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#2929036 01/27/22 07:59 PM
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I was just asked for a divorce 2 weeks ago. Our marriage has been less than stellar for 5 of the 7 years. A quick run down:
My father died 11/7/14
We married 1/26/15
We bought a house 2/15/15
He moved 3 hours and started a new job, "here" on 4/7/15
His stepfather died 4/11/15 (unexpected)
His mother died 4/22/15 (battle with cancer)
His father died 9/2015
I saw him spiraling down a dark hole of depression, I begged him to talk to me, but he shut me out, I begged him to talk to a professional..........blah, blah, blah. For a couple of years, it was "okay", but the fusses became more frequent; it was almost like he was completely shutting out everyone in his life and he has become and IS, SO angry. He has never hit me. He would break his hand on a wall first, but in my constant pleas of get help, WE are not doing well, stop shutting me out, it has continued to get worse. We haven't slept in the same bed for 2.5 years and haven't had sex in about the same amount of time. We seemed okay until I tried to ask about our lack of communication. They were ALWAYS met with HUGE resistance. In the past 6 months to 1 year, the arguments have become so verbally abusive. He calls me really bad names, tells me that he has told me what needs to change (yet I don't know), says that I left him to wallow in the most difficult time of his life. He set up cameras in our bedroom, like he was spying on me thinking I was cheating and I found them and confronted him and he is gaslighting me into thinking I am in sane. He says that he loves me but WE don't work. This is my 3rd marriage. My first two husbands cheated and I could NOT let it go. This is his first marriage. I am 12 years older than him. I am 52, him, 40. I DO have trust issues, but that was known before and during our courtship and marriage. Normally, with him, I didn't go through his things. He was not like the other two....until I was printing some paper off of the computer and found porn. He admitted it and said it was a one time thing; but here are those trust issues again.
I am at a wall. I DO love him and want my marriage to work. BUT, I seriously don't know which of the techniques I even need to try. He has resorted to literally living in the basement. We speak, very civilly, when I go to the store, I buy the things that he wants, likes, needs. I cook dinner and we have had a few together. As long as conversation stays superficial, we are fine. Anytime I bring up "us" or staying together, his answer is SOLID, that he is resolved on his decision and WE don't work. I 100% believe there is NOT anyone else. He has made zero effort to pack or leave, but the living environment is causing me to walk on eggshells and wonder what is next. Someone please give me some path to go down. After reading Divorce Busting, The 7 steps and listening to "A Woman's Guide to Changing Her Man".............is seriously have NO clue what to do because I don't feel like WE fall into any criteria. He is 100% against therapy. I started therapy a few months ago. His view on therapist are they are overpaid, evil people who tell him what a "f____" up he really is. I am at a loss guys. I welcome any and all help :-)

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Welcome! I am pasting in Cadet's Welcome Thread for you:

Welcome to the board

Sorry you are here but you will meet some wonderful people here and get some great advice.

Yes first thing you should do is be sure to read the Divorce Remedy (DR) book by MWD
http://www.mcssl.com/store/mwdtc2014/
http://divorcebusting.com/sample_book_chapters.htm

and Michele's articles
http://www.divorcebusting.com/articles.htm

You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts
(for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support).
Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active,
and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down.
Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come!
Most important - POST!

Get out and Get a Life (GAL).

DETACH.

Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.

Have NO EXPECTATIONS.

Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.

Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.

Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:

I would start with Sandi's Rules
A list of dos and don'ts for the LBS (left behind spouse)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553072#Post2553072

Going Dark
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=50956#Post5095

Detachment thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2538414#Post2538414

Validation Cheat Sheet: Techniques and tips on how to validate (showing your walk away spouse (WAS) that you recognize and accept his or her opinions as valid, even if you do not agree with them)
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2457566#Post2457566

Boundaries Cheat Sheet
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2536096#Post2536096

Abbreviations
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2553153#Post2553153

For Newcomer LBH with a Wayward Wife by sandi2
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2545554#Post2545554

Resource thread
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forum...ain=57819&Number=2578224#Post2578224

Stages of the LBS
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=1964990&page=1

Validation
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=191764#Post191764

Pursuit and Distance
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2483574#Post2483574

The Lighthouse Story
http://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2484619#Post2484619

Your H or W is giving you a GIFT.
THE GIFT OF TIME.
USE it wisely.

Knowledge is Power - Sir Francis Bacon

Last edited by Cadet; Mon Jun 15 2020 07:23 AM.
Me-67, D35,S34


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Cathy, wow. That was a rough read. Not only because of what you have had to go through which sounds brutal. But also because, I was your husband. Almost everything that you describe with the exception of a couple (the porn and I never called her names, just critical of what she did or didn't do) were things I was guilty of. But I was angry, bitter, entitled. When BD arrived I had actually contemplated BDing her for quite a while.

A few things stand out to me. First, I feel like he is sure he doesn't want to stay with you because he KNOWS that he can have you back anytime he wants. As I said above, I was close to BDing my WAW when BD rolled around in my sitch, and instead it was her telling me she didn't want to be married anymore. Suddenly, she became the THING I had to have. I went from "if she isn't careful I will leave her!" to "OH MY GOODNESS! IF I LOSE HER I WILL DIE!!"

Also, you say you have trust issues. Apparently so does he. Setting up cameras to spy on you? WOW. And it is also contrary to what he says and how he acts. He has shut you out for years. He claims there is no hope for you guys to stay together. But he apparently cared enough to spy on you!

Finally this: " speak, very civilly, when I go to the store, I buy the things that he wants, likes, needs. I cook dinner and we have had a few together. As long as conversation stays superficial, we are fine." This tells me that the first thing that you have to learn is that you CANNOT nice him back to the marriage. So stop this behavior. I mean be civil, but stop going out of your way for him. This man is firing you as his wife, and your reaction (many of us have had this same reaction) is to be more of a wife to him. I did the same thing, "she doesn't want me as a husband, so I will become the best husband she has ever seen!" The problem is that it doesn't work. He will cake eat and let you continue to be a stepford wife, but it won't command his respect.

Notice what I point out above: In my case I thought I didn't want my wife....until I couldn't have her! And he obviously still cares otherwise he wouldn't have spied on you. So, what if you gave him what he wanted? What if you showed him you were willing to move forward with your life without him? In my own sitch some of the things that made her question her decision were: my being willing to sell the house, my telling her I would not be playing house with her after D, my talking to a divorce lawyer, my pushing to talk to our daughter about the split, etc.

I think you have a chance, if you very confidently, very happily, very boldly start moving forward with your life. It may start getting him to realize what he is losing. Go out and GAL like a mad woman. Be busy busy busy. If he asks who you are going out with and where you are going, you tell him that he has fired you as his wife and he doesn't get to ask those kinds of questions. You continue to work on yourself, stay in IC/therapy, learn how to 180 on bad behaviors, and become the best version of yourself that you can be. Become a woman only a fool would leave! And then you also learn to emotionally detach from him. You literally do not let his words and deeds have an effect on you emotionally. When he starts to get angry and lash out and be verbally abusive, you calmly state that you will not allow yourself to be spoken to that way, and then you leave! Go out and do a GAL activity, but you do not stand and allow yourself to be disrespected.

1 or both of two things will eventually happen if you can do the above: one you will become the best version of yourself, happy and healthy, and move forward with your life....NO MATTER WHAT he ultimately decides. If he decides to go through with the divorce, well, you are set up for success in your future life. If he decides to stay, then you can decide what MR 2.0 (your current marriage is dead and should NEVER be allowed to continue to exist) looks like and tell him what you expect from him in order to remain married: IC for him, MC for you both, full transparency from him in every facet of life (email, social media, smart phone, and all electronic devices).

Cathy, we all go through the "I need to do whatever the WAS wants in order to save my marriage." You need to change your perspective to "I need to do whatever I can to move my own life forward happy and healthy". The difference is the latter sets you up for success no matter what your WAH decides. And the latter also sometimes causes the WAS to realize what they are missing and decide they want to stick around.

Cathy, one last thing. Please do not take this a bash, it is just an observation, and something you can explore with your therapist, but it sounds like you've spent a lot of your life as a doormat. Two ex-Hs that cheated on you. A WAH that feels free to speak to you in ways that no man should speak to their wife in. Find your inner-strength, see your own self-worth, and start standing up for yourself!

Please keep posting, and tell us more, and feel free to ask questions.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
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Hello, CathyC. Wow--it sounds like your entire marriage has been filled with difficult times. I'm sorry you've been put into this position for your third marriage in a row. You'll find some supportive people here.

Starting point? The verbal abuse. It's damaging for your psyche and doesn't breed respect in your partner. I would work set boundaries around that. We have a whole thread on boundaries (which control you to protect you) vs. ultimatums (which is an attempt to control other people). Whatever you've done imperfectly, you don't deserve that treatment.

Originally Posted by CathyC
Anytime I bring up "us" or staying together, his answer is SOLID, that he is resolved on his decision and WE don't work.
I would drop relationship talks. The DB approach typically frowns upon them as unhelpful and your personal experience thus far also indicates they're not helping you. This is more "do no harm" than "help".

Q. What binds you to him? Did you have 5-10 great years to offset 5 bad years? Your story makes it sound as if it's mostly been bad times and he never tried to fix things.

Q. Regarding trust issues, where have you misbehaved? Telling him that you have trust issues is good communication, but doesn't absolve you of working on them.

Q. Porn - You say this triggered your trust issues. Why--had he made any promises or vows? Most people can't go 2.5yrs without sex without some form of relief??

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Thanks for the quick resources

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CathyC,

Sorry you're here. That sounds very difficult. I'll try to weigh in more later when I have additional time, but two questions:

1) You're married 7 years, but how long were you together as a couple before marrying?
2) Are there any kids involved? Either together or from a prior relationship?


Me:39 Ex-W:37
M:7 T: 9
S:6 D:3
BD/IHS/Confirm EA/PA: Feb '20
OM1 affair ends: May '20
W/OM2 & moves out: June-July '20
W files for D: Jul20
OM2 confirmed: 9/2020
Divorced: May '21
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We did have 5 years of a wonderful relationship before we were married. He lived three hours away, yet traveled every weekend to my house for visits.
I have not had an affair, nor have I sought out an affair. He knew about my trust issues because I disclosed them to him about my former exes that cheated and one of them was heavily into porn. The porn was after about 6 months of no type of intimacy's, what-so-ever. I seriously quit trying to find it or check a computer history because he is so computer savvy, he wouldn't make that mistake again.
There are no children involved (from either of us).
Steve, I seriously thought that after being called an effing C____ or b____ one more time that I would be the one to ask for the divorce. I have already sought out a lawyer and when he approached me about wanting to file a non contested divorce, I was surprised. Not only does he want half of the equity, but also wants to recover the $30,000 that he put into house restorations (from his inheritance). He wants a non contested divorce so that we do not have to hire lawyers and can "do this ourselves".
I have done enough investigation to know that I can hire a lawyer and I can file an "at fault" divorce and we will likely not even get half of the equity.
One, I don't want to be divorced and as I sit here and type these things, I ask why.
Two, I do not want an ugly, costly divorce and divorces are SO expensive when you get into fault divorces.
I appreciate all of your comments and advise and Steve, you are right....I am trying to be the "best wife that I can be", which is NOT making him miss me at all. It is just really hard with him still in the same house. I desperately want to keep peace and not have any arguing, so I try to make everything, "okay".

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Welcome Cathy. I echo what others have said here. Stop making him the focus and make yourself the focus. Get out of the house. Do not make dinner for him. In fact, when dinner time rolls around, make a point of being elsewhere every few days. Go for a walk, make plans with friends, go to a movie, the gym, etc…. Just don’t do what is expected. And do not tell him what you are doing or report to him in any way. It’s none of his business. Do a really good self assessment and figure out what things you need to change to make you the best you that you can be and get going on it.

I know it is hard. Believe me…when BD happened to me, I just wanted to crawl into the nearest corner, curl up in a little ball and die. I was beyond devastated for many months. People on here just kept telling me to get up and get moving and that eventually my feelings would change. I did not believe them. I did not think that I could ever feel okay again. Being tossed aside in favour of someone else (in my sitch) is the WORST feeling ever. But, as D is fond of saying, feelings are fleeting so we should try very hard to not make critical decisions based on them.

Four years later and I am divorced, XH is married to OW and I have 50/50 custody of my kids. When all of this began, those three things were my absolute worst fears. At the time, I imagined all three of them happening and I literally thought I would die if they did. But guess what? I didn’t die and, in fact, I am doing better than ever. I am happy. I am growing. I am learning. I am dating…lol. My 54th birthday is looming and I’m okay with it.

I’m not sure where the turning point for me was in my situation. I remember that I posted non-stop at all hours of the night just to deal with the emotional pain of it all. I tried to take people’s advice (often failing miserably) and when I felt the least like getting up and out of the house is when I pushed myself the most. New Years came around. I didn’t want to do anything so I hosted a party of about 25 people. I went to staff parties I didn’t want to go to. I made some new female friends. I took my kids on vacation. I improved my diet and started exercising more. And then one day my friend, who had been through a similar situation, looked at me and said, “think of what you have lost and when nothing comes to mind, move on”. I laughed at the time but when I really reflected on what she had said, I realized she had been right. Even though my H had only left four months before then, the truth was that he had left me long, long, long before that and I had been alone for much longer than I cared to recognize. Not sleeping in the same bed for two and a half years? I think you can probably relate. I was married for 12 years and desperately lonely for four of those. I am not lonely anymore.

Having been where you are, I know that what people are saying probably doesn’t feel like it is helping. You want to know what to do to get him back… change his mind. What you need to really understand is that the more you focus on answering those questions, the less likely it is that it will happen. Work on you first. Save yourself. You cannot control what he does. You can only control what you do. I promise you. You will not always feel like this. Use the time you have now for self improvement…not to get him back but to get you back.

BTW…do not go to therapy. Couples therapy only works if both people are going with the same goal. If you are going to save the marriage and he has already decided it is over, he will use whatever is said in session to justify his choice. I don’t care how skilled the therapist is… it will not help.

Hang in there. It gets better with time. (((HUGS)))

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One other thing… verbal abuse… ANY abuse is not okay and has no place in a marriage. You deserve better.

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Thanks for the replies. I had replied, but do not see it. To answer some questions, we had been together for 5 years before we got married. He traveled 3 hours every weekend before that. We do not have any children (neither of us), and as far as the trust issues, he knew about those from my other two marriages when we were dating. He also knew that one of my exes was obsessed with porn, so when I found that here, it did plant a seed or outlook of "here we go again". He is very computer savvy, so I knew that even if he did do it again, he would wipe it away so there was no trace in a browser history.
I DO feel broken right now. As far as therapy, I continue to go. I made the appointment for us and he didn't show up. I continued to go without him. She is now "my" therapist and would refuse to see "us". He believes that therapist are the root of all evil and they are over paid to tell him how f____ up he truly is (those are his words; not mine).
I am desperately seeking advise and comfort to know that I am not alone because some days, I REALLY feel that way. I have a good network, but many are mutual friends and I don't want to necessarily reach out or talk about it with them because I don't want them to feel like they are choosing sides. The friends I have talked to have all said get out now........but I feel like it is always easy for people to say that with no regard to what YOU want.
I feel like I need to do the whole 180, but you guys are right..........I fear then that I WILL lose him for good because he will think, oh well, she doesn't care. I am exhausted. I have struggled with this failing marriage for several years seriously thought that I would be the one to ask for the divorce. I have several letters, where I do just that. But I wrote them and never followed through.

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