Looks like you are starting to see a few positive signs from H. That's a good thing, in any situation in life, if there's improvement over deterioration, it deserves to be acknowledged.
You are right to have feelings of anger and resentment. I think it's important to feel those things, but not let them consume oneself. It's a narrow balance to maintain - part of us wants to retaliate, another part wants nothing to do with the other person, and yet another part wants to put the past in the past and look to a better future.
Where you go from here is up to you, as it is for all of us LBSs.
I'm nowhere near piecing, but I would tend to think that you might start it by rereading your last paragraph in the post above and later, once he has shown a willingness to continue with his own improvement and if you so choose, finding a way to communicate that to your H.
Alison - Your emotional awareness of what is going on inside of you is remarkable. I don't really have any advice I just wanted to say I admire your equanimity in the face of a really really difficult situation.
Hang in there, sometime sitting still and doing nothing is exactly the right thing to do while you let thoughts and emotions settle.
How can your H possibly show you? I have no idea. Being on the other side, I don’t know how to show it to my W either.
Just some thoughts... frankly the ball is not in your court. Relationships are not tennis matches.
I abused my husband emotionally and verbally. He moved out 4 months ago. In my case I was depressed which drove a lot of my behavior. I didn't know how bad it was until it was gone. I sought ADs after he left not realizing it would change my life for the better.
He's gone dark but because of kids I can show my changes to him without seeing him. We do text about the kids in a business like manner. At first I was manipulative and he could tell by the words I chose. I couldn't hide it because it wasn't sincere. Over time I started to heal and I don't know I just no longer have the need to manipulate or control. These days I don't expect a response from him, I'm not upset when he ignores me, I can now take the "I'm angry at you" texts without making excuses or trying to talk him out of his feelings. When he pointed out my bad behavior (recently) I thanked him for pointing it out to me and said I would fix it (I was sincere). I'm not completely sure what he wants but I am fixing it to the best of my ability. When I see him (rare) I do ask to R but when he says no I don't push.
I've got to work now but I will write more later. Oh and on the tennis ball thing I read that in cases like this it is the abuser that has the ball. Took me a bit to let that sink in but I get it now. He left solely because I was an abuser. He didn't rush off to file which means the ball is in MY court. He's not doing anything hastily either which means I've got time. BTW I'm 4 months out and I am NOT healthy enough to reconcile. I've come a long way yes but it's too soon and i know it/he knows it. As much as I hate to say this I'll probably need a year. Not full on NC for a year just not not making any major decisions until that year is up.
Kass, I just wanted to acknowledge your post properly. I am sure that a lot of the problems in my marriage stem from a period nearly five years ago when I had very severe PND. I didn't believe I was sick and refused to get treatment for over a year, and in that year made my H's life a misery. I wasn't violent and I wasn't unfaithful, but my behaviour was appalling. I was ill and it wasn't my fault I was will. I wish I'd sought treatment earlier, but part of the illness is not really knowing you are ill. I know it made him scared of me, and feel out of control and helpless, and he felt unable to leave or set boundaries around my behaviour (because, as he said, what kind of man leaves a woman with PND?) and I'm at the stage now where I can look back on that time, and the effects it caused in me, for my H and on my marriage with compassion and regret but not with guilt. I wish you well. Your honesty is really inspiring. If your H is anything like mine, there's a huge amount of fear underneath everything else.
Alison - Your emotional awareness of what is going on inside of you is remarkable. I don't really have any advice I just wanted to say I admire your equanimity in the face of a really really difficult situation.
Hang in there, sometime sitting still and doing nothing is exactly the right thing to do while you let thoughts and emotions settle.
Thank you so much unchien. I feel pretty settled and calm most of the time - I have all the same feelings, but I am watching them rather than acting out of them for the time being. It's a better place to be. I find it much easier to maintain that sense of calm and detachment when I am not around my H. When I am with him, I do feel myself getting more anxious, defensive, upset, needy etc - all the bad stuff - and acting out of that rather than acting out of a steadier place. That's how I know I am not ready for piecing. I like myself better when I am not around him. It's sad, and it might change in time, but for now that is how it is.
I know you weren't asking for suggestions, but just in case this is helpful to you - what I have found useful to help me get steady is 1. going dark as much as is practically possible (we do still actually talk a lot about childcare logistics and the kids, which is fine - and these past couple of weeks I listen when he wants to tell me about himself, but I don't tend to join in). 2. meditation 3. walking.
When I am with him, I do feel myself getting more anxious, defensive, upset, needy etc - all the bad stuff - and acting out of that rather than acting out of a steadier place. That's how I know I am not ready for piecing
I would say that is a good sign you are not ready.
Originally Posted by AlisonUK
I know you weren't asking for suggestions, but just in case this is helpful to you - what I have found useful to help me get steady is 1. going dark as much as is practically possible (we do still actually talk a lot about childcare logistics and the kids, which is fine - and these past couple of weeks I listen when he wants to tell me about himself, but I don't tend to join in). 2. meditation 3. walking.
Alison - Steadiness is my goal, and I'm glad to hear I am following a similar path because I can tell from your posts you are reaching a nice balance.
#1 - I am doing something similar, probably not to the degree you are. We still have weekly MC and a 1:1 phone call to cover logistics and the kids (with a pre-set agenda). There are flare-ups from time to time, but the frequency has reduced. I feel like I struggle more with detaching from the dream of nuclear family life than from my W. Kid handoffs are still a little weird, we both fall into old patterns of friendliness sometimes which feels awkward.
#2 - After probably 7 years of periodically dabbling, but never seriously, for the last 10 days or so meditation is finally clicking for me. It is incredible. The phone app has helped me a ton because it has so many options to try. It really has helped ease me in and experiment with what works (instead of just trying to sit quiet and focus on breathing, which I think is a really hard way to enter into meditation for a newbie).
#3 - I work at a beautiful campus, and every day includes an after-lunch walk. That and I am exercising like a maniac (which helps with sleep issues).
I am also an avid podcast consumer. But I switched from relationship and divorce podcasts over to different ones recommended primarily by Maika. Many of these touch on emotional awareness and relationships, but sometimes they are just great motivation to get up and attack life head-on day by day. Taking that energy and re-focusing it in a positive direction helps a lot.
What doesn't work for me: Ruminating, reading too many books or articles, spending too much time on DB forums, wallowing, worrying about the future, whether I will reconcile or find somebody else, sitting on my couch, etc.
Alison - it seems to me that you really want to get some assurance that your H has made substantive changes and that is eminently reasonable. He's presumably only a bloke so his mind is racing round in circles trying to convince you of something. He will be wasting loads of emotional energy. If you give him a clue he can focus his attentions more selectively and you can speed up the process for both of you. Let him know you are monitoring and that you are looking for the same light at the end of the tunnel( if you are? ). Don't give him a list of objectives - that is for him to work out.
This process is hard for both of you. Don't make it any harder than it needs to be
Now divorced, boys grown up. Now in new failed relationship( never again, please )
Update. Well, we've continued to talk and spend a bit more time together - I let him instigate that. It feels easier than it did and I feel less needy and anxious in his company. There are misunderstandings sometimes. I think he's as tentative and as scared as I am, though sometimes it looks to me like it is reluctance or resentment - so I have a hard time not reading the worst into his feelings, and he into mine. We've talked through a couple of those moments together fairly well though there's not so much R talk. The sadness I feel is still there, but not as strong as it used to be. There are bitter sweet moments, where sometimes I forget (especially if he is affectionate with me) but then I remember and want to draw back. He talks to me a little about his therapy. I am careful not to offer advice or opinions. He looks healthier and healthier - he is clearly taking much better care of himself and it seems the drinking habits I was getting worried about seem to have changed.
I really thought we were heading in the right direction, and were starting to have some talks about what I would need and what he would need to take things further - when I found out that he's only able to stay at the place he is renting until November. I didn't know that. Now I am thinking that perhaps he's just trying to get onto my good side because it suits him better to be at home than look for somewhere else to live. He has the money and ability to find somewhere else in the short term, and in the long term a divorce would lower both our standards of living slightly but not significantly, so I am not sure how much of an influence that really is on him or if it's just my insecurities showing. I notice him paying lots of special attention to the children and things between him and Eldest are 100% better. There are still flash points occasionally (usually caused by Eldest being pretty difficult - as would be normal for a boy his age) but H seems to deal much better with them - he is firm but not abusive, belittling or sarcastic. It's been a good while since he's behaved in a way I'd consider to be abusive. At times he is very tender and loving with me. Eldest is still in therapy and seems much calmer and more settled.
The difficulty is in me, I think. I do love him, but I look at him and see the terrible things he's said and done to me. The way his temper frightened me and made him utterly unreachable - he became a man that could not be reasoned with and was not capable of civility. That really wasn't so long ago. Father's Day (which is mid June here in the UK) I had to call him a taxi and throw him out of my home because his behaviour was so incoherent and unacceptable. That's only two months ago - and while he's consistently behaved much much better than that in recent times, I have no idea how he would behave under the normal stress and strain of family life, poorly behaved teenagers, trouble at work, illness - all the normal stuff that a marriage needs to bear. I don't feel afraid of him now because I have my own space and control over when and how I see him. But I can't really imagine how I could trust him again now I've seen what he's capable of. I don't expect perfection and he's doing and saying all the right things but neither of us can change the past and growing trust again is very slow.
Originally Posted by Family Man
If you give him a clue he can focus his attentions more selectively and you can speed up the process for both of you. Let him know you are monitoring and that you are looking for the same light at the end of the tunnel( if you are? ). Don't give him a list of objectives - that is for him to work out.
Thank you for this Family Man. Could you give me some suggestions as to the kind of thing you mean? I guess if I was going to come out and ask for specifics, I would say 1. he needs to go to IC, 2. he needs to see his doctor for stress / depression and do whatever his doctor suggests 3. he needs to have no contact at all with EA woman 4. he needs to concentrate his attention on repairing the relationship with his children 5. he needs to communicate with me openly and honestly without blaming me or using verbally abusing or belittling language. And he is doing all of these things - I mean, he could be lying about 1, 2 and 3 but because I am witnessing such clear changes on 4 and 5 I don't think he is. I am not sure what else I could ask for that would make me feel better. Only time, I suppose.
Alison, be very, very careful. I don't see anything different this time than all the other times he's turned on the "mister nice guy" routine to try and pull you in again. Expect the abuse cycle to continue to repeat. He needs to do a lot of hard work before he'll be able to be in a serious R again.
What I see is your torment. At the moment you are not even sure that you want a R with this man in the future. You are asking what things you should look for in order for you to persuade yourself that you should go for it.
Nobody can answer that. You have to feel it, know it and live it. Everything that you have posted says that you are not ready to begin piecing if it is on the table.
It's far too soon to talk about whether his changes are permanent. You know that; hence the torment.
You need time. Are you worried that this is a once only chance and if you don't grab it he will get pi**ed off?
If he's not prepared to give you ALL the time you need then that's your answer about permanent changes.
There's no need to force any time scale. Continue to be kind and true to yourself and sit back and see what ensues.
