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A Message from Michele
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Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881077
01/17/20 01:40 PM
01/17/20 01:40 PM
Joined: Nov 2019
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wooba Offline
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Gosh, Iím so sorry that this happened. Your H sounds completely out of control. I worry about handing your son over to him if heís emotionally unstable. You really handled the situation as best as you could.


BD: Sep 2019
H moved out: Oct 2019
3 kids under 12
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: wooba] #2881099
01/17/20 02:56 PM
01/17/20 02:56 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 27,664
Southern Maryland
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Scout,

Are you documenting each and every time he's let or doesn't pick up his child? If not, you need to start doing so. I know that you would like for him to be on time when picking up his child, but he's not going to do it. He may be genuinely late or he may be doing it deliberately to annoy you. Whatever the reason...document. He really is gaslighting you and trying to control the situation.

You said what was on your mind, now you need to step back, document and try not to get into it again w/him. You are dealing w/someone who is emotionally immature and acting irrational about having to be responsible.

You handled the situation the best you could. I just hope he doesn't become physical in the future towards you.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881449
01/20/20 02:35 AM
01/20/20 02:35 AM
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 435
Australia
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scout12 Offline OP
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kml, DS, wooba, job - thanks for weighing in. Job - I document everything. DS - several people have recommended I speak to the police, so I'll keep that in mind.

I made an emergency appointment to see my psychologist on Friday which helped a lot. I'm finding I'm able to bounce back from these attacks more quickly now. The emotional hangover doesn't last as long.

My parents stayed over on Saturday night so they could be there when H arrived to pick up S1 on Sunday morning. I think their car in the driveway was enough of a deterrent because H was on his best behaviour. I did not speak to him.

My L informed me that H responded to the consent orders himself this morning. He does not have a legal representative. I now have his residential address on record, so that eases my mind when he takes S1 to his place. Even though him taking S1 there still goes against our parenting plan agreement, at least I know where my son is.

There's a section in the orders which asks both parties to respond to the question: Were the contributions from each of the parties as homemaker and parent the same?

After explaining that I was the stay-at-home parent for the first year while he worked full-time, my solicitor responded: The Applicant (me) made greater contributions as homemaker and parent of the child of the relationship.

H's response: DISAGREE. Applicant did not make greater contributions as homemaker. Respondent (him) wishes to add that household chores and homemaker duties were split evenly between both parties. Respondent cared equally for the child and performed a greater variety of homemaker tasks than the Applicant.

Am I correct in thinking a judge is going to read that and laugh? Surely by definition a SAHP and working parent physically cannot have equal responsibility for childcare and household duties?

My L said this will go on record as a disputed fact and will not require further negotiation, so once she amends the orders with H's comments and he signs them, it should be a straightforward path to settlement. He did not dispute the financials, which is the important part. One step closer to the end.


W32
X30
S2

June 2019 | Runaway husband
May 2020 | Legal separation
Xmas 2020 | Divorce hearing
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881453
01/20/20 03:20 AM
01/20/20 03:20 AM
Joined: Mar 2017
Posts: 1,748
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OwnIt Offline
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My guess is the judge will roll the eyes on that one. He just needs to be the good guy, as they all do. Makes him feel better and costs you nothing. I say get this thing pushed through before the buyer's remorse kicks in for him. I'm glad your parents were there. If it is an ongoing issue, at least in the US you can get exchanges ordered at police stations, but I'm sure you and your lawyer have discussed what the options are in view of his physicality, lateness and rudeness.

Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881611
01/21/20 04:11 AM
01/21/20 04:11 AM
Joined: Aug 2019
Posts: 435
Australia
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scout12 Offline OP
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Just journalling here. A memory from the immediate post-BD weeks. I want to say late June 2019. I was suicidal, taking care of S1 without any help from H, not eating, sleeping, or able to work. And yet I was still certain this was a temporary crisis and we would work everything out.

He reluctantly agreed to meet up to talk. He originally said Wednesday, then his mum called to confirm childminding for Thursday. I was confused and called H to double check. He morosely told me he had plans on Wednesday and and hung up.

He picked me up in the evening and drove us to a local park. I suggested we get fish and chips for dinner and he grumbled about it, saying he wanted to get this over with quickly. I did my best to act happy and unruffled. I told him I had seen a psychologist who had confirmed that I no longer needed treatment for postnatal depression or anxiety, and that despite the marital crisis, I was feeling much healthier. I said I had so much compassion for him, no anger, no judgement, and that I wanted to support him no matter what. He did not respond to any of this.

He commented how amazing it was to have the freedom to pick up and go camping on a whim, or stay overnight at a friend's house when the opportunity arose. I held my tongue thinking "the only reason you can do that is because I am taking care of our baby ON MY OWN every single night". Of course, 'friend's house' = 'OW's house', but in those early days I defended his honour to anyone who suggested there was someone else involved.

We got to the park and unfolded our package of food. I was the only one eating. He seemed put off watching me eat. The conversation went terribly, as you can expect. I felt blindsided all over again. I did my best to simply listen and validate, but ended up in tears. I said I couldn't change what had happened in the past, but asked for the opportunity to spend the rest of my life making it up to him. He became furious and insisted he take me home. I begged him to tell me what I had done wrong and he just drove in silence.

Eventually I sobbed "why do you hate me?" and he became so agitated he lost control of the car and narrowly avoided crashing us into a roundabout. He yelled at me to be quiet and said "this is why I can't talk to you!" When we got home we sat in the car for a few minutes so I could compose myself and he said "I don't hate you. I just don't love you." He repeated this several times, as though he was convincing himself. I asked again "why?" and he couldn't answer.

(It wasn't until I wrote him a letter taking ownership for my flaws and mistakes in the marriage that he began to craft his narrative of the controlling and manipulative wife. He turned my desperate insights and honest apologies into weapons, arming himself with reasons he had to leave me. Giving him that letter was probably my biggest mistake in this whole process.)

We went inside and his mum held me while I cried that he just didn't love me anymore. H sat down on the lounge with FIL in silence. MIL made me a cup of tea and we all sat down on the lounge watching a show about ambulance chasers. We sipped our tea in complete silence. FIL made a joke about something on the show. It was bizarre. There was no acknowledgement about this intense personal crisis that was going on. FIL did not say one word to H or me, just joked about this meaningless TV show. MIL asked H a couple of questions and he stared at the floor and ignored her.

Eventually H left and MIL gave me a hug and said to call her anytime. Once they left, I laid down on the cold tile floor and cried myself to sleep.


W32
X30
S2

June 2019 | Runaway husband
May 2020 | Legal separation
Xmas 2020 | Divorce hearing
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881661
01/21/20 02:08 PM
01/21/20 02:08 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 27,664
Southern Maryland
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Scout,

I am so sorry to read about the post BD meet up. Your posting truly broke my heart to read it. How cold and indifferent your h and his parents were. They were very uncomfortable w/the way that meet up went. As for the in-laws, they don't have a clue when it comes to their son. They were most likely hoping that all of this would be shoved under the rug and life would go on. Your h may have told them some out of this world lies/excuses as to why he's doing what he's doing and they will believe him for a while...but eventually, the truth will come out...but until then...blood is always thicker than water.

Your h was and is a very lost soul. He really does not know why he doesn't love you and if you were to ask him today, the answer would still be the same. In his mind, he's been unhappy for a very long time and he thinks the marriage and you are the reason for that unhappiness. Your man needs to grow up and realize that happiness comes from within and not from exterior things.

He would have blamed you for the moon rising or the sky being blue. That is the way of the MLCer, i.e., they blame us for everything that went wrong in the lives, i.e., not taking blame for anything. They remember and remind us of things that we did or say many years ago and then use those things as excuses for what they are doing now.

Scout, you are human and you wanted to try to make things right w/him. We all have apologized for our flaws. Don't ever beat yourself up over apologizing to him.

My xh said the same thing to me as well, i.e., "he didn't hate me, but he didn't love me either". It's a phrase from the MLC lingo book. Another one is "I don't love you the way I use to". Typical lingo from a MLCer.

Scout, you've come a long way and you are stronger than you think. Please do not ever doubt yourself. The road you are traveling started out as a difficult one, but from where I am sitting, you are getting stronger each and every day and that road is starting to lose the bumps and potholes for you.

Keep the focus on you and your child. Listen to what your h has to say, but sift through the garbage spewing from his lips to find the truth. You know what you need to do and no matter what he says or does...you are the one fighting for your child and yourself.

Hang in there.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881671
01/21/20 02:30 PM
01/21/20 02:30 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 1,557
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HaWho Offline
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Iím sorry; that is so painful what happened.

Donít blame yourself for the letter. First off, in a healthy relationship you can and should be able to express vulnerability without it being turned on you. So you did nothing wrong. And trust me, if you did not give him the letter, he would concoct other reasons. Are you familiar with gaslighting?

Reading your post, I see tremendous emotional abuse. He acts angry towards you. You try to ask why he hates you and then he says that is why he canít talk to you. Classic gaslighting. He creates situations to make you to blame because he needs an excuse for how he feels.

You had a partner who could not care for you or your child when you both needed it. Strong men want to care for loved ones. That cold dynamic you saw from his family during that show should look very familiar to you in your husband. They are emotionally constipated.

Stop blaming yourself. Heal. Strengthen yourself. Raise a good man. You are the prize.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881766
01/22/20 02:51 AM
01/22/20 02:51 AM
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Hello scout

That is a heartbreaking story. (((scout)))

H is a sad lost soul. Desperate and lashing out. It hurts so much when our spouse uses our apologies and admitted flaws against us. Crisis people need justifications for their actions, and they exaggerate the h3ll out of them.

He doesnít hate you, but doesnít love you. Or loves you, but not in love with you. There are lots of variations of this theme. All of them say something along those lines. All are deeply confused and really donít know why they donít love you anymore.

The hidden truth is that they donít love themselves anymore. That is a very difficult thing to face and overcome. Hence all the running and projecting upon the LBS.

His familyís response was bizarre. It does highlight why he is the way he is. Not hard to imagine some unknown trauma he had to burry when he was a child. My XWís family was similarly bizarre and cold; undoubtedly a source of future problems of crisis proportions.

You are doing very well scout. Sane, strong, and stable.

DnJ


Current
Me52 XW49 S23 S22 S19 D18

Oct 8/17-BD, Moves in w/OM, Leaves Kids
Me49 W46 S20 S19 S16 D15
M26 T29
Dec 9/17-Legal Separation
Oct 3/18-W Files
Apr 6/19-Divorced

I may give up, but not today.
Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881769
01/22/20 03:09 AM
01/22/20 03:09 AM
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OwnIt Offline
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Scout, the mind movies end at some point and the memories become just that. Not anything devastating or unsurvivable. Yep, the parents attitude was like a neon sign. Process, grieve, and keep moving forward.

Re: Scout's QLC journey #3 [Re: scout12] #2881778
01/22/20 04:55 AM
01/22/20 04:55 AM
Joined: May 2019
Posts: 1,494
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unchien Offline
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Originally Posted by scout23
(It wasn't until I wrote him a letter taking ownership for my flaws and mistakes in the marriage that he began to craft his narrative of the controlling and manipulative wife. He turned my desperate insights and honest apologies into weapons, arming himself with reasons he had to leave me. Giving him that letter was probably my biggest mistake in this whole process.)

scout ~

This exact same thing with letter-writing happened to me. I'm so sorry you had to go through that, I know how painful it is to feel so vulnerable and pour out your feelings onto paper only to have them weaponized. Also my biggest mistake and regret.

When they want out, everything is fuel. There is no doing right. DB often advises a neutral or non-reaction, but sometimes I think there are situations where a complete non-reaction provides them a blank canvas onto which they can project all those negative feelings. Then they can freely paint the picture they want, and then use THAT as fuel. Everything is fuel.

I don't think there is anything wrong with standing up for yourself and disallowing the projection (as you have been doing). It shows that you won't play the same games anymore (gaslighting, projection, whatever it is...) It is a proper boundary.

Last edited by unchien; 01/22/20 04:56 AM.
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