Living With WAW 4

[Kind18]

I can feel W questioning things right now. She has been teetering between acting the same as she has for the past 8 months (man, time has flown by) and checking if I'm still a viable backup plan if the fantasy life she is seeking falls apart.

Why not flip the script?

Why don’t YOU file?

You know it’s coming eventually from her. She has it all planned out. She’s just terribly disorganised like they all are. But some time in February you know it’s going to happen. She might spend another month or so playing these BS games where she hugs or or says ILY.

I couldn’t stand being in permanent limbo with someone who is treating me like a cat playing with a dead mouse, and checking if her monkey branch is holding solid.

Make sure you don’t live in an at-fault jurisdiction, and then take your power back.

[Kind18]

Keeping a copy of that plan in her purse would be a smart move too.

[BL42]

DW17,

Last weekend she asked me if I'd ever ask her to marry me again. I got caught off guard and responded with “that’s a pretty heavy question” and shifted to something else.

"Um...we are married?"

It feels like when a waitress is overly happy with you and you know it’s fake.

I definitely know all about the overly happy laughing way too loud to be genuine. You should hear ExW at S7's games.

The other day she dropped an ILY multiple times in a joking manner, like she was waiting for me to say ILY too. She was trying to gauge my reaction. I don't think she has said this since probably May. It's been so long I don't even remember. Again, I was caught off guard and just didn’t respond.

I'm curious what folks think about the "marry me again" / hugs / ILYs. I never got anything close to those. Better than getting hooked and being needy for sure, but perhaps there's a more attractive way to respond than ignoring?

I’m proud of how I’ve handled things without getting emotional one way or another. Part of me is starting to get excited about the possibilities that lie ahead for my future. But another part of me expects W to crash at some point, likely months to years after we split and it’s hard trying to decide if it’s worth waiting to see if/when that happens. I know I have to ignore it because it’s out of my control.

Keep up the good work DW17. You are the dad your kids deserve.

[Ready2Change]

I'm curious what folks think about the "marry me again" / hugs / ILYs. I never got anything close to those. Better than getting hooked and being needy for sure, but perhaps there's a more attractive way to respond than ignoring?

I like the idea of using body language, facial expressions, and tone. There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

Last weekend she asked me if I'd ever ask her to marry me again. I got caught off guard and responded with “that’s a pretty heavy question” and shifted to something else.

"Nope, only plan on being married once. Too bad it didn't work out" There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

She came up behind me and hugged me while I was washing dishes and asked why I wouldn't hug her. I said I had to go get my laundry and left the room.

"I might turn you on and I don't want to give you the wrong impression." There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

The other day she dropped an ILY multiple times in a joking manner, like she was waiting for me to say ILY too.

I would respond differently every time. "i can tell..too bad you can't have me" or "Ya, you want to show me how much you love me?" or "I love you more!" There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

Those were just off the top of my head.



Humor, confidence, sexual insinuations, cocky, etc...

I really don't know how one could learn these skills without practice.


Passing "hsit tests" is an art and a skill.

[DW17]

Thanks for the advice everyone.

Why not flip the script?

Why don’t YOU file?

You know it’s coming eventually from her. She has it all planned out. She’s just terribly disorganised like they all are. But some time in February you know it’s going to happen. She might spend another month or so playing these BS games where she hugs or or says ILY.

I couldn’t stand being in permanent limbo with someone who is treating me like a cat playing with a dead mouse, and checking if her monkey branch is holding solid.

Make sure you don’t live in an at-fault jurisdiction, and then take your power back.

I’ve spent some time thinking about this and will continue thinking about it. For me, it’s a debate between taking my power by filing first and taking my power by forcing her to be the one to pull the trigger on our 22 year relationship. I told my kids initially that I’d give it a year and I’d give my best effort to make it work. That means a lot to me as well. Plans do change, but I want my kids to know that I did as much as I could.

I'm curious what folks think about the "marry me again" / hugs / ILYs. I never got anything close to those. Better than getting hooked and being needy for sure, but perhaps there's a more attractive way to respond than ignoring?

I haven’t gotten any hugs/ILYs/etc pretty much this entire time. Maybe a hug or two several months ago, but that’s it. And even those were just comforting hugs when something sad was going on. I know I should have responded more attractively than “uh oh…don’t know what to do….get away from me”, but I was completely caught off guard. It’s pretty funny in hindsight.

R2C, thanks for your suggestions on how to approach some of these situations. I’m normally pretty good at responding in an attractive way so now that I know to possibly expect these interactions, I’ll be less awkward next time.

This week I intend to meet with one more lawyer before I commit to one. The one I reached out to hasn’t returned my messages, which is probably a red flag despite the reviews she has online. I’ll have that sorted out by tomorrow.

[DW17]

Reading through Doug54's thread and it made me think of a few more things.

Ran into one of W's friends while out today and she remarked to me, unsolicited, "So, (W) is going crazy, huh? Midlife crisis?" You can't make this stuff up. This was an old friend whom W had somewhat reconnected with a little. I said "You can tell? I thought it was just me."

I just had this same experience this weekend, only W’s friend added that it seems like W never grew up. It’s weird how everyone else notices the changes except the one going through MLC. They surround themselves with people who won’t questions things, people who are struggling themselves.

D18 had a soccer game this weekend and her bf’s parents were there. W told me that the bf’s mom came up to her at half time and asked if she was doing okay because she had heard W was not doing well. W said she responded that she is doing great and living her best life and seemed genuinely dumbfounded that anyone would think otherwise. She is depressed, doesn’t sleep, doesn’t spend time with her kids, lost a bunch of weight because she barely eats (zero exercise), spends 2 hours/day in the bathtub, her 18 yr marriage is about to end, etc…and she still tries to convince herself she’s living her best life.

W also asked me why my mom no longer comments on her FB posts with pics of the kids now that she found out we were separating. I said I didn’t know but I should check on my mom since I hadn’t spoken to her in a bit. W never had a great relationship with my mom. I know W’s expectation of post-D life is rainbows and unicorns, but it was weird that she seemed confused by this. W only has a few family members that live here (parents, sister, 1 nephew), so maybe it’s related to losing the rest of the people she could still consider family. Who knows, that’s for her to figure out. But it was interesting to think about.

[BL42]

DW17,

Last weekend she asked me if I'd ever ask her to marry me again. I got caught off guard and responded with “that’s a pretty heavy question” and shifted to something else.

"Nope, only plan on being married once. Too bad it didn't work out" There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

She came up behind me and hugged me while I was washing dishes and asked why I wouldn't hug her. I said I had to go get my laundry and left the room.

"I might turn you on and I don't want to give you the wrong impression." There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

The other day she dropped an ILY multiple times in a joking manner, like she was waiting for me to say ILY too.

I would respond differently every time. "i can tell..too bad you can't have me" or "Ya, you want to show me how much you love me?" or "I love you more!" There would definitely be a twinkle in my eye and slight grin. Wink and a walk away. Confident and happy.

R2C is nailing these responses. You can see how light and fun and flirty they are. It's hard not to act hurt when you are a hurt LBS in IHS, but better to be playful and attractive.

Humor, confidence, sexual insinuations, cocky, etc...

I really don't know how one could learn these skills without practice.

Passing "hsit tests" is an art and a skill.

R2C do you respond like that to ExW? Wonder if you practice on her just to make her wonder what she threw away.

Why not flip the script?

Why don’t YOU file?

I’ve spent some time thinking about this and will continue thinking about it. For me, it’s a debate between taking my power by filing first and taking my power by forcing her to be the one to pull the trigger on our 22 year relationship. I told my kids initially that I’d give it a year and I’d give my best effort to make it work. That means a lot to me as well. Plans do change, but I want my kids to know that I did as much as I could.

Don't rush into anything DW17. I totally get the flip the script and take back the power, and part of me wishes I had packed up then-W's things in some boxes during affair/IHS and left them out on the porch for her, but on the other hand you want to be able to say to your kids and yourself you didn't give up. It's a hard decision, not one you need to race into.

I know I should have responded more attractively than “uh oh…don’t know what to do….get away from me”, but I was completely caught off guard.

Understandable. Most of us wouldn't be prepared for that either. Study what R2C is saying though...

[DW17]

I'm curious what folks think about the "marry me again" / hugs / ILYs.

Well I think I got my answer, or at least part of it, courtesy of D18. She said W was talking to her in the car the other day and said she was going to kill me with kindness because she is about to break my heart. W has been noticeably nicer the past week or so, but this is the exact reason you guys say not to get hopes up after positive interactions. You never know the actual motive behind the behavior.

It's weird to me that W is pretending to care about breaking my heart. She did that months ago by being unfaithful again and turning into a terrible mother to my kids. My broken heart has been healing as I’ve tried to accept her as the person she actually is rather than the person I wish she was. I know feelings change, but I don’t know that I’ll feel anything other than disappointment toward her.

Yesterday I decided to drive to the final lawyer that I wanted to speak with, rather than leaving another message. I’m glad I did. We talked for about an hour, she didn’t charge me anything and she was more helpful than the first two I spoke with. She recommended that I try to negotiate with W first and if I need her to look over any paperwork or anything, she will just bill me for that time. I’ve got some things to sort out this week, but I feel much better finding a L that I’m comfortable with. I didn’t get a good vibe from the other ones.

[LH19]

Well I think I got my answer, or at least part of it, courtesy of D18. She said W was talking to her in the car the other day and said she was going to kill me with kindness because she is about to break my heart. W has been noticeably nicer the past week or so, but this is the exact reason you guys say not to get hopes up after positive interactions. You never know the actual motive behind the behavior.

Truthfully she probably doesn't like breaking your heart but won't let that keep her from preventing her PERCEIVED happiness.

It's weird to me that W is pretending to care about breaking my heart. She did that months ago by being unfaithful again and turning into a terrible mother to my kids.

So ask yourself what are you trying to save DW?

My broken heart has been healing as I’ve tried to accept her as the person she actually is rather than the person I wish she was. I know feelings change, but I don’t know that I’ll feel anything other than disappointment toward her.

Why are you disappointed in her?

She recommended that I try to negotiate with W first and if I need her to look over any paperwork or anything, she will just bill me for that time.

You have a good lawyer! Negotiate while she is feeling guilty because that won't last long.

[DW17]

So ask yourself what are you trying to save DW?

At this point, I don’t think I’m trying to save anything. It’s been a slow journey to the realization that I’ll be better without her. I know that feelings change, but I’ve spent a lot of time thinking about some of the questions I’ve been asked here, particularly why I would want to be with this person. I have accepted a few things – It is very likely that I will never truly trust W again and I cannot be in a relationship without trust. It is very unlikely that W will change. She is a broken person from a broken background. She does not take accountability for her faults and likely never will. She does not love herself. I do not trust her to ever put in the work required for self-improvement. This is who she always has been and likely who she will continue to be. Nothing from our 22 years together suggests to me that she will work on any of this.

Despite all of this, a big part of me would love to be the one to help her through it. I have faults that contributed to this situation. But I also know that her upbringing, which she did not get to choose, is something that will cause her problems for the rest of her life. I feel like I know her better than anyone else ever will and that I would be able to help her overcome these issues. I also know that she fired me from that job.

Why are you disappointed in her?

I guess it’s not disappointment toward her as much as disappointment in the situation. It all seems so unnecessary. Being in a relationship and having kids at a young age set me up for this to some degree, but this entire situation seems like something that IC and a few good books 20 years ago could have easily prevented.

You have a good lawyer! Negotiate while she is feeling guilty because that won't last long.

I will spend time thinking about this and how I would approach the situation.