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Just another voice against nesting here.

I agreed to nest at the beginning of our separation because H sold it as a trial separation and I was desperate to not believe that he really wanted to leave.

It was brutal and I wholeheartedly do not recommend it. H used it as an opportunity to point out all my flaws and justify his departure 'the house was messy when you left' (it wasn't), 'you left me with no food' (I didn't) 'you purposely left my dirty laundry and didn't do it with the rest of the kids' clothes' (not true, I just didn't get to laundry those two days). Transitions were awful, and the fact that I had to see him and his shark eyes every few days nearly killed me. Peace became more attainable when he actually moved out for real and I was able to claim my space, get into more of a rhythm and start to heal.

And the kids were mightily confused. It was like pulling an old, stuck bandaid off reeeeaalllly slowly. Because H wasn't willing to tell the kids or me the truth (he wanted out and wanted a D), they didn't know up from down. Nor did I.

Nesting is for people who either are amicably separating and have a clear, defined direction (and are both on the same page with themselves and the kids) or it is for cake-eating walkaways and waywards who are confused about what they really want. H had 2 or 3 reconciliation attempts during our nesting phase when he told the children we were never going to get divorced, he loved me more than the earth and sky etc, etc (vomit) etc.

Don't do it.

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I did not want the house, but I stayed until I had a 50/50 parenting plan. I then rented a place, set it up for me and my three kids and moved out of the marital home.




Originally Posted by costanza
so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.
It is really easy. Don't agree to it. Do not try to control her, do not let her control you. Be the best dad ever.

Let her be as angry as she wants, those are her emotions. You are strong enough to not let her emotional state effect yours.

If she wants out of the marriage bad enough, she will move out.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
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Costanza,

to clarify-- I do not think you should nest either (or at least, if it was me, I would not nest). When I said you can't control her, I meant you can't force her to do anything-- stay, go, be a happy wife, etc. Just like she can't force YOU to go or to nest.

If I were you, I'd spend some time really, really thinking about what YOU want.

Do you want to stay married/stand for your marriage under the current circumstances? No one here will judge you if you decide you can't. But this is critical information for you to know yourself and for folks here to give you advice based on your goals.

She can't force you to nest if you don't want to. If she wants to leave, she can leave. If she doesn't want to go permanently and you decide it is too painful/hard to live under the same roof as her when you are separated (remembering that you can't control her behavior), then you can choose to move out yourself or to nest. It is up to you. Your primary responsibility is to be the best dad you can be for your kids. If you think that nesting is the best way to do that, then by all means, but I would read the experiences of others really carefully. Be very very sure you're only doing it for your children and not out of a secret hope that it will result in an R. Like Sage says, it can be really difficult for the children-- and for me, I really felt like if we split, I was going to need to really focus on my own mental health and healing in order to be the best mom I could be. Nesting (or really any contact besides the bare minimum) wasn't going to help me heal and move on.

If you decide you don't want to nest and you don't want to move out yourself, then you just tell her-- hey, I've thought about this some more, and I'm not interested in nesting. I don't want to divorce or separate. I understand this is what you want, but I don't think nesting will be good for me or our kids.


Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs
9/20 - present: R and piecing
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Originally Posted by costanza
I asked my WAS to move out of the house last Tuesday, the lack of respect, her alcoholism and her "moving on" while under the same roof, just threw me over the edge.
Ok Costanza this sounds like a control issue. She has to move out because she is moving on from you? Remember you have try to keep your emotions in check. Please explain in more detail what happened?

I dunno, it just seems like common sense and decency to me. Obviously moving on in front of the others face 2 months after the separation announcement is just childish and mean. Under normal circumstances where x-spouses don't hate each other and there was no abuse, etc... i don't see how one can just expect it to be normal to start flirting in front of the recently ended 12 year relationship. Once again, the person I knew would not have done this.

Originally Posted by costanza
She moved to her parents home 10 minutes away. We've been swapping the kids every two days.
The kids are staying at your grandparents?

No, the kids stay 2 days with me, then 2 days with their mom at the g-parents, and back with me for two days, and so on....

Originally Posted by costanza
Not having them fulltime is killing me, I miss my family soo much it hurts.
It $ucks. I can tell you the feeling will lessen in time. You will even start to feel guilty because you will look forward to alone time.

Yes, The time alone does help, it gives me time for this board and GAL.

Originally Posted by costanza
I've been seeing a lot of friends and family, but it's just not the same.
It's good you are getting out.

Originally Posted by costanza
I never envisioned this lifestyle for myself. I loved having a family and full house.
This is why so many people here struggle. It's not about the spouse its about the loss of the future of the family. There is a poster on here Scotty B who really struggles with this part. You should read his thread.

You nailed it, its all the future plans that went down the drain that hurt so much. We had a sabbatical planned in 2 years. 8 months in Costa Rica and 4 months in Europe. Our house would've been paid off, things were looking great.

Originally Posted by costanza
I still find it shocking that my WAS wouldn't consider therapy and is ready and more than willing to walk away from everything we built.

Right now she can not see a happy future with you. They may change down the road.

Originally Posted by costanza
I keep expecting to wake up from this horrible dream. I really need to come to terms with this fast.
This is going to take a really long time so you need to be patient with yourself.

Originally Posted by costanza
I struggle with "the new her" she's become the past year, she's a completely different person.
How has she changed?

I believe I touched on this in the earlier posts. She became almost unrecognizable 1 month after the SSRI's. 2 months into SSRI's she became an alcoholic, when the medication says to not even consume alcohol. Went from someone that wouldn't even get in a car with someone that drank, to drinking and driving herself. She totaled our car a few hours after drinking with coworkers at lunch.
Denied a drinking problem, yet every measure clearly shows it. Always taking on new projects at work, and doing less with/for the kids and home. Became an extreme extrovert, loads of energy. Very functional at work and university even considering the drinking. I can go on if you'd like a better picture.

Originally Posted by costanza
She said she's trying to get the drinking under control, she's also booked an appointment with her doctor to discuss her situation. Seems her parents, the car accident (and I) finally broke through her alcoholism denials.
It's good that she is acknowledging it.

Originally Posted by costanza
I'm not convinced she'll be 100% open and honest with her doctor, but after reading you all I understand that its not my problem anymore. My concern in all this is obviously the kids.
Originally Posted by costanza
Well when it comes to the safety of the kids it is your problem.

That's been my point from the start. It's terrifying.

[quote=costanza] She agreed to move out for 2 weeks, however she expects to come back and we start swapping the family home until official separation.
Actually I don't think this is a bad idea as long as its temporary. Meaning she is looking for a house come the new year.
Originally Posted by costanza
A few of you suggested I grab my balls back and refuse, but like May22 says, it's not really in my control.
I think May meant you can't force her to move out. You certainly don't need to nest if you don't want to.

Originally Posted by costanza
I can't legally kick her out of the house, I also can't expect her to respect "house rules", so I don't see how I can avoid nesting for the remaining month or two. I'm open to suggestions.
What are these house rules? When I was in house separated there was one rule, you watch the kids when it was your night to watch them.

I was aiming for decency, no overt flirting and not crawling in drunk at 2am.

Originally Posted by costanza
I haven't resumed contact with the friend/x-GF or any others based on everyone's suggestion.
Uuum congratulations on staying celibate for two weeks while being married.

I understand your shot. The way I see it is, I lost my wife last year 3-4 weeks after she started the SSRI's. It's been incredibly lonely even though we lived together. It wasn't the same person, we didn't talk, joke or spend time together in the same way. The memories were swept under the rug. She wasted no time to start flirting with coworkers and anyone else that will give some attention.

Originally Posted by costanza
I'm still a little perplexed by this one though.
Seriously?
Originally Posted by costanza
Is it in the goal of focusing on just me and not confusing my thoughts?

You can't do that without sticking your penis in another women's vagina?
Originally Posted by costanza
Is it to focus on reconciling if that is in fact what the LBS wants?
It's to focus on yourself and your kids.
Originally Posted by costanza
Is it to avoid hurting someone else?
Seriously? You better hope Ginger does come to your thread.
Originally Posted by costanza
I mean my WAS is clear she's moving on, are we LBS' expected to remain celibate?
LOL. Yeah I think you can keep your dick in your pants until after Christmas.
Originally Posted by costanza
Any info on this one is also appreciated.
See above.

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Originally Posted by Sage4
Just another voice against nesting here.

I agreed to nest at the beginning of our separation because H sold it as a trial separation and I was desperate to not believe that he really wanted to leave.

It was brutal and I wholeheartedly do not recommend it. H used it as an opportunity to point out all my flaws and justify his departure 'the house was messy when you left' (it wasn't), 'you left me with no food' (I didn't) 'you purposely left my dirty laundry and didn't do it with the rest of the kids' clothes' (not true, I just didn't get to laundry those two days). Transitions were awful, and the fact that I had to see him and his shark eyes every few days nearly killed me. Peace became more attainable when he actually moved out for real and I was able to claim my space, get into more of a rhythm and start to heal.

And the kids were mightily confused. It was like pulling an old, stuck bandaid off reeeeaalllly slowly. Because H wasn't willing to tell the kids or me the truth (he wanted out and wanted a D), they didn't know up from down. Nor did I.

Nesting is for people who either are amicably separating and have a clear, defined direction (and are both on the same page with themselves and the kids) or it is for cake-eating walkaways and waywards who are confused about what they really want. H had 2 or 3 reconciliation attempts during our nesting phase when he told the children we were never going to get divorced, he loved me more than the earth and sky etc, etc (vomit) etc.

Don't do it.

I believe my situation is a little different. There is no doubt my W wants a D, it could not be clearer. She's announced the separation to everyone on her side, friends, family, coworkers, day care, etc.... Seems like she won't miss an opportunity to mention it. She's pushing to start mediation and financial split ASAP. She's already looking and may have found a permanent place for January (if not sooner).

It's sad and pathetic on my part, but i wish she was a little more wishy washy on the subject. In my head I still have no doubt we could've worked things out.

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Originally Posted by BL42
How are your kids handling all this? It's certainly tough on you, but make sure you're stepping up for them. Every two days is a lot of transitions. Your girls are young (2&4?), but you may want to adjust to less frequent exchanges over time? Read up on that - there are a lot of options.
I think you're right, W already mentioned this as well, I guess we'll look into other schedules soon.


Originally Posted by BL42
I don't recall you bringing up alcoholism or a car crash before? The focus seemed to be SSRIs, though you mentioned drinking with them. Is there a long history of alcoholism with her? Was the crash related to drinking?
No history of alcoholism, she always drank occasionally and pushed it once in a while on the odd night out or special occasion, but never regularly and never this amount. Yes, crash was a couple hours after a liquid lunch with coworkers.


Originally Posted by BL42
My suggestion, as everyone else has said, is...do. not. nest. Simply tell her you've decided not to move out. You're acting out of fear right now, but it's unlikely she'll move back into the house because of your decision...it's more likely she'll continue to stay at her parents or find some other arrangement. Stand up and be strong for yourself.
I like your stance here, I'm gonna go with this approach. Thank you!

Originally Posted by BL42
You're married. Emotionally you want to connect because your W is leaving and you're scared you won't meet someone else, or want revenge on your W, or have a need to feel validated by another woman, but...if you want to have any chance of staying married, don't have an emotional and/or physical affair with your x-GF.
I'll be straight up, although the D-bomb was a little over 2 months ago, I've been living with a stranger for the past 12 months, the person I had a past, kids and dreams with is gone, replaced by a hyper and self centered creature. I've been lonely a long time, I feel I've already come to terms with having lost my wife, perhaps and hopefully only until she stops with the medication and alcohol. So ya, I'm lonely, I miss having company, affection, real conversation and plans.

I realize it'll probably take years for anything to change with my W, she isn't going back on her decision any time soon. She's all in, high on life (and medication) and loving it.

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Originally Posted by CWarrior
It's up to you whether to stand for keeping your family together or to throw your hands up and move on. Another poster here points out, at one point she wasn't determined to marry you, and then she was. She's determined to move on now, but that's not necessarily a permanent state. There are several success stories here.

Have you decided not to stand? That would affect our advice.

It would seem this is where I'm stuck. I need to read up more on the term "Stand". Nothing will change in my situation any time soon (meaning 1-2 years). So although I want nothing more than to reconcile, I realize it won't happen any time soon. At the same time, like I said in a previous post, I'm just flat out lonely, I have a lot of family and friends, but i miss having a family and someone to talk, joke, cook and just have fun with. Honestly, am I being pathetic or is this reasonable?

Originally Posted by CWarrior
100% of us recommended against nesting if you want to save your marriage, including May22.

It is under your control to say, "No, I am not leaving." and then not leave.

This is what I will do. Thanks.

Originally Posted by CWarrior
If you mean "Constanza's Rules", of course not, why would she? Wayfarer put it nicely, "Do you tell a roommate when they can come and go? Do you tell them who they can and can't spend time with? Do you worry about what your roommate ate for dinner? Or who they ate it with? No you don't. Because you're not their keeper, or their parent. "

Touché, you got me here. Yes, I just assumed decency would be respecting a partner of 12 years. This would only be normal for me and the previous version of my W as well. It isn't the case anymore.

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Originally Posted by CWarrior
What self-improvement projects have you been undertaking?

Not as much as i would like. Been working on the house, getting ready for winter, researching mediation options, spending a lot of time with the kids. But mostly, trying to understand and deal with my situation and talking about it way too much with my sister, mom and friends.

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Originally Posted by costanza
I'm just flat out lonely, I have a lot of family and friends, but i miss having a family and someone to talk, joke, cook and just have fun with. Honestly, am I being pathetic or is this reasonable?
This is an 180 opportunity for you. Meet new friends. The ladies and sex will come in time. You must first be able to live alone. During the pandemic I went without sex for 10 months. Guess what? I didn't shrivel up and die.

Tell me more how she's overly flirting in the family home.

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Originally Posted by LH19
Originally Posted by costanza
I'm just flat out lonely, I have a lot of family and friends, but i miss having a family and someone to talk, joke, cook and just have fun with. Honestly, am I being pathetic or is this reasonable?
This is an 180 opportunity for you. Meet new friends. The ladies and sex will come in time. You must first be able to live alone. During the pandemic I went without sex for 10 months. Guess what? I didn't shrivel up and die.

Tell me more how she's overly flirting in the family home.

That's the thing, I'm not afraid of ending up alone, I know I'll find someone and be fine in the long run weather that's with her or someone else.

It's just been a long time since I had a real partner. We had been having sex until July, so its not just about the sex.

Regarding the overt flirting, it's mostly via Teams chats and calls with colleagues and cell phone on the evenings. Extra info: 2 years ago a friend of mine and colleague cheated on his wife with another colleague and ended up leaving his family for her. We had dinner with his x-wife and new wife a few times, back then, my W found his situation pathetic, first to dip your pen in company ink and not end things before realizing the relationship was over. Fast forward and her main site for meeting and frequenting new people is at work.

Until a year ago this was someone that walked in the door and left her cell phone on the counter top and would maybe check it for missed calls 2 times in an evening. Her parents and friends always called me if they needed to talk with her because she never bothered to carry her phone around. Now she's a social media junky and I assume obviously flirting on it as well since she's attached to it even while playing with the kids and cooking. You wanna talk complete 180's!? I just don't know this person.

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