One thing you need to come to grips w/is that the old marriage is dead, gone. If, and when, you and your h reconcile, it will have to be a brand new relationship. You cannot go back to the old ways because neither of you will be the same once his crisis is over. You both will have grown by leaps and bounds and at that point, you will be the one to decide whether to try again, not him.
For now, breathe, it's okay to cry and grieve for the loss of the relationship/marriage. It's never easy, but you will need to pick yourself up and think about selecting a lawyer to help you make some decisions. Once you receive separation/divorce papers, you need to look at your situation as a business deal gone sour. Think w/your head and not your heart when dealing w/the separation/divorce. Do not allow him to sway you w/promises of what he will or will not do for you because they change their minds entirely too quickly if things do not go their way.
Breathe! Be kind/gentle to yourself today.
Thx job! Being kind to myself is a struggle for me too. I will re-read this. Having learned how much h has suppressed his feelings and “runs/hides” as a people pleaser...how do I even hold out hope for a R when he has never ever “looked within”...how can he possibly start now? Also, do MLCrs ever realize the extent of damage they’ve done/ hurt they’ve caused? I feel like if they do, how on earth do they ever feel they can return?
I hope this doesn’t sound like I’m super attached still ...I know I’m not detached yet but I am less asking the above out of desperation and more out of interest /curiosity about this MLC journey.
I believe the MLCer knows the hurt they caused...but they also have ways of dulling reality and forgetting the pain they inflicted
they run, they go in denial, they use alcohol and substances, they use affairs and sex, they us drugs, spending there are many ways to drown out their pain and that is why you see him running
Remember the crises is not your fault or about you yes the M may have been good and bad..
they are usually running from previous trauma from childhood..things never resolved although they lived with it for most of their life
In my opinion, it comes up in midlife and causes this reflection on their lives and the crises most will never realize this and project their pain on you and the M
but saying and knowing this, cant help them..they cant see it and will think you are crazy if you say it keep it to yourself..but know its not you
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
Thx peacetoday - I missed earlier you asked H age...he’s 44. Looking back after BD I was able to see that things have been “off” with him since at least Oct 2018. How on earth did I miss the signs of something happening, even more work than usual, distant at times, restless sleeping...I thought it was work and he let me believe that or denied anything at all was “wrong”.
Does anybody know / have experience with what changes a mlcers destructive path? What triggers them to rethink or dig deeper to see that all hope is not lost? ESP if they are in complete denial and won’t seek any form of help.
Last edited by job; 01/05/2004:31 PM. Reason: added space between paragraphs
When the MLCer has tried all avenues to dull their pain and there is nothing left to distract them, they will then begin to look within. MLCers, like addicts, must hit their bottom. Until they are ready to face reality, they will be lost. They have to lose everything, i.e., respect, the love and compassion, understanding, etc., from their families and friends. They even have lost respect for themselves and when they do hit their bottom, that is when they finally realize that all of those exterior "fixes" where not the answers to dull their pain. When they come to realize that they were not at fault for what happened to them so long ago is when they will truly wake up and begin the long journey back to reality.
That long journey will take a while, i.e., just as it took them to go into crisis. They don't just snap out of it, it is a very gradual rise to the surface and one that we will begin to see when they begin to reconnect w/friends, etc.
It is important to let them go, give them the space and time that they need. We can push and prod and suggest getting help, but until they are ready to do so, they won't. Just like an addict, they have to work on themselves and be ready to admit that something is wrong and then seek help...we can't do that for them, because we didn't break them, therefore, we can't fix them. The best advice is to listen and validate whenever possible.
BTW, you missed the signs just like all of us...they were very gradual and we may have thought that they were having issues at work or just not feeling well...you wouldn't have known what to look for...but looking back in the rearview mirror now, you can think about things and actually begin to piece together the signs back then. Don't beat yourself up because you didn't see the signs....again, they are so gradual, we didn't pay too much attention to them.
Dig deeper for patience and keep that focus on you.
Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to. The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Kindly, I watched my lefty, atheist, clean-shaven, pet-hating, teetotaling, drug-abhoring, travel eschewing, husband take up with a Republican dog-owner and then a self-proclaimed religious drinker. In the process he's grown a beard, told me he would pray for me, lives with dogs (and the other woman's kids), apparently drinks heavily, abused drugs at one point, and travels a lot. As job says, they will try it all. They will keep trying looking for the thing that will finally make them happy. I can't tell you how many times I said my husband would never . . .
You can't stop it. You can't fix it (but you can fix your need to fix it). You can't shorten it (but I think you can extend it). All you can do is find yourself and survive--for you. Maybe you will be on the same path again one day. Maybe you won't. But finding you is always going to pay dividends.
Job - Thank you for the answer...it helps to understand some of the why. I feel like my skull is soooo thick. I hear the words, I understand the words but I feel like I’m still coming up with “buts” ....”but if I just say this he’ll get it or at least think about it at some point”. I feel like I’m trapping myself because I haven’t had the opportunity to apologize for how I’ve made him feel (mostly MLC talk but if he said it aloud I should have validated instead of fought ...this was early on in the confusion stage) now he’s shut right down and does anything and everything to avoid a conflict of any sort including talking. He also still seems to be going out with family and friends which seems ‘abnormal’ for MLC so I’m feeling like things are status quo for him, while also questioning if I’m using MLC incorrectly as an answer to his behaviour. Much advice says ignore them, detach but then others say change what you need to change within yourself and he’ll see those changes but my H won’t if he’s not even communicating with me. [i]<whine whine whine> even as I read this back I’m annoyed with myself but I feel like it helps to clear my head. [/i] I guess if I was to actually pull a question out of the above ramble it would be:
1. Do they often appear as if everything is fine with total confidence that nothing has changed? Except for when hiding in ‘their quarters’ and showing avoidance behaviour at home?
2. How do I show him change is possible from a distance when I feel like he’s not even looking? When The changes “we” as a couple need to make are quite minimal but the changes we individually need to make within ourselves are larger and he’s oblivious to that. - again when I read this back the answer seems obvious in that I can’t “make” him see anything.
I sometimes feel like it’s harder when he’s here but then at least I know where he is. I dunno. Thank you all so much
Ownit- Thx for making me laugh with the beginning of your post...especially today it’s been a rough one emotionally. I hope you don’t take offence to that. I love the way your wrote that and you must have a great sense of humour. Another important quality at times throughout this I’m sure.
Originally Posted by OwnIt
You can't stop it. You can't fix it (but you can fix your need to fix it). You can't shorten it (but I think you can extend it). All you can do is find yourself and survive--for you. Maybe you will be on the same path again one day. Maybe you won't. But finding you is always going to pay dividends.
I LOVE this ......“you can fix your need to fix it”!!! Just like I can fix my want “to know”, my need to “see the further”, my need and want to “throttle him back to his senses” instead of constantly beating myself down.lol!
When the MLCer has tried all avenues to dull their pain and there is nothing left to distract them, they will then begin to look within. MLCers, like addicts, must hit their bottom. Until they are ready to face reality, they will be lost. They have to lose everything, i.e., respect, the love and compassion, understanding, etc., from their families and friends. They even have lost respect for themselves and when they do hit their bottom, that is when they finally realize that all of those exterior "fixes" where not the answers to dull their pain. When they come to realize that they were not at fault for what happened to them so long ago is when they will truly wake up and begin the long journey back to reality.
Wise words from job. I needed to hear this too.
Kindly, you are not alone. As for question #1, the posters here advocate believing half of what you see and nothing of what they say (I think that's correct, if not hopefully someone will set me straight). The advice is to not worry about how they think, feel, act, appear, or talk. Ideally your actions will be based on your own values and principles and therefore shouldn't change based on anything to do with your H. This answers your question #2. You don't change for him. Change if you believe you need to change.
now he’s shut right down and does anything and everything to avoid a conflict of any sort including talking. He also still seems to be going out with family and friends which seems ‘abnormal’ for MLC... 1. Do they often appear as if everything is fine with total confidence that nothing has changed? Except for when hiding in ‘their quarters’ and showing avoidance behaviour at home?
My H was like that. Looked and acted normal generally. Avoided serious talks. Until he started to self-destruct.
Originally Posted by Kindly
2. How do I show him change is possible from a distance when I feel like he’s not even looking?
You don’t, you make changes for yourself and the purpose is not to show him. He may or may not notice. But that doesn’t matter if they are still deep in MLC...you do things for your own good. Not to win him back.
they do/will notice the change in us this shift helps form a friendship or a co parenting agreement if there are kids
they have to see and feel the energy shift from anger /fear to allowing working on acceptance
but usually the shift will not be enough to turn their heads back In some cases where it is not MLC it may Your situation sounds very MLC to me but Im not an expert only a fellow traveler
When they see we are OK, it makes it easier for them to transition out
remember we cant control this so we are choosing a higher road for us a road of compassion dealing with a sick H
hang in
married 14 years H 42 bomb 2/07 IDLYA D final 3 /09 M ow D ow
