Hey guys. I'm going to probably be moving my thread to the divorced section soon. XW and I are ramping up mediation and divorce this month. Have had a lot of things here that I have been meaning to talk about and post the last month. Some moments, some internal realizations.
Most recent events Last Sat. I picked up S2. We've been having a lot of fun together. I've been hiking on my off weekends which has been clearing my head. Been on a few dates over the last 4 months. They are ok. Nothing serious. Platonic coffee dates. Just getting practice getting back into the game, and attraction.
So last week XW submitted all stuff to mediator. Cc'd me on it. Im still submitting and looking for L just for review. Been short but pleasant and co operative with XW. Went to pickup S2 last weekend. XW wanted to have discussion about D and mediator. I didn't want to get emotionally involved, but let her talk and express her thoughts about it. I was very cool and non chalant about how I handled the conversation. She said she was "A little sad and a little anxious about the finality of it all" So I kept my cool. She mentioned inviting me to a dinner about pre-mediation just to cover our basis. Validated how hard this is for everyone. It is what it is and things will get done in a fairly timely manner on my end since I'm involved with deceased Mom's estate silmultaneously. Been really good but really short with PMA in front of XW for last 8 months. NC other than talk of S2 or practical stuff. But in reality in my own head Ill go weeks or months being detached then fluctuating some days between saltiness, sadness and bitterness to then being fine with D and moving on with my life.
XW painted marital house over the weekend. So anyway. Over last weekend when I had S2. XW's comment " about the finality of it all" kind of got me miffed, a little attached, and a little and mildly agitated over the weekend I had S2 because its like I couldn't tell if she was just expressing her feelings or trying to rope me back in?†Internally my mind was screaming. "WELL WHAT AND HOW DID YOU EXPECT TO FEEL!? THIS IS WHAT HAPPENS IN DIVORCE!" I almost told her maybe you should save these conversations for your family members friends or therapists in the future?
So because my mind was on our interaction from Sat all weekend. Sun when I went to drop S2 off. I back slid from Sat. XW could tell I was a little irritated. I was also a little irritated because I'm attempting to quit smoking again. I kind of went off on her when she tried to rope me into another semi R convo about mediation. I said "I just want to get this f*ckin done without being emotionally roped into any conversations and just want this to end so I can forget about the hurt and get on with my life!" That I know this has to get done, but can we just communicate about it through emails/mediator, and stick to discussions of S2, cause I didn't want to be constantly reminded, confused, emotionally involved etc. Myself, the mediator and XW have been CC'D on all communications, messages and intentions moving forward. So I didn't see the necessity to keep discussing "the plan going forward." Or why she wanted to bring it up? Just for confirmation we are on the same page?
I left in a pissy mood. Slammed my car door. Took off. Pounded the gear shifter. Stopped the car, backed up. Knocked on the XW's front door and apologized for my behavior. She validated me to a degree and invited me in to talk. But what actually wound up happening is she did all the talking again about herself, how much I hurt her, and how there are times she's good to go moving forward too like me at times, detached and ok with it all. And then there are times where she says there are reminders still all around the house of me, and it makes her a little sad. She was also going out of her way to convince me that she is not dating anyone, how she was always faithful, kind of threw in there "I'm not the one online dating" implying me, and how much she is still trying to get over the hurt that I've caused her in the past. Again just validated all of it. She kind of talked around about the things I knew about when I was snooping 10-12 months ago trying to convince me all these changes she's making is for her. Mentioned she's looking for work out of state again. I emphasised I want S2 within a 15 mile radius of where I'm living currently and want that in the parenting agreement. Left the convo with how I can't be friends with the same amount of hurt/trust issues as a result of her lifestyle changes, decisions, etc. That I'm not like her divorced relatives that are friends with their exes and bring they're new spouses to family affairs.
I picked up S2 Mon. I initiated another talk that I just want us both to grow from this experience, be happy, and healthy for S2. That I don't want to have to keep fluctuating between being indifferent, and ok with D, between acceptance and denial in my own mind, and having to force myself to be bitter just to be able to fully let go at times. I just want to heal. I don't want to hate her. She is a really good person, a good mother, that just made some $hitty decisions and life choices.. But I'm sure we both have. I definately have. I don't want to ever want to be that person anymore, that is reactive to these bull$hit scenarios anymore, do what needs to be done and move on forever. I want to change. I want to be at peace. I want to have good coping skills and resolve again. I just want to rid myself of my own anger issues, fully shift my focus to our new lives, grow and learn from it and be the best version of ourselves. That I still don't respect a lot of her choices, but understand she has to do what she has to do to be happy and move on with her life as well. That I do respect her as a person, that she is putting herself first, and that there were a lot of good memories there, and I would like to move on keeping it that way remaining amicable but somewhat distant friends. (Really don't see the point lol...but it helps me dispel the anger saying that.) That said. I announced I was casually dating, which she figured from divorced brothers XGF who saw me online 1 year ago. Apparently they hang out every week now according to XW. I got some more stuff out of the atttic at her place. She asked me if I wanted the video from our first vacation together. I told her. Honestly I'm just going to put it in a box for the time being, (She said the same thing.) and I intentionally left it when I moved out 5 months ago. Told her to keep it in case S2 gets curious years later and wants to see it. She wants to have a dinner to go over all the D bull$hit. I wasn't fine with it at first because if there is something that needs to be debated or argued, I'm not getting roped into it. Just let the Lawyers and mediators handle any disagreements... But by Mon after our 2nd convo. I was a little more open to it for practicality reasons for saving $ and being billed hourly over things. I know this sounds crazy to most of you here but I have to be friends with my ex-wife if I'm ever going to respect her as a whole person, and if I'm ever going to look at her in a positive light as a good person. I can understand why she has made her choices that doesn't mean I have to like it. But I am doing this for me so I don't have to feel any anger anymore about the whole situation.
I was actually shocked in our conversation Mon. she showed some humility and accountability on her part this time. She realized how her communication patterns were very avoidant and stuffed down, and was afraid to talk to me. Even though she had some mentions of her disappointment in the M. She never fully expressed her needs appropriately, and we never fully focused on permanent solutions. Just temporary fixes. She said she needs to take more accountability and work on her communications. That made me feel good hearing that. Sounds like therapy is going good for her. Because for an entire year and even last Sun. All I got was victim mentality of how I hurt her, but she was totally unaware or concerned how she was hurting me. There are no victims in this. Just S2 because he's a child and didn't ask for this. We are both guilty of making mistakes and having bad relationship patterns torwards the end.
For the life of me what I can't figure out sometimes is when we were first dating. We both intentionally focused a lot on good relationship habits, communication, etc. Even met John Gray and got a book autographed to the both of us by him... Its weird. We went from being single, to growing together exponentially and having so much in common. We used to respect each others boundaries, be on our best behavior, try harder for one another, teach each other things and grow. Be more thoughtful, kind, and considerate. Our actions used to match our words. We used to have a rule to never go to bed angry. I guess we stopped growing at one point and over the years it just dwindled. My frustration grew with her and within myself, and I need to heal that. My complacency grew as well as hers. From my perspective. We had a really beautiful relationship until the day we got married... Lol... Then the habits changed, the division of labor changed, the follow through of promises changed, etc..I miss those pre-marital days sometimes. They make me happy thinking about them. Post Marital stresses mixed in with other wonderful memories were well? A typical marriage lol...I'm sure at some point we both stopped growing as individuals and in the M. Time to grow again as a single person. I don't get sad very often anymore. But when I do now. It just quickly washes over me. Sometimes my sadness comes out in anger, but that is very far and few in between nowadays with the exception of last Sun.
I've been socially handicapped for the last couple of months due to all the life circumstances. But the feelings that I get living on my own I feel like I'm 12 years younger again sometimes in my mind. Being single and all exploring and growing and trying new things, the freedom is there but not like when I was 27. But that is just being an adult and father with less PD time and social time. The future is going to be fun, even when things don't go according to plan, even if I get disappointment after disappointment. I'm going to handle it and grow from it and look forward to the simple things.
So that's that. My M is going to be a wrap and Im not looking back. F*ck it! We both need to heal and grow. I decided to blow the bridge forever, let go of hope, the rope, and all else. But I figure if I was going to do it. Do it with love, clairty, resolve, and respect. Who knows what the future will bring. I'm looking more forward everyday to not only taking myself back from all this, but becoming more at peace with myself, trying on new things, new people, new places, and new mindsets. Ill keep you guys updated how everything turns out in the next few months.
This post is just for Wolf's $hit's and giggles..I was watching sick S2 today with diarrhea. We had a lot of fun today though. I picked him up early this morning and brought him back to my place, XW wanted to break my ball$ so I broke some back. Still had a few laughs out of it. XW has always had it in her head that I don't wash my hands enough and practice good hygiene, which nothing could be further from the truth. I am Mr. Compulsively hygienic and clean and wash my hands so much to the point that they crack and I always need Eucerin lotion everywhere I go.
XW: Please make sure you wash your hands, especially after changing S2's diapers today. It will help him to not have this reoccur.
XH: I have. I do. Maybe you should stop mothering me!
XW: Maybe you should stop being gross and start washing your hands.
XH: Make sure to mention that with your therapist they might be able to help you with that.
XW: Good call!
XH: I don't know WTF you are talking about and I don't have time for bull$hit. So rest assured I am an adult. I am wasing my hands. S2 is in good hands we are having fun and every hand/surface is Chloroxed, and being bleached.
XH: 😆 😁 HAVE A NICE DAY!
XW: I would tell you to have a nice day, but you will probably have a $hitty day,Ö pun intended💩💩💩 😷😳
XH:Ooohh.. Chocolatte bon bons. Thanks you shouldn't have...
XH: Got me some N95 masks too. $hit is selling like hotcakes.
XH: Ill save you some of S2's patee with some crackers later. 😝
XH: All kidding aside. I understand your concerns and fears with pathogens and stuff with this Corona Virus and other stuff going around. I do wash my hands religiously whether you want to believe and trust in that or not. Just because I took a moment to use a wipe to clean butt cream ointment off my finger after changing S2 this morning doesn't mean I didn't wash my hands right after. You watched me wash them! I'm not going to leave him unattended on the table. I suit him up. Then wash my hands. I always do after a diaper change. So I don't know what you are talking about? Just because I don't do something when you expect me to doesn't mean I don't do it.
I understand you have a lot of fears that don't stack up with my reality and that's fine. Maybe therapy can help with that. I really don't take it too personally. But I would appreciate if you would stop sending me these type of bull$hit motherly fearful reminder texts to do XYZ when its a given of what I do as a parent, and put trust in that S2 is in good, secure, and capable hands. I know your concern is him first so I don't take it personal. My apartment and my habits are way cleaner than yours. Hello! Your talking to Mr. Compulsive Neat Freak here! But the frequency of these type of reminders need to stop. It would mean a lot to me and I would really appreciate it if you can work on that, work through you're assumed fears and develop some trust.
XH: What I'm trying to say is. Its not how an ex treats another ex and not how a friend treats another friend.
XW: Point taken
XW: How is S2?
XH:He's great! He's playing were having lots of laughs. Eating blueberries and crackers. And he's even helping me mop the floor 😄 ( Sent pics of him mopping kitchen floor. He loves the mops.)
(Edited other parts of convo.)
XW: Any more diarrhea yet?
XH: HAHA. I literally just read this and heard a shart from across the room.😆
XW: 😳 Was it bad... as in, should i call out tomorrow?
Glad you're making a shift towards acceptance, too. You're starting to see the benefits of being single.
> XW: Please make sure you.. > XH: Maybe you should.. > XW: Maybe you should.. > XH: Make sure to.. > XH: these type of reminders need to stop
lol. Some clever exchanges, and a comedy of attempts by ex's to control each other.
I like that your XW keeps things cordial by changing subjects when things get heated: "XW: I would tell you to have a nice day, but you will probably have a $hitty day,Ö pun intended", and "XW: How is S2?"
Originally Posted by IHCLACS
I know this sounds crazy to most of you here but I have to be friends with my ex-wife if I'm ever going to respect her as a whole person, and if I'm ever going to look at her in a positive light as a good person.
PS - I don't know that one needs to be friends with their ex-wife. You know you, but I wouldn't describe my ex-wife as a friend. As with some business acquaintances, we have enough trust and communication to get our common work done. My assessment of her as a "good" or "bad" person is irrelevant.
That was painful to read. Can you explain how this exchange is going to get you closer to friendship ??
And why do you have to be friends with her? I am civil with my ex and get along with him, but we are not friends. He would like to be my friend and so would his OWW, but I donít think friendship is necessary.
Really though. That exchange was not good. You joke, get offended, get wordy, get insulting. Her opening statement wasnít even bad. You could have sent a simple ďof course, like I always do. But you had to ramp her up and go all over the board from mean, not thinking you are joking, where you can see right through that, to becoming offended....
Seriously, you arenít going to get closer to civil/friendship, with that!
That's not heated that's bustin ball$ in my world. I don't think friendship is necessary either Ginger. Who needs a friend that was once a confidant, lover, and life companion that flew the coupe? I just try to keep that frame in my head so I can move on without hating her on occasion depending on which way my mind starts to go for the day. Its actually helping me a lot with detachment. Ginger another thing? I don't care how I come across to her... I could have cut down in the wording and be a little less mean... But then again.. I DON'T CARE! LOL.....I'm just tired of the f@cking nagging, stupid fear based controlling victim mentality. I'm not her H anymore, so I won't be bothered or nagged or reminded of common silly fear based things anymore....I endured that stupid accusation for 10 years amongst others, so it needs to stop. She knows I'm half joking half serious because she knows me she was after all married to me for 10 years. That aside I appreciate her concern for S2. I decided to have a little fun with it and really don't care what she thinks. She picked up S2 later and everything was fine. These dynamics were typical so? Im not looking to change them but eliminate them. I only put it up here for Wolf's amusement. Didn't leave it open for criticisms but I'm sure Im going to get it anyway. I stopped posting here for a reason because everything I write or share here is open to unwanted criticism. I stopped asking for help a long time ago. I just want to be single, have fun, improve and be me.