Still pretty bad sitch

[SteveLW]

SA, remember validation is understanding her feelings....it isn't agreeing with what she is saying.

W: "You were being abusive when you would stonewall me."
You: "That must have been tough for you to have felt that way."

Doesn't corroborate her accusation, just validates the way she felt.

Lots of people get this wrong about validation. Read the validation thread. Study it. Practice on your own.

What you never validate is disrespectful behavior. So if she starts screaming at you that you are a jerk, idiot, or other names. You do not validate that, you stand up for yourself: "I refuse to be spoken to in this manner." then walkaway.

[JosephS]

I agree with Steve above, but with that said, so many people (heck including myself) are so bad at validation that you can land yourself in hotter water attempting too. I agree with I believe it was LH who said try it with others before your wife. Steve’s response above is perfect, and yet could be twisted into sarcasm, or you could be accused of blowing off her feelings. Heck, I can see someone who really wants to ensure everything is your fault, say I didn’t feel that way, that’s how it was.

[LH19]

I agree with Steve above, but with that said, so many people (heck including myself) are so bad at validation that you can land yourself in hotter water attempting too. I agree with I believe it was LH who said try it with others before your wife. Steve’s response above is perfect, and yet could be twisted into sarcasm, or you could be accused of blowing off her feelings. Heck, I can see someone who really wants to ensure everything is your fault, say I didn’t feel that way, that’s how it was.

Yep it was me. What Steve said could be considered condescending depending on their relationship dynamic. I know Sandi wasn't a big fan of validating waywards.

KISS comes into play here. "I understand that's how you felt".

[SteveLW]

I agree with Steve above, but with that said, so many people (heck including myself) are so bad at validation that you can land yourself in hotter water attempting too. I agree with I believe it was LH who said try it with others before your wife. Steve’s response above is perfect, and yet could be twisted into sarcasm, or you could be accused of blowing off her feelings. Heck, I can see someone who really wants to ensure everything is your fault, say I didn’t feel that way, that’s how it was.

Yeah you have to certainly be good at the delivery of validation lines. I think you raise an outstanding point about that. Something we do not discuss often enough. It has to be genuine or it will come across as sarcastic or even condescending. Neither of which are good.

[detachA]

So I read the thread R2C posted earlier with all the good snippets of advice. I think I have had some kindof epihany, I havent felt so happy in ages.

I realise that what I think has been DB, recently, has been more whingy and needy BS. I have tried detaching today. She called me at work and I didnt pick up. I went home tonight, had a bit of a laugh with my eldest when I got in the house. Then went upstairs and changed without saying anything. I came down and started cleaning the kitchen. She eventually came in and asked could we change to my son goes to the tutor. I said I dont know, you need to ask the tutor. Then i just stopped the conversation. Ive taken my eldest to soccer practice now, and will put him to bed then go to my room when I get home.

Im very angry with myself that she cheated and I have been the one pussyfooting around.

[detachA]

Also any ideas I get, like last nights MC idea, im gonna float here and see the response first before actioning anything

[detachA]

Gal

Today - Taking eldset son to football, Walking around running track while he plays and listening to a self help book, Working on my solution orientated goals
Tomorrow - Going shopping for new clothes for the BBQ. Im gonna have a blast there and meet some new people,Watching tv with the boys
Friday - Going for a 5 k run, Taking the boys out for breakfast with my friend,Going out with a work colleague and his wife in the evening for dinner and drinks

[Traveler]

Yes, validation and active listening take practice.

Validation is about recognizing and acknowledging her feelings. Active listening is about repeating back what you heard in your own words which shows understanding. Neither is about agreeing nor being agreeable. They are both good skills to practice on as many people as you can.

I decided against asking her to go to MC.

Props. You are listening and making some positive changes.

I should have shut this down right away, but I let it run.

Sounds like controlling behavior. Let it go.

I am a big fan of the LBS being so busy that they have to be the one to end the discussion. After listening and validating for a bit "I have to be some where." And then going and GAL.

Yes, that's the best answer!!

She starting talking about how we need to get someone who can look after them, in the event something happens to both of us, until they can get repatriated. This went on for a bit,

Cool. "I get being worried about the kids if something should happen to both of us. So, your plan would be to.. " <Validation + Active Listening>

the. she started a R talk. I should have shut this down right away, but I let it run.

No, that's your controlling side again. You should not shut her down.

She was fully in negative mode - nothing was ever good, ever! She doesnt want to work on marriage,

"You do sound upset. I understand you don't want to work on the marriage."

why do we not separate,

There's that WE again. It's often an implicit attempt to control. Whenever you or she deploy WE when you're not on the same page, try to break it down into YOU and I. "Why are you staying?" (Again, if she cites obstacles such as needing your approval, be clear to remove them without doing leg work.) If you've never stated why you're staying before, this could also be an opportunity to insert "I'm staying because I love you and want to be married to you."

At this point she saw the smokes and started asking if i was smoking. I didnt say anything and she kept going on that I shouldnt do it. She took the smokes with her when she went and asked several times would I stop doing it (btw she smokes).

Strange interaction. "No, I'm not smoking."

During the R talk I didnt raise my voice, I stressed I wanted to get my family back. I let her do 60% of the talking and tried to validate and empathise.

I like LH's goal to go from 40% of the talking to 20% of the talking.

The R talk ended with her saying she was still “observing”.

That's not a TERRIBLE outcome. It sounds like you did not lash out at her, break down crying, or spend hours trying to persuade her. Keep working at it. (:

[LH19]

Ive taken my eldest to soccer practice now, and will put him to bed then go to my room when I get home.

How about getting dressed up and going out?

[BL42]

Gal

Today - Taking eldset son to football, Walking around running track while he plays and listening to a self help book, Working on my solution orientated goals
Tomorrow - Going shopping for new clothes for the BBQ. Im gonna have a blast there and meet some new people,Watching tv with the boys
Friday - Going for a 5 k run, Taking the boys out for breakfast with my friend,Going out with a work colleague and his wife in the evening for dinner and drinks

Great GAL! Love the multitasking today (son's football game, exercise, and self help). Easier to fit a lot in when you have it planned out. Still a little unsure about this BBQ...might be better to do something without W? But like the new clothes and meeting people and not hanging on her attitude.

During the R talk I didnt raise my voice, I stressed I wanted to get my family back. I let her do 60% of the talking and tried to validate and empathise.

I like LH's goal to go from 40% of the talking to 20% of the talking.

The R talk ended with her saying she was still “observing”.

That's not a TERRIBLE outcome. It sounds like you did not lash out at her, break down crying, or spend hours trying to persuade her. Keep working at it. (:

Agreed the outcome wasn't terrible. Good you kept your cool. Agree w/LH on CW on reducing your talking.

The "observing" comment from your W comes off as condensing to me. SHE's the one having an AFFAIR and she needs to observe YOU?!? You need to flip your attitude around so that you're the prize and she's lucky if YOU take HER back.

Im very angry with myself that she cheated and I have been the one pussyfooting around.

Yep. See my comment above.