. Finish my response later. Thanks.

Doesn’t sound like someone I would want to live with


M:51 W:43
T:17 M:15
S:13 D11
10/2022 BD/IHS
03/2023 W moves out
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
D
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Nov 2022
Posts: 86
Likes: 31
Just stay on track developing yourself and the new you will persevere


M:51 W:43
T:17 M:15
S:13 D11
10/2022 BD/IHS
03/2023 W moves out
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
So my guess is your are basically living the same life you lived for the last 30 years with one difference, you now know she is unhappy and capable of leaving. You probably have been reading up on healthy thriving relationships and have decided that is what you want. The problem you are encountering right now is that you realize it takes two people committed to having a healthy, thriving relationship. These types of relationships are hard and right now your w has no desire to commit to putting in the work because she’s currently on the fence. So right now you have 3 options:

1. Ride it out while working on yourself and see if she commits back to the marriage. The problem with this option is you are always going to be waiting for the other shoe to drop. Also without any incentive she is unlikely to put in the work.

2. Take SteveLW’s advice and give it a set amount of time and then D her. The problem with that is when you drop the d papers on her that might be the action to incentivize her to work on the marriage.

3. You tell her that this no longer works for you and you are no longer willing to have the remain status quo. Outline what you need from her to continue in the marriage. She can either accept your conditions, negotiate terms that work for the both of you or end the marriage.

None of these are ideal but unfortunately after bomb drop the game completely changes and is never the same. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Dats000
Originally Posted by MikeP
I think it is more a fear of her hanging around but not really wanting to be here. She built up the nerve to leave once, not sure she would do it again. She may just suffer through because it's the "right" thing to do. She seems to be slowly returning to a lot of her old self. What do I do if she just eases back into us and nothing is ever said or worked on? I don't see how we make it work by just ignoring what happened.

Advice sounds a bit complicated. Don’t get a temperature check and don’t wait around forever to see if she wants to reconcile. Sounds like you have to weigh out the pros and con and make sure you make a decision to get out before you realize your back in the same situation you were before BD. Are you finding a way to incorporate an IC into the process? This would help keep you in a healthy mindset with everything else you are doing.

Originally Posted by mikep
Gotta run, she just got home and I'm in the living room on our old computer. Finish my response later. Thanks.

Doesn’t sound like someone I would want to live with

I only meant I had to run because I didn't want her to see me on this forum. When I'm on this computer I am out in the open.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
1 member likes this: Dats000
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Boat14
So my guess is your are basically living the same life you lived for the last 30 years with one difference, you now know she is unhappy and capable of leaving. You probably have been reading up on healthy thriving relationships and have decided that is what you want. The problem you are encountering right now is that you realize it takes two people committed to having a healthy, thriving relationship. These types of relationships are hard and right now your w has no desire to commit to putting in the work because she’s currently on the fence. So right now you have 3 options:

1. Ride it out while working on yourself and see if she commits back to the marriage. The problem with this option is you are always going to be waiting for the other shoe to drop. Also without any incentive she is unlikely to put in the work.

2. Take SteveLW’s advice and give it a set amount of time and then D her. The problem with that is when you drop the d papers on her that might be the action to incentivize her to work on the marriage.

3. You tell her that this no longer works for you and you are no longer willing to have the remain status quo. Outline what you need from her to continue in the marriage. She can either accept your conditions, negotiate terms that work for the both of you or end the marriage.

None of these are ideal but unfortunately after bomb drop the game completely changes and is never the same. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

It is the same in a lot of ways. However I have made changes to myself and how I interact with her. I'm doing the best I can to GAL and am much closer to being detached. I am not angry about things like I was even just a couple of months ago. Sometimes my mind wanders and yes I do get angry. I have learned how to deal with it now. I feel it and move on, I don't dwell on it. That is a big change for me as a person. I was always bad about needing to let who ever I was angry at know about it.
I think option 3 is what will eventually happen, I'm not ready for that yet though. I will give her more time and see what shakes out. We are about to go through a very hard time with her dad right now due to his health issues and now is not the time to put more stress on her. I may even end up taking care of him quite a bit, he may have to move in with us for a while. Thanks for the input, appreciate it.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by SteveLW
My point is you are worried about the time you have left and limbo has a tendency to last a longtime. So how kind are you willing to wait. 55 turns into 60. 60 into 65. Decide how long you willing to give her then stick to that timeline.

You are right Steve, that's a big concern for me. I don't want our R to be over but better sooner than later if it's inevitable. Maybe I'm wrong about that, don't know.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Mach- What kind of old truck are you driving around in? I'm a Dodge fan however I love all old cars and trucks. Plus Jeeps.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
So I mentioned before that my father in law is in the hospital. He is back in rehab for two more weeks and then may have to come home after that. Insurance will only pay for that amount of time. If his rehab nurse can't get argue with them and get him more time he will probably come stay at our house. This is going to be hard. He currently can't walk and can't use his hands much. W is super stressed and I'm getting there. Don't know how this will affect our R. Already causing some small amount of friction. The prognosis is he may get better in a month or two with a 20% chance he doesn't. This stinks. He was the most active 75 year old I've next with the exception of my grandmother, she was unbelievably active. I hate that this has happened to him, he is a great guy and a wonderful grandparent to our three kids. Fingers crossed and positive thoughts. I'm posting this here out of concern for what may happen with W and I, not using the forum as for unrelated personal stuff. This would be hard for a couple not in our sitch.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by Mike
Mach- What kind of old truck are you driving around in? I'm a Dodge fan however I love all old cars and trucks. Plus Jeeps.

I came across an early eighties F-truck a few months back. Got it cheap and been doing some upgrades on things. It runs strong and is in really good shape. Just FYI, never trust 40 year old wiring harnesses.... : ) There's a group on a large social site that has a face, called Bullnose Fords that has a pic of it. It's pretty sweet actually.... If you get a chance, check it out. You would like' it...




Originally Posted by MikeP
So I mentioned before that my father in law is in the hospital. He is back in rehab for two more weeks and then may have to come home after that. Insurance will only pay for that amount of time. If his rehab nurse can't get argue with them and get him more time he will probably come stay at our house. This is going to be hard. He currently can't walk and can't use his hands much. W is super stressed and I'm getting there. Don't know how this will affect our R. Already causing some small amount of friction. The prognosis is he may get better in a month or two with a 20% chance he doesn't. This stinks. He was the most active 75 year old I've next with the exception of my grandmother, she was unbelievably active. I hate that this has happened to him, he is a great guy and a wonderful grandparent to our three kids. Fingers crossed and positive thoughts. I'm posting this here out of concern for what may happen with W and I, not using the forum as for unrelated personal stuff. This would be hard for a couple not in our sitch.

It certainly is hard for any situation, and I hope for the best outcome for you and your family....

Something that I've thought over the years, was that there can be no testimony without a test....

Everything right now is a test for you...

Maybe let your wife lead this, and just be the support.

???

Also, maybe let this "come" to you a bit. Don't borrow trouble from the future...

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by MikeP
Originally Posted by Boat14
So my guess is your are basically living the same life you lived for the last 30 years with one difference, you now know she is unhappy and capable of leaving. You probably have been reading up on healthy thriving relationships and have decided that is what you want. The problem you are encountering right now is that you realize it takes two people committed to having a healthy, thriving relationship. These types of relationships are hard and right now your w has no desire to commit to putting in the work because she’s currently on the fence. So right now you have 3 options:

1. Ride it out while working on yourself and see if she commits back to the marriage. The problem with this option is you are always going to be waiting for the other shoe to drop. Also without any incentive she is unlikely to put in the work.

2. Take SteveLW’s advice and give it a set amount of time and then D her. The problem with that is when you drop the d papers on her that might be the action to incentivize her to work on the marriage.

3. You tell her that this no longer works for you and you are no longer willing to have the remain status quo. Outline what you need from her to continue in the marriage. She can either accept your conditions, negotiate terms that work for the both of you or end the marriage.

None of these are ideal but unfortunately after bomb drop the game completely changes and is never the same. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

It is the same in a lot of ways. However I have made changes to myself and how I interact with her. I'm doing the best I can to GAL and am much closer to being detached. I am not angry about things like I was even just a couple of months ago. Sometimes my mind wanders and yes I do get angry. I have learned how to deal with it now. I feel it and move on, I don't dwell on it. That is a big change for me as a person. I was always bad about needing to let who ever I was angry at know about it.
I think option 3 is what will eventually happen, I'm not ready for that yet though. I will give her more time and see what shakes out. We are about to go through a very hard time with her dad right now due to his health issues and now is not the time to put more stress on her. I may even end up taking care of him quite a bit, he may have to move in with us for a while. Thanks for the input, appreciate it.


Nice food for thought....

I agree that #3 would be an option for you. Yet, you have a lot on your plate right now. Maybe not focus on what is going on for a while and just "be".....

Things like this have a way of pushing things toward one side or another.....

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Mach1
Originally Posted by MikeP
Originally Posted by Boat14
So my guess is your are basically living the same life you lived for the last 30 years with one difference, you now know she is unhappy and capable of leaving. You probably have been reading up on healthy thriving relationships and have decided that is what you want. The problem you are encountering right now is that you realize it takes two people committed to having a healthy, thriving relationship. These types of relationships are hard and right now your w has no desire to commit to putting in the work because she’s currently on the fence. So right now you have 3 options:

1. Ride it out while working on yourself and see if she commits back to the marriage. The problem with this option is you are always going to be waiting for the other shoe to drop. Also without any incentive she is unlikely to put in the work.

2. Take SteveLW’s advice and give it a set amount of time and then D her. The problem with that is when you drop the d papers on her that might be the action to incentivize her to work on the marriage.

3. You tell her that this no longer works for you and you are no longer willing to have the remain status quo. Outline what you need from her to continue in the marriage. She can either accept your conditions, negotiate terms that work for the both of you or end the marriage.

None of these are ideal but unfortunately after bomb drop the game completely changes and is never the same. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle.

It is the same in a lot of ways. However I have made changes to myself and how I interact with her. I'm doing the best I can to GAL and am much closer to being detached. I am not angry about things like I was even just a couple of months ago. Sometimes my mind wanders and yes I do get angry. I have learned how to deal with it now. I feel it and move on, I don't dwell on it. That is a big change for me as a person. I was always bad about needing to let who ever I was angry at know about it.
I think option 3 is what will eventually happen, I'm not ready for that yet though. I will give her more time and see what shakes out. We are about to go through a very hard time with her dad right now due to his health issues and now is not the time to put more stress on her. I may even end up taking care of him quite a bit, he may have to move in with us for a while. Thanks for the input, appreciate it.


Nice food for thought....

I agree that #3 would be an option for you. Yet, you have a lot on your plate right now. Maybe not focus on what is going on for a while and just "be".....

Things like this have a way of pushing things toward one side or another.....

Definitely letting things be. The idea that he might be coming to stay here for a while just came to light a day or two ago. I am letting her take the lead in this and being supportive. I might end up spending a lot of time taking care of him though. Definitely another test for us, I will try my best to pass.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Mach, I'll try and find this face place you speak of. 70's-late 80's are my second favorite behind the Dodges. I know what you mean about old wiring, Dodge/Plymouth are notorious for wiring issues.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
So “we” were supposed to go out of town this weekend for a softball tournament. W tells me yesterday that she’s not going. S17 will be home alone, dogs will be alone, etc. No big deal. Except, exactly one year ago we had the exact same scenario and when I got home that Sunday I caught her and him together. I have no concerns about her and OM now, just feeling anxious and remembering how devastated I was. Kind of like ptsd maybe? Also struggling with anger from remembering the pain. Keeping it to myself. Not taking it out on her or showing it outwardly. I’m very anxious about leaving.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Another thing-during a convo concerning my father in law somehow the subject if R came up. It was a week ago, don’t remember exactly how it came up. She made the comment that we are ok. Didn’t pursue what that meant. Things have been pretty good. I think she is working on just sweeping everything under the rug and going back to the way things were. Not sure how to proceed. I don’t want anymore drama. Things can’t just go back to the old ways.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
MikeP, focus on the task at hand. So giving her so much head space. Life it too short for that. Go to the tournament, enjoy yourself. Have fun.

Early on in my situation I was like that too. Almost had separation anxiety. As time went on I enjoyed the time apart.
Work on getting to that place.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
I’m good with the time apart. It’s the memory of last time that’s causing my anxiety. Working through it, just needed to vent a little.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
So what I thought would happen has happened. W told me Sunday night that she is happy and wants to be here, with me, again. Her words before were that she didn't want to be here a lot of the time. However, she wants to move on like nothing happened. Can't understand why I need to discuss the anything, doesn't want to attend IC or MC. Just move on. I told her I wasn't ok with that plan because we will end up right back in this situation again. I asked her if the roles were reversed wouldn't she want these things. She said no. We are different and she could just move on. I'm at a loss. I know that I need to just keep on with the basic principals of DBing as far as GALing, 180, improving myself, etc. Beyond that, what's next? I don't want to push her away and I don't want to wake up 5 years from now to another BD. One thing I pointed out was her saying she "feels" happy. I asked what was to prevent her from not "feeling" happy again and wanting out. No answer. Mostly no answers to anything. She thinks that my being willing to stay with her after the A, which she still has never admitted was physical, means I should just be willing to move on.
I bring up her not admitting the affair was physical because, as in all of these sitches, there are so many lies and deception. I still struggle with that. It's hard to trust someone that doesn't really express remorse. My initial thought is to just carry on for now and see where things go. Any advice would be appreciated.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
Logic and reason are telling you no remorse, she still works with OM and wants to slide back into the marriage is a recipe for disaster. Emotion is telling you she is staying so that makes me feel safe in my comfortable marriage. I don’t want to do or say anything to upset her.

When decisions are made based on emotion there is sure to be consequences.

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Boat14
Logic and reason are telling you no remorse, she still works with OM and wants to slide back into the marriage is a recipe for disaster. Emotion is telling you she is staying so that makes me feel safe in my comfortable marriage. I don’t want to do or say anything to upset her.

When decisions are made based on emotion there is sure to be consequences.

That's basically correct. I do want to do or say something because I am aware it is a recipe for disaster if I don't. Just not sure what to do. Push for IC or MC? With my father in laws current health issues, this is terrible timing for anything too drastic. She is stressed out over his future. That is why I am thinking carry on for now and see what happens with him. I also don't want to give her a false sense that I am ok with her lack of interest in what needs to be done.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
D
DnJ Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
Good Morning Mike

A lot of spouses (and LBS) would just love to just sweep things under the rug. You are correct to be wary of such a path. There would be so many things left unsaid or reconciled that trust would be difficult and resentment likely.

Originally Posted by MikeP
I told her I wasn't ok with that plan because we will end up right back in this situation again.

I agree. However, it’s “likely” that you’d end up right back in it. “Will” is more a guarantee. No point sabotaging your mindset or hope.

That being said, the big reason for discussing is to show open honest communication and willingness to work and commit to the relationship.

Originally Posted by MikeP
W told me Sunday night that she is happy and wants to be here, with me, again.

Words and actions. Which do you, should you, more believe?

Did she change her mind about not attending the softball tournament? Someone wanting to be with you, I’d suspect would not decline a weekend away.

Originally Posted by MikeP
Her words before were that she didn't want to be here a lot of the time.

Realize she is still on her journey. Her emotional journey.

Keep moving forward. W has demonstrated some positive moment. What you’ve been doing has been working. Remember, your changes and life is for you. If W is interested and attracted to you. If she wants to be with you. Great! Let her catch up. You don’t run from her, yet you don’t stop for her either. Just keep moving along.

Originally Posted by MikeP
One thing I pointed out was her saying she "feels" happy. I asked what was to prevent her from not "feeling" happy again and wanting out. No answer. Mostly no answers to anything.

I know you will have lots of questions. Will want lots of answers. Unfortunately, those likely will need to wait for a while more.

Let her lead with what she is willing to tell you. She may not even have answers to why or much of anything. Yet.

Go slow and keep things out of the interrogation realm.

Originally Posted by MikeP
I don't want to push her away and I don't want to wake up 5 years from now to another BD.

Good.

The first one you can control. The second you can only find acceptance and a level of comfort towards.

Originally Posted by MikeP
I’m at a loss. I know that I need to just keep on with the basic principals of DBing as far as GALing, 180, improving myself, etc. Beyond that, what's next?

You keep doing you. GAL, improving, and such.

Something next. Usually there is some testing. To see if we LBS have truly changed, have forgiven or can forgive, and so on. It’s all very unfair, being the situation of an affair and all. smile Yet, it is what it is. Take the high road and realize for a while you will still need to do the lion’s share.

Boundaries will be tested. W, probably unknowingly, will see how far she can push you. Ensure you know what you want in and from a relationship. And that you can articulate it. Not just I want to feel safe and happy. Defined behaviour that show you she is a person you can respect and trust. Articulating this is not for W, it for you. (Although, there may be a time to tell her.) Being able to put into words, demands those held values are more than mere emotional influences.

In time, with your calm influence and example, hopefully, W will come to and demonstrate such consistent positive behaviour.

Originally Posted by MikeP
She thinks that my being willing to stay with her after the A, which she still has never admitted was physical, means I should just be willing to move on.

A truth dart would be useful methinks. “No, it does not mean I’m willing to move on. It means I am willing to move forward and heal from the hurt. To not just sweep this under the rug and pretend it never happened. I am willing to discuss and grow and have a better relationship. How about you?”

Of course W would like the easy way out of this. You can hold her accountable, with compassion, empathy, and forgiveness. Go slow.

Trust is easily destroyed, and difficult to regain. Trustworthy behaviour is required. As well as a willingness to see such.

Originally Posted by MikeP
It's hard to trust someone that doesn't really express remorse.

However, it’s kind of a catch 22 here as well. We need to extend some trust so they feel safe enough to show remorse and be open.

Originally Posted by MikeP
My initial thought is to just carry on for now and see where things go. Any advice would be appreciated.

Yep, keep on keeping on.

Do more of what works, and less of what doesn’t.

With her admission and opening up, do you have a list of things you need to see? Things, behaviours, questions, whatever, that demonstrate to you that she is making forward positive progress. A solutions journal for example. MWD speaks about such. It may help you realize the small steps she actually does take and how it is leading to the goal. Or when it skews away from the goal.

Give her time, she will demonstrate if she truly is upon the path or still getting there.

D


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
Be direct about your needs and intentions. “Your father’s health and needs are our number one priority right now. We will revisit our relationship and some of my concerns in the future. That clearly dictates that everything isn’t peachy king right now”.

Last edited by Boat14; 04/25/23 04:34 PM.
2 members like this: Ready2Change, MikeP
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
How's that fear thing now ?

: )

You know I'm gonna come at ya from a different perspective, cause that's what I do....

Reading this, I get the feeling that the situation with your FIL is actually taking the front seat anyhow.

Some of what you/her are saying makes sense, yet a LOT of it doesn't.

A WAS that wants to come back, yet isn't pursuing, doesn't want to put the effort in to work on things, let alone a Woman that doesn't appear to want to work toward a healthy, happy, emotional connection... ????


Hmmm.....

Mike, I really feel as if she is facing the loss of her Father, and facing the loss of you, and everything that has been "real" in her life to this point, and she is scared schidtless that the bottom is gonna fall out of everything for her, and she is looking to YOU to be her safe spot to land...

I think a lot of this is a "touch and go" for her. She is trying to say the right things , yet just enough to keep you "close" for her next patch of unknown. Words and actions certainly aren't aligning.

I would suggest this....

Make yourself a list of what a reconciliation would look like for you. What supports the person that you are becoming, where you want to be. A template of sorts, of what you want in a partner. How they define love, and how they support you in your morals and values.

Then be totally honest with yourself when you hold her up to it....

Without total brutal honesty, open communication, and transparency from both parties, there can be no trust rebuilt. and I certainly don't see you both there.....


On another note....

Did you find that site ?

I think it was "Bullnose Ford Trucks".....on Read it....(or something similarly spelled)...



For now ???

Words change nothing....

Keep being Mike for now, deal with what is in front of you immediately.

IF this is real, then that is long road, and you WILL have time to figure it out.

And whatever you do, DO NOT sell yourself, just so that you can say that you are still married....

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Thanks guys, I will carry on for now and use your suggestions. I definitely need to write down what reconciliation looks like to me.
Mach, I was talking with a friend and brought up the same concerns. I’m afraid, there’s that fear again, that she is trying to get back to a secure, safe place while we go through this with her dad. When things get better(or worse) then she may not feel the same way about us. I know that’s out of my control, still think it’s a legitimate concern. Also, I found a couple of Fb pages for Bull nose Fords, wasn’t sure if you were on either of them.

D- no she did mot change her mind. Lots of excuses to not go. What are you gonna do?

I think with everything going on right now I will take her words as a small positive sign and just keep on doing what I’ve been doing. No rush, I just hate that at some point things could fall apart due to me not letting her sweep everything under the rug, so to speak.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by MikeP
Thanks guys, I will carry on for now and use your suggestions. I definitely need to write down what reconciliation looks like to me.
Mach, I was talking with a friend and brought up the same concerns. I’m afraid, there’s that fear again, that she is trying to get back to a secure, safe place while we go through this with her dad. When things get better(or worse) then she may not feel the same way about us. I know that’s out of my control, still think it’s a legitimate concern. Also, I found a couple of Fb pages for Bull nose Fords, wasn’t sure if you were on either of them.

D- no she did mot change her mind. Lots of excuses to not go. What are you gonna do?

I think with everything going on right now I will take her words as a small positive sign and just keep on doing what I’ve been doing. No rush, I just hate that at some point things could fall apart due to me not letting her sweep everything under the rug, so to speak.


It's possible that is what she is looking for...

However, I don't see so many of the signs that a person would have, if they are wanting back into a relationship....

There is a certain aspect of "from this day forward" that you will have to recognize, yet there should be a higher level of really wanting this, that should be out there too....

I would suggest just dropping the expectations for now....

Don't expect that things will work out...

Yet, also, don't expect that they won't work out either....

Answers will come in time, and not your time either....

For now ?

Nothing has changed, so why should you ???


I'm on a couple of them, the one from earlier today is the easiest one to see it on...

Just look for 1984....

Let me know if you like it...

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
No expectations is probably more important now because I let myself get my hopes up. Just need yo remember this and carry on.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
1 member likes this: Mach1
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Last couple if days have been really hard. I feel like I’m back to square one at times. Sad, angry, just generally down in the dumps. I “feel” like I’m being played by W. Those feelings again, as stubborn as those fears. Feel like she’s here for the wrong reasons, not here to be with me. Ever since she told me she was happy again yet wants to sweep everything under the rug and move on I’ve been in a major funk. I look at her or think about how she is now and I wonder what happened to the girl I’ve loved my whole life. This isn’t her and I don’t even know if I love her anymore. Still in love with a memory. That was hard to type. I just don’t see a future with her right now and it [censored].

A part of the convo I forgot about- When she told me she was happy again I asked if her feelings towards me had changed. She didn’t understand the question. I said you told me on BD (I used different terminology) that you weren’t in love with me anymore, is that still true? She said I love you and then tried to say it was the same thing. We talked about it some more and I dropped it. Maybe it shouldn’t have bothered me so much. Maybe I’m just splitting hairs. She is happier acting yet she definitely doesn’t seem like she’s in love again.

I said I would move forward as if that conversation didn’t happen. I can’t seem to though. I feel like an idiot, maybe I should move on. I’m not doing a good job at all lately of trying to forgive her. Maybe I’m really as bad as she thought I was and will be happier with out me.

Last edited by DnJ; 04/28/23 04:44 PM. Reason: Corrected typo.

M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 569
Likes: 46
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Mar 2020
Posts: 569
Likes: 46
Hey Mike, I'm going to be blunt, she doesn't mean it. People who regret their decisions and want to make things work realize their mistakes and want to atone for them, not sweep them under the rug. If you falter now, and stop DBing you will be back.

As far as you looking at her differently, it doesn't surprise me. What newbies don't realize is there are more than a few marriages that could have been "saved" on these forums and in life, however like you are now, so many before you came to realize their self worth and want more out of their spouse and choose to leave anyway. Sometimes the journey just isn't worth the destination.

Sounds like you got some hard decisions coming up. Please continue to be active.


Me: 40
EX:37
Together 17 years
Married 16 years
5 kids, 20,18,15,14,11

BD 03/06/20, divorced 12/23/21
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by JosephS
Hey Mike, I'm going to be blunt, she doesn't mean it. People who regret their decisions and want to make things work realize their mistakes and want to atone for them, not sweep them under the rug. If you falter now, and stop DBing you will be back.

As far as you looking at her differently, it doesn't surprise me. What newbies don't realize is there are more than a few marriages that could have been "saved" on these forums and in life, however like you are now, so many before you came to realize their self worth and want more out of their spouse and choose to leave anyway. Sometimes the journey just isn't worth the destination.

Sounds like you got some hard decisions coming up. Please continue to be active.

I think her not meaning it is my problem. I didn’t believe it after I really thought about it and it feels like more lies. Maybe she’s not lying to me, lying to herself.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
Originally Posted by MikeP
Originally Posted by JosephS
Hey Mike, I'm going to be blunt, she doesn't mean it. People who regret their decisions and want to make things work realize their mistakes and want to atone for them, not sweep them under the rug. If you falter now, and stop DBing you will be back.

As far as you looking at her differently, it doesn't surprise me. What newbies don't realize is there are more than a few marriages that could have been "saved" on these forums and in life, however like you are now, so many before you came to realize their self worth and want more out of their spouse and choose to leave anyway. Sometimes the journey just isn't worth the destination.

Sounds like you got some hard decisions coming up. Please continue to be active.

I think her not meaning it is my problem. I didn’t believe it after I really thought about it and it feels like more lies. Maybe she’s not lying to me, lying to herself.

WASs, and WWs in particular, do a lot of lying to themselves, no doubt about it.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Just reread Michelle’s article on forgiveness. Going to start rereading her book later this afternoon, I’ll have several hours alone to get started.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
1 member likes this: Rockon
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
Originally Posted by SteveLW
WASs, and WWs in particular, do a lot of lying to themselves, no doubt about it.
And they TRUELY BELIEVE them.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 9,309
Likes: 283
Originally Posted by MikeP
A part of the convo I forgot about- When she told me she was happy again I asked if her feelings towards me had changed. She didn’t understand the question. I said you told me on BD (I used different terminology) that you weren’t in love with me anymore, is that still true? She said I love you and then tried to say it was the same thing. We talked about it some more and I dropped it. Maybe it shouldn’t have bothered me so much. Maybe I’m just splitting hairs. She is happier acting yet she definitely doesn’t seem like she’s in love again.
You are not going to talk your way through this.

You have to completely change the way you interact with her. Most guys do not understand how important this is. You have to reinvent who you are and how you interact with everyone, especially her. It is important for you to look at this through completely different "glasses".

Do you know your SMV? Is it higher or lower than at bomb drop?

One big onion to peel back. Layer by layer. So many layers.


Being in love vs feeling in love vs loving someone are all different. There are different types of love as well. the more types that she has for you , the better. Your behavior can elicited these different feelings in her. Other behaviors of yours can also kill these feelings. You have to figure out what type of feelings you want her to experience while in your presence and then behave accordingly.




Like I said above, you are not going to talk your way through this, but you can use your words to stir up feelings within her. You should not be talking to her to have a logical discussion. You should instead want your words to do things such as turn her on. Watch her actions/reactions for her true beliefs/intentions etc.

Do not be boring. Have fun. Don't take her behavior supper serious.

Love her. Hate her behavior if warranted.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
This was a convo she initiated, I haven't started an R talk in months. I do interact differently with her now and there really isn't much difference in how she responds to me. Nothing I do turns her on apparently. There just isn't any spark there. Once I realized the talking was going nowhere I just shut up and let her speak her peace. I am aware that I am most likely making a bigger deal out of the "in love" aspect. Just having a hard time this week.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
B
Member
Offline
Member
B
Joined: Sep 2009
Posts: 318
Likes: 87
I don’t think your W is lying to you or herself. I think she wants to have feelings for you in the way that she had them for OM. She’s just not emotionally mature enough to realize that it’s not going happen. Unless you are willing to except this you are going to suffer immensely. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle. The innocence of your marriage was destroyed when she decided to have an affair. I think you are going to have to dig down and decide what is most important to you. Keeping your family together while waiting for the other shoe to drop? Letting her know that status quo is not working for you?

The good news is you don’t have to make that decision today or tomorrow. You’ve been given the gift of time so use it wisely.

1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Boat14
I don’t think your W is lying to you or herself. I think she wants to have feelings for you in the way that she had them for OM. She’s just not emotionally mature enough to realize that it’s not going happen. Unless you are willing to except this you are going to suffer immensely. You can’t put the genie back in the bottle. The innocence of your marriage was destroyed when she decided to have an affair. I think you are going to have to dig down and decide what is most important to you. Keeping your family together while waiting for the other shoe to drop? Letting her know that status quo is not working for you?

The good news is you don’t have to make that decision today or tomorrow. You’ve been given the gift of time so use it wisely.

For now I'm willing to wait for the other shoe to drop while trying to keep our family together. If d13 were 4-5 years older I might have a different view on that. It's hard when she acts like everything is ok, even initiating sex, when I feel deep down she doesn't even want to be with me. I was asked before if it would be worth going through this if eventually we wind up in a better R than before. It is worth it, just have my doubts we will get there. Another thing I haven't mentioned is that she drinks too much, in my opinion. That's when she seems "happy" to be here. I have no problem with drinking, having a Summer Shandy while I type this. I think she is using alcohol to make things feel better. I've talked to her before about my concerns, didn't change anything.


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Thanks to everyone that gives advice and reads my rambling posts. I feel like a lunatic sometimes bouncing from thought to thought, venting on here with contradictory posts. Things feel so good with W at times and I slip into that old feeling of comfort and familiarity. Then something triggers a memory or reaction and things fall apart. Honestly, I've been doing terribly at DBing lately. I need to get back to work and have been actively searching. Tested for a job I really want yesterday. Losing my routine of going to work has been much harder than I anticipated. I'm starting to read DR again and start over from square one. I know what I need to do, just gotta do it. Thanks again


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Feb 2018
Posts: 9,822
Likes: 226
Originally Posted by MikeP
Thanks to everyone that gives advice and reads my rambling posts. I feel like a lunatic sometimes bouncing from thought to thought, venting on here with contradictory posts. Things feel so good with W at times and I slip into that old feeling of comfort and familiarity. Then something triggers a memory or reaction and things fall apart. Honestly, I've been doing terribly at DBing lately. I need to get back to work and have been actively searching. Tested for a job I really want yesterday. Losing my routine of going to work has been much harder than I anticipated. I'm starting to read DR again and start over from square one. I know what I need to do, just gotta do it. Thanks again

Hang in there Mike, it will all work out for the best.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
Mike big hugs brother. Go get this.


M:52 W: 51
T:27 M:25
D26 S24 S21 D20
BD:2022
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
What's goin on in your world Mike ?

Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Originally Posted by Mach1
What's goin on in your world Mike ?
Not much has changed. We are getting along well, I’m starting a new job a week from now, and things are good. I have been staying busy working in the yard. D13’s freshman sb season just ended and she was pulled up to Varsity so we are excited about that. S17 will graduate in a few weeks, also exciting. Glad to be getting back to work yet a little bummed.
W did ask me recently if I wanted her to find another job. I replied that she knows how I feel about it and the decision is hers to make. Added that in the end I don’t believe her working there and sweeping everything under the rug is going to work out for us. Told her that I’m not happy with her lack of effort to work on our problems but I’m willing to see where it goes.
So I’m doing much better at living life as it is and have been in a very good headspace for a couple of weeks. I truly think I have accepted where we are and that I’ll survive this ordeal wether our R does or not. I know in the recent past I thought I felt that way. I think it’s real now. No worries or expectations and life is pretty good. Thanks for checking on me. How about you?


M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
M
Member
Offline
Member
M
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 4,687
Likes: 236
Originally Posted by MikeP
Originally Posted by Mach1
What's goin on in your world Mike ?
Not much has changed. We are getting along well, I’m starting a new job a week from now, and things are good. I have been staying busy working in the yard. D13’s freshman sb season just ended and she was pulled up to Varsity so we are excited about that. S17 will graduate in a few weeks, also exciting. Glad to be getting back to work yet a little bummed.
W did ask me recently if I wanted her to find another job. I replied that she knows how I feel about it and the decision is hers to make. Added that in the end I don’t believe her working there and sweeping everything under the rug is going to work out for us. Told her that I’m not happy with her lack of effort to work on our problems but I’m willing to see where it goes.
So I’m doing much better at living life as it is and have been in a very good headspace for a couple of weeks. I truly think I have accepted where we are and that I’ll survive this ordeal wether our R does or not. I know in the recent past I thought I felt that way. I think it’s real now. No worries or expectations and life is pretty good. Thanks for checking on me. How about you?



Is that different from you ? Stating your needs ???

It sounds healthy for you...

Word of caution though...

When an WAS returns, there are two schools. Some come back hard, while others come back (and yours appears this way) with a whisper of doubt.


Yet ALL of them fear judgement, and failure.

Most fear falling back into old patterns .



That is the reason I asked you to define what reconciliation looked like for you.

She is giving the appearance of wanting to work on things in her own way, which is entirely different from your way. And that CAN be okay as long as the requirements are being met.

I guess what I'm saying is this...

Be careful with your words, be even more careful with your expectations.

Unspoken expectations are really just resentments waiting to happen....

Listen without defending, speak without offending...

Seek to understand, so that you can be understood....


You have the tools, and they are more finely honed than hers at this point, don't use them as a blade against her....


I know it sounds strange, and small to worry about, yet every word is important right now. Standing firm on your boundaries is important now....

Just remember, a WAS will not return to a situation that they were trying to get away from....


Me?

I'm getting there slowly.

It's been a long , tough road for sure.

Days are starting to brighten though little by little.

I've kinda slacked off on projects on my truck since spring. Just enjoying driving it for now, although I am lining up a couple things coming up. Mowing for me, and maintenance on my neighbor's machinery has been taking some time.

Just life ya know ?

I was wondering if you had a chance to take a look at it on the reddit site. It's been fun to get back into.

Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
M
MikeP Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
M
Joined: Oct 2022
Posts: 312
Likes: 59
Stating my needs is definitely different for me, we didn’t have much communication pre-BD. I tried to state what I thought we needed to help get past this without any anger or spite. I also want her to not think I am being a pushover, even though it honestly seems that way. I said that if the best she could do right now was to move on like nothing happened then I would go along with it, albeit with doubt that it is going to work out in the end. She definitely fears judgement, she has started numerous times that she doesn’t think I’ll ever forgive her completely. I simply say, every time, that I choose to forgive her yet I won’t forget it. She fears that it will be something I’ll always bring up if I am angry with her. My answer to that is that I have no desire to spend the rest of my life being angry about it and using it against her. Why would I want to stay together yet keep bringing if up, she would obviously not hang around long. I am mostly at peace with how things are for now. I fear that once my father in law gets better,🤞🏻, she may become “unhappy” again. Time will tell. I have been staying busy taking care of the in laws property and helping her mom get by.

Glad to hear things are looking up. hope you find happiness after all you’ve been through. I forgot about the truck again, dang it. I’m getting on Reditt as soon as I post this! Thanks for the words of wisdom as always.

Last edited by MikeP; 05/15/23 06:54 PM.

M:50 W:48
T:33 M:25
D23, S17, D13
BD:4/2/22
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
R
Member
Offline
Member
R
Joined: Sep 2022
Posts: 1,183
Likes: 222
Following along Mike and Mach. I left Reddit like I left Twitter. But I’d like to see that truck! And your new bike Mike! 😊


M:52 W: 51
T:27 M:25
D26 S24 S21 D20
BD:2022
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
D
DnJ Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
Hello Mike

Please start a new thread.

D


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
1 member likes this: MikeP
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472
D
DnJ Offline
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jan 2018
Posts: 4,645
Likes: 472


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
Page 1 of 11 1 2 3 10 11

Moderated by  Cadet, DnJ, job, Michele Weiner-Davis 

Link Copied to Clipboard