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Scout, not pleasant, but will likely be helpful for your case. Judges really do not like people they believe are making things difficult or not playing nice. Follow her advice and hope that he leaves it with some cutting words and then finds an attorney. More evidence of what you are dealing with.

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scout12 Offline OP
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Yes, I can't quite believe he thought it appropriate to respond to my L in that manner.

Here are the facts about the issue he is so angry about.

1) The current arrangement, which has been in place since August, had his visitation time occur at my/S2's house. Since I stopped allowing him in the house in November, these visits have taken place at the park, at his parents' or sister's place, or just out and about. There was never a discussion about visitation occurring at his place because he refused to share his address whenever I raised it.

2) He was forced to share his address in order to complete the consent orders two weeks ago. Other than the general suburb information, I had no knowledge of where he lived. My proposed compromise to the current arrangement was sent to him in January, well before I had this information, and at the time I declined his request for overnights at his place because I wasn't comfortable with my 2 year old child staying at an unknown location.

3) Now that I have his address, I said I was happy for daytime visitation to occur at his place. I agreed to the overnight visit he asked for, but stipulated it take place at his parents' or sisters' place initially because it's a familiar setting for S2 with familiar people. I specified this was a transitional arrangement, giving S2 time to adjust to his father's residence during daytime visits, and that overnights would occur at his place following an adjustment period for S2.

This was all spelled out very clearly in the letter. The actual schedule hasn't changed from the compromise I proposed in January, in which I agreed with 90% of his request for increased time. The purpose of the letter was to couch my proposal in legal and psychological terms in support of S2's developmental needs, and to explicitly say it would be a transitional arrangement that we would work together to implement.

I know, MLCers are emotional. Yeesh.


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Scout, you know there is nothing unreasonable here. Do be careful though. There have been a lot of scary stories in the media over custody matters and when someone feels a loss of control they can quickly become someone different from who we think we know.

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Son can spend the night at his place once he gives you the address. Easey Peasey.

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Scout, think for a minute about what you would do if someone told you about some other man who would not give his ex-wife his address at all, let alone when her child was staying there. That is weird and scary and potentially dangerous. It is insane. Your thinking so much about it or excusing it in any way is LBS egg-shelling. I know because I did it for seven years.

They unravel more and more as the D unfolds. Do not wait, do not pass go! Protect your child here and now with a solid arrangement and, if possible, a social worker who can either supervise H or ensure that he follows normal rules. The years to come will be a very vulnerable time for you kid, and your H may get worse and worse before he comes out of this. You don't have to be mean to H or sink to some low level that you abhore, but I would get things on paper, including where he lives.


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scout12 Offline OP
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H responded to my L with a huge list of demands and accusations. He suggested she "tell [her] client to get her story straight". He said I was only thinking of my own selfish wants and keeping S2 all to myself. "You know that as well as I do", he told her. He was nitpicky and aggrandising and threatened to "seek other avenues" if I didn't agree with what he wanted, which is basically 50/50 shared time, and inappropriate for a child of S2's age.

After the hostility escalated to an uncomfortable point, I decided to reach out to H directly to try and come to a resolution with the parenting plan. My email was kind, accommodating, reasonable, flexible and child-focused. More than he really deserves from me at this point, but I have to be my best self. He texted me to say he hadn't had time to reply and couldn't agree to certain things, but the tone of his message was more pleasant and respectful than it has been recently.

I'm sure there will be further negotiation, but I don't feel frightened about it now.

I feel like I've reached a new stage of acceptance. S2 won't be with me full-time, and that's OK. Even if his dad and I were together, I still wouldn't be with him full-time as he grows up. My house will always be his home. He will spend time at his dad's house, and that's OK too. Is this fair on me? No, but it's good for S2. I've accepted this, but I won't compromise on my boundaries or my responsibility to protect S2's physical, mental and emotional wellbeing.

I ended my email with this statement:

Quote
Lastly, your affair and abandonment of the marriage have nothing to do with parenting. I will only say this once and never mention it again. I am not your friend and have no desire to be part of your life in any way. I will be divorcing you as soon as the waiting period is up. That does not mean you are my enemy. I don't hate you because that would not be best for S2. I just don't care about you in any way other than as S2's dad, and only for S2's sake.

I am hopeful this can be settled between us with some effort and communication around the shared goal of ensuring S2 feels safe and supported at all times, and has a meaningful relationship with both parents that is appropriate for his age. If you don’t agree that this is the best way forward, I will defer to my solicitor in reaching an agreement. If you are abusive or angry in your response, I will forward it directly to my solicitor as such hostility is unnecessary and upsetting.


If he refuses to compromise, I will tell him that I know he falsified his retirement fund balance in the property settlement to the tune of $10-20k. I will instruct my L to request full and frank disclosure of this figure and deduct the additional balance from his share of the settlement. So one way or the other, he will do the right thing.


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There was a post on Reddit this morning from a man considering leaving his wife due to lack of sex in the 18 months since their child was born. It stirred up some feelings of guilt and shame about that period of time in my own marriage, the unexpected psychological impact of becoming a mother, and my sense of failed womanhood due to H's affair.

I had severe PPD/A following S2's birth. I had some birth trauma and PTSD-type symptoms that took a while to process. My sex drive was below zero, but I was desperate to want it again for his sake. My efforts weren't enough in the end, but I'm not sure what else I could have done. I was honest about my feelings, sent him scientific articles about postpartum hormones, went to therapy, played around with different anxiety medications, went on and off birth control, scheduled sex, agreed to maintenance sex, bought various toys, gave him suggestions to turn me on, showed him love in other ways...

We went from a couple times a week pre-baby to once a month post-baby. It took me 3 months to work up the courage to even have sex after giving birth. I cried after sex for a good 6 months due to pain and different sensations and PTSD. Obviously not a turn-on for anyone.

I probably did stuff wrong, too. I asked him to sleep in the spare room whenever he had an early/late shift or stayed up late playing video games to help me preserve my sleep. He might have felt rejected by that. I explained many times that my postnatal hormonal state interfered with my sex drive and he would just need to be patient. Perhaps 15 months was too long to wait for things to return to normal. At one point, I even made comments about him fulfilling his needs elsewhere if that would satisfy him, because I felt so guilty for turning him down so often. Obviously, I shouldn't have been so flippant about that.

I understand why he turned to a young, attractive woman who was under his control and willing to give him what he wanted. That doesn't make it okay. I do wish he could have given me more of a chance. Becoming a mother is the biggest upheaval a woman will ever experience. Her brain chemistry is completely rewired, her organs are settling in new places, her heart is walking around outside her body inside that little person. The first two years of a child's life are supposed to be the most difficult on a marriage, but it gets better, right? I wish someone older and wiser could have told him "What's two years in a lifetime of marriage?"

Submitting to unwanted sex in order to please him never felt right, but maybe I should have done that to keep him happy. I was of the opinion that sex is something you do with, not for, your partner. But maybe I am wrong. He was never able to express how he felt about it, other than petulance and blame, which made me feel guilty and defensive. I explained many times that you cannot pour from an empty cup, and that I needed more emotional support from him without the expectation it would lead to sex. As the saying goes, women are not vending machines that you put niceness coins in until sex falls out.

I don't know. Thanks for reading my Monday morning ramble.


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Thanks for sharing your feelings Scout. It's difficult when outside sources stir the emotions, isnt it.

I hear what you're saying but nah, that's pretty much all on him Scout. What sort of man demands sex after his wife, the mother of his child, has given birth, especially in your circumstances post birth. I'm kind of unsurprised he didn't volunteer to do more, or sleep elsewhere when Xbox became the priority. I think from what you've said here you really, really went above and beyond.

You're no vending machine, and even if you were, sounds to me like XH was substituting the coins he was putting in for those worthless copper game arcade tokens.

How's GAL? How's S2 - any nice milestones? How'd the date go you went on the other week? Future dates with him on the horizon?

Cheers DS


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Hi Scout,

I know we've been talking about this all over today. I wanted to say on your thread a couple of things. First:

Originally Posted by scout12
Submitting to unwanted sex in order to please him never felt right, but maybe I should have done that to keep him happy.

No. No, no, no. Please never ever think this. I remember reading in the thick of the SSM that the basic recommendation was fake it til you make it, and I never did that... I sometimes wonder if I had if we would be where we are now, but in that case, for *me* I probably would still be low desire and would never have had the impetus to really change how I perceive myself... which would be a far-from-optimal solution for me, even if my H was happier and maybe didn't end up being unfaithful if there wasn't an SSM. Also, you can't change the past, so no use beating yourself up about it. You did the best you could with the tools you had at the time.

You did *far* more to try to boost your sex life back up than I did-- really impressive, actually. I went to the doctor (was told it was totally normal, not to worry about it), read some magazine/internet articles (fake it til you make it), and talked to my friends, kind of, about it (who were all also not having sex with their husbands either). That was it. And it went on for literally years. The last 5 years we probably had sex once a month or less (by the end maybe once every other month) and I dreaded it. So your husband was on easy street compared to mine! wink

I know you mentioned the Emily Nagowski book on Alison's thread, and I highly, highly recommend it. The other two I read were Esther Perel's Mating in Captivity and Laurie Watson's Wanting Sex Again. I would rank them in that order (Nagowski, Perel, and Watson).

Anyway, I hope you don't feel guilt around being low desire. One of the biggest things I have taken away from these books and more research about it is that I am totally normal and so are you. There is nothing wrong with you. And (the Nagowski book is particularly good at this) once you understand how desire works for YOU, you can nurture it.


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Scout - it sounds to me like you made plenty of good faith efforts to remedy the problem while your H made little or no effort. It’s not surprising that his lack of support and affection worsened your postpartum depression and dampened your desire for him.

This situation revealed your H’s basic narcissism - a trait that was always there but may not have been visible to you so long as he was getting his narcissistic supply from you.

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