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Hi, Kindly. It is helpful to follow along with your thread, because you are asking many of the questions I have asked. You are not alone. We are not alone, and there are many here who have been on this path.

Originally Posted by Kindly
1. Do they often appear as if everything is fine with total confidence that nothing has changed? Except for when hiding in ‘their quarters’ and showing avoidance behaviour at home?


One of the things my H will do is act like everything is fine and he's living a wonderful life while he does his best to avoid me when he's at home, which totally makes me question reality. Sometimes I will see a glimpse of anger or something other than that projection of happiness in him and remember that what's going on on the surface is very different than what's going on inside him, and that's why he's trying to run from it. It's crazy-making, which I suppose is a good reason for the compassionate detachment we're trying to reach.

Originally Posted by Kindly
2. How do I show him change is possible from a distance when I feel like he’s not even looking?

Visit my thread and you'll see I recently asked a similar question, even as I knew the answer, which is pretty much what others have said here! The more I am seeing of my H's ability to justify any decision he makes, the more the truth of this, "Make changes for YOU," hits home. Example: He has noticed changes, but worries they won't last. It seems like if they do notice, it will be something like that, or they will come up with other reasons, whatever they can. So, whether he does or doesn't notice is beside the point, ultimately--they should be changes that are in accordance with your core values, for yourself.


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Kindly, you do have to find the humor where you can--it is a must to survive.

Mine is a professional with a very big and important job. His job loves him. He's gotten several promotions through this. He gets a lot of supply from the job so he has become a workaholic to soak up all the praise and adulation he gets there.

I have not had one person from his life contact me (other than OW1--she said he was manipulative, a liar, and all her friends hated him) to convey any concerns about his behavior or what he was doing. His family that he previously wrote off and had nothing to do with for 25 years appears to have welcomed him back with open arms. I don't think any but those very close to them see anything wrong.

I have gone up to 1.5 years without seeing mine (and with him not seeing my kids). He has stalked me throughout though and done creepy things and I've kept a side eye on his actions from afar). I can tell you with absolute certainty that he sees the changes in me. How? I don't contact him unless it absolutely necessary (and even this has been 1-2 times per year with two kids), I don't cry when I'm around him, I don't do anything to seek his attention, and I no longer take the bait when he tries to temp check me or find out if I still care. When I stopped manufacturing reasons to contact him or see him, he started manufacturing reasons to see me (usually through settlement/divorce talk that goes nowhere). I've also dropped tons of weight and keep better care of myself. That I know he sees, but won't acknowledge.

They do see you. They do see the changes. But only when they are real. Only when you really drop the rope. Its an energy, it's things we can't control.

You may not want to hear this, but while you really want him back now, chances are you won't by the time he would actually come back. I get somewhat sick at the thought of mine touching me, or even talking to me about anything other than logistics. I see him as a weak, sad, tainted man. None of those things are attractive. Then I look at my children when they are hurting and sometimes I do hate him, but usually for just a moment.

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Originally Posted by Woosa
My H was like that. Looked and acted normal generally. Avoided serious talks. Until he started to self-destruct.

Woosa- how long after BD did self destruct start and what did that look like for you/H ...should I find your thread? My Hs behaviour often makes me feel like I’m crazy and that this isn’t MLC and that he will just carry on his merry way because it’s what he said he will do in the beginning and throughout.

[quote=peacetoday] When they see we are OK, it makes it easier for them to transition out.


This is exactly how I feel....and is truthful one of my big insecurities if I’m being honest with myself. In the beginning when things were very bad and I was in awful shape, he stayed around and tried to be compassionate and “help” me but then just couldn’t do it anymore as the monsters in his head seemed to take over. I often feel like if I wasn’t doing well he would feel the need to take care of me. This is 100% my weak voice talking from a desperate place. 5 months in I’m finding it easier to silence this voice, but some days it’s hard to keep the head high and shoulders back.

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Originally Posted by cardinal
One of the things my H will do is act like everything is fine and he's living a wonderful life while he does his best to avoid me when he's at home, which totally makes me question reality. Sometimes I will see a glimpse of anger or something other than that projection of happiness in him and remember that what's going on on the surface is very different than what's going on inside him, and that's why he's trying to run from it. It's crazy-making, which I suppose is a good reason for the compassionate detachment we're trying to reach.

Thx Cardinal - it’s so true...I am constantly questioning myself especially because he’s not showing the same behaviour to his closest friends. He is so matter of fact with them that they just take what he is saying at face value. I want to reach out to one of his co-workers so badly but I imagine that would be a no-no. He takes many opportunities to remind me that he’s serious ...”why would you buy that we won’t be here for long” or “when we sell”..... so hurtful....but his reality I guess. And the reminder to make changes for you is so important regardless of hard it seems at times.

Originally Posted by OwnIt
Mine is a professional with a very big and important job. His job loves him. He's gotten several promotions through this. He gets a lot of supply from the job so he has become a workaholic to soak up all the praise and adulation he gets there.


Ownit- this is one of the major catalyst in my situation. H is a workaholic and always has been. Once the MLC hit he dove into work even more. Praise and adulation became the only thing that mattered to him and I still didn’t see this shift as a problem until BD. Another area where it seems like he is still functioning highly which makes me question my sanity regarding whether this is MLC Or not .

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Woosa - I’m still learning how to quote ... I accidentally asked you a question mixed in with your quote. Sorry about that crazy

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Originally Posted by job
If he's not brought up the separation/divorce, then let it be. The more you give him space and time, the better. Sometimes they will use the "divorce" word to get us to back off and just leave them be. They do like to have control and threaten us at times just to reel us back in and keep us right where they left us pre-crisis. ....

Dig deeper for patience and keep the focus on you. Sit quietly and the answers will come...but if you aren't in a hurry for a divorce...don't bring it up. If he does, then you can address it.


So H sent me via email financial discovery forms to start the S process...I am very confused as to what to do next. I have started my search for a lawyer...but realized that something doesn’t feel right here. Since Nov he’s been threatening S/D and specifically said his Lawyer was going to reach out to me. That never happened. Now he sends these papers and has left MAJOR assets off. I asked if this was from his lawyer and he said yes. My gut says it is not even though there is a L name at the top of pages...it’s too sloppy. How do I navigate this? I don’t know if this is just another push me away tactic after the holidays where family and friends might have tried to reason with his baffling decision or whether it’s legit and I need to comply as not to look bad in the eyes of the law. There has been little to no conversation between us since prob Nov/Dec And the last convo where I asked him if he was sure he wanted to dismantle our lives like this did not go well when I mentioned certain assets. I don’t want to get “tricked” into retaining a lawyer or progressing his wishes along when he could be MLC lying ....Any advice for how to proceed?

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Originally Posted by Kindly
Woosa- how long after BD did self destruct start and what did that look like for you/H ...should I find your thread? My Hs behaviour often makes me feel like I’m crazy and that this isn’t MLC and that he will just carry on his merry way because it’s what he said he will do in the beginning and throughout.

Honestly he's been on a path of self destruction for awhile now. But after BD he never lost it with me. In hindsight I think he knew he would if he's around so he opted to not sleep here anymore and minimize his time here. but just a few days ago he blew up. so in terms of a timeline it's about 3~4 months since BD. For whatever reason he hit a low point that day and couldn't contain it.

Originally Posted by Kindly
So H sent me via email financial discovery forms to start the S process...I am very confused as to what to do next. I have started my search for a lawyer...but realized that something doesn’t feel right here. Since Nov he’s been threatening S/D and specifically said his Lawyer was going to reach out to me. That never happened. Now he sends these papers and has left MAJOR assets off. I asked if this was from his lawyer and he said yes.

Have you consulted a L yet? If not I would strongly recommend it. knowledge is power. Take legal matters seriously and let your L determine whether he is lying etc.


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Originally Posted by Woosa
Originally Posted by Kindly
Woosa- how long after BD did self destruct start and what did that look like for you/H ...should I find your thread? My Hs behaviour often makes me feel like I’m crazy and that this isn’t MLC and that he will just carry on his merry way because it’s what he said he will do in the beginning and throughout.

Honestly he's been on a path of self destruction for awhile now. But after BD he never lost it with me. In hindsight I think he knew he would if he's around so he opted to not sleep here anymore and minimize his time here. but just a few days ago he blew up. so in terms of a timeline it's about 3~4 months since BD. For whatever reason he hit a low point that day and couldn't contain it.



Interesting Woosa... my H also had a couple of outbursts directed toward me in the 3-4 months range. I felt the most calm and detached during his second one, when he seemed to be following a script. It was like observing a subject in an experiment. I suppose I should try to tap into that way of observing things as often as I can!

Thanks for your support on my thread, Kindly! As you know, I also feel crazy a lot of the time. smile It's much harder to have any kind of perspective on one's own sitch, at least in my experience. We must hang in there and try not to doubt ourselves too much.


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Kindly,

How you navigate depends on what you want and whether you risk anything by not acting now (which I now assume the LBS does in most cases).

If you don't want to help with the divorce or move it along and not doing so doesn't hurt you, then just respond and say hey I noticed you left a bunch of stuff off. Why don't you send me a complete form and when I get it, I'll go see a lawyer and respond. If it is serious, he should fill it out and send it to you. If it isn't you won't hear anything.

Don't assume that because it is not complete that a lawyer didn't do it. Could be a sloppy lawyer or an untruthful husband (my vote is on the untruthful husband). Or to save costs the lawyer could have given him the form and said fill this out and give it to her. Unless you want no communication with him and you want to pay lawyers to talk to lawyers (something that makes me chill to the bone, but some prefer this), then don't care whether he drafted it or the lawyer did because you will never know. As 25yearmlc always quoted, constant wondering is constant suffering.

I like to do things that leave the ball in his court so he can't accuse me of stalling (even though he still does) or think I'm trying to hold onto him (which makes him feel safe and happy to stay in his mess). It also tells me when he is really committed to doing something.

Don't teach him how to hurt you. Don't freak out and get worried or hop to because he takes some action (especially if it is an action you don't want to see again, like constant divorce talk, because he will use the same trick the next time). Show him calm. If it was an effort to test you, the only way you will ever know is by looking like you are complying by leaving the ball in his court, and then looking backward to see if he actually followed through.

Most basic rule--don't do something for him to make it easier for him if it is not something you want or is not in your best interest. You can't nice these people back. You can only allow yourself to be screwed by being afraid of standing up for what is rightfully yours.

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Hi Kindly,

My vote...Untruthful MLC H...

My friend trusted her MLC H, and he made the papers himself to save money
she signed
She did lose everything including her home

when it comes to D...You may see another side to your H

Some will steal trust funds that belong to the kids...Mine came to my home, while watching the kids and took deeds to his car and motorcycle.He drained our business and put it in debt
..they change and if it is MLC, you will see a slow decline

My seemed sort of normal maybe the first 6 months other than the late hour out and not wanting to spend anytime with me
He visited a lot..after he moved out he was friendlier
He took the kids school age at that time to arcades and dinner
He bought them lots of gifts




You may notice alcohol, later hours, spending, secretive calls and texts ect

At fiirst , I could not believe XH was draining our business, overspending
He lived with OW, he said he was at friends,, they lie a alot
Then I found a credit card statement

get a free consult asap
stay calm as own said
don't be surprised if he tried to pressure you to agree or if he gets crazy or angry..

MLC are on their own plan right now and little concern for spouse or kids


married 14 years
H 42
bomb 2/07 IDLYA
D final 3 /09
M ow D ow
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