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I took down my first thread since I was worried H saw the website and my previous title being too conspicuous.

So just to recap, H and I are in early 30s, T 11 M 5. Baby daughter. BD June 2019. H and I had been going through a few years of fertility struggles and had a pregnancy loss. H fell into a bout of depression and increased anxiety causing him to pull away from me, go out with new work friends at least once a week, potential EA, not confirmed. I also got pregnant around this time with fertility treatment, which he reluctantly agreed to. When he learned I was pregnant, he got very upset and it seemed to push him over the edge. We've always wanted kids and talked about having kids so it seems like he ultimately was upset because he thought I was calling the shots as to WHEN it happened. I kept trying to reconnect as he said he thought we were drifting, suggesting dates (one time he said, "We can't afford to go on a date"), agreed to go to MC but only made it through 3 sessions in which the MC was very focused on his family history. He would frequently come home later, stand me up for dinner plans at home, and his communciation with me was poor. He said he didn't want to have kids anymore. At one point he said he accepted that we were having a child, but that he decided he didn't want to have any more kids after this (we've always said we would have multiple children)

I expressed this and all of his behavior upset me, which led to H telling me first he needed to move out to work on his depression, and he felt that I was pinning his unhappiness too much on his depression. I begged/pleaded/cried, all the no nos. He then within a few weeks told me he thought we should separate before our baby knew what it was like to have 2 parents together. He was angry at me for controlling too much of our life together. I can shoot holes through his complaints (i.e. he said we didn't spend enough time alone together when I asked him to spend time with me and he would decline or stand me up) He told me his plan was to move out at the end of the year when the baby was a few months old (I was 8 months pregnant at the time)

Currently, he is still living in our house. He sleeps in the study and refers to it as "his room" (and the MBR is "my room") - not sure if he considers us to have an in house separation. I began DBing around Oct 2019 and have noticed an improvement. I dropped all R talks, stopped texting him throughout the day, stopped initiating conversation and asking for time together. His depression seems to be much improved. His mood is better, he communicates better, he doesn't disappear for hours at a time and stand me up for things anymore. Not sure if this is becuase of my DBing or the arrival of our daughter, who he is so in love with. He has initiated some physical affection, will make eyes at me when we're taking care of our baby and things like that. We haven't had a R talk in months. He has made some vague comments about how the house is mine and he's letting me call all the shots [since he won't be living there much longer]. No other mention of separation. It's hard to imagine him leaving because he just adores our baby. We are really getting along well now and do a good job taking care of the baby together.

I do feel like I'm in a much better mental space than I was this time last year, even before BD. I'm proud of myself for feeling more detached, I feel that I've accepted that I can't control him or his behavior, and that I will be okay if/when he pursues an actual separation. I don't deserve the way he's been treating me the last ~1.75 years but I didn't respond in the best manner when he was expressing issues with our M (I would deny or debate, I've since learned the value of validation and I think that would've really helped my case earlier). Most of the time our R seems mostly the same since before, minus the fact that he's not sleeping in bed with me. W

I struggle with not knowing what our status is (I know, continue to detach). I also am debating whether or not I need to do more DBing techniques. I spend a fair amount of time at home because of the baby. We inevitably end up spending time together in the evenings and weekends just watching TV, having meals, etc. Is this bad? I'm trying to go out more often but it is a little difficult to coordinate with the baby and the fact that I'm her source of food at the time. I made plans this weekend and just vaguely told him I was going out. I'm wondering if I should try to spend more time alone at home when the baby is asleep - go read or lounge in bed instead. Trying to think of ways to project confidence that I'll be okay if he leaves me. I feel like this would be alot easier without a young baby and a busy work schedule.

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Welcome back .... Do I know you? Is this who I think it is ... Did you post daily, and I replied often, and you had several threads and then vanished?

Blu


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Hi Blu,
You may have posted on my other thread but I didn’t post daily and have only been MIA for about 1 month!

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Hi Rosy,

First of all... I just want to say how awful it is that you are going through this when you have a tiny baby. I can't imagine. How old is your baby again? And you're back at work?

First of all, you need to congratulate yourself for being such an amazing, bad-a$$ mom every single night before you go to sleep.

Second,

Originally Posted by Rosy10
I feel like this would be alot easier without a young baby and a busy work schedule.

OMG yes! Cut yourself a whole lot of slack. Here's my recommendation (and TBH this would be a recommendation for any young mom):

Think about what YOU want to do. What can you imagine doing-- for you-- that makes you happy? A long nap on a weekend day? Pedicure? Reading a new novel? I think self-care is really, really important for everyone, but for a combination new mom and a LBS, you need to double down on taking care of yourself and feeding your own needs and soul. Take the time to be there for yourself first and foremost.

After that, *then* I think you can worry about DBing in terms of thinking about how your GALing may or not affect him. I sincerely believe that GALing is for you, not for him-- to the extent that it does catch his interest, great, but that isn't why you're doing it and I think you want to have that authentic lens on it-- you are doing this for YOU. (Because you deserve it!)

All that being said, here are some ideas you might consider, but only if they resonate with YOU. For instance, I found getting out of the house with the baby, while sometimes complicated, was important for me to not feel stifled in the house for too long. So walks, restaurants, museums, just getting out and about. You can do this without your H (I mean maybe he is welcome to come with you, but maybe at first you just let him know you'll be out and go). Also, I would probably steer away from too much sitting on the couch together and watching TV, unless you're watching a show you really like. In my sitch I found that we often defaulted to things my H liked to watch (because he likes to watch TV more than I do) and then I'm just sitting there working or reading or whatever, and getting antsy wondering what was going on in his head. I started moving my working/reading elsewhere, OR picked up the remote first and selected a show I was interested in.

Do you have other mom friends with a baby the same age? Getting together with them, glass of wine while the babies roll around on a blanket on the floor (or when they got older, playing) was like one of the most soul-feeding things I did when mine were little. And, since your H seems like he's around, can you leave the baby with him for an evening or a lunch? Do you have enough stored breastmilk to make that work? I remember feeling like I didn't want to waste that liquid gold for no good reason (like taking time for myself) but you know what? that IS a good reason.

Anyway-- I don't know if any of this is helpful, but just want to say hang in there, glad you are back and posting. There are a lot of people here that will support you through all of this. And you will get through it.


Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
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There was a poster here last summer with a similar sitch and she disappeared after posting several times a day. I think I mistook you for her, sorry!

Blu


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Originally Posted by may22
Hi Rosy,

First of all... I just want to say how awful it is that you are going through this when you have a tiny baby. I can't imagine. How old is your baby again? And you're back at work?

First of all, you need to congratulate yourself for being such an amazing, bad-a$$ mom every single night before you go to sleep.


Thank you, May! You posted on my last thread as well and I always appreciate your feedback and advice! I've been following your story as well when I log in and I admire your DB approach with your H. She is 6 months old now and I'm back at work.

Originally Posted by may22
Think about what YOU want to do. What can you imagine doing-- for you-- that makes you happy? A long nap on a weekend day? Pedicure? Reading a new novel? I think self-care is really, really important for everyone, but for a combination new mom and a LBS, you need to double down on taking care of yourself and feeding your own needs and soul. Take the time to be there for yourself first and foremost.

After that, *then* I think you can worry about DBing in terms of thinking about how your GALing may or not affect him. I sincerely believe that GALing is for you, not for him-- to the extent that it does catch his interest, great, but that isn't why you're doing it and I think you want to have that authentic lens on it-- you are doing this for YOU. (Because you deserve it!)


That's a good point. I need to keep in mind that GAL is what's best for me when it all boils down to it. I get so caught up in the idea of using tactics to try to catch is attention when I just need to focus on bettering myself for whatever happens in the end. I'm working on setting up social get togethers with more friends, just not always easy to do when they want to bring their husbands and I don't! I have confided in a few close friends what's going on with my H, but I feel uncomfortable when couple friends suggest doing something all together becuase from the outside, things look normal and we appear to be a happily married couple with a beautiful little baby!

I do hate leaving the baby to go out but if I can time it for after her beditme so H is just sitting at home alone with her asleep, even better!

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Originally Posted by BluWave
There was a poster here last summer with a similar sitch and she disappeared after posting several times a day. I think I mistook you for her, sorry!

Blu


Maybe you're referring to Kech? Actually, on my last thread someone (may have even been you) gave me the link to her thread to read through since she had a similar situation.

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Just a follow up. Often times I feel like I don't have much to post since our situation seems stagnant...H is sleeping in the study but other than that we get along great and he seems to keep up appearances of being happily married to me to people. Haven't had a R talk in months.

We did get each other small gifts for Valentines Day (I found out he was ordering me something so I went ahead and got him a gift as well) Not sure if this was a good move or not but I have trouble being rude. I kept it simple, no card as we would usually do. He asked what I wanted to do for VDay the day of and I just played it off as I didn't care and we just ate take out at home.

We are considering bringing in some new hand me down furniture into the house. The only spot for it is in the study where he's sleeping. It won't fit in the room and still allow him to open the pull out couch where he sleeps. Today he was texting me about moving his stuff down into the basement instead and even buying himself a bed to move down there. He's made alot of comments about moving out/keeping his things separate. At this point, it just annoys me. I am tempted to say, "So when are you going to move out?" (and stop hogging an extra room in the house) but I feel like that would be pressure. I'm acting nonchalant and accepting of him moving his stuff around in the house. When he first told me he wanted to move out, he said he was planning on getting an apartment but would still pay the mortgage as is our current arrangement. He isn't in the financial situation to afford an apartment and our mortgage, so I don't put much weight into the fact that he's still in the house.

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What is with these WS's complaining about not feeling close but then doing whatever they can to prevent that from happening? Ugh, same sitch. And it can be crazy-making when you really get along fine but they are planning on D. And I'm not sure how the baby is you calling the shots. Fertility treatments take two willing people.

It sounds like you are doing a good job. I am not sure if it's so bad to ask, "when are you moving out?" as long as you aren't going in for the attack, but in a detached way. I mean, it's rough when they have to best of both worlds, the benefits of living with you with none of the commitment. I am curious what the veterans think. My H is doing the same. He can't afford dual living situations. So it's so hard.

Do you think there is an OW? So much of this seems like it could fit. But I don't know based on your info.


the best apology is changed behavior.
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me: 45 h: 48
m: 23 T: 26
DD1:19 DD2:16 DS:11
BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016
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Originally Posted by oceangrl
What is with these WS's complaining about not feeling close but then doing whatever they can to prevent that from happening? Ugh, same sitch. And it can be crazy-making when you really get along fine but they are planning on D. And I'm not sure how the baby is you calling the shots. Fertility treatments take two willing people.


Ugh, I know!! When he was giving me my litany of faults during the BD, I almost laughed because it's ridiculous that he feels like I didn't want to be close to him yet he had been treating me so poorly/standing me up when we had plans/avoiding me.

His main argument was that I decided when we would have a baby. When we were first married, we lightly discussed having children then but life would get in the way so I keep suggesting we push it back. He never seemed upset about it at the time but now looks back on it as me only being willing to have a baby when I wanted to. He went along with the fertility treatment but complained about it (to which one night I cried to him about feeling torn about it since he was upset about doing it and he kind of just gave me a "Whatever you want to do" answer). To him, it was just another instance of me having too much power over the decisions in our marriage (though that's definitely not how I remember things)

Originally Posted by oceangrl

Do you think there is an OW? So much of this seems like it could fit. But I don't know based on your info.


I do think he's had/having an EA even if he doesn't consider it to be an A. I do not think he's having a PA. He has just been so forthcoming with his reasons to leave me and telling me ILYB/I don't love you that way anymore that I think he would have mentioned a PA as another reason to separate. I could be wrong though!

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Still struggling with the new furniture decision. If we take the new furniture (keeping this vague for discretion), it will cause him to move his sleeping area to the basement and/or buy a bed to sleep on in the basement. I'm not sure if I should just decline the new hand me down furniture at the time to avoid this issue (though it would be nice to have it in the long term and he has expressed it will be nice to have as well). He keeps putting the decision on me... "Whatever you want in there." One of his BD complaints was that I made too many decisions about the house he wasn't okay with (though he would consent at the time) For example, we needed to have our deck repaired because it was overdue and a safety issue. I have a family member who does that sort of work so brought him over for an estimate. My H said he couldn't afford to pay for it (we've always kept separate bank accounts and just split the bills) so I would have to pay for it myself if I wanted to move forward with the repair and so I did. A few months later, he claims I disregarded his opinion on this repair. (Side note, H has a lot of school debt and financial insecurity/anxiety and I make a good amount more $ than he does) He also has gotten into a few bad situations by neglecting car repairs, payments, etc, so I'm generally the person in the M who takes the lead on bills and house repairs. I've always felt like one of us needed to step up, so I've just done it myself.

So with him constantly telling me any decision about the house is for me to make is almost like he's pulling the 180/giving up on having an opinion since he's giving up on our M??? Any thoughts on this?

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
I'm working on setting up social get togethers with more friends, just not always easy to do when they want to bring their husbands and I don't! I have confided in a few close friends what's going on with my H, but I feel uncomfortable when couple friends suggest doing something all together becuase from the outside, things look normal and we appear to be a happily married couple with a beautiful little baby!

I do hate leaving the baby to go out but if I can time it for after her beditme so H is just sitting at home alone with her asleep, even better!

I wouldn't worry about not bringing your H along-- just go ahead, make the plans, and make an excuse about his absence (working/sick/whatever). I've often found in those situations it ends up getting grouped into the dads in one convo and the moms in another, so it won't really matter all that much that he isn't there. And/or, go ahead and suggest a moms-only night! I guarantee you all the moms will go for it... especially if it is after the babies are in bed!!

Originally Posted by Rosy10
I do think he's had/having an EA even if he doesn't consider it to be an A. I do not think he's having a PA. He has just been so forthcoming with his reasons to leave me and telling me ILYB/I don't love you that way anymore that I think he would have mentioned a PA as another reason to separate. I could be wrong though!

This was where I was for a long, long time... He didn't even tell me ILYB until more than a year into it (though was acting like a giant a-hole), four months after ILYB confessed to an EA and said he wasn't talking to her anymore... and I would have sworn there was NO WAY there was a PA because we both *knew* that I'd immediately kick him out (ah, principles smile ) and I figured he wanted out so badly he would just tell me if it were true. Anyway, as you probably know it turns out he'd been in a PA for 2 years and didn't find out until about six weeks ago. This board was really helpful for me in seeing the possibility of all of this. I'd just be open to the possibility if I were you so you aren't blindsided if it happens to be true.

Finally, on the furniture-- how badly do you need/want it? My suggestion would be if you really, really want it, then do it... but otherwise passing on the furniture now to relieve pressure on your H to move to the basement is probably not all that big of a loss. I mean, do you want your H to move to the basement? If you do then accepting the furniture seems like a good move, but if you don't I wouldn't take it. Or could you put the furniture in the basement if you absolutely need to take it?


Me (46) H (42)
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Originally Posted by may22


This was where I was for a long, long time... He didn't even tell me ILYB until more than a year into it (though was acting like a giant a-hole), four months after ILYB confessed to an EA and said he wasn't talking to her anymore... and I would have sworn there was NO WAY there was a PA because we both *knew* that I'd immediately kick him out (ah, principles smile ) and I figured he wanted out so badly he would just tell me if it were true. Anyway, as you probably know it turns out he'd been in a PA for 2 years and didn't find out until about six weeks ago. This board was really helpful for me in seeing the possibility of all of this. I'd just be open to the possibility if I were you so you aren't blindsided if it happens to be true.


Good point, May. Can never say never and he's not his usual self right now or the person I married really so I can't be sure he isn't having a PA. The mutual friends I've confided in have also asked me if I thought he was having an A since his behavior is indicative of one, and they've known him longer than I have. In some ways, since he's told me he doesn't love me anymore romantically and wants to S, it's almost like I feel like it can't get any worse and my feelings can't be hurt any more.

Originally Posted by may22
Finally, on the furniture-- how badly do you need/want it? My suggestion would be if you really, really want it, then do it... but otherwise passing on the furniture now to relieve pressure on your H to move to the basement is probably not all that big of a loss. I mean, do you want your H to move to the basement? If you do then accepting the furniture seems like a good move, but if you don't I wouldn't take it. Or could you put the furniture in the basement if you absolutely need to take it?



I suppose it's safe to elaborate...it's a piano that we both want for our D to play as she gets older. So it's something we'd have to pay to move and it would stay in it's designated spot in the house once moved in and can only go in certain places. He's expressed he wants us to have it but keeps telling me it's ultimately my decision since he's telling me the house is mine now. Eye roll.

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
In some ways, since he's told me he doesn't love me anymore romantically and wants to S, it's almost like I feel like it can't get any worse and my feelings can't be hurt any more.

If you feel this way then I think you can just keep doing what you're doing. I might just recommend thinking through what happens if you find out more.

On the piano... I don't know if this is the case where you live, but I know in a lot of places people are getting rid of pianos and actually can't sell them so have to pay to haul them off to the dump. Which is then very sad because most people have all sorts of memories with their pianos, etc. Anyway... unless it is a family heirloom or a Steinway or something, your baby won't be ready to play for several more years and a lot can change in that time-- you might move, other pianos might come available... I might recommend just looking on Craigslist or something to get a sense of how easy it might be to get another piano at some point in the future. I just don't know, if I were you, that I'd want something like this to be what pushes your H into the basement, unless that is what you want too. (And also FWIW, we ended up getting our kids a high-end electronic piano. The touch feels exactly like a real piano, it has pedals and everything. It takes up far, far less space AND... the best part... you can control the volume and/or put in headphones! My oldest will sometimes wake up early and practice in the morning with her headphones on. it is the BEST.)


Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
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Originally Posted by may22
if I were you, that I'd want something like this to be what pushes your H into the basement, unless that is what you want too. (And also FWIW, we ended up getting our kids a high-end electronic piano. The touch feels exactly like a real piano, it has pedals and everything. It takes up far, far less space AND... the best part... you can control the volume and/or put in headphones! My oldest will sometimes wake up early and practice in the morning with her headphones on. it is the BEST.)


Good points. I think I’ve decided against getting the piano unless it fits into another room. Not worth the pressure on my H to buy a bed or move into the basement. He complains about being cold in the study so he’ll really be cold in the basement... And also good point about the electronic keyboard with headphones!

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Was just sitting with my H and he showed me a photo on his phone as a text message notification popped up from a women who’s name I’ve never heard him mention before. Not a coworker, family member, or friend that he’s mentioned. He quickly hid the notification and became overly chatty and nice, so pretty sure she’s the likely EA partner who he may be texting and snap chatting often. I’m not even surprised and don’t feel overly upset about it.

Thinking back, he went on a business trip months ago and had a free day and mentioned meeting a group of people at a bar and touring around town with them the rest of the day. That day I didn’t hear from him for about 10 hours straight when he usually will at least text once if he’s gone to check on the baby. He was very vague about the people he met then so very well may have met a woman there.

The more I consider him having an A the more it makes sense how he’s been acting...focusing on the flaws in me and our M to validate him straying and having feelings about someone else. My brother also happens to just have finalized a divorce and his ex cheated on him. My H has said multiple times that my family “can’t be mad at [her] for falling out of love with my brother” which I thought was just because he feels he fell out of love with me but now perhaps he’s defending her having an A which makes more sense.

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
Was just sitting with my H and he showed me a photo on his phone as a text message notification popped up from a women who’s name I’ve never heard him mention before. Not a coworker, family member, or friend that he’s mentioned. He quickly hid the notification and became overly chatty and nice, so pretty sure she’s the likely EA partner who he may be texting and snap chatting often. I’m not even surprised and don’t feel overly upset about it.

Thinking back, he went on a business trip months ago and had a free day and mentioned meeting a group of people at a bar and touring around town with them the rest of the day. That day I didn’t hear from him for about 10 hours straight when he usually will at least text once if he’s gone to check on the baby. He was very vague about the people he met then so very well may have met a woman there.

The more I consider him having an A the more it makes sense how he’s been acting...focusing on the flaws in me and our M to validate him straying and having feelings about someone else. My brother also happens to just have finalized a divorce and his ex cheated on him. My H has said multiple times that my family “can’t be mad at [her] for falling out of love with my brother” which I thought was just because he feels he fell out of love with me but now perhaps he’s defending her having an A which makes more sense.


First, I am so sorry you are dealing with it. I have been there. I didn't suspect it for a while because I was sure my husband could never do that, and also he hid it so well. He went from an EA to a PA (he "doesn't know how that happened" and was "so surprised").

But during that time I could do very little right. He was always magnifying my faults and how I always do this or that. Any anger he had toward himself was projected onto me. My self-esteem took a beating.

There is a book MWD quotes in her "Healing from Infidelity" book. It's called "Not Just Friends" and details how this happens and what his thought process is. Remember, while we all have to own what we contribute to a marriage, an A is not about you. It's about him. And the fantasy of who he is when he is with someone that doesn't know what he's like to live with.

Following the advice in MWD's books and these threads can help so much. Focus on yourself. Detach. It will come to your aid no matter what happens down the road.


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***************
me: 45 h: 48
m: 23 T: 26
DD1:19 DD2:16 DS:11
BD1: PA for 2 yrs 08/2016
BD2: OW is one of my closest friends 12/2016
BD3: H wants a D 11/2019
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Originally Posted by oceangrl

There is a book MWD quotes in her "Healing from Infidelity" book. It's called "Not Just Friends" and details how this happens and what his thought process is. Remember, while we all have to own what we contribute to a marriage, an A is not about you. It's about him. And the fantasy of who he is when he is with someone that doesn't know what he's like to live with.

Following the advice in MWD's books and these threads can help so much. Focus on yourself. Detach. It will come to your aid no matter what happens down the road.


Thank you, oceangrl. I'm going to check out that book. I'm finding self help books to be a good crutch right now. I'm hoping my lack of reaction is a sign that I am detaching properly.

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Journaling... Found myself getting frustrated yesterday and was having trouble remaining upbeat around H. Our life is pretty much unchanged minus him sleeping in the study. Every day we take care of the baby, eat dinner together, often will spend the evenings watching TV together (although I'm working on doing my own thing at night instead based on what I feel like doing). I often feel like my situation isn't as "active" as others on this site. I wonder if the lack of our change in pace other than not sleeping together is him being unsure if he really wants to S or if he just can't afford it right now so he feels like an in house S is the best he can do. ~8 months ago he was spending more time away from me. I don't want to live like this for years but he's never been one to take much initiative so I have a hard time picturing him filing and moving out on his own. Or maybe he's just hoping I'll get so fed up with him taking up the study with the ugly pull out couch constantly being out that I'll ask him to get it over with and leave???

I feel like I'm detaching to the point where I feel like I will be fine if he does leave me, my concerns are around my baby and upsetting my family (at this point they don't have any idea and are very fond of H).

The other day, we were discussing an annual music festival we've attended multiple years in the past which is featuring a few bands he likes this summer. I made a reference to him likely wanting to go and his response was "Well how would we go?" referring to my breastfeeding situation. My immediate thought was, "I was thinking you could go alone...." When he makes comments like that referring to things we'll do together in the future, it makes me pause becuase I'd think if he wants a S he'd be thinking of doing more WITHOUT me.

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Need some advice if anyone has some to share... we have to make some household repairs in the next few weeks and my H keeps telling me everything is *my* decision to make. This is a point of contention since part of his BD was stating that I made too many decisions and didn't consider his opinion (rewriting of history there)

What should I say when he tells me he feels like I should make all the calls with the house? I'm trying to validate, i.e. "I understand why you feel that way but would still like your opinion".

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Last thing he just texted me when we were discussing a home repair was, “I feel like you should make the house decisions”. I know he wants me to read this as, since he’s moving out the house is mine to make the decisions. Not sure what to respond.

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
Last thing he just texted me when we were discussing a home repair was, “I feel like you should make the house decisions”. I know he wants me to read this as, since he’s moving out the house is mine to make the decisions. Not sure what to respond.


Not sure of the nature of the decisions you're talking about and what the money implications are, but unless you're burdening him with a lot of costs then I would go ahead and make the decisions yourself and proceed. I understand your concern that he thought you were too controlling before, but he's checked out now and you can't fix that in the relationship for now. Plus you've got to consider how much of that is really just rewriting of history. Were you really controlling or were you just stepping up because he wasn't? Right now he's looking for any ammo he can to use against you, even if it's completely fabricated or exaggerated.


Me: 60 w/ S18, D24, D27

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Originally Posted by AnotherStander

Not sure of the nature of the decisions you're talking about and what the money implications are, but unless you're burdening him with a lot of costs then I would go ahead and make the decisions yourself and proceed. I understand your concern that he thought you were too controlling before, but he's checked out now and you can't fix that in the relationship for now. Plus you've got to consider how much of that is really just rewriting of history. Were you really controlling or were you just stepping up because he wasn't? Right now he's looking for any ammo he can to use against you, even if it's completely fabricated or exaggerated.


Right, I’m not even a controlling person or great decision maker by nature - I was definitely just stepping up since he didn’t in the past. I agree, he’s looking for fuel to the fire.

Having a rough day today. Feel down and lonely. H referred to the study as his bedroom today and I went to the basement to do laundry and just sat against the washer and cried. I don’t want him to see me crying.

This week was relatively uneventful. Last night, H came home from his second job (he has a part time evening job apart from his 9-5) and seemed somewhat down and subdued. I went to bed right as he came home. He showered and then woke me up kissing me in bed. Just leaning over me and kissing me. Not sure if he was hoping for sex or not or what that was about. He stopped and then went downstairs to the study to sleep.

I’ve been debating the sex issue lately. I have caved a few times and had sex with him the last few months. Definitely seems cyclical like every 3 weeks he’s interested. I never initiate. I realize he is likely just using me when he’s horny and that really hurts. He often apologizes after sex too. But it’s hard for me to decline because having sex seems (artificially I know) like a temporary return to normalcy in our M. If I start refusing him altogether, it’s one less thing tying us together. I don’t even know how to broach the subject of feeling used in sex. Stop him when he’s making an advance? Initiate a conversation about it?

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
Feel down and lonely.

Hi Rosy, you're definitely NOT alone in feeling alone after losing your partner of many years. ((Hugs)) I'd write more, but have a dinner to serve for two growing foodies/critics. wink

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
But it’s hard for me to decline because having sex seems (artificially I know) like a temporary return to normalcy in our M. If I start refusing him altogether, it’s one less thing tying us together. I don’t even know how to broach the subject of feeling used in sex. Stop him when he’s making an advance? Initiate a conversation about it?

First and foremost you have to decide if you want to have sex even knowing that it doesn't mean much with respect to reconciliation. If yes, there's not much to talk about. If no, then yes when he makes an advance is probably the time to tell him you're really turned on but only will if----xxxx----whatever your terms are. Maybe also consider what your terms were the first time you two were intimate.


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Thank you, CWarrior. Seems like I just need to decide and keep my boundaries in regards to being physical.

I haven't been on here in over a week since things have been picking up at work. For the last few months, it seemed like things with H were trending up (he would occasionally show affection, say nice things, etc) but he seems to have pulled back again. He's not talking or texting me as much (I'm still working to not initiate) and is overall more withdrawn and on his phone constantly. He seemed a moody like he'd been around BD so I half expected him to come out and tell me he was having an A last night and my reaction would be "Yeah, not surprised."

Felt frustrated with trying to GAL this past weekend. H went for a hike, didn't tell me with whom or where and was gone about 8 hours. I didn't ask any questions or act like I cared. I stayed home with the baby, which was okay becuase I could relax but it was also a little lonely. I tried to meet up with friends while he was gone but they already had plans and it would not have worked for me to come with baby. I did join an app to try to meet more mom friends in the area (not something that I would usually do so proud of myself here)

I overall was feeling very angry torward H this past week. What kind of sorry excuse for a spouse does this to his wife. He's also acting like a 15 year old constantly on his phone and avoiding responsiblities such as car and house maintanance. For example, his plate tags have been expired for over 6 months and he has yet to renew them. This would be something I would generally keep gently reminding him about but I just ignore it. And I hope he gets a ticket. smile

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Journaling... Did not see H much this past week and weekend due to his work schedule. 98% sure he lied and said he had to work his part time job on Friday night but went out instead. Even made up a generic statement about how it was on Friday. And to think one of the things I've always admired most about him was his honesty...

Feel like I've been grieving the loss of our MR and the H he has alot the last week. H really hasn't been himself for 2 years. I'm still grappling with not having that "person" to rely on, talk to, move forward confidently in life with. Friends and family just see us as a normal couple and it's embarrassing when they ask me questions or make assupmtions that we will do things together when I don't know the answer and I don't know how things will be a few months from now. I've read in other people's threads that it's better not to talk to anyone about your situation and perhaps even that the less people know your spouse wants to D, the less likely they are to follow through with it, so I've been maintaining this facade of a normal M to most people we know.

Trying to stay in the mindest that I don't need to put MY life on hold just becuase of him. For example, I want to take my daughter on a vacation this summer and I will move forward with planning whether he wants to come or not. It's been a big leap for me to realize that I can be happy even if my M is not in a good place.

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Got on here to rant because I’m feeling angry and having a hard time keeping it to myself.

One of the main reasons H told me we need to separate was because of his new feelings on kids. When we got married, before we got married, we always said we would have multiple kids and were both enthusiastic about one day being parents. H was ready for kids after 1 year of M, I delayed it due to career reasons which he seemed understanding of at the time. When I finally got pregnant with our daughter, following a few years of fertility struggles and a loss, H wasn’t happy because he felt I had called the shot about when we got pregnant. He wasn’t excited about the baby and made me feel like trash. You hear stories of most H being happy and supportive and catering to their W’s food cravings, but H didn’t want to talk about the baby or pregnancy in general. Even when we watched TV if he saw a pregnant woman, he’d change the channel. In a few months, he became more accepting of the pregnancy but told me he “didn’t want to go through this again” and so now only wanted one child. He also told me he would take permanent measures to only ensure he had one child as well.

So now, he is head over heels with our daughter but of course still says he only wants one child ( and now is planning on leaving me anyway). One of my siblings just announced another pregnancy which is causing him to keep mentioning how he only wants one child and I just felt triggered. I’m so angry that he tainted my pregnancy experience and now wants to leave me. This is the same man who was pushing me to seek fertility treatment a few years ago and was ecstatic with my first pregnancy (which we lost).

I’m angry that he’s such a different person from who I married. I don’t want him to alter my life negatively any more than he’s done already. I’m not sure where the sweet, fun man I married went.

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Rosy,

I am sorry you're going through what you are. I too am wondering what happened to the person I married. Someone I've always known to be all about family (so much so that she would never say she wanted anything for birthday/Christmas/etc. except to be with her family). Now, after our daughter, she's completely different.

Even though I've been trying to save the marriage (by working on me now), it's hard difficult to even like the person she is now, most of the time. I can't imagine how much harder it probably is for you, since he has had a A (my W has not, as far as I know).

If you figure anything out on GAL with a little one, let me know. I have a two year old, and it's very difficult because I am torn between spending time with her the 2-3 hours we have each night, and trying to go out and do things for me (I consider spending time with her as doing something for me too!). I'm especially at a loss now that everything is closed. I ended up going for a walk at about 11:30 last night just to get some exercise in.

Hang in there.

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Originally Posted by CaptainN


Even though I've been trying to save the marriage (by working on me now), it's hard difficult to even like the person she is now, most of the time. I can't imagine how much harder it probably is for you, since he has had a A (my W has not, as far as I know).

If you figure anything out on GAL with a little one, let me know. I have a two year old, and it's very difficult because I am torn between spending time with her the 2-3 hours we have each night, and trying to go out and do things for me (I consider spending time with her as doing something for me too!). I'm especially at a loss now that everything is closed. I ended up going for a walk at about 11:30 last night just to get some exercise in.

Hang in there.


Thanks, Captain. I feel similar, the man my H is now is not the sweet, loyal man I married. It’s difficult for me to like him as he is now. Sometimes, a glimpse of his old personality peaks through and it’s hard not to see it as refreshing.

It truly is hard to GAL with a young child. I’ve been trying to connect with other moms in my city using an app. Before BD, when my H started being a jerk and was going out a lot and I was expressing that I was sad he was doing so, he made a comment that he wished I had more friends. Those words keep ringing in my head and it would be nice to have some other people to relate to, so that is one way I’m working on GAL at the moment. Hoping to eventually have a meet up with new friends and can take the baby!

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Hunkered down in the house with H during this crazy quarantine situation. It seems like whenever we spend an extended period of time together, it makes us get along better. We’ve never been a couple that fights but on trips or less busy periods in life, our R seemed to flourish. H has been overall pretty flirty this week as we’ve both been working from home and taking care of the baby. Lots of silliness and laughing. He did try to initiate sex once and I balked and just steered it away without bringing up that I feel used when he has sex with me.

He’d been sleeping in “his room” as he likes to call the study, on the pull out sofa. This week he switched to an air mattress in there using only a sleeping bag as covers. He’s not a teenager so I’m not sure how sustainable it is for him to sleep on that. Reminds me of his sad bed situation in college.

One night this week, he told me he was driving somewhere to hike and was gone 8 hours, until well after it got dark. It annoyed me since we had plans for dinner and he did no communicating whatsoever where he was or who he was with. I really was trying my hardest not to let it bother me but it was hard to hide. I know, I shouldn’t care.

Lately, I’m finding myself just wishing he’d get it over with and move out. I’m sick of not knowing what the future will hold. But I know asking him for a timeline is pressure.

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Rosy, I share your frustration and your feelings about wanting H out completely. What stops me from taking action/voicing it is I think about how different my life would be when it happens. For me, not that different...I think I’ve detached enough where his words and actions don’t really bother that much anymore. Yes, out of sight out of mind would definitely be easier, but that also might give you a facade of thinking that you are really detached. Use this opportunity of quarantine to practice patience and detachment!

Hang in there.


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Thank you, Wooba! Good points. This time is really trying my patience and I’m having trouble holding my anger towards
my H in but it is an ideal time for me to focus on detaching and not worrying about his nonsense or what he’ll do next.

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Feeling emotional this morning. H said he picked up a shift at his part time job last night but was gone until about 12:30AM, so who knows where he really was, especially during this quarantine situation. This morning I just am annoyed with him and sad about the future, just worried about not giving my baby the life I thought she’d have. I was feeling weepy so went to bed to lie down and H is acting all concerned, came upstairs to check on me, was rubbing my back, and asking me what was wrong. I felt like saying, “what the f*** do you think is wrong? My M fell apart, I’m scared for the future, and I’m so angry at you for continuing to be dishonest”. I just kept saying I was fine and that I was just tired because I figure it’s best to avoid showing that I’m still that upset over the situation. I don’t understand why he feels the need to try to comfort me and ask what’s wrong.

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
Feeling emotional this morning. H said he picked up a shift at his part time job last night but was gone until about 12:30AM, so who knows where he really was, especially during this quarantine situation. This morning I just am annoyed with him and sad about the future, just worried about not giving my baby the life I thought she’d have. I was feeling weepy so went to bed to lie down and H is acting all concerned, came upstairs to check on me, was rubbing my back, and asking me what was wrong. I felt like saying, “what the f*** do you think is wrong? My M fell apart, I’m scared for the future, and I’m so angry at you for continuing to be dishonest”. I just kept saying I was fine and that I was just tired because I figure it’s best to avoid showing that I’m still that upset over the situation. I don’t understand why he feels the need to try to comfort me and ask what’s wrong.


I suspect its guilt... I know it doesn't make you feel any better. I'm so sorry for this situation and I too what to say to my H those types of things. Trouble is he doesn't want to hear them and frankly push him farther away.

Keep showing strength even though you are so twisted inside. Focus on what you can control and the let rest go for now.

I freak out over not seeing or hearing anything from my H in 5 days. But what are 5 days really? Do I think he is going to have some epiphany in 5 days??? Probably not even after 90 days. It is gut wrenching I know.

Hugs

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Hi Rosy, I’ve been following along worth your sitch, can’t remember if I’ve commented before or not.

I so, so relate to your recent post. I just texted my best friend about this today, because my H does the same thing. At this point it makes me furious. Just this afternoon when he picked up D4 he was all “how are you? Are you ok?” And rubs my shoulder. I want to SCREAM. Just as you said, “YOU KNOW WHATS WRONG!!!!” And like KitKat said, if I were to actually stare the truth, well he wouldn’t want to hear that.
It’s selfish behavior and it’s infuriating.
All I can say is every time I’ve bitten at that bait to share emotionally, it’s bitten me right back. Stay strong!

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Originally Posted by HopeCA
Hi Rosy, I’ve been following along worth your sitch, can’t remember if I’ve commented before or not.

I so, so relate to your recent post. I just texted my best friend about this today, because my H does the same thing. At this point it makes me furious. Just this afternoon when he picked up D4 he was all “how are you? Are you ok?” And rubs my shoulder. I want to SCREAM. Just as you said, “YOU KNOW WHATS WRONG!!!!” And like KitKat said, if I were to actually stare the truth, well he wouldn’t want to hear that.
It’s selfish behavior and it’s infuriating.
All I can say is every time I’ve bitten at that bait to share emotionally, it’s bitten me right back. Stay strong!


Thanks Hope! SO tempting to lash out when they do this but that is true, it's not the best approach to take the bait!

Just some more reflections as we continue this crazy quarantine situation. Being stuck in the house with my H and not seeing other people in person who care about me feels like it is really starting to take a toll on me. I'm struggling with detachment. I so want a H who looks me in the eyes and is honest. Who wants to cuddle and sleep in bed with me.

I felt like I was making more DB progress overall when I was more "mysteriously happy" around my H. It is very hard to hide my lows from him and focus on making myself happy when his bad habits are constantly in my face (i.e. seeing him constantly text other woman/women). When he can't get through a diaper change or taking the trash out without checking his phone, that seems pretty pathetic to me.

I'm having quite a few bouts of extreme sadness and anger and hopelessness. I've toyed with the idea of signing up for one of those online counseling services - has anyone used one and have any feedback about them? Aside from the current pandemic, I feel like it'd be easier for me with my schedule and the baby to be able to participate in counseling virtually. I think it might be a combination of postpartum hormones and my situation with my jerk H but I am sick of having such low periods and feeling worthless. Being present for the baby does make me value my life more however. Don't want to share this to sound so pathetic or to ask for sympathy, just reflecting on my sitch and want others to know that if you're feeling this way, you are not alone.

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Originally Posted by Rosy10
I'm having quite a few bouts of extreme sadness and anger and hopelessness. I've toyed with the idea of signing up for one of those online counseling services - has anyone used one and have any feedback about them? Aside from the current pandemic, I feel like it'd be easier for me with my schedule and the baby to be able to participate in counseling virtually. I think it might be a combination of postpartum hormones and my situation with my jerk H but I am sick of having such low periods and feeling worthless. Being present for the baby does make me value my life more however. Don't want to share this to sound so pathetic or to ask for sympathy, just reflecting on my sitch and want others to know that if you're feeling this way, you are not alone.


I'm not a vet or an expert by any means but I'd strongly recommend IC of some kind. Your ability to handle your emotions dictates your actions and outward appearance to everyone - and in all of our situations, we're better off operating from a place of peace and strength.


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Hi, Rosy. I really empathize with your feelings—H is my roommate in lockdown and whereas I was pretty good at not letting his moods get to me before, now I’m finding it harder to not be affected (annoyed, angered, saddened). I think we are all doing our best in an already very challenging situation made more challenging because of the circumstances. I have been meeting virtually with my IC and it’s very helpful to have someone to vent to, and someone who can validate what I’m going through. I wonder if a DB coach could be a possibility as well. It’s key to find a good fit, and you might have to check out a few counselors to find one you feel is best for you. You’re not alone, either! (((Rosy)))


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Originally Posted by cardinal
Hi, Rosy. I really empathize with your feelings—H is my roommate in lockdown and whereas I was pretty good at not letting his moods get to me before, now I’m finding it harder to not be affected (annoyed, angered, saddened). I think we are all doing our best in an already very challenging situation made more challenging because of the circumstances.


One thing I have tried doing that helps is look at my H as a zoo animal. This sounds wrong, but I see it more from an observation point that I can't have interaction with.
When he comes up and grumpy "Hmm that primate is angry. He doesn't understand(listen) to me, so there's no point in saying anything in-depth or meaningful. I will listen to his grumblings if he does them and offer to placate him with words (validation) " I also try to remember that he has an entire life beyond me, and chances are with everyone he's interacted with, the fact that it's me that angered him is slim.

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Originally Posted by Cest_Moi


One thing I have tried doing that helps is look at my H as a zoo animal. This sounds wrong, but I see it more from an observation point that I can't have interaction with.
When he comes up and grumpy "Hmm that primate is angry. He doesn't understand(listen) to me, so there's no point in saying anything in-depth or meaningful. I will listen to his grumblings if he does them and offer to placate him with words (validation) " I also try to remember that he has an entire life beyond me, and chances are with everyone he's interacted with, the fact that it's me that angered him is slim.


Ha! Good way of looking at it. Don't put much value on their grumbling. Thanks, Cest_Moi!

Carrying on in this quarantine situation. H continues to be mostly friendly, sometimes flirty (i.e came into my office area and randomly kissed me the other day). Also, I sometimes feel like I'm in the friend zone with him. We are still friends through this - enjoy many of the same shows, similar sense of humor, etc. H seems so comfortable with me he will discuss the future with me living alone with our daughter in a friendly manner or ask questions about things related to living apart from me, such as what bedding he should buy. Like many of us, this makes me wonder sometimes if I'm signaling that I'm too okay with all of this. But I want him to know I WILL be okay if he leaves, but it's not going to be all sunshine and rainbows with seeing me and the baby. I think he has an idealized take on all of this; that he'll get his own nice apartment (not going to happen with his financial situation) but he'll be the cool dad and still see the baby every day somehow and stay on good terms with my family and our mutual friends.

Besides working, putting my energy into ramping up my exercise routine lately since I have more time at home. Boosts my confidence, makes me feel productive, and helps eliminate some of my frustration. I've also been looking around the house and planning some smaller home renovation projects I'd like to eventually do. Making a plan for decorating and arranging the house should my H ever actually move out to make it a cozy space for me and my daughter. H has always had anxiety about money and would get anxious when I spent anything aside from paying bills (and I'm honestly a naturally frugal person, buy alot of second hand inexpensive clothes, choose to eat in to save money, etc). I also have never defaulted on any of my bills (whereas he has), have good credit, and make about double what he makes, so him getting anxious about me spending money is silly. But it will be nice to buy some throw pillows or something without him getting nervous!

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^^^^ I like the ramping up exercise routine!!! I think you are exuding a great attitude!!!

Yeah... the flirty, kiss thing would definitely make me the WT*. And all this nice talk like you are room mates makes me think he is still living in the fantasy of what he thinks his life is going to be like rather than the reality of what life is like without you.

It's got to be so hard 'stuck' in the home and not able to get out and do your own thing and make him think and wonder what you are up to.

Hang in there... You are doing a great job of focusing on you!

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Thanks, KitCat! Losing the last of the baby weight will feel good. I'm so glad that we've had such nice weather in our area during all of this too - taking lots of walks with the baby as well. Makes me feel better to see other people even from a distance aside from my H.

Lately, I've been finding myself fantasizing about finding another boyfriend/H. Does anyone else find themselves doing this? It would be so nice to be with more readily wanted to spend time with me and respects me. My H hasn't been himself for over 2 years now, and it all started with him being grumpy and not wanting to do things we've always enjoyed together as a couple and with our friends (didn't want to go on any trips, would sulk when we went out to bars/restaurants, etc). H has been acting so juvenile these 2 years, I've been daydreaming of someone who acts his age, wants to enjoy life, appreciates having a sig other who is there for them, who is more proactive about housework and repairs, wants to go on vacations, etc. I'm not sure if it's a healthy behavior to fantasize about a next relationship, but it does make me feel more optimistic about the future, instead of picturing it as a single lonely mom.

I've also been focusing on the idea that this man H is right now is not the person I married. Why would I choose to be married to this current person? He is someone else right now. He seems selfish and consumed with himself and his hobbies. He is good with the baby, but doesn't always give her 100% of his presence and attention if he wants to text or watch videos. I don't know if he'll ever return fully to his old self again, but this isn't someone I want to be married to. His hobbies and interests have even really changed. Since we've been in quarantine, he's been really into making silly videos (which is fun but also seems a little juvenile to me) and also has been toying around with some psychedelic drugs in low doses. Which he's never done before. I of course will not leave him alone with the baby when he's using them. I don't say anything to him about using them besides asking him to be safe. Sometimes I wonder if some of these are symptoms of an early MLC. A dark part of me wants to document his use to make a claim for full custody too when/if we D.

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Finally getting on for an update. H and I continue to get along well as our mostly in home quarantine continues. We worked together nicely on some home improvement projects over the weekend. It was nice to see him put in the effort when this would NOT have been something he would have done 1 year ago. He still likes to push decisions on me and refers to the house as "mine".

I don't know if this is the wisest DBing choice, but we have been intimate quite a few times as well. He definitely spouts some nonsense during the act about wanting to reconcile, etc. I'm glad I read the book "Why Men Marry B****", so I'm sure it's all BS, and I don't it seriously.

One thing I have been struggling with, is that as our baby is outgrowing some of her clothes and toys, H keeps asking me to sell or donate them and doesn't want to store them in the basement (where there is plenty of space). I've mentioned this before, but one of his major issues with our M was that after I got pregnant, he said he changed his mind about kids, first saying he didn't want our baby, and then saying he would accept that we were having a baby but did not want any more kids. (pre-M and for years, we've always wanted multiple kids). And that was one of the main reasons he told me we should S/D at bomb drop, because I wanted more kids and he had changed his mind and did not. Staying in my current M or not, it's hard for me to give up the idea of not having any more kids and I don't really want to give away hundreds of dollars of baby supplies right now. Do I push back and tell him that? Or do I go along with it and get rid of the baby stuff? I have made a comment at one point (may have been a bad move) when he mentioned not having any more kids that I may still have more children [with someone else].

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Just one man's opinion. Stuff is just stuff. And can be replaced. I am not a huge fan of storing things, so just take this with a grain of salt. But I would be inclined to donate them. And then if and when you are ready to have another you can have the fun and joy that goes with the shopping for the new baby!

In short, getting rid of the baby items now doesn't mean you won't/can't have another baby (or babies).


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If you have space to store all those things, by all means store them if you're still not ready to get rid of them. If not for having a second baby, those things have sentimental value. I picked a few things from my babies to keep. They're kept in a small box which doesn't take up a lot of space. If he cannot respect your sentiments, and keep insisting on not wanting to have more kids with you....maybe you can just repeat yourself, "I'm keeping these just in case I'm going to have another baby." Because you're right, it does not have to be with him.....lol!


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Hi Rosy,

I agree with keeping a few things for sentimental purposes, but I also agree with Steve that stuff is stuff and all replaceable. It doesn't have to mean anything. It feels a little similar to the piano question (that was you, right?)

My guess is that it feels like pressure to him, that staying in the R with you means capitulating to having more children. It is no skin off your back to donate the clothes and supplies, or sell them and buy something new for the baby with the $$. Someone else can get a lot of use out of them when they'd otherwise be sitting in your basement, silently pressuring your H. But the things you really love and want to hold onto-- keep those.


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Thanks Steve, wooba, and May. You're right, it's just stuff in the end so it probably is best to keep a few sentimental items and can sell or donate the rest. I sometimes can't decide when I need to push back and stand up for myself on decisions versus let him "win" to benefit the R.

And that's right May, I did have the piano situation as well!

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Feeling like H is really trying my patience lately. Part of it may be I'm just getting on his nerves since he's been around me so much since the quarantine situation. I need to work on withdrawing from him in our house and spending more time alone. The other night instead of watching TV after dinner as we usually do, I sat outside by myself with a glass of wine. He comes out after 10 minutes to join me, which surprised me.

H was irritable this weekend. He has alot of pet peeves but everything I did seemed to be getting on his nerves. I accidentally dropped a can of bug spray (no harm done, just a clumsy move) and he got irrationally angry with me. I questioned how he could honestly be so angry if it just was a harmless clumsy move. He had a few instances of that over the weekend and I even made a comment that he's been more crotchety as he's gotten older (as compared to when we were dating/early in our M when he was more laid back and sweet) to which he said, that he feels like he's just being more honest with his feelings lately. This probably isn't very notable in my DB situation, but did make me add another pro on the side of us separating, so I don't have to deal with him getting annoyed with me for the littlest things.

I feel like we are still stuck in some sort of limbo. H continues to sleep on the couch in our study with some old pillows and a sleeping bag. I'd respect him more if he used actual bed linens or even bought a real bed and turned it into another bedroom. He hasn't made any comments the last few months about moving out, but does refer/insinuate that I will be living on my own in the future. I had to bring up the future in regards to a childcare issue and he starts asking me about when *I* want to sell our house and if I want to downsize.

I did previously question if it would be wise or not to ask him when he would be moving out, but I ultimately decided this felt like pressure, so have not asked.

I feel myself really struggling not being able to picture the future. I've been mentally preparing myself to be on my own as my D gets older and trying to picture how my day to day would be. I know that when/if H leaves me, I'll be okay, and life will go on. I just sometimes can't see how that would not be a step backwards for me. I try to focus on the benefits of not living with H, such as not having to worry about all of his pet peeves and being able to make financial decisions on my own.

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