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i'm glad your friend's farm and the animals were spared. I have friends who are like family to me who are now traveling out of state due to evacuation.

As far as leaving the area - don't make any hasty decisions right now. Try to keep it as simple as you can. Don't plan more than a week out. Get as much rest as you can. Get as much exercise as possible. Focus on your immediate needs and base your goals on the core values you've identified for yourself. Most of that Job taught me. The last one I learned on my own.

Protecting yourself is not an option - it's self care. Imagine any other person in the world treating you as your H is currently. What would be your response - as you stated, avoidance. You're being polite. You're being respectful. If you can behave in a manner that is congruent with your core values, that is all anyone can ask of you. If it's not good enough for someone who has already said they are leaving you, then too bad for him.

Honestly my dear, I wish I'd known more when I was in your shoes. I would have practiced metta even more deeply, and ho'onoponopono as well, because both kept and continue to keep me sane. More. Focus. On. You. All. Focus. On. You.

Does any of that make sense?


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
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Hello cardinal

Originally Posted by cardinal
Someone was saying to me that maybe it's better to have a L who seems aggressive even if you don't necessarily "like" him or connect with him, but don't I want someone who can help diffuse conflict and not feed it in this situation?

I would say it is unlikely to find a L you like or connect with after a meeting or two.

I felt much better about my own lawyer after my separation AND the rewriting of my will. The legal altering of my will could not happen until W and I separated, I found out.

My L’s skills and expertise had been proven during separation. However, it is more than that. It’s trust. And that takes time. I had extended my faith to him for leading me, and looking after my interests during the divorce. I was not disappointed. I trusted him to understand and empathize my desires to help me craft my will accordingly. Again I was not disappointed.

And in the less than the required year, when XW served me papers, his behaviour has sealed him as a professional I would recommend. And yes, a person I like. However, our relationship is business.

Do you want someone who can defuse conflict? And not feed this situation? No you do not. You want a lawyer that can bring this situation to a timely and fair resolution. The lawyer is hired to dissolve your marriage, not save it.

There is conflict, this is divorce after all. The L’s job is to hash out those conflicts with the other L and bring you the options. And that requires feeding directly into this situation. Feeding in a way to garner you what you are negotiating for, if possible.

The very skills necessary to see the overall picture, to not prolong conflict or the situation, probably appears rather aggressive. Results oriented is an aggressive work style.

I would tend to agree to look for competent and aggressive instead of likeable. Lawyer vs counsellor, I suppose.

Originally Posted by cardinal
I struggle with feeling like I have failed in one of my goals of staying friendly, in feeling like we are further apart than ever.

Originally Posted by cardinal
I think it is just a way of being that I'm not used to--I'd rather have friendly chit chat than silence. I've never had to be in close quarters with someone who was treating me this way. I've never really been treated the way H has treated me during spew, period. And I think I still confuse remaining compassionate with being overtly friendly. Would I be overly talkative to a cashier who had yelled at me? I would probably avoid their line next time. But I wouldn't go out of my way to be unkind to them. Am I on the right track here?

I am sorry you feel you have failed with your goal of staying friendly.

I like your cashier analogy; not purposefully seeking to be unkind. At times that is all one can do to be compassionate and friendly. Avoid interaction for a while, until times allows for emotions to cool. You are avoiding H’s line is all.

Yes, you and he are further apart than ever. Unless you tried talking and pushing kindness upon him. You wisely know how that would go down and the fallout from such a confrontation. You are upon the higher path. The right track.

Compassion and friendly do somewhat get blurred. True, both can and plenty do exist within each other’s realm. It is compassion that can exist with indifference. And indifference is a way of being that takes some getting used to.

You are doing good my friend.

D


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Originally Posted by cardinal
I think it is just a way of being that I'm not used to--I'd rather have friendly chit chat than silence. I've never had to be in close quarters with someone who was treating me this way. I've never really been treated the way H has treated me during spew, period. And I think I still confuse remaining compassionate with being overtly friendly. Would I be overly talkative to a cashier who had yelled at me? I would probably avoid their line next time. But I wouldn't go out of my way to be unkind to them. Am I on the right track here?

Hi Cardinal,

I don't think you have any obligation to be chit-chat friendly with your H. i know it feels weird and wrong and like you're the bad guy... but you aren't. I really truly don't think you are breaking a commitment to yourself to be a compassionate human being when you stay silent. Silence can be incredibly uncomfortable but it can also be peace-bringing and healing. And when you are putting your friendliness and kindness out to someone who cannot return it in kind, maybe it is actually kinder to simply say nothing. Don't put him into a situation where he feels like he maybe needs to say something in return and he simply isn't capable of doing that well right now. Does that make sense? By giving him silence instead of opening the door for interaction, you are preventing an opportunity for him to spew which is better not only for you but for him as well.

Turn that big heart in on yourself and nourish your own spirit right now. You need it and you deserve it. xx


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Originally Posted by cardinal

The other thing bothering me is that H and I barely say anything to each other now, since his spew a month ago. I've tried to stay NC other than offering cordial hellos or good mornings, and H has been gone a lot. There hasn't even been a short exchange about the fires. I struggle with feeling like I have failed in one of my goals of staying friendly, in feeling like we are further apart than ever. I realize that it's his decision to spew and belittle me that has contributed to this more than anything I have said or done, but I still have that nagging feeling sometimes like I'm failing to do something or act a certain way, or to act like myself. Maybe it's because I'm just seeing through his warped perspective--that I'm cold and never loved him and, see, now I'm just confirming it.

Hi Cardinal,
[/i]Same. Same. Same[i]...I can’t remember the last time H and I have said hello or good morning. The last interaction was a week ago and he was in fine spewing form...and now silence as well as darkness (literally won’t turn lights on when he comes upstairs ....beezare!!) I feel like this is compassionate failure as well.

Reading a lot of the advice that was posted I did find helpful. And I do think a big part of us feeling this way is because it is such foreign behaviour for us. Trust me though you are not “cold” nor did you “never love him” - this is gaslighting, searching for sense but allowing it to get twisted.

Compassion comes in many forms and sometimes the compassionate focus needs to be taken off of our H and put onto us. After all they are “living their best lives” (until they are not). We need to “right” ourselves the best way we know how with very little answers or explanations. (I’m telling myself all of this too btw....)

I remember job and dnj saying early on that actions we take as LBS’s will seem counterproductive and all wrong...but that’s when you know you’re heading in the right direction...(I hope I have the jest of that correct) Maybe that’s what this is Cardinal, as may22 said:

Originally Posted by may22
I don't think you have any obligation to be chit-chat friendly with your H. i know it feels weird and wrong and like you're the bad guy... but you aren't. I really truly don't think you are breaking a commitment to yourself to be a compassionate human being when you stay silent. Silence can be incredibly uncomfortable but it can also be peace-bringing and healing. And when you are putting your friendliness and kindness out to someone who cannot return it in kind, maybe it is actually kinder to simply say nothing. Don't put him into a situation where he feels like he maybe needs to say something in return and he simply isn't capable of doing that well right now. Does that make sense? By giving him silence instead of opening the door for interaction, you are preventing an opportunity for him to spew which is better not only for you but for him as well.

Maybe it is taking some more of the pressure off of them?

Have you baked anything lately? I think I’m due to make some brownies .....yummmmmm
(((Cardinal)))
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It's been hard to find time and focus to write a post here, though as always I've been reading along with everyone's threads and finding much wisdom and support.

bttrfly, Sage, DnJ, may, and Kindly, your posts on dharma and compassion and kindness really have helped me to rethink the way I was framing my relative silence toward H. I've read them many times. I am so grateful for them. Sage, your recent-ish post on your thread really resonated with me, as did the responses from peace, Scout, etc.

Since I last posted, my focus has been almost entirely on me, and I haven't spent any time reading articles and websites in an attempt to understand H. I have a ton of work to do to get ready for online teaching starting in a few weeks, so there's that. Then I started researching other states, other cities. As the fires near here have started to get a little more under control, I stopped feeling the need to run from them and started thinking with less urgency about leaving the state. I've always been adamant in wanting to stay here because I've been here almost a third of my life now, have a wonderful community of friends, have animals to care for, and, despite the fires and high cost of living, there is a lot I love about this region. It's still clear that if I am to stay, I must stay in this house. Rents have gone up so much everywhere else, and there's almost nothing to rent--it's crazy. But H was my family here. I don't have family here now. I started thinking more about whether I will want to stay, long-term, in an area that was expensive for a couple with 1 1/2 the income and will be that much more expensive for me on my own. It seems unlikely I could ever buy a house here on my own unless I win the lottery. Maybe, with a much better job, I could save like crazy for 10 years and manage. That would depend on a lot of factors.

I started entertaining the prospect of where I might want to go if I didn't live here. I started spending hours researching other places. Short answer: I really don't know. What I always wanted was to live where I live now.

bttrfly, you advised me not to try to plan too far in advance. For the last 14 months, I've been operating on the assumption that I would stay here, that post-D I would give myself a year to figure out if I wanted to make any big changes, that no life decisions would need to be made in the midst of what is already such a life-altering shift. But I've been wondering if being willing to leave my life here and move in search of another one is something that would benefit me in negotiation wth H, monetarily and/or emotionally, in that it may mean a quicker agreement, and less time with this alien H. Could any positives there really outweigh what I'd be giving up? How can I know that in the present?

That said, when is this process even going to start? Is he really never going to act on the decision he made last year? Am I really going to have to file myself at some point? I mentioned to IC re-reading the letter H wrote me last fall, the one announcing his decision to file. Even though he was drinking all the time and, from my perspective, not in a healthy place, he was able to write a letter that was somewhat apologetic and rational-sounding. Sure, it oversimplified a lot (you know, the whole I need to D to be happy, all my problems are solved), but that's to be expected. I feel like this is echoing Kindly's post now--it's so hard for me to imagine how someone could make that kind of decision, announce it, and then never act on it. Of course IC reminded me that people with mental health issues often don't act rationally. I mean, every post on this board is proof of that, right? It's par for the course for MLCers.

bttrfly, how have the chickens settled in? How are your friends that had to evacuate? Kindly, I made some cake last week in honor of my friend's birthday (though she doesn't live nearby, it was a good excuse for cake!). I'm not sure what's up next. Brownies always sound good!


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Originally Posted by cardinal
Since I last posted, my focus has been almost entirely on me, and I haven't spent any time reading articles and websites in an attempt to understand H.


Good for you Cardinal! Not easy to stop this hunt for answers but I deleted all the tabs I had open on my phone and felt a sense of relief. I’ve read so much that it all started to blend together and was getting me nowhere mentally. When I do focus on myself I find much more peace so there’s my answer as to where the value is right now.

Originally Posted by cardinal
bttrfly, you advised me not to try to plan too far in advance. For the last 14 months, I've been operating on the assumption that I would stay here, that post-D I would give myself a year to figure out if I wanted to make any big changes, that no life decisions would need to be made in the midst of what is already such a life-altering shift. But I've been wondering if being willing to leave my life here and move in search of another one is something that would benefit me in negotiation wth H, monetarily and/or emotionally, in that it may mean a quicker agreement, and less time with this alien H. Could any positives there really outweigh what I'd be giving up? How can I know that in the present?


Been doing lots of thinking on all of this too Cardinal...for the longest time I felt like having to leave my house was another “failure” on top of the D (none of which has happened yet) one day at a time and only deal with what’s immediately on the plate. But this is hard being a planner and not liking suspense. Many of my close circle don’t understand why I would want to stay here...but we’ve accomplished so much here, I love the area and have completed so many Reno’s to make it home. I’m coming around to a mindset that perhaps the answers will present themselves when it’s time. I dunno?

Yummmm I love any excuse for cake and would love a piece!!!

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Originally Posted by cardinal

Since I last posted, my focus has been almost entirely on me, and I haven't spent any time reading articles and websites in an attempt to understand H. I have a ton of work to do to get ready for online teaching starting in a few weeks, so there's that. Then I started researching other states, other cities. As the fires near here have started to get a little more under control, I stopped feeling the need to run from them and started thinking with less urgency about leaving the state. I've always been adamant in wanting to stay here because I've been here almost a third of my life now, have a wonderful community of friends, have animals to care for, and, despite the fires and high cost of living, there is a lot I love about this region. It's still clear that if I am to stay, I must stay in this house. Rents have gone up so much everywhere else, and there's almost nothing to rent--it's crazy. But H was my family here. I don't have family here now. I started thinking more about whether I will want to stay, long-term, in an area that was expensive for a couple with 1 1/2 the income and will be that much more expensive for me on my own. It seems unlikely I could ever buy a house here on my own unless I win the lottery. Maybe, with a much better job, I could save like crazy for 10 years and manage. That would depend on a lot of factors.

I started entertaining the prospect of where I might want to go if I didn't live here. I started spending hours researching other places. Short answer: I really don't know. What I always wanted was to live where I live now.


It's ok not to know right now. The point is, you're open to at least the possibility. That is huge. Great job!

Originally Posted by cardinal

bttrfly, you advised me not to try to plan too far in advance. For the last 14 months, I've been operating on the assumption that I would stay here, that post-D I would give myself a year to figure out if I wanted to make any big changes, that no life decisions would need to be made in the midst of what is already such a life-altering shift. But I've been wondering if being willing to leave my life here and move in search of another one is something that would benefit me in negotiation wth H, monetarily and/or emotionally, in that it may mean a quicker agreement, and less time with this alien H. Could any positives there really outweigh what I'd be giving up? How can I know that in the present?


I don't know Card. I really don't. I'm foregoing alimony because I don't want the BS attached. My peace of mind is worth more to me right now, as is my son's peace. You have to come to that place on your own, and you will in time. Trust that.
Originally Posted by cardinal


That said, when is this process even going to start? Is he really never going to act on the decision he made last year? Am I really going to have to file myself at some point? I mentioned to IC re-reading the letter H wrote me last fall, the one announcing his decision to file. Even though he was drinking all the time and, from my perspective, not in a healthy place, he was able to write a letter that was somewhat apologetic and rational-sounding. Sure, it oversimplified a lot (you know, the whole I need to D to be happy, all my problems are solved), but that's to be expected. I feel like this is echoing Kindly's post now--it's so hard for me to imagine how someone could make that kind of decision, announce it, and then never act on it. Of course IC reminded me that people with mental health issues often don't act rationally. I mean, every post on this board is proof of that, right? It's par for the course for MLCers.



My exh was an absolute pr!c&. Once the house was sold and he had money in his pocket, he started with the ILYs ... and got monstery when I told him to stop. It was radio silence on D for months and months. We're talking 8 months. Finally he said, 'well, I guess we'd better get on with it.'

At the time, obviously i did not know he was in another relationship. I told him it was up to him, I was not going to make the move. This was his divorce. I felt really strongly about that because I didn't want to tell our son I was the one who filed. I put the onus strictly on the person who left - exh. That was my choice, and here we are 4 years later and I'm glad I played it that way, for my son's sake. However, we were not living together and had little to no contact. Your sitch is different.
Originally Posted by cardinal


bttrfly, how have the chickens settled in? How are your friends that had to evacuate? Kindly, I made some cake last week in honor of my friend's birthday (though she doesn't live nearby, it was a good excuse for cake!). I'm not sure what's up next. Brownies always sound good!






The chickens are completely sublimely happy in their new space. Overnight Belle grew wattles. I'm not sure what kind of a bird Violet is. I posted on the chicken board and one person said another marans. Remains somewhat unclear to me. They all get along well and are very peaceful and content. They do not have an egg box yet. I'm thinking of just setting aside interior space since the coop is 4x6 and there's only 5 birds. Thoughts? The buff orps are 17 weeks and the remaining three are 16 weeks. Ty for asking about them and my friend. She's seriously thinking of leaving the state as she's not willing to go through this every year.

How are your girls?? Your friends?


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
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That this too, was a gift."
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Hello! Short update just got longer after my morning with H—bear with me, if you can!

Part 1:

I have continued to be so busy with job and planning upcoming classes, and then last week, after I'd really come to peace with leaving this state and started to get excited about all the other possibilities, I got a job interview here. And then, of course, two days later, a job offer. I hope the universe it telling me my time here is not done--that's the way I'm trying to see it. It's an entry-level job with great benefits and pretty good pay that will finally allow me to be financially independent from H, but the rental market is so bare and so expensive, it doesn't pay quite enough to give me the freedom to move out to another (inevitably much more expensive) rental. I will still make 20k less than H, but I don't know how much support I will be entitled to now, and I also wonder if the court will still order him to help with my L expenses. I had been dreaming about moving far away and cutting ties with this house H refuses to leave, even if that meant leaving the chickens, but now, if I accept the offer, I'm in the same stalemate house-wise.

I have pretty much decided to accept the job, because there is room for growth in the next year and hopefully more money, because I need job experience to transition to supporting myself and future opportunities, and because it's for an organization whose work I believe in. Everyone tells me this job doesn't mean I'm stuck here--I can choose to quit and leave in six months if I want to. But I don't feel like I have quite the freedom I had before the job offer--that I lost some power with H because I'm back to needing to stay in this house. Turning down the offer isn't really an option--I know how hard it is to get a job in this market, in these crazy times, how lucky I would be to have my own health insurance and steady income, and to work from home for the time being. I hope some of you here can offer encouragement, as I'm stressed about working from home with H, with learning a new job while teaching two classes when my energy level is waning after a year+ of this situation (my confidence is still lower than it should be after this last year, I'm realizing), all while dealing with H's moods and no longer being able to escape the house to go to work.


Part 2:

I'd been meaning to come here and post that update, but I have another set of questions after a not-surprising confrontation from H. I'd been planning to open my own account next month now that I'll have my own income, and to tell H that I would start paying half of the rent, utilities, and internet. Today I asked him to move my desk out of his room (it used to be my office/our guest room), because I'll need to start using it. I said, Doesn't have to be today, but sometime this week would be great--thanks!

I then expected a passive aggressive confrontation of some kind to follow, and about an hour later, got one.

In summary: H went out, came back, started tearing his room apart. I knew he would probably start rearranging his room, because he has mountains of stuff on my desk all the time, and nowhere to put it. He then came to my room and asked if he could move the TV from the living room to his room, because I get to use it, but he never gets to, because I "go to bed so early, he can't ever watch TV or play video games!" (My room doesn't have a door, just a curtain, and it faces the living room.)

I wasn't sure in the moment, so I said, Hmm. Well, I do watch it sometimes... He was already turning around when I followed up with, Could you use your headphones and use it even if I'm in bed?

Characteristically, he cut me off and said, "Never mind! It's fine!" as he was walking back to his room.

A few minutes later, he came back to say, "By the way, starting next month, I'm only paying half the rent, half the utilities, and half the internet. Welcome to the real world! And I can't have you pay for car registration because it's under my name, but if you want to drive the car, you're paying for the insurance, and I'm taking my name off of it."

I bristled because, once again, he's telling me what he's going to grant me and what he's not. I wanted to bring up the fact that he's basically been paying all of these things in lieu of support, but didn't. Since I was planning to get my own account and start paying for half of these joint expenses anyway, I let it go.

I did say that if he would sign the car over to me, I would pay for registration, insurance, everything. But if it's not my car, I said, I'm not sure if it makes sense for me to pay all of the insurance.

"I'm planning on giving you the car when we're actually divorced, but I've got to take care of things first. For now, if you want to drive it, you pay the insurance. That's how it works." (I didn't point out that I could get a court order if he refused to let me drive it--in other words, he thinks he has all the power, but that's not quite accurate. This would only inflame things, so I used this knowledge to reassure myself.)

Next, I brought up moving the TV and said I would think about it, because maybe I could then move my desk to the living room. I'm going to have to WFH in either that spot or in the entry way right outside his room. H made it clear that he knows I'm going to be teaching classes (I'm pretty sure that's why he decided to stop paying all the rent), but I didn't tell him about my other job offer.

I think because I stayed calm we were able to discuss pros and cons of desk location for a minute--he WFH in the kitchen, and the pro to me working from the entryway is that I can close a door that separates his room and entryway from the rest of the house. He of course is worried about whether he will be able to listen to music in his room during the day while I'm working. I didn't say much to this except that I would let him know what I decide about where I want to work. He ended with a comment about how the TV should be his because he paid for it, "but whatever." (Apparently anything we bought while we were married should be his because he paid for it, i.e. he made most of the income. Uh huh. But, in the end, am I going to fight over the TV? No.)

Questions:

1. Is it in fact fair for me to pay all of the insurance on the car if the car is still in his name? If he would just sign it over like he says he intends to do, it would be simpler because I would pay for registration and everything, and he wouldn't have to deal with it. I didn't keep pressing this point though. The way I see it, if I can afford to pay the insurance, it's not a big deal, and at least I get to drive the car without having to get a court order to keep driving it. I think it was more the way he said, "Pay this or you're not using the car," that I was objecting to, than actually paying the insurance.

2. Did I do okay in this exchange? I am still bothered that he continues to come and TELL me what I can and can't have, what I will pay for, etc., rather than approaching it as a discussion. It's clear he still does not see me as an equal, and thinks it is entirely within his power to order me to do whatever. This would be a problem if I wasn't starting a new job, as I would have to involve a L to get temporary support if he was demanding that I pay half of joint expenses when I didn't have enough income to do so. BUT since I was planning on bringing up splitting finances by the end of the month and my paying him half anyway, because thank goodness I have a job now, I just let him think he was running the show on this, because I saw no point in explaining that his attitude and assumptions were passive aggressive, unfair, or unkind. I'm getting what I wanted: desk out of his room, split finances.

3. On where to WFH: I should choose where to work based on where I want to work--where I think I could have the most focus and privacy; I shouldn't choose based on whether H will be able to listen to music or not. Isn't it fair to ask him to use headphones if he's listening to music during regular work hours, no matter where my desk is? (His music is loud no matter where you are in the small house.) Then again, maybe if I choose to work from the living room, which I think is his preference, he would be less apt to passive-aggressively start listening to music during the day anyway. In the end, I should be able to try out one spot and move to the other one if I choose to.

3. My instinct was to bring up this supposed D again, or to say, again, when is work on this supposed agreement starting? To again suggest mediation. But that feels like me pushing again and getting no results in return--I pushed for financial docs 6 weeks ago, and, no surprise, still have not gotten any. Should I be proactively doing anything else here? I have a retainer ready to sign as soon as I decide I need a L. I'm still holding out hope that H will decide to leave on his own. I'm not sure if getting served papers would push me to retain L right away or if it would depend on what else was happening. I think my friends are hoping I would just file, but I'm not quite there yet. There's not a lot in our joint checking, and I've been paying my credit card every month out of it, so I'm not going to demand half of that even—I'm just opening my new account and starting fresh. I still don't know, however, how much is exactly in the savings account I can't access.

I think I'm trying to reassure myself that I wasn't stepped over, even though it feels like it, since I didn't say much. All in all, I have some anger over how he continues to interact with me, but I did better this time at not engaging with him or trying to get him to see that, for instance, we are still married. Saying nothing still kinda feels like I'm not standing up for myself (even though in this case I think things were working out as I'd planned, and that's why I didn't speak up more). Mind-reading, but his attitude says he walked away likely thinking "She's finally gonna have to pay her share! I've been so nice in not demanding it until now," and still assuming he's got me under his thumb. There was/is still the temptation to want to reflect his warped reality back to him, but I know that is a lost cause. No matter what I say/do, he won't see things from any other perspective, and anything I say will be used against me.

I want to be able to walk away from an interaction with H, no matter how he acts, feeling confident that I am saying/doing/not-saying/not-doing all the right things, but I'm not there yet either. I do, however, feel way better than the last time I was drawn into his spewing and tried to have a conversation as if I was talking to old H. I'm not regretting anything I said, so that's the upside to not saying much!


Last edited by cardinal; 09/07/20 09:49 PM.

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Originally Posted by Kindly
I’m coming around to a mindset that perhaps the answers will present themselves when it’s time. I dunno?


I too saw leaving as another failure for a long time. And this mindset once again proved true, as suddenly I was open to considering other possibilities that came with leaving. I couldn't have gotten there any sooner than I did. My friend said it was as if I'd been "buffering" for a month (though really it's probably more accurate to say that it started on some level at BD). Once I got the interview, I realized that I was really ready to leave and felt almost a little disappointed when I got the job offer. And, as I wrote above, I've been conflicted about staying now. You remind me that I should probably look at this again with the answers in time mindset. Here's an answer for now: I'm staying and have a job. Maybe different answers will come in time.

Originally Posted by bttrfly
The point is, you're open to at least the possibility. That is huge.

Thanks for saying that, bttrfly. It did feel huge to find myself open to the possibility, and then almost ready to embrace it. This feels like a really big shift--the focus is so much more on me and what I want my future to look like. Do I still have times when I think of a memory and wish things were different? Yeah. I was reading one of May's updates recently and realized some little part of me still hopes for reconciliation in the future. I suppose I just have to acknowledge that desire still exists, and let it exist alongside the steps I'm taking for my own future.

Originally Posted by bttrfly
That was my choice, and here we are 4 years later and I'm glad I played it that way, for my son's sake. However, we were not living together and had little to no contact. Your sitch is different.

It will be interesting to see how I feel over the next few months. I think if we weren't living together and had no contact, I would be more at peace. If we are both still living here next year and H has not filed, I might feel differently about really wanting him to own his decision to D.

I am glad your chickens are happy and enjoying their home! We just have a few small partitions in our coop to act as nesting boxes, and they usually all fight over the same spot. Our chickens are molting, and there are feathers everywhere. I'm going to have to clean out the coop soon. Also, I am feeling like your friend--I can't imagine living in this state long-term and going through these fires year after year. If I actually owned a house and had to evacuate, or rebuild, as so many have... it would be even harder to want to stay. All that and the cost of living? It's a lot to handle.


T: 16 M:10
BD 6/2019
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Hi Cardinal,

Congratulations on the job!! That is awesome!! I think it is terrific and agree with all your friends that starting a job doesn't mean you can't quit in a few months if you decide it is best for you to move to a different city. This gives you a lot more freedom and control and ability to make decisions without worrying about your H and what he will or won't do financially. Also, it helps you to establish a broader work history -- always easier to move jobs when you're in one than when you aren't.

I think you handled all that very, very well. Really impressive. You seem far less drawn in emotionally to his garbage and the very fact that you were so calm in the moment, can reflect on what makes most sense for you and what is driving any need to push back, is really really great.

I do think that to the extent you can simply not care what is going on in his mind and whether or not he thinks he can order you around, or tell you what you do/don't deserve financially, the better. If he feels more in control *and* you are getting what you want/need, that is better for you as you're spared his BS.

On the desk location-- yes, choose the best place to WFH for you. I don't think it is asking too much to have him wear headphones (it is probably not a bad idea for you to as well). And if it doesn't work out, move somewhere else.

On the car insurance... if it were me, I would probably just pay the insurance too, not pay the registration or whatever if he isn't going to sign it over, and take it as a free car for awhile. you might, though, look into buying a car of your own-- without knowing any of the numbers, I could imagine that there is a chance that you could lease something pretty inexpensively (or maybe buy a used electric car which would also save on gas?) and you might even get a better insurance deal with just your name on it than your H's too, depending on his driving history.

You being stepped on or standing up for yourself-- to me, it seems like a perspective thing. if you know you're doing the right thing for yourself, you're doing the right thing and standing up for yourself, even if you did that just by saying nothing. If he thinks he got to squash you but you aren't squashed... who cares what he thinks? You know the truth and can be secure in the knowledge that you're doing the right thing for yourself and for the right reasons. Him feeling smug for getting one over you is no different from him thinking all the other ridiculous things he's been thinking.

Sounds like things are going well for you, Cardinal... you're doing great.


Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs
9/20 - present: R and piecing
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