WAW w/Exit Affair or WW? - Don't Want Divorce (3)

[BL42]

Previous Threads:
WAW w/Exit Affair or WW? - Don't Want Divorce (1)
WAW w/Exit Affair or WW? - Don't Want Divorce (2)

One Year Since Bomb Day

One year ago today, the day after I brought her home her favorite flowers for Valentine's Day and two weeks after we returned from a family vacation in Disney, my wife told me we need time apart and may need to separate (aka Bomb Day). It took me less than a day to find out she was having an emotional affair with a married co-worker (who has 3 young daughters) and a few weeks to confirm it had also turned physical.

W & I were together 9 years, married 7 with S5 and D2. We did have disagreements on kids nutrition, screen time, and finances but like so many, no "major" issues (abuse, drugs/alcohol, cheating...etc.), though I now recognize I did have some resentment over SSM. Like many, I "did all the wrong things at first"...begging, pleading, promising to change. I back off a bit but continued pressuring her, relationship talks and trying to get here to admit the affair every few weeks, snooping...a lot (I knew everything). Trying to play nice with her and my family having us together for dinners and Holidays even while she mocked me behind my back (not knowing I knew), in the vein of "nice'ing her back" and trying to keep the family together. Looking back I pressured her even longer than I realized, being overly generous as late as Mother's Day, even when S5 was crying because he "just wanted to see Mommy on Mother's Day', and "talks" in June. I now wish I would have notified her close friends and family of the affair while she was at work with the guy, packed up her things and put them out on the porch for when she returned home at midnight or 1am with a note that read "I won't put up with this affair any longer".

Sometime in the May timeframe when their employer and OM1's wife found out (on their 15th wedding anniversary) about the affair, it ended. Sometime in June/July W started dating OM2, filed for divorce, and subsequently moved out. She talked to our kids about the separation without me (even though we had planned it all with a therapist), and the rose color glasses started to come off. Even then I naively thought she wouldn't introduce/have him stay over with the kids until a more reasonable timeframe, but clearly everything she's doing is in her best interest and not for the kids.

I started reading this site in the Summer and made my first post in July. I dropped all forms of pressure and pursuit, got strong again, and started doing things just for myself and the kids, and have now been DB'ing (not for her but for me and the kids) for 6-8 months now.

So...

180s - Immediately after BD I stopped/"fixed" any behaviors my W criticized, namely being less critical and more complementary. This was before I knew through DB and other sites and that she was simply explaining what led her to her decision rather than asking me to change and/or excusing her actions in her mind by blaming me. I bought a really nice, brand new vehicle which was a 180 because I prided myself on running my car into the ground. This wasn't really for her, it was for me and the kids (now that we wouldn't share two vehicles), but it felt good. I've also done a ton of projects around the house in my new-found spare time which is a 180 because I didn't do much before between no growing up "handy" and having very little time always taking care of the kids, but I've learned a lot and it feels good making improvements.

GAL - In the Summer once W moved out, the tension lifted, and I had plenty of time on my hands without the kids, I played a lot of golf, hung out and drank and play cards with the guys, did dinners with some couples friends. Did a lot of projects outside in the yard and cleared a lot of junk out in the house. That's slowed down in the Winter months. I do get together with friends (brunch, SB party...etc.) but it's less consistent because people are coupled up and have plans. I try to fill my time with inside home improvements (painting, hanging storage wall in garage...etc.). I need to do a better job about getting out when I'm on my own to hike or ski.

Parenting - I'm crushing it. I was a great dad before and always spent tons of time with the kids, but have stepped that up even more. I bend over backwards to flex out of work before/after school and every Friday (even on "W's weeks" I spend as much time with them as her), to be their rock. We've gone to the playground, on hikes, playing, reading books, sledding, gymnastics, coaching S5's sports team...etc, etc. They know they're loved.

Kids - D2 definitely has her rough patches and break downs but it's hard to say if that's the "terrible twos" or due to the separation. S5 is certainly impacted. He's 80-90% normal and 10-20% sad and angry. He gets wistful and cries at times (once for 45 mins and cried himself to sleep in my arms) and gets angry other times, which he never did before. I hope over time me and my family can help him through this hard time - he opens up to my mom; she's his safe person. I've read some people say "kids are resilient" and others say "it will have lasting effects". This is definitely a tough aspect for me right now, but as I've learn on this forum and through other mediums I can only control how I handle it and be their rock.

Dating - I flirted with the idea a month after my wife moved out (there were a few potential opportunities) but ultimately decided against it. Not only did this forum advise against it, but it seemed like the best thing to do for my morals and my children. I want to be able to say to myself and my children I tried everything I could to save my marriage and keep our family intact and did nothing inappropriate before she divorced me. I've had a couple attempted set-ups and been asked a few times when I'll date and I just respond "I'm not interested at this time. My kids are getting 100% of my attention."

Areas for Improvement - I need to get into a regular workout routine. I'm not a too overweight but could have a more athletic build with effort. I lost 30lbs in the first several months after BD and was looking good, but have gained half of that back. If I had worked out regularly been pretty ripped. I've devoted so much time to kids and work so far...need to make time for my own physical health.

Divorce Status - W filed in July; preliminary conference last month. We essentially have agreement on custody and child support. In terms of asset division we've traded financial documents and have agreed on the value of the marital home, but have everything else to address. W said she was open to negotiating without the lawyers to save money and I floated the idea of each taking our own house/car/accounts...etc. as opposed to dragging things out (believe she wants to wrap this up ASAP), but she hasn't responded yet so I'm guessing that's a no-go. Fortunately we live in an equitable (not equal) distribution state and my (significant) pre-martial assets are safe. My lawyer says we're close and should wrap it up quick so it doesn't go sideways but then I don't hear from either side for weeks, and I'm not pushing it.

Current Mindset - It's amazing how in the first few months each day/night seemed like an eternity and now it's already been a year. I was a mess the first 3-4, maybe even 6 months. Severely depressed, struggling to focus on work, and needing help from my parents with the kids. Now I'm crushing it with the kids, back on track at work, hanging with friends, making improvements around the house, and kind of enjoying life. I still have angry moments flair up, but feel much stronger than before and feel the progress I've made.

W appears to be happy with OM2. He moved in soon after she moved out and is staying overnight with my kids (which I hate, but can't control), so they've been dating (having an affair) for at least 6 months. They're planning a Summer vacation together with the kids. I can't see her reversing course and coming back to me. However, even if she did I don't know how I could possibly take her back at this point. She's been with two other men and treated me worse in the last year than anyone has ever treated me in my life. She has hurt her husband (me), her kids, her extended family. The only reason I could possibly entertain letting her try to come back at this point would be if I thought it was in the best interest of my kids, because I never wanted them to go through this and come from a divorced home, but even then it would be a horribly difficult road and I don't know that I could do it. At this point I'm lamenting the loss of an intact/nuclear family more than the loss of W, and can better understand now what people on this forum mean about how difficult it would be to piece after an affair.

So there you go...one year into my "new normal" already. Doing much better, but still have a long way to go...

[Mumin]

Thanks for the update BL!
So much is similar to my experience (and many others here).

The main difference for me is the kids. Not sure if they fully understand but they havnt acted out at all.
They still thing OM is a friend and dont know mom was the cause of everything.
Have you told the kids details of what happend?

This week is the third week after physical seperation.
I am at a point where I am considering if saying: "If OM is to be sleeping over while kids are there I want to know in advance".

BL sounds like your doing a great job in general! Keep it up!
On exercise set a goal with some friends, it real spurs me.
Mine is to have exercised 200 times this year and we share progress daily in a group together. I am currently at 26.

[sandi2]

BL42 and Mumin, you guys have very young children. How can you explain what's happening on their level? I think LBH's try to tell them too much, really. It's understandable, b/c you're dealing with a lot of nasty stuff. I just think you have to keep things very, very simple, b/c they cannot grasp adult stuff.

This week is the third week after physical seperation.
I am at a point where I am considering if saying: "If OM is to be sleeping over while kids are there I want to know in advance".

Seriously, why do you think you should be notified whenever the OM will be sleeping over? I've never heard of a WW notifying her LBH in advance when she plans to do the other guy. If you don't want them to laugh in your face, I suggest you drop that idea.

Mumin, you've previously said similar things about wanting to know in advance when OM will be staying at your W's place. When will you realize that it's none of your business? Unless you see some signs the children are suffering from the OM in some way, where you get officials involved, you can't help what goes on in your W's personal life.

The sense of loss of control must be unbearable for you. I don't say this coldly. My family has experienced the same situation with one of our adult children. It's horrible, and there is nothing you can do about it.

((((Big Hugs))))

[Mumin]

Hi Sandi, thanks for replying and sorry BL for hijacking (though it sounds like your battling similar thoughts).
Its great with these posts because they force me to think through things.

I fully agree with you Sandi that keeping things simple and without details is the right course. However, if it is possible to communicate/co-parent around introducing new people in the children's lives I think that's a good thing. Heck XW herself got angry and asked me to communicate when I was introducing a babysitter to the kids.

So to the sleeping over issue. My wording above was a bit unfortunate. To be clear I DO NOT want her to let me know every time. Just the thought is appalling.
What I am after is to get a heads-up if/when she is going to be introducing him more in their lives, and it doesnt have to be the sleeping over.
However, as I (like you) believe it is a very dramatic experience for a child that small to suddenly find another man in Moms bed I feel it is the duty of me as a father to say something. Especially when XW seems to not be sure about anything in her life and I think she might actually consider my opinion.

I am not 100% sure about this and I am battling, letting things go vs what's in the best interest of my children.

Will post this same message in my own thread if you would like to answer.

[BL42]

Mumin/sandi2,

Thanks for the update BL!
So much is similar to my experience (and many others here).

The main difference for me is the kids. Not sure if they fully understand but they havnt acted out at all.
They still thing OM is a friend and dont know mom was the cause of everything.
Have you told the kids details of what happend?

BL42 and Mumin, you guys have very young children. How can you explain what's happening on their level? I think LBH's try to tell them too much, really. It's understandable, b/c you're dealing with a lot of nasty stuff. I just think you have to keep things very, very simple, b/c they cannot grasp adult stuff.

Mumim - Yes, we're in very similiar sitches in terms of the kids/ages. I just re-read your entire 7 threads and posted my thoughts. Check it out. My S5 has had very tough times over the last 6 months. I don't go into details (the affair...etc.) but I do tell him mommy decided to live somewhere else and ask him to make sure OM2 isn't treating him poorly. I guess on day he'll realize what happened, or he'll be too young to remember. If he asks in the future when he's older I can share more (age appropriate) details at that time.

The sense of loss of control must be unbearable for you. I don't say this coldly. My family has experienced the same situation with one of our adult children. It's horrible, and there is nothing you can do about it.

Yes, it's tough. I hate the kids are forced to learn this life lesson and deal with the situation.

BL sounds like your doing a great job in general! Keep it up!
On exercise set a goal with some friends, it real spurs me.
Mine is to have exercised 200 times this year and we share progress daily in a group together. I am currently at 26.

Thanks! Yes, I need to start on the exercising/lifting hard core. That'll help for sure. I agree...little goals.

[BL42]

If I'm being honest I was disappointed not to get more response from my "One Year Since Bomb Day" post two weeks ago. Seemed like a significant milestone and I put a lot of reflection into it. Hopefully others will still read through and share their insights?

In terms of GAL, I crushed it this week. Found a beautiful, stylish 5 piece hard wood bedroom set on an online marketplace I love and bought for a 10th of the price for what it would sell brand new, so I'm making progress in my master bedroom updates. I cut out of work earlier in the week to go night skiing with a friend, coached S5's sports team, went out for drinks with three buddies Friday night, and yesterday did brunch with 5 other friends which rolled into dinner. Today I'm catching on some work, reading/posting here, and have some errands and small projects around the house before the kids come home tonight.

[Traveler]

Hi BL42,

I hear you. I recall reading it and wish I'd let you know! I make frequent, brief visits and sometimes when a post is long and the author's perspective is already well thought out, I plan to think on it and reply later, and then--squirrel! I get when you put very personal things out there you've thought on for some time it feels good to be heard. The replies I receive every few updates are so meaningful and often refocus me or open me up to new perspectives. I'll look now. Unless there's a squirrel or cat. Then later today for sure!

[Traveler]

180s - Immediately after BD I stopped/"fixed" any behaviors my W criticized,

That's how most of us begin our 180s. We make changes for them--e.g., I spent a (wasted) weekend fixing everything in the master bathroom my wife had been complaining about for years.

This was before I knew through DB and other sites and that she was simply explaining what led her to her decision rather than asking me to change

Bingo. Once I realized that, Mr. FixIt vanished! The smallest 180 you do truly for yourself will last through the DB marathon and/or your single future, and be more believable to boot.

I do get together with friends (brunch, SB party...etc.) but it's less consistent because people are coupled up and have plans. I try to fill my time with inside home improvements (painting, hanging storage wall in garage...etc.). I need to do a better job about getting out when I'm on my own to hike or ski.

You may need to develop new friendships! I'm working on that, too. It's okay if those friends are male, or younger, or older, since your goal is friends not dating. This gets you out of your house, too. This past week I met with a hiking group, a dancing group, and hosted a friend of a friend who was traveling.

I've had a couple attempted set-ups and been asked a few times when I'll date and I just respond "I'm not interested at this time.

Hopefully, the attempted setups at least give you confidence the opportunities will be there when you're ready. I definitely feel more confident knowing there are ladies interested in me.

If I had worked out regularly been pretty ripped. I've devoted so much time to kids and work so far...need to make time for my own physical health.

A simple bodyweight routine can be done in 15min without any equipment. E.g., I can execute my CORE, LEGs, SHOULDER, or ARM routines between decorating cookies with my kids and taking them out of the oven.

My lawyer says we're close and should wrap it up quick so it doesn't go sideways but then I don't hear from either side for weeks, and I'm not pushing it.

You've got a competent lawyer--that's great.

Now I'm crushing it with the kids, back on track at work, hanging with friends, making improvements around the house, and kind of enjoying life.

That's also fantastic. My days are also much happier, free from a mediocre relationship.

W appears to be happy with OM2. He moved in soon after she moved out and is staying overnight with my kids (which I hate, but can't control),

I can see hating it. I've never hated my ex-W's partners--they weren't responsible for our relationship falling apart. My big question is whether they treat my kids well, and so far, they have.

Take care, BL42. Hope you're enjoying this weekend!

[SteveLW]

BL, I did read your 1 year post above the other day, it was on my phone so I didn't get a chance to respond. And to be honest, there isn't really a lot to respond to! You've got this covered and seem to be in a good place, all things considered. Love how you are crushing it as a dad, love how you have embraced post-WAW life, and are just making the best of every day and opportunity you have! It is awesome to see someone go through this and come out stronger and better. On the 2 year anniversary of BD I expect that you will be even further along than you are now! I think once the D is finalized, out of the way, and you are moved forward into even dating or a new R, you have set yourself up for future R success and an awesome life! Well done.

[ovrrnbw]

If I'm being honest I was disappointed not to get more response from my "One Year Since Bomb Day" post two weeks ago. Seemed like a significant milestone and I put a lot of reflection into it. Hopefully others will still read through and share their insights?

In terms of GAL, I crushed it this week. Found a beautiful, stylish 5 piece hard wood bedroom set on an online marketplace I love and bought for a 10th of the price for what it would sell brand new, so I'm making progress in my master bedroom updates. I cut out of work earlier in the week to go night skiing with a friend, coached S5's sports team, went out for drinks with three buddies Friday night, and yesterday did brunch with 5 other friends which rolled into dinner. Today I'm catching on some work, reading/posting here, and have some errands and small projects around the house before the kids come home tonight.

I read it this morning. Well thought out and detailed. I'd say the biggest reason you got little response is because you seem to have a well thought out plan with a clear direction. You're doing all the right things. It's so much easier to comment on a sitch where people need immediate, desperate help and you just seem to be firmly in the driver's seat. Good on you, I say.

I hope you hit the gym hard and get ripped like you want to. Once you guys get divorce I'd stop turning down the offers from women though.

Prepare for your W to have more crazy crap going on. She jumped from her marriage to this crappy R with nothing in between but chaos. It's going to be messy for a while, if not longer.

[joejoe1]

BL,

Just because you don't have comments don't mean it hasn't been read. I read a lot of post and don't provide feedback. I use to be more active in my feedback, but it has died down because of my busy schedule. Since I can't provide as a detail post I would like, I stop posting unless, I see a person and need of a comment.

I'm glad you are doing better. Keep up the great work.

[harvey]

I didn't get a ton of feedback on my threads, but I think it was mostly because I was doing well. You'll notice the amount of feedback is directly proportional to how poorly you are DB'ing. Consider it a good sign.

[LH19]

B,

Nothing to add you are crushing it. You are going to be fine!

[BL42]

CWarrior/SteveLW/ovrrnbw/joejoe1/harvey/LH19,

Appreciate you all weighing in. It's great to hear others' perspectives, and it seems like everyone thinks I'm doing well. I agree (relative to/considering the sitch). Still blows my mind it's been an entire year. That's something for the newest newbies to consider...the days in the beginning seem like weeks or months and all of a sudden it's been a year. I'm think I'm doing well overall, but there are definitely tough moments. W emailed me about the kids yesterday - nothing bad - yet I could feel the anger boiling up, and D2 was "terrible 2-ing" today and it would've been nice to have a partner.

Bingo. Once I realized that, Mr. FixIt vanished! The smallest 180 you do truly for yourself will last through the DB marathon and/or your single future, and be more believable to boot.

I've actually increased Mr. FixIt...but she's gone and it's all for me!

You may need to develop new friendships! I'm working on that, too. It's okay if those friends are male, or younger, or older, since your goal is friends not dating. This gets you out of your house, too. This past week I met with a hiking group, a dancing group, and hosted a friend of a friend who was traveling.

This is a great point. You're right. It's a bit harder with COVID but I've been thinking of joining a beginners running club and reaching outside of my typical go-to people for folks who would go skiing with me. I definitely could use some focus here.

Hopefully, the attempted setups at least give you confidence the opportunities will be there when you're ready. I definitely feel more confident knowing there are ladies interested in me.

Indeed, it did.

A simple bodyweight routine can be done in 15min without any equipment. E.g., I can execute my CORE, LEGs, SHOULDER, or ARM routines between decorating cookies with my kids and taking them out of the oven.

You're right. I'm thinking of starting a push up routine in-between meetings (I work remotely). Any suggestions for a balance routine?

That's also fantastic. My days are also much happier, free from a mediocre relationship.

I wanted a traditional family unit, but there certainly are benefits.

I can see hating it. I've never hated my ex-W's partners--they weren't responsible for our relationship falling apart. My big question is whether they treat my kids well, and so far, they have.

I don't have a visceral hate of him per say, like I did OM1, because OM2 situation helped me realize it's her problems not all mine (or the other guys'), but hate the fact my kids moved out halfway almost immediately living with another man. It's not the values I want them raised with to think that's normal and have that modeled for them - but like everyone says I have no control. That said, I'd be lying if I said I didn't prefer they break up and she have to start again with someone new she didn't start dating before she moved out (let alone got divorced)

Thanks CWarrior!

BL, I did read your 1 year post above the other day, it was on my phone so I didn't get a chance to respond. And to be honest, there isn't really a lot to respond to! You've got this covered and seem to be in a good place, all things considered. Love how you are crushing it as a dad, love how you have embraced post-WAW life, and are just making the best of every day and opportunity you have! It is awesome to see someone go through this and come out stronger and better. On the 2 year anniversary of BD I expect that you will be even further along than you are now! I think once the D is finalized, out of the way, and you are moved forward into even dating or a new R, you have set yourself up for future R success and an awesome life! Well done.

Thanks Steve, I appreciate it! Is this a name change btw? Hard to think of another year out but then it's hard to believe it's been a year. Part of me longs to date a bit, but I'm trying to stay firm on the "not until the divorce" goes through mindset for my own morals and the kids' sake, and as most say here giving it more time to heal is better.

I read it this morning. Well thought out and detailed. I'd say the biggest reason you got little response is because you seem to have a well thought out plan with a clear direction. You're doing all the right things. It's so much easier to comment on a sitch where people need immediate, desperate help and you just seem to be firmly in the driver's seat. Good on you, I say.

I hope you hit the gym hard and get ripped like you want to. Once you guys get divorce I'd stop turning down the offers from women though.

Prepare for your W to have more crazy crap going on. She jumped from her marriage to this crappy R with nothing in between but chaos. It's going to be messy for a while, if not longer.

Thanks! I need to give some focus on the physical aspect and get into a routine. I've done well learning to prep food, but need a workout routine I'll stick to. Should get easier to get outside and be active as we move into Spring too.

I have no idea what till happen with her new relationship. On the one hand it seems you're right and she has a lot of issues she didn't work through and is love bombing him now but what will happen when the rubber meets the road and they don't even have kids to bind them (like we did). On the other hand she's the brother of her friend and they're all acting like one big family and he probably thinks he struck gold and can look past raising someone else's kids because he's a live at home with his mom without a GF in a long time not a great career guy...so it might last quite awhile. In terms of crazy, I think that's why my L wants to wrap this up ASAP.

BL,

Just because you don't have comments don't mean it hasn't been read. I read a lot of post and don't provide feedback. I use to be more active in my feedback, but it has died down because of my busy schedule. Since I can't provide as a detail post I would like, I stop posting unless, I see a person and need of a comment.

I'm glad you are doing better. Keep up the great work.

I didn't get a ton of feedback on my threads, but I think it was mostly because I was doing well. You'll notice the amount of feedback is directly proportional to how poorly you are DB'ing. Consider it a good sign.

B,

Nothing to add you are crushing it. You are going to be fine!

joejoe1/harvey/LH19 - Thanks for the encouraging words. Guess it's a good thing you don't have any advice!

[Mumin]

Hi BL, Thanks for posting on my thread I will get back to you.

I agree with the others here, you are doing really well and thats why there wasnt that much feedback orginally.
Ask specific questions if there are things you are wondering about. I always appreciate the perspective of this board.

Reagarding working out, set some SIMPLE goals and find a routine.
ITs not perfect by any means but often I do the same two gym routines twice a week.
Those two are what keeps me going.

Not sure you are interested but I am willing to post them and why I do them if you'd like.

[BL42]

W's L told my L he hopes to get a settlement proposal over to us later today. She rejected my suggestion we take own own house/car/accounts and go our separate ways quick and easy, so we'll see. I'm anxious/eager to review the first real offer. I've been preparing myself from a financial mindset since the Summer for what my understanding of what she's entitled to under the law. Hopefully it's reasonable.

[Vapo]

Mumin, I would be interested in your routine.

[Mumin]

Ok here goes:

Upper body
Warmup >5 min(do whatever I feel like, usually rowing)
- Benchpress, 1 warmup set + 3 sets of 4-10 reps
- Cable cross machine for Pecs Major usually angled to target lower vs upper, 3 sets lower (heavy) 3 sets upper (lighter)
- Arnold press (front shoulders), 3 sets heavy
- A version of arm raises (target mid shoulders), 4 sets - 2 very light, depending on form 2 more light or 2 heavy
- Bent over raise/row (target back shoulders), 2-3 sets mid weight
- (Sometimes I do 3 sets of a traps exercise here, very heavy)
- Triceps pushdown (or pull), 3 sets mid to heavy
- AT LEAST 5 minutes of ABS (Youtube exercises or heavy in a machine)

Legs and back
Warmup ~5 min(do whatever I feel like, usually rowing)
- Deadlift, 3 sets usually 1 heavy (2-3 reps) and 2 mid weight (10 reps)
- Power cleans, 3 sets mid weight (DO NOT DO THIS WITHOUT PROPER TECHNIQUE!)
(Sometimes add another leg exercise here, ladies like the butt too ;))
- Dumbell row, 3 sets mid to heavy
- Chins (or machine), 3 sets at least body weight
- Bicep curl 1 (focus on lower arm and outer bicep), 3 sets mid weight
- Bicep curl 2 (normal), 3 sets heavy

This week I will do both these routines twice plus a conditioning routine.
Both of these usually take a bit more than an hour if I am in a hurry I reduce some sets to 2 (rather than 3) and typically only warm up 2 min. VERY important to not go to heavy on one of those "stressed" workouts. I've learned the worst thing that can happen in the gym for me is to get hurt. Not because I lose out on exercising but because I lose the routine.

[MrBrside]

I don't have a visceral hate of him per say, like I did OM1, because OM2 situation helped me realize it's her problems not all mine (or the other guys'), but hate the fact my kids moved out halfway almost immediately living with another man. It's not the values I want them raised with to think that's normal and have that modeled for them - but like everyone says I have no control. That said, I'd be lying if I said I didn't prefer they break up and she have to start again with someone new she didn't start dating before she moved out (let alone got divorced)

Since i found this site, and Sandi's rules, i look at a WW in 1 way - Selfish. Pure and Simple.

I don't think i've read a single post where a WW isn't out for herself.

Selfish people do not make good partners, or good parents.

That said, i genuinly think my WW has had a positive benefit on me and what i have learnt.

The biggest thing i have leant is to learn from her messups with the children - and there are lots.

You cannot control WW or the damage she causes -

I relate WWs to the terminator in 1984 ( showing my age )

Kyle Reese: Listen, and understand. That terminator is out there, it cant be bargained with, it cant be reasoned with, it doesn't feel pity or remorse or fear, and it absolutely will not stop... EVER, untill you are dead!


Extreme, but it is the same principle. Listen and Understand. The Wife you knew is gone. You cannot reason with a WW. They are consumed by emotion. Rational is not something they want to or will understand.

You can't reason - You can learn. You watch how her actions impact on your children and you do the 180. You make sure you dont become that person.

You show your children "your" values

If and when you date again, don't introduce your children to this partner until you think this may be a life time partner. I'm talking years potentially if the children are young.

Breakups really impact on children. Imagine how they feel when they are introduced to OM days later. Chances are, your WW likes to play happy familys with OM, but if shes in that "honeymoon" stage, all her attention will be on the OM, not the kids. So you make sure that all your attention is on them.

The damage is already done though.. In their heads, they will always fear being pushed out if WW / you get another partner.. So you be the best dad you can and never let them feel pushed out when with you.


I know from personal experience - My WW introduced my children to OM 3 days after she left and they found him in WW bed 3 weeks later. It shattered them. I saw the heartbreak that caused, and i will never put my children through that.

My Best friends mother was a WW.. She ran off with a man and left the dad ( LBS ) to look after 5 kids. My friend will always tell me how he was an amazing dad initially - he became their rock, and WW was gone... UNTIL he met a new partner, who had no interest in the kids. The relationship with his kids just stopped - His new partner became his focus. It was around the same time his mum ( WW ) split with other man, realised her mistakes and started to make a mense. He has no relationship with his father now. Sad, but true.

On the note of dating and children: Again, learn. RED flag !!!... If a lady you are dating wants to introduce you to her children / go on day trips / stay over shorlty after meeting you - THINK !!!!!..

I have ( and always will ) call it off it this happens.. that date is showing you who she is ! How is that different than WW.

WHen you have them butterflys Its easy to think with your d^%*, but have a thought for her children - How do you know you arent the 4th new man this year that the date has introduced them to.. It shows unhealthy issues IMO - and selfish. By staying over at this hot girls place after 4 weeks, how are you much different from OM ? Ok, you may not have caused a relationship breakdown, but you are not considering her children.

This is why this board is so good.. Its not about saving that relationship.. Read the posts and learn - like you learn from the WW mistakes. It will make you a stronger person and a better father if you embrace the knowledge.

I have no idea what till happen with her new relationship. On the one hand it seems you're right and she has a lot of issues she didn't work through and is love bombing him now but what will happen when the rubber meets the road and they don't even have kids to bind them (like we did). On the other hand she's the brother of her friend and they're all acting like one big family and he probably thinks he struck gold and can look past raising someone else's kids because he's a live at home with his mom without a GF in a long time not a great career guy...so it might last quite awhile. In terms of crazy, I think that's why my L wants to wrap this up ASAP.

Chances are it will come crashing down.. As in its almost a certainty.

She isnt thinking about house, his career or the fact he lived with his mum. Your post above is thinking to look at it logically - Not in her world - She is acting on emotion - dont try to understand or rationalise it - you cannot.

Reread the terminator comment - all emotion..

Once that honeymoon period goes, the resentment will build and she will find somebody else.. She will probably come back to you as a Plan B - do you want to be second riddle !

[LH19]

Lol. Love the Terminator reference.

I once compared a WW to Godzilla crashing through a city destroying everything in its path with people fleeing everywhere.

[OnlyBent]

I laughed out loud at the Godzilla comparison, the Terminator one scares me.

Mr B said it perfectly, it’s a dead giveaway to the values of a person if they let their young children meet someone so easily, people give away clues to their characters constantly, you just need to be watching for them. Not sure who’s says this regularly, but when someone shows you their true colours believe them.

[Mumin]

If and when you date again, don't introduce your children to this partner until you think this may be a life time partner. I'm talking years potentially if the children are young.

Breakups really impact on children. Imagine how they feel when they are introduced to OM days later. Chances are, your WW likes to play happy familys with OM, but if shes in that "honeymoon" stage, all her attention will be on the OM, not the kids. So you make sure that all your attention is on them.

The damage is already done though.. In their heads, they will always fear being pushed out if WW / you get another partner.. So you be the best dad you can and never let them feel pushed out when with you.

THIS!!!!

If there was a second welcome thread, it doesn't have to say much more than this.

[ovrrnbw]

Lol. Love the Terminator reference.

I once compared a WW to Godzilla crashing through a city destroying everything in its path with people fleeing everywhere.

Which is why it is our duty as LBS's to detach and turn into King Kong and wreck Godzilla so that the childrens can live happily ever after.

[Vapo]

I am not quite sure I want my children remembering me as King Kong and their mother as Godzilla.

[Mumin]

Vapo, any comments on workouts?

[SteveLW]

I am not quite sure I want my children remembering me as King Kong and their mother as Godzilla.

LOL

Well......what they remember about their mother is up to her. But good point.

[BL42]

MrBrside/LH19/OnlyBent/ovrrnbw/Vapo - Terminator, and Godzilla, and King Kong...oh my! LOL! Thanks for that. You all certainly brought some levity to my day!

Mumin - Appreciate the workout routine suggestion. I'll check it out.

MrBrside,

Great insights in here. I'm going to read through this several times.

Since i found this site, and Sandi's rules, i look at a WW in 1 way - Selfish. Pure and Simple.

I don't think i've read a single post where a WW isn't out for herself.

Selfish people do not make good partners, or good parents.

Yeah, definitely seems to be the case here as well. My family and I often wonder if she's always been this way and fooled us for 8 years (how is that possible) or if she just snapped between post-partum/affair/coming off meds. Either way, I guess it doesn't matter because we're a year in now and the damage has been done.

If and when you date again, don't introduce your children to this partner until you think this may be a life time partner. I'm talking years potentially if the children are young.

Breakups really impact on children. Imagine how they feel when they are introduced to OM days later. Chances are, your WW likes to play happy familys with OM, but if shes in that "honeymoon" stage, all her attention will be on the OM, not the kids. So you make sure that all your attention is on them.

The damage is already done though.. In their heads, they will always fear being pushed out if WW / you get another partner.. So you be the best dad you can and never let them feel pushed out when with you.


I know from personal experience - My WW introduced my children to OM 3 days after she left and they found him in WW bed 3 weeks later. It shattered them. I saw the heartbreak that caused, and i will never put my children through that.

This is so sad. How old were your children? Not sure my kids are "shattered" at this point, maybe they're too young to be?, but it's certainly impacted them significantly. I haven't dated yet, and don't plan to until at very least the divorce is finalized, and even then agree with you...don't plan to introduce them to the other person until the relationship has progressed significantly.

My Best friends mother was a WW.. She ran off with a man and left the dad ( LBS ) to look after 5 kids. My friend will always tell me how he was an amazing dad initially - he became their rock, and WW was gone... UNTIL he met a new partner, who had no interest in the kids. The relationship with his kids just stopped - His new partner became his focus. It was around the same time his mum ( WW ) split with other man, realised her mistakes and started to make a mense. He has no relationship with his father now. Sad, but true.

Wow. I honestly hadn't considered that scenario. I'm certainly their rock now, and plan to be going forward, but appreciate you sharing this example...I need to be vigilent any future relationships to change that stance and go down the wrong path for the kids like my W is doing now. I guess even the LBS can get spun out on the dopamine of a new relationship.

On the note of dating and children: Again, learn. RED flag !!!... If a lady you are dating wants to introduce you to her children / go on day trips / stay over shorlty after meeting you - THINK !!!!!..

I have ( and always will ) call it off it this happens.. that date is showing you who she is ! How is that different than WW.

WHen you have them butterflys Its easy to think with your d^%*, but have a thought for her children - How do you know you arent the 4th new man this year that the date has introduced them to.. It shows unhealthy issues IMO - and selfish. By staying over at this hot girls place after 4 weeks, how are you much different from OM ? Ok, you may not have caused a relationship breakdown, but you are not considering her children.

This is why this board is so good.. Its not about saving that relationship.. Read the posts and learn - like you learn from the WW mistakes. It will make you a stronger person and a better father if you embrace the knowledge.

Good point. All things to consider at some point in the future when I start dating.

Chances are it will come crashing down.. As in its almost a certainty.

She isnt thinking about house, his career or the fact he lived with his mum. Your post above is thinking to look at it logically - Not in her world - She is acting on emotion - dont try to understand or rationalise it - you cannot.

Reread the terminator comment - all emotion..

Once that honeymoon period goes, the resentment will build and she will find somebody else.. She will probably come back to you as a Plan B - do you want to be second riddle !

Could be it'll crash and burn. I tend to think this one will last awhile. OM1 was married 15years with 3 young kids, so it had glaring challenges, whereas OM2 has been single for a long time and ties to her friend and they've formed a "new family" already. Guess time will tell. Either way, the damage has been done. I waited an entired year and thought I could forgive OM1 once that ended, but dating OM2 and moving him in with my kids right away...that would be a bitter pill to swallow, and I can't imagine going back now. Really the only reason at this point would be if I thought it was better for the kids, not for me at all. But even then, I think I'm through the worse part with the kids and have been strong for them. Hopefully I can use what I've learned on the board to stay strong for myself if at any point she comes back as a second fiddle.

[Traveler]

Hi BL42,

re: Workouts.

They're highly personal. I strength train 6 of 7 days/week so my goal is speed and efficiency. I have weights at home, but I prefer bodyweight. I leverage that sports science has shown that single sets of exercises to near-failure are as effective as multiple sets. I'm happy to be done within 20-30min and spread that across my day as I have breaks, drives, or business calls. Bodyweight can be done at home or away.

LEGS - Squats, Bridges, Calf Raises, Lateral Leg Raises, Deadlifts (when I have weights available). All of these exercises have progressions (e.g., box vs bodyweight vs goblet vs pistol squats). 15min

CORE - Dead Bugs, Mountain Climbers (or other plank), and Side Planks (obliques) - Again, all of these have progressions (e.g., low-plank vs high-plank vs mountain climbers.) 9min

ARMS - For me, a PULL (pull-up, let-me-up, or row) and a PUSH (push-up) is enough - 6min

SHOULDER - <rehab/specialized> - 15min

ANKLES - <rehab/specialized> - 3min

CARDIO - A mix of 30min high-intensity or multi-hour endurance activities.

BALANCE - Balance is sports-specific. Studies show little or no carry-over from learning to walk a slackline or master a Wii Fit balance board to other activities. Climbing sandstone, snow, or mud is different. When climbers can't climb, they do core work. When mountaineers can't climb, they do single-leg work.

Train your goal That's where most of my strength work happens. I climb hills and mountains with a heavy pack to train for climbing mountains with a heavy pack. Your training may look different.

[Vapo]

Vapo, any comments on workouts?

Bloody hell, dude, you are a machine. I had to google half of your text just to decyphre it. Well done m8.

[Mumin]

Haha, thanks Vapo! Back and legs today!
Been going to the gym on and off for a very long time.
This time around though is different. I have already doubled my longest streak of consistent training.
Minimum 2-3 times per week for +2 years now.

[Traveler]

Haha, thanks Vapo! Back and legs today!

Arms, core, and shoulders for me—rock on!

[Vapo]

Beer, pasta and pastrami for me - accompanied by fresh warm bread from the oven.

[BL42]

Pretty good week and a half...

Kids - We had a surprise party for son's (now S6) birthday the weekend before with my family. Drove him home from his Saturday activity with D2 and he walked in to everyone yelling "surprise!" and "happy birthday!" and he fell down to the floor in shock and then ran around the house yelling all excited. I got him a fishing pole (he loved doing it at a friend's lake house last Summer) in his favorite color, with the idea we'd go out together more this year when the weather gets better. I happened to have the kids for my "off-week dinner" on his birthday as well so I rented out a field in a local sports dome (he flipped out) with some friends and then took him out for dinner/ice cream. There was a moment while wrapping up the presents I felt a little down, thinking my W and I would usually be doing this, but overall was happy and excited for S6 and nailed his birthday.

Last Friday (completely unprompted) S6 says "Daddy, even on Mommy's weeks I'm with you." I had been with him basically all day Wed, Thurs, and Friday either though it's W's week. Didn't know exactly how to respond - trying not to say anything bad about W to him - so just replied "I'm so glad I do see you so much buddy; I love spending time with you". D2 also told my mom "I like mommy's house but I love daddy". No clue what they're saying when with W, and trying to be carefully not to be biased against her, but it did warm my heart a bit. Still crushing it with the kids.

GAL - Got out of town for the weekend at a lake with several couples who are close friends. I was the 9th wheel but it was a blast. I'm fortunate to have such great friends. Went out to relaxed, wineries, nice dinners...etc. They asked at times about me and the process, but tried not to focus too much on it. Also attempted another set up (3rd time now, different women), but told them I was focused on the kids and happy right now and wanted to wait until the D was finalized. Definitely enjoyed the weekend away. Hopefully we can plan more together.

Divorce - Received a proposal on asset division from W's L, met with my L, and we responded within the week. Some of the items were pretty reasonable, others we had to go back on. L made the comment I seem like a much different guy about it than 6 months ago. We'll see what their response is (might take awhile, seems like her L is slow), but sense it'll be wrapped up in the next month or two before our trial date. I still think it's going to be a weird/tough day when we actually sign the papers, but also kind of tired of the process and ready to be done with it.

[SteveLW]

BL, great update! Love it. Onward and upward!

[OnlyBent]

Great stuff BL, keep doing what you're doing my man! I admire the way you are making the kids number 1!

[sandi2]

Love to hear that kind of post from you!

[LH19]

B,

I am 2.5 years out from living with my ex wife. I've been happier divorced than I was for years being married.

How are my kids doing now? Honestly they are doing GREAT! Do they like going back and forth between houses? No. Do they like that their family traditions, like vacations together and restaurant meals as a family have been disrupted? No. But they do feel loved by both of us, they know that we are there for them, they have each other, and that is more than enough. Believe me it is.

Now to what you really want to know about. Dating. I am not going to lie it has it's ups and downs. I have had some really bizarre and bad first dates but the majority of them were good but the girl wasn't a match for me. I started dating one girl from another country and the border closed after we were getting to know one another so that became a major road block. So for about two and a half months I have been dating a girl 10 years younger then me. She is super sweet and we have a lot in common. She came to my work today to take me out to lunch. I would say she is the complete opposite of a WW. She's been single for 8 years and has really appreciates a good man when she meets one. I am taking it day by day and we will see where it goes.

So I was once where you were at and did not see where I could be happy without my intact family. I was never more wrong in my life. Divorces are hard because our identity becomes wrapped up in who we are as a person in the relationship. When that person is gone from our lives, we often feel like we don’t know who we are anymore, because so much of our life revolves around being in a relationship that no longer exists. It takes time to heal and rebuild your life to get back to a place where you love and enjoy your time being single and learning to have fun again. By knowing what you want and loving and valuing yourself, you can set and enforce healthy boundaries to make sure everyone in your life belongs there because they have PROVEN through their ACTIONS that they DESERVE the gift of your time. This ensures that you never settle for less than what you are capable of having and creating in your life, because those that are not a match simply get bounced out of your life permanently.

If you have any specific questions please feel free to ask.

[harvey]

B,

I am 2.5 years out from living with my ex wife. I've been happier divorced than I was for years being married.

How are my kids doing now? Honestly they are doing GREAT! Do they like going back and forth between houses? No. Do they like that their family traditions, like vacations together and restaurant meals as a family have been disrupted? No. But they do feel loved by both of us, they know that we are there for them, they have each other, and that is more than enough. Believe me it is.

Now to what you really want to know about. Dating. I am not going to lie it has it's ups and downs. I have had some really bizarre and bad first dates but the majority of them were good but the girl wasn't a match for me. I started dating one girl from another country and the border closed after we were getting to know one another so that became a major road block. So for about two and a half months I have been dating a girl 10 years younger then me. She is super sweet and we have a lot in common. She came to my work today to take me out to lunch. I would say she is the complete opposite of a WW. She's been single for 8 years and has really appreciates a good man when she meets one. I am taking it day by day and we will see where it goes.

So I was once where you were at and did not see where I could be happy without my intact family. I was never more wrong in my life. Divorces are hard because our identity becomes wrapped up in who we are as a person in the relationship. When that person is gone from our lives, we often feel like we don’t know who we are anymore, because so much of our life revolves around being in a relationship that no longer exists. It takes time to heal and rebuild your life to get back to a place where you love and enjoy your time being single and learning to have fun again. By knowing what you want and loving and valuing yourself, you can set and enforce healthy boundaries to make sure everyone in your life belongs there because they have PROVEN through their ACTIONS that they DESERVE the gift of your time. This ensures that you never settle for less than what you are capable of having and creating in your life, because those that are not a match simply get bounced out of your life permanently.

If you have any specific questions please feel free to ask.

I could have wrote this. I'm 50. XW is 44. GF is 39, the complete opposite of XW, and shows appreciation for a good man. At least, for now. Daughters are 15 and 11. It's been a little over 2 1/2 years since I lived with XW.

Life is good. Is there a part of me that wishes I would have know what was going to happen and tried to do something about it? Maybe, but I don't give it much head space. I'm enjoying the new life that I'm leading.

[LH19]

B,

I am 2.5 years out from living with my ex wife. I've been happier divorced than I was for years being married.

How are my kids doing now? Honestly they are doing GREAT! Do they like going back and forth between houses? No. Do they like that their family traditions, like vacations together and restaurant meals as a family have been disrupted? No. But they do feel loved by both of us, they know that we are there for them, they have each other, and that is more than enough. Believe me it is.

Now to what you really want to know about. Dating. I am not going to lie it has it's ups and downs. I have had some really bizarre and bad first dates but the majority of them were good but the girl wasn't a match for me. I started dating one girl from another country and the border closed after we were getting to know one another so that became a major road block. So for about two and a half months I have been dating a girl 10 years younger then me. She is super sweet and we have a lot in common. She came to my work today to take me out to lunch. I would say she is the complete opposite of a WW. She's been single for 8 years and has really appreciates a good man when she meets one. I am taking it day by day and we will see where it goes.

So I was once where you were at and did not see where I could be happy without my intact family. I was never more wrong in my life. Divorces are hard because our identity becomes wrapped up in who we are as a person in the relationship. When that person is gone from our lives, we often feel like we don’t know who we are anymore, because so much of our life revolves around being in a relationship that no longer exists. It takes time to heal and rebuild your life to get back to a place where you love and enjoy your time being single and learning to have fun again. By knowing what you want and loving and valuing yourself, you can set and enforce healthy boundaries to make sure everyone in your life belongs there because they have PROVEN through their ACTIONS that they DESERVE the gift of your time. This ensures that you never settle for less than what you are capable of having and creating in your life, because those that are not a match simply get bounced out of your life permanently.

If you have any specific questions please feel free to ask.

I could have wrote this. I'm 50. XW is 44. GF is 39, the complete opposite of XW, and shows appreciation for a good man. At least, for now. Daughters are 15 and 11. It's been a little over 2 1/2 years since I lived with XW.

Life is good. Is there a part of me that wishes I would have know what was going to happen and tried to do something about it? Maybe, but I don't give it much head space. I'm enjoying the new life that I'm leading.

H,

So a couples things H I totally get the “for now” comment. I realize in the beginning everyone is at their best. What I do know now is if I bring it and show up every day and it is not reciprocated then I can walk away with no regrets.

As for the “tried to do something” I’m 99% it was going to happen at some point. My exw is an attractive woman and was bound to get attention elsewhere at some point. She became addicted to the brain chemicals and such and doesn’t have the emotional maturity to understand what is really going on. She was miserable when she left and by all accounts miserable now. As the saying goes “not my circus not my monkeys”.

I do miss the family structure but I don’t miss my ex at all. It’s been about 4 years of doing things just the 3 of us and though I still have a blast there are times I feel like something is missing.

Not the life that I had planned but like Clint Eastwood said in Heart Break Ridge “ You improvise. You adapt and you overcome. That in a nutshell is what divorce life is all about.

[BL42]

I got pretty riled up tonight. When I pulled up to drop off the kids tonight OM2's truck was parked outside. This was the first time in awhile I've had to drop the kids off with him there. Rationally it's silly because I know he stays there will the kids, but it's not always in my face. I didn't make a scene or anything - it was a typical brief exchange - but was fuming a bit in the car and grocery store afterwards. Yes, it's out of my control so I'm supposed to get passed it, detach, not get worked up but I could feel the anger rising up in me and things churning inside. It's just not right the kids living with another man at this point and it also seems like a slap in the face to me.

[SteveLW]

Sorry BL, I know that is difficult. Just keep working on you. You'll get there one day.

[OnlyBent]

Sorry to hear BL, I can understand how sh!tty that would make you feel on both fronts. Without being glib or too simplistic though, what choice do you have than to get past it? You can’t change it, so there really is only one option. I know you know this, and you’ve been doing great, so don’t beat yourself up for feeling crappy. Just get back on the horse, if you’ve felt good before, you know you can feel good again.

Keep at it mate.

[mako]

I got pretty riled up tonight. When I pulled up to drop off the kids tonight OM2's truck was parked outside. This was the first time in awhile I've had to drop the kids off with him there. Rationally it's silly because I know he stays there will the kids, but it's not always in my face. I didn't make a scene or anything - it was a typical brief exchange - but was fuming a bit in the car and grocery store afterwards. Yes, it's out of my control so I'm supposed to get passed it, detach, not get worked up but I could feel the anger rising up in me and things churning inside. It's just not right the kids living with another man at this point and it also seems like a slap in the face to me.

Look on the bright side, you didn't get pissed and make a scene in front of your kids. Better to fume a little at the store. We can only control the things we control, but we're human too and can't be robots all the time. Takes a long time to get past it all.

Your March 16 update looked great, so keep at it. Looks like you've been having more good times than bad.

[BL42]

SteveLW/OnlyBent/mako - Thanks for the support!

LH19,

I am 2.5 years out from living with my ex wife. I've been happier divorced than I was for years being married.

Glad you're enjoying life so much. I never wanted this, but do see the benefits - much more time for myself and freedom to do things the way I want. She thinks the same I believe (though in my mind I more often than not deferred to her).

How are my kids doing now? Honestly they are doing GREAT! Do they like going back and forth between houses? No. Do they like that their family traditions, like vacations together and restaurant meals as a family have been disrupted? No. But they do feel loved by both of us, they know that we are there for them, they have each other, and that is more than enough. Believe me it is.

How old were/are your kids? Mine are very young (S4, D1 at BD; now S6 D2). It's been tough on S6 for sure - he's had rough patches. Can't tell with D2 if it's the constant shifting around or just a case of the "terrible twos". That said, they're doing better than I expected and can see them doing well. Between the flexibility my company has given us due to COVID on top of the natural remote work/flexibility of my profession, I've really been able to see them much more than 50/50 and hopefully be their rock. I wonder though with their ages if they just won't know or remember any different (maybe S6, but even he's young). I'm able to handle them as a single dad easier than I thought and we're always doing activities and fun things. In some respects it can be easier because I naturally bring fewer things / prep less / make it simpler (though it other ways obviously harder).

Now to what you really want to know about. Dating. I am not going to lie it has it's ups and downs. I have had some really bizarre and bad first dates but the majority of them were good but the girl wasn't a match for me. I started dating one girl from another country and the border closed after we were getting to know one another so that became a major road block. So for about two and a half months I have been dating a girl 10 years younger then me. She is super sweet and we have a lot in common. She came to my work today to take me out to lunch. I would say she is the complete opposite of a WW. She's been single for 8 years and has really appreciates a good man when she meets one. I am taking it day by day and we will see where it goes.

Was it weird to date others at first? It's been 10 years for me. I don't plan to now until after the divorce is finalized but it's been 13 months since BD and 8 months since separation, so I can see starting this Summer. How have you met dates, especially during COVID? Is it personal interactions, or mostly dating apps? What's it like to date someone 10 years younger?

So I was once where you were at and did not see where I could be happy without my intact family. I was never more wrong in my life. Divorces are hard because our identity becomes wrapped up in who we are as a person in the relationship. When that person is gone from our lives, we often feel like we don’t know who we are anymore, because so much of our life revolves around being in a relationship that no longer exists. It takes time to heal and rebuild your life to get back to a place where you love and enjoy your time being single and learning to have fun again. By knowing what you want and loving and valuing yourself, you can set and enforce healthy boundaries to make sure everyone in your life belongs there because they have PROVEN through their ACTIONS that they DESERVE the gift of your time. This ensures that you never settle for less than what you are capable of having and creating in your life, because those that are not a match simply get bounced out of your life permanently.

I did have a good part of my identity wrapped up in being married / family man, and wonder occasionally what some people I know think about me getting divorced / wife running off with OM2 (E.g., do they think I not not a good person / man enough). However, I feel like most who know me know my character and think less of her than me, and those who don't see me with the kids and know I'm a wonderful dad. I've felt the pity in interactions with some casual friends, but someone said here the pity is better than disgust.

My feeling of self-worth did take a dip for awhile but I'm I'm already back to be being (mostly) happy and know I'm a high-value man. I think of the analogy of people who get a new car or win the lottery and feel happier at first but over time revert to the mean of their previous happiest (or vice versa), and think that's the same here. I had high self-esteem and happiness before BD. It then plummeted but I'm getting back to myself again. I wonder if the opposite is going to happen with W. She is happier right now because she feels free and has a new man to shower her with affection, but will revert to her low self-esteem / unhappiness again at some point.

Harvey,

I could have wrote this. I'm 50. XW is 44. GF is 39, the complete opposite of XW, and shows appreciation for a good man. At least, for now. Daughters are 15 and 11. It's been a little over 2 1/2 years since I lived with XW.

Life is good. Is there a part of me that wishes I would have know what was going to happen and tried to do something about it? Maybe, but I don't give it much head space. I'm enjoying the new life that I'm leading.

Glad life is good! How are your daughters handling the sitch? They're much older than my kids and I imagine it was a jolt. Plus they're getting towards the teen years and dating themselves. Also, like LH...what's it like dating someone a decade younger? How'd you meet...in person or dating app?

LH19,

So a couples things H I totally get the “for now” comment. I realize in the beginning everyone is at their best. What I do know now is if I bring it and show up every day and it is not reciprocated then I can walk away with no regrets.

The "for now" is definitely interesting. I assume most of us were very happy and in love with our spouses/exs when we dated and got married, and those stiches went sour, so how can we ever be confident it won't happen again? I guess improve ourselves and use the lessons learned to handle things better in the future? I suppose even if there is a problem in the future having gone through it once we'll know we'll be fine either way next time.

As for the “tried to do something” I’m 99% it was going to happen at some point. My exw is an attractive woman and was bound to get attention elsewhere at some point. She became addicted to the brain chemicals and such and doesn’t have the emotional maturity to understand what is really going on. She was miserable when she left and by all accounts miserable now. As the saying goes “not my circus not my monkeys”.

I do miss the family structure but I don’t miss my ex at all. It’s been about 4 years of doing things just the 3 of us and though I still have a blast there are times I feel like something is missing.

Not the life that I had planned but like Clint Eastwood said in Heart Break Ridge “ You improvise. You adapt and you overcome. That in a nutshell is what divorce life is all about.

You're confident it would've happened at some point regardless. How do you know? I'm content knowing and will tell my children some I tried everything I could to keep my marriage and our family together. I think they'll know I was there for them. I don't know if my result wouldn't been the same no matter what I did - there are certainly things I could've done differently or better but I think overall I wasn't the main cause. A friend of my sister who went through sometime similar and offer to talk told me "your biggest mistake was marrying someone whose parents had been married 3 times" and my IC told me she pictures my W as the person who "almost made it / escaped". W had a troubled past with parents divorce, relationships, counseling and ADs/anti-anxiety. I can't help but think maybe she would've ended up in this sitch with anyone else (it just happened to be me).

Anyway...incredibly long post. Would love to hear thoughts!

[LH19]

How old were/are your kids? [

13 and 9 when we D.

Was it weird to date others at first?

Sex with a woman after 24 years with the same was definitely weird.

Is it personal interactions, or mostly dating apps?

I've had a mixed bag. But most on dating apps.

What's it like to date someone 10 years younger?

Good and bad. She's very active and likes to go for walks in the morning when I sometimes want to stay in bed. lol

My feeling of self-worth did take a dip for awhile but I'm I'm already back to be being (mostly) happy and know I'm a high-value man.

Totally normal! I am a pretty confident man and my self esteem took a big hit.

So a couples things H I totally get the “for now” comment. I realize in the beginning everyone is at their best. What I do know now is if I bring it and show up every day and it is not reciprocated then I can walk away with no regrets.

The "for now" is definitely interesting. I assume most of us were very happy and in love with our spouses/exs when we dated and got married, and those stiches went sour, so how can we ever be confident it won't happen again? I guess improve ourselves and use the lessons learned to handle things better in the future? I suppose even if there is a problem in the future having gone through it once we'll know we'll be fine either way next time.

No guarantees my friend. If you survived this you can certainly survive it again.

You're confident it would've happened at some point regardless. How do you know?

Because it's mostly about her unhappiness. Yeah maybe if I was prefect it wouldn't have happened but I am human and far from perfect.

[BL42]

GAL - Had a pretty good "off" weekend...a friend's birthday party on Friday night with dozen friends and watching basketball games / UFC fights with the guys Saturday night. Also just had some downtime and relaxed by myself.

Divorce - Still waiting on W/L's response to my/L's counter on their initial settlement proposal. L & I get the sense her L is slow and overbooked; he's said a few times he would get it to us but haven't' seen anything yet and it's several weeks overdue. I'm a little anxious to see their thoughts. In my mind most items are fairly straightforward and could've been done a lot faster (and cheaper) without all the back and forth and attorneys as middle-men, with a similar result. I got pretty detailed in my breakdown, "showing the math" so to speak, so not sure they have a lot of ground to counter, but it'd be nice to just know it's settled. Also, it'll be another step closer to getting this over with and moving on. I'm tired of the process and although I don't like the situation the kids and I were put in, also haven't been "hoping for a recon" for quite awhile now.

Kids - I continue to do a ton of activities with them and watch them a large portion of W's week. There have been some frustrations in terms of parenting in terms of kids hygiene. I had to clean my son before school one day because she hadn't given him a washed his face the night before or morning of (let alone given him a bath) and he had dirt under his nails. Same thing later in the week his hair was all sweaty the night before from sports and D2 came over without a diaper and had wet herself, so I gave both of bath. I held off on addressing with W as I wanted to avoid riling her up right before they responded to the settlement counter, but may have to just go ahead address it with her at this point regardless because it's taking so long (E.g., can we at least both agree to bathe/wash face/brush teeth before bed?).

[Traveler]

Hi BL42,

My ex doesn't make my son bathe. He bathes regularly at my home. I've never raised the issue with her. If you're unsure which issues matter to their health vs. are your preference, talk to your pediatrician. I took a stand when my ex wasn't giving them lunches. I let it go when my ex wasn't giving them calcium (Pediatrician: "They visit you every day anyway--just give them calcium then.")

[Gigi123]

Always tricky when it comes to kids. So H gives the kids a lot of sweets and biscuits and takes then to mcdonalds. May i add that when we all lived together out kids didnt even know what sweet stuff was and it was normal, ate very healthy.
Literally nothing i can do, but to make sure when they are at home, which is most of the time that they eat healthy.
Reading for school-ocassionally i remind h to do that, but its hit and miss, again not much i can do, and sometimes we dont read in the evening when they are at home either.
H doesnt generally keep track of stuff at school and i do, so on ocassion he brought kids into school in uniform when it was a dress up day. Wouldn't he an issue if s7 didnt feel so anxious about being the only kid in uniform. It irritates me, but literally nothing i can do besides remind H a couple of days before. So essentially im still managing their schedules.....but im doing this for the boys because of how they feel and not for H.

What im trying to say i choose my battles, some of it is a a pain for me, but not worth fighting over.

[LH19]

B you win the quote of the day.


“Big things have little beginnings. All great things take time. You can have everything you want, just not all at once. Some goals and dreams take months, others take years and even grander goals and dreams take decades to accomplish. Life and time are going to pass no matter what you do or fail to do. Doesn’t it make sense to spend your life doing things that light you up on the inside and doing it with people whose goals and values are aligned with your own? Resolve what you want to accomplish, why you want to accomplish it and then take relentless consistent action to eventually make it a reality.” ~ Coach Corey Wayne

[BL42]

LH19 - Good quote. Looking back 10-20 years at this point I can see how the little things add up and snow ball (good or bad) over time. In the case of my finances I've always made the sacrifices and investments and that's paying off significantly at this point. In terms of physical shape (not that I'm too bad off now) but I can see how that same dedication and commitment a decade or two ago would've paid dividends now. I guess the thing with life is you can't change the past and can only move forward starting today.

CWarrior/Gigi123 - If minimal bathing, decent nutrition, and school work are "preferences" of a parenting style instead of the bare minimum of care, we truly have societal issues. I did bring up my concerns with the family physician at my annual physical (as my son's is coming up and W is taking him) to make him aware. I told him though he's not responsible for co-parenting with us, I'd appreciate if he raise the topics generally as it would certainly be received better by W from him than from me. I've bit my tongue and not raised the topic with W recently because the we're getting towards the end of the D agreement so strategically don't want to rile her up and derail the negotiations/settlement and as the board rightfully points out I simply can't do anything about it and have to make up for it on my parenting time instead.

[OnlyBent]

Looking back 10-20 years at this point I can see how the little things add up and snow ball (good or bad) over time. In the case of my finances I've always made the sacrifices and investments and that's paying off significantly at this point. In terms of physical shape (not that I'm too bad off now) but I can see how that same dedication and commitment a decade or two ago would've paid dividends now. I guess the thing with life is you can't change the past and can only move forward starting today.

This is so on the money BL. You guys in the US/UK may not have heard of it. But there's a famous song in Australia by Paul Kelly called From Little Things Big Things Grow. I love it, so true!

[SteveLW]

LH19 - Good quote. Looking back 10-20 years at this point I can see how the little things add up and snow ball (good or bad) over time. In the case of my finances I've always made the sacrifices and investments and that's paying off significantly at this point. In terms of physical shape (not that I'm too bad off now) but I can see how that same dedication and commitment a decade or two ago would've paid dividends now. I guess the thing with life is you can't change the past and can only move forward starting today.
instead.

I agree with OB! It is always the little things in life. Little things add up to the big things. The big things come around once in a while, but it is the little things that add up over time. I remember in my reading during my sitch reading about a man that every day put a fresh red rose in a vase for his wife. Every day, never missed one. After she died he continued to do it. When asked why he said that it was a small thing that had added up to a 50+ year marriage. And so in tribute to her and their marriage he continued to do the 1 small thing that added up to their successful R. Many people try to make up for the lack of little things with the occasional big thing. It never works.

[Traveler]

CWarrior/Gigi123 - If minimal bathing.. are "preferences" of a parenting style instead of the bare minimum of care, we truly have societal issues.

The American Academy of Dermatology (and other medical professionals) recommend any frequency between daily and weekly is healthy for the general population of children 6-11. When my son comes home and hasn't showered in 4 days, my social norms reaction may be "Omigosh! You're showering tonight." We are both co-parents and both our perspectives are valid. Her perspective is she doesn't want to force him to shower when it's not needed and he doesn't want to shower there. My perspective is I wanted him to shower at least every other day so I get him bath products he likes and it's never "optional". I only raise safety and health issues. I've found it easy to get support and enforce changes when I stick to those.

[ovrrnbw]

CWarrior/Gigi123 - If minimal bathing, decent nutrition, and school work are "preferences" of a parenting style instead of the bare minimum of care, we truly have societal issues. I did bring up my concerns with the family physician at my annual physical (as my son's is coming up and W is taking him) to make him aware. I told him though he's not responsible for co-parenting with us, I'd appreciate if he raise the topics generally as it would certainly be received better by W from him than from me. I've bit my tongue and not raised the topic with W recently because the we're getting towards the end of the D agreement so strategically don't want to rile her up and derail the negotiations/settlement and as the board rightfully points out I simply can't do anything about it and have to make up for it on my parenting time instead.

I'm off the mindset that kids should not be making their own choices on a lot of things. You would think that the events of the last year would encourage cleanliness. A lot of kids don't want to take a bath, that is normal. It may be that they are simply testing parents as children do. Whatever it is, it won't matter if he goes to school, or basically anywhere, stinky and dirty, the result will be the same.

[BL42]

I'm off the mindset that kids should not be making their own choices on a lot of things. You would think that the events of the last year would encourage cleanliness. A lot of kids don't want to take a bath, that is normal. It may be that they are simply testing parents as children do. Whatever it is, it won't matter if he goes to school, or basically anywhere, stinky and dirty, the result will be the same.

I agree with this, and it probably sums up the differences in parenting style between my W and I. I think "we're the parents; they're the children" whereas she is extremely deferential to them almost as if they're the ones running the show.

Anyway, it is what it is...I guess I just have to deal with it best I can on my time, but feel like the burden is on me "make up for things" at times, in the best interest of the kids.

[BL42]

It's been almost a month since a real update and life's been hectic....

Kids - Great Easter. Visited my sister's family for egg dyeing / egg hunt and the cousins had a blast together, and then back home for the Easter bunny and church on Sunday. I'm coaching two of my son's sports teams, which keeps me busy and engaged...it's fun. Also taking them to gymnastics and the park. Son did tell my mom one afternoon when my W showed up to pick him up that "why does he have to leave with 'her' and why can't he stay and play at my grandma's house and then go home (my house)". My mom said "you mean mommy?" and had to put on a nice face and tell him that "mommy loves him". Something to keep an eye out on...

GAL - W took kids out of two for a week after Easter so I had a true week off (typically I'm with them before/after school, an evening or two, and all day Friday on my "off" weeks). I missed the kids but video chatted every day, and made the most of GAL. Went golfing several times, out to dinner and drinks with friends...etc., a friend's birthday party last night. Friends have attempted to set me up with 3-4 women now and let them know when I'm ready but have told everyone I'm waiting until at least the divorce is final. I may explore dating afterwards though as it's been over a year since BD. We'll see.

Divorce - Finally received a response on our settlement proposal counter. Both L's had a conference with the judge a week ago (seems like its purpose is for the judge to urge compromise and avoid trial, so he tells them how he'll likely rule and says go off and make a deal). My attorney said our issues are narrow so he expects an agreement, but their counter didn't move or resolve much. Waiting to meet with him on a response from us early this week. W seems to be digging for more money by bringing up new issues and not compromising on asset values (whereas I think I'm being reasonable), but our biggest outstanding issue is she won't agree to a "right of first refusal" for the kids (I.e., the parents have first right to be with the kids on the others' week) which I want to get in writing. Don't think it's unreasonable to have the right to see my kids if W doesn't want to. So we may go to trial if she won't budge there...

Oh, and for a second time now in as many months W notified me she's going on a trip which will overlap with her scheduled time with the kids. I'm glad for the extra time with them, but come on...plan around your time with them. Sigh.

[SteveLW]

Overall, good update!

It's been almost a month since a real update and life's been hectic....

Kids - Great Easter. Visited my sister's family for egg dyeing / egg hunt and the cousins had a blast together, and then back home for the Easter bunny and church on Sunday. I'm coaching two of my son's sports teams, which keeps me busy and engaged...it's fun. Also taking them to gymnastics and the park. Son did tell my mom one afternoon when my W showed up to pick him up that "why does he have to leave with 'her' and why can't he stay and play at my grandma's house and then go home (my house)". My mom said "you mean mommy?" and had to put on a nice face and tell him that "mommy loves him". Something to keep an eye out on...

I find that most kids prefer "home, as opposed to the new place that a spouse lives after a split. I wouldn't worry about it too much. My daughter at 6 would prefer to stay at grandma's house all day every day! LOL It is hard to compete with grandma's house.

GAL - W took kids out of two for a week after Easter so I had a true week off (typically I'm with them before/after school, an evening or two, and all day Friday on my "off" weeks). I missed the kids but video chatted every day, and made the most of GAL. Went golfing several times, out to dinner and drinks with friends...etc., a friend's birthday party last night. Friends have attempted to set me up with 3-4 women now and let them know when I'm ready but have told everyone I'm waiting until at least the divorce is final. I may explore dating afterwards though as it's been over a year since BD. We'll see.

Kudos for not jumping right into dating. Probably the biggest mistake I see LBSs make after they start getting the hang of DBing is jumping to dating as a way to "move forward". Dating is something, in my opinion, you do AFTER you've moved forward. I think post-D + some period of time (different for everyone) is a good target. So I think you are doing well here. I know it is tempting but there will be plenty of time for that later.

Divorce - Finally received a response on our settlement proposal counter. Both L's had a conference with the judge a week ago (seems like its purpose is for the judge to urge compromise and avoid trial, so he tells them how he'll likely rule and says go off and make a deal). My attorney said our issues are narrow so he expects an agreement, but their counter didn't move or resolve much. Waiting to meet with him on a response from us early this week. W seems to be digging for more money by bringing up new issues and not compromising on asset values (whereas I think I'm being reasonable), but our biggest outstanding issue is she won't agree to a "right of first refusal" for the kids (I.e., the parents have first right to be with the kids on the others' week) which I want to get in writing. Don't think it's unreasonable to have the right to see my kids if W doesn't want to. So we may go to trial if she won't budge there...

Weird that she won't agree to this. So in other words if she wants to go to Tahiti on her week with the kids, she'd rather have the right to have someone babysit them than to see if you are open to them staying with you? That is a strange thing to dig in on. Any thoughts on why she won't agree to that?

Oh, and for a second time now in as many months W notified me she's going on a trip which will overlap with her scheduled time with the kids. I'm glad for the extra time with them, but come on...plan around your time with them. Sigh.

Ironic since she is refusing to agree to right of first refusal. "I don't agree that you should get first chance to have the kids if I can't have them on my week, but by the way, can you have them on my week while I go out of town?" Strange.

[BL42]

Crazy day in the life of a single dad...

D2 had a meltdown midway through her "mommy and me" preschool class (which my mom takes her to), I had to review/sign a half dozen documents related to the D, the dishwasher broke, crazy day virtually at my job, S6 had a bathroom accident after school for which I had to wash him and his clothes up, and D2 projectile vomited multiple times on herself, me, and half the house at bedtime, so...it may be a rough night.

Lots of D negotiations over the last two weeks since my last check-in; will post an update on the process when I can get a breath of air.

[Traveler]

Hey BL42, hang in there. The projectile vomiting nights are rare.. even if you never forget them.. especially if a small spot on your wall has a yellowish tint even 10 years later despite cleaning teams' best efforts! Seriously, though, it sounds like you're doing your best in tough circumstances.

Sending strength and good vibes your way!

[SteveLW]

Crazy day in the life of a single dad...

D2 had a meltdown midway through her "mommy and me" preschool class (which my mom takes her to), I had to review/sign a half dozen documents related to the D, the dishwasher broke, crazy day virtually at my job, S6 had a bathroom accident after school for which I had to wash him and his clothes up, and D2 projectile vomited multiple times on herself, me, and half the house at bedtime, so...it may be a rough night.

Lots of D negotiations over the last two weeks since my last check-in; will post an update on the process when I can get a breath of air.

I've found that the saying "when it rains it pours" is very true in this life and in this imperfect world. I recently have had a a serious of misfortunate event related to to the house (things needing to be replaced), a death in the family, an elderly dog in failing health, and a few other things going on (health problems for some other family members, etc). Always seems things like this all happen at once.

BL42, personally I think you've come a long way and have made great progress. Life is life, don't let it derail you!

[SteveLW]

Crazy day in the life of a single dad...

D2 had a meltdown midway through her "mommy and me" preschool class (which my mom takes her to), I had to review/sign a half dozen documents related to the D, the dishwasher broke, crazy day virtually at my job, S6 had a bathroom accident after school for which I had to wash him and his clothes up, and D2 projectile vomited multiple times on herself, me, and half the house at bedtime, so...it may be a rough night.

Lots of D negotiations over the last two weeks since my last check-in; will post an update on the process when I can get a breath of air.

I've found that the saying "when it rains it pours" is very true in this life and in this imperfect world. I recently have had a a serious of misfortunate event related to to the house (things needing to be replaced), a death in the family, an elderly dog in failing health, and a few other things going on (health problems for some other family members, etc). Always seems things like this all happen at once.

BL42, personally I think you've come a long way and have made great progress. Life is life, don't let it derail you!

[BL42]

Tough weekend for GAL. I coached S6 games last night and we had a pizza party for the kids which they loved. We also had a game early afternoon in which S6 did great so that was good to see but W's mom & step dad were in from out of state and my neighbor (no longer W's neighbor) showed up and sat next to W and her "contingent" and they were laughing and hollering and having a grad time. Besides being with my son, a benefit of coaching was I'm on the field and removed from the sideline awkwardness drama, but have a constant reminder of it in my ear. I know this neighbor knows about the affair, and assume OM2, but still is going out of her way to be friends. One of my assistant's Ws has been laughing it up with W on the sidelines every game as well and given my mom "the eye", and I wonder if she knows the real story (or what story she knows). I would've thought that people would be appalled by her behavior and look down on it but it seems everyone wants to be her best friend anyway like she and her life are so wonderful anyway. Sometimes it seems like our world is pretty messed up flipped upside down.

Also I've been reaching out to tons of friends to hang out today/tonight/tomorrow but everyone is off doing their own thing, which is fine - I know they have lives - but definitely feeling a bit sad and lonely on a beautiful Saturday evening when I'm free and available but don't have anyone to hang around with.

[DejaVu6]

Cheer up BL42. It could be worse...you could be me trying to pack up a house by myself on a beautiful Saturday evening. Kidding...kinda. I know that feeling well. Do not worry. It will pass. I sometimes feel that way as well. I just try to focus on being really good company for myself. I eat something I like. Watch a movie no one else would want to watch. Take my dog for a walk and listen to music in my headphones. Watch some self-improvement videos on YouTube. It passes the time. Hang in there. If there is anything that I’ve learned in the last three years, it is that change is constant. Worse than being by yourself...being in the company of someone you know isn’t right for you. Been there, done that. (((HUGS)))

[SteveLW]

Cheer up BL42. It could be worse...you could be me trying to pack up a house by myself on a beautiful Saturday evening. Kidding...kinda. I know that feeling well. Do not worry. It will pass. I sometimes feel that way as well. I just try to focus on being really good company for myself. I eat something I like. Watch a movie no one else would want to watch. Take my dog for a walk and listen to music in my headphones. Watch some self-improvement videos on YouTube. It passes the time. Hang in there. If there is anything that I’ve learned in the last three years, it is that change is constant. Worse than being by yourself...being in the company of someone you know isn’t right for you. Been there, done that. (((HUGS)))

DejaVu6 nailed it.

[BL42]

DejaVu6 / SteveLW - Thanks. Guess I was having a pity party for myself last night. Just feeling sad and lonely and drank a bottle of wine by myself.

Today was a lot better. Finally got a contractor over to do some house improvements which I've been waiting on for awhile, and also went to play golf with good friends, played well and really enjoyed myself. Unfortunately D2 told me this evening at change-over she swam in the pool with OM2 this weekend, and that got me a bit angry inside, but overall it was a good day.

[BL42]

There have been significant developments in the month since my last substantive update...

The financial negotiations ramped up ahead of our trial date. It seems no one (judge, lawyers, plaintiff, or defendant) actually wants a trial. Negotiations were a major stressor between caring for the kids, focusing on a major work assignment, and reviewing the two dozen page documents and back/forth of negotiations...it was a lot. Also, I'm meticulous and was analyzing everything and hoping in my head things closed out my way. However, the open issues to address at that point were narrow and it was in everyone's interest to come to an agreement and avoid trial.

In the end, although I never wanted divorce and my family to break up, I faired very favorably in the agreement...

• Custody - Most importantly, 50/50 custody with no primary residence and successfully negotiated a "right of first refusal" so that the kids can't be dumped off to non-family members without the me having a chance to be with them instead. In practical terms this applies to the nights and I see my children significantly more than her due to before/after school and every Friday (regardless of who's week it is) as well as vacations over her time.
• Spousal Support - Waived. She was entitled to some, but based on the relatively short (7 years) of marriage and both of us having an income it wouldn't have been substantial or long-running.
• Child Support - Unfortunately our state is very unfair to me, but the law is the law. Despite having 50% nights and my caring for the the kids significantly more during the days, I have to pay her a consequential amount for the next 15-18 years, simply because I earn more. However, we did get a deviation from the presumptive amount, and my attorney says I got a "good deal", at least based on current law.
• Financial Assets - I'm coming out with roughly 85% of the assets. Fortunately for me we reside in an "equitable" not "equal" distribution state. I proved a significant amount of pre-martial assets (which are taken off the top before the rest is split) whereas she was in debt...so I leave with most of the money. She got a slightly better deal on her car and house, but I won big-time on valuation of my house, last year's taxes, 401k, bank accounts...etc. Feeling confident my L and I crushed it in the negotiations (not sure if she even realizes it to be honest).

Emotionally the process was draining. I had a breakdown when reading over the settlement proposal for the first time. In the months prior I had been quite strong and loving life, but think the finality of it really hit me. Reading the document I started tearing up and went to the bedroom to lie down and cry. It was a cathartic release. Unfortunately I had to toughen up because it came no long before S6 needed to be picked up from school for the day. But definitely reflected on all the pain and destruction of W's affairs and the divorce process. It's sad. She must have such internal turmoil from her upbringing to cause all this pain to her husband and children. For my part, I'm just doing my best to work through it and move forward.

GAL - Started a 13-session religious-based separation/divorce support group program to discuss various topics (anger, depression, loneliness, dating, finances...etc.), so hopefully that'll be helpful, though my observation of the first week is that most folks are struggling more than me. I also started playing in an adult soccer league now with co-workers, which is good for GAL and exercise, though we're a bit older than some of the "kids" running around the field LOL. And of course still coaching S6's soccer and baseball teams. I'm also thinking of going back for my Master's degree online (starting one course in the Fall semester) as my employer will pay the cost, but want to make sure I can balance everything and keep the kids my priority. Also may tip my toes into the dating pool this Summer.

In terms of the actual legal process, we're not technically divorced yet. We both signed the settlement agreement, the judge cancelled the trial, and W's attorney filed the paperwork today. Next step is for the judge to review everything and sign off. That will probably be in the next week or two. At that point I will be officially divorced.

Of course we'll still 18 more years of child rearing to navigate together...

[SteveLW]

As the husband of a wife that is the child of divorced parents.... You'll be linked to her for the rest of your life. Unless you're not going to attend your kids graduations, weddings, grand children's events.

[OnlyBent]

Completely understandable emotions BL, but you sound like you’re doing well. None of what you have described you’re feeling is abnormal. Yes you’re struggling a bit at times but you’ve got a pretty good handle on what is likely to be the toughest thing you’ll ever go through. Stay strong mate, you got this.

[BL42]

It's official. I'm legally divorced. The judge signed the paperwork, and that's it.

What a crazy 15-16 months. Feeling pretty sad about it all right now...

[Traveler]

BL42, I’m sorry the wound is fully open.

As with other days when our feelings are a tempest, this too shall pass. Be kind to yourself while you’re feeling this way. Think towards non-alcoholic comfort foods and beverages, maybe a workout.

[SteveLW]

It's official. I'm legally divorced. The judge signed the paperwork, and that's it.

What a crazy 15-16 months. Feeling pretty sad about it all right now...

Merely part of the process, BL. Many couples have D'd, only to R later. Not saying you will, or that you would even be open to it. But it does happen.

One of the things that struck me in my post-BD reading, watching video, etc. The number of WASs that eventually come back with regrets wanting to reconcile. One guy that does coaching for men now talked about how after BD, he essentially DB'd (he didn't call it that, but it really was heavy on the GAL and self-improvement side, with a good bit of detachment thrown in!). He talked about the day they signed the D papers she told him that she had noticed all of the positive changes he had made since she said she wanted a D, and that she was having second thoughts. She said she would be willing to give it another chance before signing the D. He chose to move forward with the D and move forward without her as his W. This is one example of many many couples that D with the WAS coming back around at some point wanting to R.

So you are sad because? You are now considered a divorcee? Because your marriage is over? Because it is final?

Those are the big reasons why people are afraid of D. The first one is true, nothing can be done about it, you are now a divorcee. The second one is a misnomer because your marriage has been over.....FOR A LONG TIME. And the third one is simply not true. Just like signing your marriage license wasn't "final", because as some point she changed her mind, either is a D decree "final". BL your feelings are your feelings and I do not want to minimize them, but feelings sad "about it all" means you need to process those feelings and deal with them WHY are you sad?

[Ready2Change]

It's official. I'm legally divorced. The judge signed the paperwork, and that's it.

What a crazy 15-16 months. Feeling pretty sad about it all right now...

Perfectly normal. Let the tears flow. It is healthy. Morn the loss of the relationship. Morn the loss of the future you thought you were going to have. Feel all the sadness. Cry all you want in your safe place. Let the anger out as well. Forgive your X. Forgive yourself.

My paperwork was signed Jan '09. 12 years flew by. Embrace your new reality. Enjoy your kids. Enjoy your "singleness".

[Ready2Change]

[*]Child Support - Unfortunately our state is very unfair to me, but the law is the law. Despite having 50% nights and my caring for the the kids significantly more during the days, I have to pay her a consequential amount for the next 15-18 years, simply because I earn more. However, we did get a deviation from the presumptive amount, and my attorney says I got a "good deal", at least based on current law.

I had 50/50 custody as well. My income was 2X hers, so I paid child support. I made every child support payment. Final one went out last month. I now have bragging rights. I also wish I had to pay her more (IE was making more income).

I hope you stick around and advise people to get "Right of first refusal".

[BL42]

CWarrior,

BL42, I’m sorry the wound is fully open.

As with other days when our feelings are a tempest, this too shall pass. Be kind to yourself while you’re feeling this way. Think towards non-alcoholic comfort foods and beverages, maybe a workout.

Thanks, definitely an emotional day. Even though I've been stronger over the last many months reading through the first draft of Settlement Agreement a few weeks ago and receiving the Judgement of Divorce today had me shedding some tears. I'm sure it'll get better over time, just a little tougher today.

[LH19]

BL,

Worse part is over brother. Truthfully I can't even remember that day and it was only 3 years ago. You are on the right path.

Onward and upward!

[BL42]

SteveLW,

It's official. I'm legally divorced. The judge signed the paperwork, and that's it.

What a crazy 15-16 months. Feeling pretty sad about it all right now...

Merely part of the process, BL. Many couples have D'd, only to R later. Not saying you will, or that you would even be open to it. But it does happen.

Not sure I could even stomach that at this point if it did become an option. So much betrayal and deceit. I'm reminded of two lines: 1) "All the kings horses and all the kinds men, couldn't put humpty together again." And 2) in the song "Defying Gravity" of the Broadway Musical "Wicked"..."You can still be with the Wizard. What you've worked and waited for. You can have all you ever wanted...", and the response is "I know. But I don't want it - No - I can't want it, anymore." Mostly I'm lamenting the loss of the dream of a family unit, though Ex-W has done too much for me to want R regardless...doesn't mean I'm not still sad about the situation.

One of the things that struck me in my post-BD reading, watching video, etc. The number of WASs that eventually come back with regrets wanting to reconcile. One guy that does coaching for men now talked about how after BD, he essentially DB'd (he didn't call it that, but it really was heavy on the GAL and self-improvement side, with a good bit of detachment thrown in!). He talked about the day they signed the D papers she told him that she had noticed all of the positive changes he had made since she said she wanted a D, and that she was having second thoughts. She said she would be willing to give it another chance before signing the D. He chose to move forward with the D and move forward without her as his W. This is one example of many many couples that D with the WAS coming back around at some point wanting to R.

Time will tell. I can't imagine that happening at this point, knowing her personality and the history with her mother, but who knows...guess I didn't see the divorce coming either. If I'm being honest right now part of me would like it to happen to fee; empowered, but suppose that means I need to continue working on detachment.

So you are sad because? You are now considered a divorcee? Because your marriage is over? Because it is final?

Those are the big reasons why people are afraid of D. The first one is true, nothing can be done about it, you are now a divorcee. The second one is a misnomer because your marriage has been over.....FOR A LONG TIME. And the third one is simply not true. Just like signing your marriage license wasn't "final", because as some point she changed her mind, either is a D decree "final". BL your feelings are your feelings and I do not want to minimize them, but feelings sad "about it all" means you need to process those feelings and deal with them WHY are you sad?

I'm not afraid of divorce anymore. After all, as of today I am divorced. Plus I know I'm stronger and can be happy with myself and with the kids. I'm not sure exactly why I'm so sad today. I think it's some of everything: the pain, the betrayal & deceit, the loss of the dream", rejection, a catharsis of everything over the past 15-16 months...etc. Definitely need to continue processing the emotions. I've worked through a lot of the loss and sadness, though it's bubbling up again with the current events, but am noticing more and more anger at times as well. It's a non-linear process though, right? 16 months from bomb day, nearly a year since separation...still more work to do.

[BL42]

Ready2Change,

It's official. I'm legally divorced. The judge signed the paperwork, and that's it.

What a crazy 15-16 months. Feeling pretty sad about it all right now...

Perfectly normal. Let the tears flow. It is healthy. Morn the loss of the relationship. Morn the loss of the future you thought you were going to have. Feel all the sadness. Cry all you want in your safe place. Let the anger out as well. Forgive your X. Forgive yourself.

My paperwork was signed Jan '09. 12 years flew by. Embrace your new reality. Enjoy your kids. Enjoy your "singleness".

I cried quite a bit today. I work from home so when I was the email come through and read the Judgement of Divorce I blocked off time on my calendar and laid down on my bed and cried. Cathartic release. Definitely mourning the loss today. Think I'm going to have to deal with my anger coming up too. And certainly have work to do to forgive my Ex LOL.

Good news is I have maximized and enjoyed my time with the kids over the last year and can recognize I'll be happy with them (and with myself) without my Ex. I was a stand out dad before and have poured myself into them even more to be their rock. Plus, there are some benefits to the down-time of "singleness".

[*]Child Support - Unfortunately our state is very unfair to me, but the law is the law. Despite having 50% nights and my caring for the the kids significantly more during the days, I have to pay her a consequential amount for the next 15-18 years, simply because I earn more. However, we did get a deviation from the presumptive amount, and my attorney says I got a "good deal", at least based on current law.

I had 50/50 custody as well. My income was 2X hers, so I paid child support. I made every child support payment. Final one went out last month. I now have bragging rights. I also wish I had to pay her more (IE was making more income).

I hope you stick around and advise people to get "Right of first refusal".

I make a very good salary but even more never hurt! LOL. Tough to stare down 18 more years of writing checks considering my daughter is not even 3yos, but it's just money. I've notice even after writing the checks and without my Ex's income, I'm still saving and having almost as much deposable income as before...there are fewer Amazon boxes arriving these days for some reason and the money doesn't seem flow out as much as before.

"Right of First Refusal" was my #1 priority, and my L claims we spend a good amount of negotiation capital on that, but it was important to me - I wanted in writing on paper that I could spend time with my children if Ex-W didn't want to.

I plan to stick around on the board for quite awhile to post updates, ask advice, and hopefully chimed in with help for others.

[BL42]

LH19,

BL,

Worse part is over brother. Truthfully I can't even remember that day and it was only 3 years ago. You are on the right path.

Onward and upward!

Thanks for the encouragement, LH! It's definitely been a tough day for me, but I'm glad the D process is complete - not knowing day-to-day when I'd get an email on negotiations or that your L filed or that the judge signed - what an emotional drain. Don't want to celebrate the situation, but also glad to continue moving forward.

I am looking forward to continuing to love life with my kids and my newfound "singleness".

[LH19]

Enjoy your singleness!

I just had a spur of the moment of singleness this past weekend lol.

[OnlyBent]

A week on BL, how you feeling about the D and everything?

[BL42]

OnlyBent,

A week on BL, how you feeling about the D and everything?

Appreciate you checking in! I had an emotional release for a day or two with the finality of the divorce process but then reverted back to my "new normal" of the last six months, which overall is pretty good.

I've heard it said that if something really good happens (i.e., win the lottery) you're up on a high for a bit and if something really bad happens (i.e., death in the family) you're on a low, but eventually people revert to their previous state of happiness. I think that's happening to me...6 months post-BD was really rough but over the subsequent 6-9 months I've slowly been coming back up to my previously happy/confident self. Not sure if that means my Ex-W will come down from her "high" from the new men and divorce freedom back down to her previously state of unhappiness and internal turmoil, but also suppose that's not my concern anymore either.

I have done a good bit in the last week and a half...

• Home Improvements - Found a painter to update half the house, refreshing the place and making the colors my own.
• Separation/Divorce Support Group - Started a religious-based support group with 13 bi-weekly sessions on relevant topics (depression, anger, loneliness, parenting, finances, dating...etc.)
• Adult Soccer League - 4 games in. We're definitely the older" team and get run ragged around the field, but it's good exercise / GAL.
• Coaching S6's sports teams - Great two baseball games this weekend to close out the season, bought the kids ice cream, and gave out trophies. Two more soccer sessions left this season. It's been a blast coaching S6 and the other kids, so I'll likely return to it next year, but will also enjoy more free evenings this Summer.
• Master's Degree - Applied to graduate school last week, to start in late August. My company will pay the tuition/fees/books so I figured try one class in the Fall semester and see how it goes. Just want to be mindful of balancing it on top of kids and work.
• Online Dating - I'm happy/proud of fulfilling my commitment (to myself and my kids) not to date before the D finalized, but figured it was time start exploring what's out there and do signed up for two services, and...yikes! Can not believe the percentage of women covered in tattoos and multiple nose rings. Nose rings must be a new trend? I guess my personal taste is a bit more traditional/conservative LOL. I "swiped left" about 90 percent of the time and have barely matched with anyone. Not worried about it though...there's plenty of time for that.

Also wrote a fairly big check to Ex-W to settle on the division of assets (house, vehicles...etc.). Not fun, but did get best of her in the divorce negotiations so not too worried about it either...guess that's the price of freedom! We have to work out the retirement fund transactions and then "that's that".

[SteveLW]

BL, great update! Onward and upward.

I would avoid the "swipe left, swipe right" sort of apps. Look into something more along your lines. There are Christian-based dating services, I'd look into them.

P.S. I try not to judge people, but the piercings and tattoos are out of hand! LOL I got a shoulder tattoo in my youth and have regretted it for the last 20 years. Adds nothing to my life!

[LH19]

Not sure if that means my Ex-W will come down from her "high" from the new men and divorce freedom back down to her previously state of unhappiness and internal turmoil, but also suppose that's not my concern anymore either.

This is likely going to happen but if she doesn't do the inner work she will just go out and look for another high. I think it is going to take a really, really long time for your EXW to reflect on what she has done.

[*]Online Dating - I'm happy/proud of fulfilling my commitment (to myself and my kids) not to date before the D finalized, but figured it was time start exploring what's out there and do signed up for two services, and...yikes! Can not believe the percentage of women covered in tattoos and multiple nose rings. Nose rings must be a new trend? I guess my personal taste is a bit more traditional/conservative LOL. I "swiped left" about 90 percent of the time and have barely matched with anyone. Not worried about it though...there's plenty of time for that.
[/list]

Probably too early for you to be dating and Ginger is going to come by and chew you out. one year minimum after D. Because you are so young I would wait maybe two. So I recently read an article that the average man swipes right on one out of every ten so you are right on pace. The average woman swipes on one out of every 200. That's why you are not seeing a lot of matches.

I would avoid the "swipe left, swipe right" sort of apps. Look into something more along your lines. There are Christian-based dating services, I'd look into them.

Totally disagree! There is nothing wrong with this apps as long as you keep your expectations at zero.

P.S. I try not to judge people

Spit my coffee all over my computer. Thanks Steve!

[wayfarer]

In a shocking twist of fate I agree with literally every LH just said. Including and especially about the dating stuff. His swipe stats are on the money. And would you really want to match with dozens of women. Isn't it easier to match with only a few at a time?

Also I do agree that if you can wait a little longer wait to date. If I had waited longer to date after my first MR collapsed I probably wouldn't have been in the position I was in my second MR. Like attracts like. If you aren't fully healed, and fully whole you will attract/be attracted to the same. That makes things messy for everyone involved and now you have other people to concern yourself with while choose a mate. It doesn't matter if you plan to keep the kids out. Everybody does. But eventually both of your worlds have to collide and it's best if you're in one that has real potential to stick not just potential.

Last this is more a pile on than an agreement. You and I are around the same age so take this or leave it, but at our age the dating pool is tenuous at best. Your choices are baggage with kids, baggage without kids and more baggage but with a side of bat crap crazy. The goal at this point in life is to find you're self a lovely matching set of luggage. But I digress. Yes, everyone has a right to have preferences, but dating especially when you're getting back into it should be exactly that, dating. Literally going on dates with different people. You have to figure out how to do this again. You have to figure out you again. It's good to broaden your horizons and if you're lucky if that chemistry isn't there in person maybe you meet a person or two or three who can introduce you to a new group of people or activities or places. It's fine if you're not looking for a lady so tatted and pierced her only employability is clearly doing said tattoos or piercings but you might need to reassess your standards on the outside packaging and try something different. Like a sampler or a flight per se. A couple you know you like, a couple of something new because you might like them. I'm body modification-less (well now, all my teenage piercings are gone) but ladies in my circle run the gamut with body modification and everyone of them are hard working, intelligent, empathetic, great moms, and fun loving people. Their tattoos effect very little of who they are as a person and what they like to do for fun. Take this as the same amount of bagging that people would do with CW when he was stuck in the concept that a perfect mate must have the same fitness level and interests. Sometimes it's best to reassess and maybe redefine your check list.


Off topic:
* Nose rings are not a new trend, I guess maybe septum piercings are more popular than they used to be but nose piercings have been incredibly common in women since the 90s.

**Steve I know plenty of Christians with giant crosses on their calves (men typically) and scripture all over their body (that's genderless). Every youth pastor I've met in the last 25 years has been tatted up. I don't know that "Christian" dating sites are going to make any difference in body modification

***I was told that people in their 30s should have their age range 5 years younger and 5 years older to widen their pool with people that have actual common interests and lifestyles. Men have a tendency to go 10 years downward. And women have a tendency to only go about 2ish years in either direction, or only 5 years upward.

[SteveLW]

**Steve I know plenty of Christians with giant crosses on their calves (men typically) and scripture all over their body (that's genderless). Every youth pastor I've met in the last 25 years has been tatted up. I don't know that "Christian" dating sites are going to make any difference in body modification

wf, I wasn't talking about a tattoo or two (I don't think BL was either). I just admitted that I, probably the most conservative Christian on this site!, has one. What I am talking about is massive tattoos, or several piercings. For me, and think this is where BL was going, it is a turn-off. I am sure some of the women with full tattoo sleeves, or even neck and face tattoos are wonderful people, and great moms, employees, etc. But if were BL, I would too be turned off by overt, large, or too many tattoos (or in the wrong places). Not a knock on who they are as a person, just a personal preference. Just like I am sure if I were in the dating pool, plenty of women in my age range would swipe left (or is it right, I've never used one of those apps) on me due to being shaved bald! It isn't a knock on me as person, father, employee....it is just that a lot of women prefer a man with a head of hair. -shrug-

BL, as I stated, if the "popular" apps aren't doing it I know several couples personally that met through the other sites (Christian-based as mentioned) and they have had long lasting Rs (and marriages). There are options was my point!

I also disagree with the others on it being too soon. You waited until the D was final. That is about a year after most people around here! LOL

[Traveler]

His swipe stats are on the money. And would you really want to match with dozens of women. Isn't it easier to match with only a few at a time?

Wise words to take care not to match too many at once! I got enough matches for a month of dates in 20 minutes swiping right on 33% of women--but unwisely continued for 45 minutes. Limiting swiping time is the easiest way to control how many matches are incoming. It can take a few days for a swipe to become a match, and it's easy to become overwhelmed. Overwhelmed with matches isn't good--it ends up becoming work to reply, or you're their slowest match to reply, or you send cookie-cutter replies. These work against getting to know the real people behind the matches and get out on dates.

[Traveler]

Can not believe the percentage of women covered in tattoos and multiple nose rings. Nose rings must be a new trend? I guess my personal taste is a bit more traditional/conservative LOL. I "swiped left" about 90 percent of the time and have barely matched with anyone. Not worried about it though...there's plenty of time for that.

I agree with wayfarer's timeline that nose rings became common in the 90s.

Some of this is location-dependent--I could rule out visible tattoos and wouldn't lose a single match. I'm in an urban area where ink would limit your employment options. Many women do have tattoos in places only seen by themself and lovers or maybe at beaches. I remember when our receptionist got one. She rolled up her shirt to show-off her lower back, but asked me not to let the boss know. (:

It's totally fine to have must-haves and can't-stands. You don't get to mail-order people, though, so if the 3 kindest, most loyal, most faithful partners in your area have nose piercings are you okay ruling them out for this preference? Do consider if you have any stereotypes or baggage, e.g., "Women with nose piercings are xxx". I used to next women for wearing high heels and makeup on dates as an indicator they weren't outdoorsy. That was silly! Being turned off by thick makeup is totally fine, though.

[LH19]

In a shocking twist of fate I agree with literally every LH just said.

Love is in the air lol!

[Ready2Change]

It's good to broaden your horizons....you might need to reassess your standards on the outside packaging and try something different.

Wise words.

I intentionally did not do the OLD thing. I went out interacting with all kinds of people IRL. I was 40 back then. I met some interesting women outside my "Age range". If I had limited my "filter", I most likely would not have met my lady. The top two traits I was looking for was honesty and openness.

[BL42]

Tattoos - Allow me to clarify a bit...SteveLW actually nailed it (from my perspective). While I don't personally have any, I'm also not against tattoos as a rule either. In fact my Ex-W had/has a few and I actually found them quite sexy and attractive. However, hers while big were mostly covered up areas which didn't typically display prominently in work/social settings. What I've seen so far on the dating apps is an aggressive number all over the body/face/head in addition to multiple nose piercing including the kind that you'd think of a bull. I'm talking 30-40% of the profiles, maybe more. I'm not judging them as people and don't have anything against those women personally - they could be very nice - but it's certainly not an attraction point for for me, and surprised me a bit.

Dating Readiness - I'm a bit conflicted. I do get the sense, as LH and wayfarer recommended, that I'm not quite ready yet. While I'm past the point of sadness/depression or wanting any sort of reconciliation, the anger is hitting me at times so that won't be an attractive feature and I certainly need to process through it more. On the other hand, it has been 16 months since BD, nearly a year since Ex-W moved out, and to SteveLw's point I waited for the divorce process to complete. I've been patient and self-disciplined in that area, so am interested in exploring what's out there and intrigued by a Summer romance with everything opening up COVID-wise. I do want to be mindful not to just jump into anything and keep the kids my #1 priority.

Dating Apps / Pool - I live in a small (maybe mid) sized area. It's not a tiny rural town but it's also not a major hub of growth with endless singles either. Maybe I'm wrong, but not sure the dating pool is massive like it is in larger areas. I'm not expecting 30 dates in 20mins of swiping CWarrior LOL. I think of myself as a pretty good catch: good looking, decent shape, excellent father, strong finances, great career...etc. but also recognize the (recent) divorce and two young children will (understandably) not be many potential matches' cup of tea. Also, I work from home in a traditionally older/white/male industry so not meeting women and singles that way. So...I'm trying the "swipe right/left" apps but not expecting all that much there, especially after the past week. If anything swiping 9 out of 10 is me broadening the pool. The more target apps (like Christian ones) would have even more limited pools in my area SteveLW. In terms of networking, my main goal in volunteering to coach sports was to bond with my son, but a side benefit has been expanding my network in the community. So who knows where connections made might lead. Also not overly worried about it at this point. To LH and wayfarer's point, it won't be the worse thing to go slower.

[SteveLW]

BL, you've got this. Great head on your shoulders, good sense of self worth. Know what you're looking for. I have no doubts that if and when you're ready for MR 2.0 it has a great chance at being for life. Keep up the awesome work!

[OnlyBent]

Thanks for the update BL, sounds like you're doing well. I respect how you have gone about things.

Appreciate you checking in! I had an emotional release for a day or two with the finality of the divorce process but then reverted back to my "new normal" of the last six months, which overall is pretty good.

From my experience so far, and others here, this sounds completely normal and likely to continue on for a while.

I've heard it said that if something really good happens (i.e., win the lottery) you're up on a high for a bit and if something really bad happens (i.e., death in the family) you're on a low, but eventually people revert to their previous state of happiness. I think that's happening to me...6 months post-BD was really rough but over the subsequent 6-9 months I've slowly been coming back up to my previously happy/confident self. Not sure if that means my Ex-W will come down from her "high" from the new men and divorce freedom back down to her previously state of unhappiness and internal turmoil, but also suppose that's not my concern anymore either.

Interesting comment here BL, I am feeling the same as well. Whilst my M wasn't amazing, far from it, I was still a pretty happy and confident person. STBXW was not. I've said it before, our sitch's are as similar as can be despite being on opposite sides of the world. Will be interesting to see how it plays out.

[OnlyBent]

This is likely going to happen but if she doesn't do the inner work she will just go out and look for another high. I think it is going to take a really, really long time for your EXW to reflect on what she has done.

Really, really long time may very well be never I'd say

[LH19]

B,

The reason I say that is because you Ws are really young. I think a woman in her late 30s and early 40s is going through a midlife transition. I think it takes people to get into there 50s to really reflect on the mistakes they made in their lives. I have a friend who is 52 who is going through this right now. He’s really been reflecting on where he went wrong.

Also you are right there may be no regrets. But like Wayfarer points out, all straight men are selfish and self centered so it’s likely she’s just trading problems for more problems due to the baggage other people bring with them.

[OnlyBent]

The reason I say that is because you Ws are really young. I think a woman in her late 30s and early 40s is going through a midlife transition. I think it takes people to get into there 50s to really reflect on the mistakes they made in their lives. I have a friend who is 52 who is going through this right now. He’s really been reflecting on where he went wrong.

Well this makes me really grateful that at 38/39 I am going through this process of reflection now and owning my mistakes.

[BL42]

BL, you've got this. Great head on your shoulders, good sense of self worth. Know what you're looking for. I have no doubts that if and when you're ready for MR 2.0 it has a great chance at being for life. Keep up the awesome work!

Thanks SteveLW!

This is likely going to happen but if she doesn't do the inner work she will just go out and look for another high. I think it is going to take a really, really long time for your EXW to reflect on what she has done.

Really, really long time may very well be never I'd say

The reason I say that is because you Ws are really young. I think a woman in her late 30s and early 40s is going through a midlife transition. I think it takes people to get into there 50s to really reflect on the mistakes they made in their lives. I have a friend who is 52 who is going through this right now. He’s really been reflecting on where he went wrong.

LH19/OnlyBent - I think you're right it's going to be a really, really long time for any self reflection or remorse (if ever). So far it's seemingly been a locomotive full steam ahead since BD and certainly since physical separation/D. There's been ZERO looking back or wavering, at least outwardly.

I was talking to a friend (used to be mutual friend w/W) whose sister was doing the same thing (affair w/co-worker, followed by a different boyfriend and divorce) to her husband / my friend's brother-in-law at the same time of my sitch. Their mom did the same thing to her dad (as my ex-M-I-L did to my ex-F-I-L). Their family actually staged an intervention with her sister having both parents saying how they regret the affair and divorce, wish they had stayed together, and recommended she stop. Of course, the intervention didn't help.

[BL42]

Yesterday I was outside working on the house and playing with S6 and D2 when a neighbor I only know casually walked by with his dog and two sons. Our kids started playing together so he & I strike up a conversation.

At one point he asked me if I was separated or divorced. I guess he's seen me around quite a bit with the kids but no sign of their mom. I wasn't offended or anything and just responded casually, "yes, recently". He followed up and asked: "Do you have full custody? Because it seems like they're ALWAYS with you.", so I just chuckled and said "Well, not on officially paper but in practice close to it".

Anyway...my neighbor goes on to tell me 3 years ago he and his W actually got legally divorced and very recently re-married. They had issues and stress when the kids were young / he was traveling for work, separated and went through the entire divorced process, then a few years rekindle things and married again.

Now, I'm not trying to apply this to my own situation or even use it as "hope" for an R w/my Ex - that's that ship as sailed in my mind - but I did find it quite interesting, and thought I'd share it with the board. Post-D recons do happen; I now know of a real-life tangible example. Maybe it'll give some folks reading this post hope for their own sitch...

[OnlyBent]

He followed up and asked: "Do you have full custody? Because it seems like they're ALWAYS with you.", so I just chuckled and said "Well, not on officially paper but in practice close to it".

This must have felt great BL, like recognition for all the hard work and focus you have been putting into your kids, props my man (not that this is why you do it)!

[BL42]

Yet another random anecdotal encounter...

I bought a new bedroom set post-separation and just sold my previous dresser through an online marketplace. The guy who shows up tells me he just got divorced and needs furniture for his kids. I didn't dig on circumstance or details out of respect to his situation, but curiosity got the best of me afterwards...based on his online profile he was married 9 years to a beautiful woman, and they have a 7yo daughter and 5yo son. Now, I admittedly know very little to nothing about them and their lives, but they certainly seem nice and normal from the pictures, so it made me wonder why they (like so many of us here) weren't able to work through their issues and stay together. Wouldn't that have been better for them (and many of us) in the long run?

Anyway, these situations seem so rampant - what a messed up world we live in.

[SteveLW]

Yet another random anecdotal encounter...

I bought a new bedroom set post-separation and just sold my previous dresser through an online marketplace. The guy who shows up tells me he just got divorced and needs furniture for his kids. I didn't dig on circumstance or details out of respect to his situation, but curiosity got the best of me afterwards...based on his online profile he was married 9 years to a beautiful woman, and they have a 7yo daughter and 5yo son. Now, I admittedly know very little to nothing about them and their lives, but they certainly seem nice and normal from the pictures, so it made me wonder why they (like so many of us here) weren't able to work through their issues and stay together. Wouldn't that have been better for them (and many of us) in the long run?

Anyway, these situations seem so rampant - what a messed up world we live in.

I have a lot of personal beliefs on why this is so common, but that is for another forum and another time. But yes, it is way too common these days!!

[Ready2Change]

it made me wonder why they (like so many of us here) weren't able to work through their issues and stay together.

Relationships are hard work. There are skills that we are not taught. We do not have good role models and support systems. I could go on and on.

[BL42]

This thread has reached 100 posts so I need to start a new one. Bomb Day was 16 months ago and I am now officially divorced, so should I stay here in the "Newcomers" forum or transition over to "Surviving the Big D"? What's the rule of thumb?

[Traveler]

BL42, personal preference, but the Surviving the Big D group are all focused on a future without their X. If you still hope to R and are trying to maximize those chances I’d probably stay here. If you’re only going to update every 3 months or so I’d stay here where more people know you. Otherwise, join the dark side!.

[Navarro]

How do I post??? It shows I have messages but I can’t check them&#128584;

[job]

New Thread:

WAW w/Exit Affair or WW? - Divorced Anyway (4)