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Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860061
08/04/19 01:57 PM
08/04/19 01:57 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 26,500
Southern Maryland
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I am so glad you are doing some things for yourself. I'm sure your hair looks great. Look at it this way, if you don't like it, you can always change the color again.

Sounds like you've had a very busy weekend. Be sure to take some time out for yourself.

Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860063
08/04/19 02:05 PM
08/04/19 02:05 PM
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Posts: 1,629
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DnJ Online
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Good Morning bttrfly

I love how you unveiled your new hairdo and colour to your Mom. Her response was so good.

Thanks sharing the reason for the date of 7th. I totally get not wanting to wait another month. And as you’ve said stuff is pouring out pretty easily so I’m sure you not rushing the process; you are far too reasonable a gal for that.

Originally Posted by bttrfly
I feel a pressing need to get on with the business of living my own vision of my life, not reacting to someone else's actions.

The way you wrote that. Excellent. The business of life - house, car, bills, fire pit, pie irons. smile The epitome of letting go and following your vision.

Originally Posted by bttrfly
As for the talk - text conversation, really. Yeah, neither of us really stopped to think about spontaneity vs needing to plan so that everyone / everything gets done. It made me feel a lot better and it was effortless once I got over the fear of bringing it up.

Really good stuff.

Overcame the fear and the talk was effortless. That’s wonderful.

Do you think/feel that your main trepidation regarding a serious conversation with friend was, and is, a remnant of past passive aggressive with XH? The deeper feelings, the hurt, that price - uncouple it from friend and your/his conversing. Be intellectual in that pursuit, and let go those remnant left overs; they will wither.

You are very much indeed worth standing up for.

I found it interesting to see what is holding us down, and what we stand up from.

Enjoy the day.

DnJ


Oct 8/17 - BD
Me49 W46 S20 S19 S16 D15
M26 T29
w/OM, Left Kids
Dec 9/17 - Legal Separation
Oct 3/18 - W Files
Apr 6/19 - Divorced
Current
Me51 XW48 S22 S21 S18 D17

I may give up, but not today.
Re: These Old Shades [Re: DnJ] #2860134
08/05/19 12:20 PM
08/05/19 12:20 PM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,885
Massachusetts
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bttrfly Offline OP
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Originally Posted by DnJ

Do you think/feel that your main trepidation regarding a serious conversation with friend was, and is, a remnant of past passive aggressive with XH?


Exh could go from P/A to full on onslaught in your face going for your jugular in a nanosecond, if he felt threatened in any way. Downright verbally nasty AF.

I would do a lot not to have to endure that ever again.


Had a fight with my son yesterday morning in which he acted like his father (or perhaps his father just acted like a teenager, you decide). It got pretty nasty pretty fast. No mother of the year awards coming my way as in absolute frustration I blasted him and told him to F off pretty emphatically. Why the fight? Apparently there weren't enough chocolate chips for the pancakes he was making himself and I don't bother to grocery shop. I spent $200 on groceries last week - two ribeye steaks (for son), luncheon meats (for son), ice cream (for son and mom) among other items. Sue me for not buying chocolate chips for his pancakes.

He has also informed me he's moving out on my birthday.

He had yesterday off. I went to my volunteer gig. Over an hour's drive, crying all the way there. One of the shyest furry friends could tell I needed some love and came up to me to give me kisses. Nothing like three beautiful furry friends over 100 pounds each surrounding you with love and kisses to make your heart stop hurting for a little while.

I was out in the sun without enough water again yesterday, as the shenanigans with Son made me forget my water. I filled an empty coffee cup from the hose, lol, but needed probably double what I actually drank. Resulted in a headache that wouldn't quit. Went to my friend's pool on the way home, didn't want to get my hair wet, lol, so my body was shivering in the pool while my head felt hot and hurt. I went home, took a shower and went to bed. Couldn't figure out why I was so uncomfortable all night - realized this morning that son shut off the A/C so it was 75 degrees in here. Yuck. I like to sleep in a 68 degree room with a down comforter, the weight of that is comforting to me as I sleep.

You know the bottom line is I have PTSD from exh. I don't respond well to being triggered. I'm working on it, but wish the healing was further along. Not sure how to 'uncouple' from it other than to keep reminding myself that was then, this is now, different situations, different people. With son it's harder, but the stakes are also higher, so it's definitely important, no - vital - to heal from this and not act out.


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


“Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.” - Rumi
Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860152
08/05/19 02:58 PM
08/05/19 02:58 PM
Joined: Apr 2016
Posts: 2,716
Canada
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bttrfly - sending you a hug and sympathy. I can understand the frustration you feel with your son. I smiled when you detailed the groceries. I also buy a lot of food that I never get to eat or appreciate. Don't be too surprised if it all blows over and he chooses to stay instead of moving out.

The problem with kids and spouses is that they know exactly where your buttons are and how hard to kick them. Someone - it might even be you - once told me that they strike out at us because they know it's safe to do so. That we are the sane parent.

But it still hurts. I'm glad your fur buddies were able to provide some comfort - here's my big Canadian bear hug {{{{btrrfly}}}}


On BD
H52, W50
T27, M26
S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good.
But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860170
08/05/19 04:44 PM
08/05/19 04:44 PM
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kml Offline
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The question is, girl, what's up with son that he was so irrational about the chocolate chips? Was it just low blood sugar talking, or drugs, or eating disorder, or stress over his recent visit with his father and whatever transpired there? It could be worth pursuing this at another time when you're both calmed down.

Remember sometimes as the strong parent we take the brunt of their angst about the divorce as they're afraid to vent on the absent parent.

Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860171
08/05/19 04:45 PM
08/05/19 04:45 PM
Joined: Jan 2003
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kml Offline
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(Or was he just grumbling in an ordinary teen kvetching way and it set you off because of the resemblance to his father?)

Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860178
08/05/19 05:11 PM
08/05/19 05:11 PM
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DnJ Online
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Good Morning bttrfly

I feel for you. Son and his shenanigans. Know it’s ok. And as Andrew pointed he knows where your buttons are.

He isn’t mad about the chocolate chips; he doesn’t really know why he’s mad. It is just an excuse.

Son needs to push you. To see if you bend, break, or stand strong. I didn’t see this when my first boy was going through this and becoming a man. I think I missed (some) of it again with my second son as well. smile

Kids need to know their parents, or parent, will be fine without them. Ah, that egocentric attitude. I learnt the importance of projecting, and being, strong and stable.

I would also say son is looking to move out, and has been thinking about it. A very reasonable and necessary thing for him to do. He has been trying to figure out how to tell you. My goodness imagine if he could just push passed his fear and just talk to you. That is even hard for us, and we have many years of experience behind us. He is just gaining his experience.

Adulting is hard. Remember back in childhood, a lot less knowledge, a lot more naive, a lot less fear. If you liked someone you’d just tell them, and if they hit you, they really liked you. Ha. You’d wear your heart on your sleeve, something much easier to do when it hasn’t been broken. We could be so open and free. Growing up we loose that, and find it again later - well more or less - sans hitting.

Son is growing up, and has also been hurt. He doesn’t need to hear how much you’ll miss him, he knows. And he is going to miss you. He needs, and wants, to hear everything will be fine. Of course he is going about it like an adolescent, irrationally. The very thing this is all based upon - emotions and feelings.

So he pushes. He lashes out. Gets you and him angry, so he can let you know his intentions; and see what your reactions are. It’s weird, ... or maybe not so much. In an emotional state, like angry, a person usually shows more of who they truly are, and what they think. Now that last part isn’t actually true, it is how it is perceived. We actually show more of what we feel - however most people do not separate, or have never been exposed to a need to separate, their feeling from their thoughts and beliefs.

Consider this, we all realize that lying and deception requires intellect and thought - control of you and the situation so as to craft a convincing tale to blind the other person. I am talk the well-crafted untruth, not an emotional “nah I didn’t do it”. So with that, we can believe that emotionally one cannot keep their lie straight and the truth will emerge.

Kids are just double checking what we said is the truth. In a most aggravating way. Seriously! - Chocolate chips. Been there bttrfly. So many times.

And something else with the dance between you and son - he is leading it. He is making his nest dirty. Easier to leave. He is purposefully causing strife so as to allow each of you to let go. My second son during one of our heated discussions, I told him “He is making it difficult from me to miss him when he is gone”. He then told me “That’s point. That is what I’m after. That’s how it should be.” He was emotional, and blurted out his hidden feelings.

Oh the fights me and my kids have had. And they all love me and care about me. And have grown into loving, kind, and caring young adults. Well, D17 is still working on that. smile S18 is pretty well along.

Letting son know in such emphatically demonstrative terms is ok. It’s not like he doesn’t know those words. And do take the current era we are living in, everything is accentuated with F. He and you are adjusting your relationship from child / parent to adult / adult. Of course he will always be your son and baby; something that takes a bit of time to figure a way to reconcile within one’s self as our child let’s go the apron string. It’s difficult and sad to watch them eagerly step away from us. And then becomes such a wonder to witness their growth and their return.

Originally Posted by bttrfly
No mother of the year awards coming my way...

I think you did excellent.

Next time, and there will be, don’t sweat the small stuff, and don’t swear. You blew up, which is good. Next time gently guiding the dance he is leading will gain so much.

Mother - the first girl we love.

Don’t beat yourself up Mom. You did fine and are more deserving of Mom of the Year than you realize.

DnJ


Oct 8/17 - BD
Me49 W46 S20 S19 S16 D15
M26 T29
w/OM, Left Kids
Dec 9/17 - Legal Separation
Oct 3/18 - W Files
Apr 6/19 - Divorced
Current
Me51 XW48 S22 S21 S18 D17

I may give up, but not today.
Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860256
08/06/19 03:20 AM
08/06/19 03:20 AM
Joined: Jun 2015
Posts: 2,885
Massachusetts
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bttrfly Offline OP
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hi Job and thanks. Yes, felt good to do something nice and different for myself. Really did!
Thanks DnJ, Ellie and Andrew ... thanks for the Canadian bear hug. I appreciate it. Son was very nice to me last night when I came home not feeling well. He checked on me and asked me if I needed anything a couple of times so I know he does care.

Today was a strange day. Friend and I texted back and forth as we usually do. He's going to a concert tonight and had several hours to kill before the show. We'd talked about going together but at the time the tix went on sale there was a lot of money flying out because of the house and $120 was too much for my budget (that was the lowest ticket price - Bryan Ferry, whom I love and would have really enjoyed seeing, but didn't feel I could justify that ticket price with the new house and the vacation and the car engine blowing up). Anyway I'd suggested to him last night when we talked on the phone that we have dinner together, but he thought that was a bad idea because then I'd have to go home and he'd have to go to the show alone. So crap day at work - my co-worker quit very spontaneously- at the end of the day I texted friend and turns out he was coming to the town I work in (hmm...) and would be about 10 minutes from the office. We decided to have a quick dinner which was lovely. We both really seemed to enjoy each other's company and then he asked about son, and then son called - twice - and was furious that he came home and I wasn't on the way and we weren't going to have dinner together. Initially I thought son was pissed about having to feed himself, but the more I think about it I think he's upset that I'm not having dinner with him. Hmm. Interesting.

anyway, friend and I parted and we definitely both hugged a bit longer than usual. Hmmm. also interesting. He seemed bummed out after we talked about my son possibly moving or not and also something that he's dealing with which isn't pleasant. I feel like he's concerned about adding more to my plate.

On the drive home I called son, to find out what was really going on. he'd had a very bad day at work. He says I "just went to my room" once he turned 13. I said no, I drove you to all your activities, never missed any and thoroughly enjoyed watching him participate in all of them. I reminded him that he went through a phase where he didn't want to eat my cooking and always wanted to eat out. I wouldn't indulge him all the time but definitely did more than I should have. I forced the issue to keep talking and told him that clearly he feels that I abandoned him and we need to talk about that. He said that since I don't agree there's no point. I countered with it's your perception that matters, and if you believe that then that's truth and we will talk about this. if Ive fallen down on the job as his parent I want to know how so I can correct it and not do so in the future. I also apologized for making him feel that way but then I also called him on his crap and let him know that his passive aggressive comments were not welcome. at all. and the attitude was also not welcome, but I'm not going anywhere so we were going to work this out. He is still threatening to move on my birthday. Doesn't have a place to go. I did what my therapist told me to do a month ago: I told him exactly what was going on for me when exh left. That I was barely keeping it together, my world had blown apart. I didn't know what to do, had to be strong for him and try to save our family. He was always fed, he always had the basics, but there would come a point where I couldn't hold it in any longer so I would go to my room and sob into my pillow so he wouldn't hear me crying. I apologized for not being able to keep our family together and said there was only one person who could have done that and he didn't want to. I've never thrown exh under the bus. I kind of feel like I did by saying that but you know what? it's the freaking truth, and son knows it.

Things were better when I got home, but my phone rang as I was going out to buy him something at the grocery store and he started being mean again. I told my friend I'd call back and said to son, "I know you think I want you to move out. I don't. What I want is for your attitude to move out, and for you to stop talking to me and treating me this way. I don't like it and it needs to stop now. Then I left, texted him a photo of the bread he wanted to make sure it was the right one and got a small bit of attitude when I came home. Ugh. But it was a bit better.

My son actually told me my chicken was dry!! That was the first thing I ever cooked for his father who always praised my chicken as being moist, tender and delicious. I was so distraught I actually called exh to ask him if my chicken is dry!!! I'm out of my mind.

Exh hasn't called back yet, for those wondering at home but I've been reassured by a close friend that my chicken is delicious.

Feh


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


“Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.” - Rumi
Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860416
08/07/19 01:17 AM
08/07/19 01:17 AM
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Posts: 4,003
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Ginger1 Online
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I’ve been reading and I just want to throw a bunch of hugs out there . I can empathize with trying to be the best parent you can be while making silent sacrifices through the hardest of times that they will never see. And to hear what he had to say must have been so hard and I just feel for you.

I cook and I cook good. My daughter however is the pickiest eater and always has a comment. It drives me nuts!

I just want you to know I get it. The frustration, the bein the only one.....

And by the way, your friend totally loves you. I know it.

And about your hair..... I have thin curly hair too that I’ve battled all my life. I had it long for years and blew it out straight and I recently decided to embrace the curl and got a special cut and use a special method. It’s actually short , but woah!ool up the curly girl method. It is such a game changer for people with curly hair! You will never believe your hair is capable of this! I wow’d so many people. And you will continue to wow your “friend”!

Re: These Old Shades [Re: bttrfly] #2860442
08/07/19 09:40 AM
08/07/19 09:40 AM
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Posts: 2,885
Massachusetts
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bttrfly Offline OP
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{{{{{ Ginger!! }}}}}

I KNOW you get it, and man, am I tired. That's why I've been up since 3:30. Son is also up. frown although we haven't acknowledged to each other that we are each awake.

Realization re: son - I'm tired because I'm trying to be both mom and dad and have been for years. Time to stop that. I'm not being a good mom or a good dad by trying to be both, so ... I will focus on being the best mom I can be today. That's all I can do. It's not my job or my place to be both parents. REALLY. hard decision to come to, but I think ultimately it's the best choice, to focus on being a good mom.

I must be doing something right because son asked what was for dinner, suggested Chinese from our favorite restaurant (45 min to an hour one way away) and said he would contribute financially to the meal and also join me on the drive as he wanted to eat it at home.

Whaaat? A chance to be in the car with son for minimally 90 minutes if the traffic was light? YES!

But omg, I cannot eat Chinese any more. I didn't make the wisest choice, and my stomach isn't happy with all the grease. No great revelations during the drive, but that's ok. Was more about spending time together I think.

Originally Posted by Ginger1
And by the way, your friend totally loves you. I know it.


Well, last year he said in a very odd tone that he and his son really like me a lot, for what that's worth. I had the feeling at the time that he meant more, and was carefully phrasing it and including son in an effort not to scare me off. Of course, me being me, it made me happy but also did scare me because I wasn't sure how I felt at the time and now there's a kid involved who I don't want to ever hurt.

He's also said a few times, 'you're not ready" or 'it's too soon for you now' but he hasn't said that since last year. We've talked about my grieving for Dad and now dealing with Mom and the two properties, and son. It's a lot. It's real life stuff, as he says.

Anyone who thinks parenting ends when their kids turn 18 has some surprises in store.

I guess from his perspective the question might be when's good timing to ask someone in my position out on a date. That's off putting enough for someone who doesn't have the history of being a LBS. As he is someone who was a LBS, I get his hesitation.

Here's where I am with that today: Finished my 4th step. Going to do a 5th tonight with my counselor to get rid of it all. Clean slate. Then I guess we'll see? I won't see him for maybe two weeks, but we text all the time.

My hairdresser keeps using Deva Curl on my hair. It looks good when he does it but on the most hot and humid days we had not too long ago it turned my mane into a rat's nest. Usually I let my hair dry naturally. I've found the best hair product for me is Morroccan Oil's intensive hair mask as a leave in. Soft, beautiful curls and no frizz. In the late fall/winter, I blow it out straight. because I can't stand wet hair in the freezing cold. I've pretty much stopped shampoo except for once or twice a week and it's the low poo variety.

It's 5:39 I'm going to try to nap for a little bit before facing the day. xoxoxo Ginger xoxoxo


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


“Your task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.” - Rumi
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