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Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 #2843309
03/25/19 05:20 PM
03/25/19 05:20 PM
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Pax_luv Offline OP
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Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2843315
03/25/19 05:38 PM
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Pax_luv Offline OP
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OneArt,
Thanks for the reply on my last thread. This is the second time heís been sanctioned and yep the judge has gotten wise to the antics. Thank goodness.


So, just a personal reflection...
Iíve spent the last close to 4 years becoming a woman only a fool would leave. I think Iíve done a pretty good job thus far but know I will always be a work in progress.

One of the things Iím not skilled at is keeping a balanced life. I find it hard to have work, gym, friends, extracurriculars etc all balanced. So, Iím someone who focuses on certain buckets for weeks at a time. But I end up stressing myself out since I canít keep all slices of the pie the same. For example, Iíll spend time focusing on the gym and then get stressed out because Iím not focusing on my social life, so then I redirect attention and then the gym goes by the wayside. I know thereís things I could do better to balance it out. 100% I know itís me, but itís something Iím working on.


With that I have been wanting to go back to school for a while now. I just canít decide if I want a PhD or a masters in a different field. I like school and I wouldnít mind going back... I canít afford it right now, I would have to get a loan.... but Iím wasting my time. Notice the direct contradiction of what I stated above!!!

Anyway, i know if I go to school, other parts of my life will go by the wayside. And...... another big thing that I have not prioritized is dating. I want a baby daddy eventually because Iím not getting younger and my eggs are drying up by the second, but I havenít made it a priority to go out and meet anyone.

So what does this mean? I need to be better at balancing and I need to put myself out there. I think even if Iím interested in someone, I still owe it to myself to date multiple people just to understand whatís really out there. I donít dislike dating, I just havenít prioritized it.

Ok, so thatís a bunch of ramblings that make no sense. I guess at the end of the day, this is all a blessing to have too many good things to keep integrated into a balanced life.

So with that... what do you think is the best dating app for a busy professional, who is old fashioned, and wants to avoid creepers?


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2843364
03/26/19 12:04 AM
03/26/19 12:04 AM
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You're young so whatever apps the young people are using would be beneficial - doubt eHarmony would be good for someone your age for instance.

I've used OkCupid with halfway decent results (I say halfway because I've dated several guys who I really enjoyed but all have been flawed - still, that may be a function of my age, lol, being in my 60's now).

As for life balance - is there a sporting activity you enjoy that is also social and involves men? That might kill 3 birds with one stone, no? I'm thinking a bicycling group, or salsa dancing, or rock climbing (or hey, if you live in/near a snowy climate, cross-country skiing - the men are buff and non-pretentious and when I tried it years ago, the ratio of men to women was super high!) Check out meetup.com for ideas?

As for grad school - be very clear on your reasons for wanting to go back. Will it significantly enhance your job satisfaction? Will it pay off in terms of dollars and cents?

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2843956
03/31/19 03:02 AM
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Pax_luv Offline OP
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Hey KML, thanks for the suggestions.
I still havenít pulled the trigger on the OLD. For some reason, Iíve become very untrusting of the sites and people on them. . I know itís me and I should just do it. I used match a couple years ago (1yr post split and had good interactions). Sadly I just canít afford it right now! I think my hesitation is just some more residual stuff from my sitch, but trust Iím ready to push through.

So itís another riveting night at the house oí Pax. It was an absolutely gorgeous day today and I was able to spend some time outdoors. It was nice.

I decided to spend the rest of the afternoon cleaning up my closet and putting the winter stuff away. I have wayyyyy too much crap/ clothes. I need to get rid of at least 50% of my belongings and even then, I know Iíd still have a ton of clothes. I have a medium size apartment that has a walk in closet. Itís not huge by any means but it is filled to the brim with stuff. In addition to clothes and shoes, it has my various size backpacks, purses, luggage, sleeping bags, etc. And that does not bring me joy! Iím all about the kon Mari and I know that clutter blocks my good energy! I need to pull the trigger there as well to overhaul the wardrobe. The thing is, I actually do wear a lot of clothes. For work, I mostly wear suiting, which is just a lot of pieces. I have a lot of blazers and they are heavy and take up a lot of room. Then, I have my workout clothes. I have a lot of work out clothes!! Itís needed when you do 2-a-days. Then I have my lounge clothes for when Iím vegging at home. Then I have my weekend clothes which is also lounge clothes that I donít mind wearing in public, jeans, or sundresses, etc and the occasional ďgoing outĒ attire and cocktail dresses for my after hour events. Bleh. Itís too much.

Iíve toyed with the idea of getting rid of all my pants and blouses so I could just get by wearing dresses and blazers. It doesnít get too cold in the winter here and I usually can make do with knee high boots and trench coats to keep warm. But as I look at some of my outfits, I realize that i do like them and I want to keep them. Bla bla bla.

Anyway...if your eyes arenít bleeding yet from reading that nonsense.... itís just all part of the journey of recreating a life that brings us lbsís true joy and peace and meaning in the long run.


In addition to the very important apparel musings... Iíve also been sorting out some upcoming trips. Iím super excited to be invited back on a medical mission in the fall. Iím very much looking forward to that. Also my bestie just invited me to join her on her trip to Maui in the summer. She has a time share and will have a room going completely unused so she offered it up to me. I would just have to fork up the air faire. I would love to make it happen. I have 13 weeks of vacation on the books that I should definitely use! Just hoping my financials are in a better place by summer.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2844123
04/01/19 04:42 PM
04/01/19 04:42 PM
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My Monday is starting off with a great chuckle courtesy of ex.

Many years ago when this all started, I went to a psychic (ok multiple psychics- donít judge), because I would do ANYTHING to get a better grasp on my situation. I was spinning and going crazy because I hadnít learned about this ďstuffĒ nor have I ever dealed with such severe gaslighting. Iím recalling one night where I was just so distraut over everything that was happening and my ex is telling me that i broke his heart. (uhhhhh come again? I broke your heart... what exactly did I do again?? He was the one who was chasing his happiness and throwing out ultimatums left and right).

I digress.

Anyway, i met with one psychic and she knew nothing about me or why I was there. Right off the bat, she said she could tell that one person was bringing me a lot of sadness. I said yes. She said, heís older than me but Iím the more mature one. She said he was emotionally very immature and he was going to be this way for a long time. After we discussed what actually was going on, she said he would grow up eventually but it wouldnít be for a really really long time. Years and years.

Back to today- I was doing my normal dog swap and there were two ladies (possibly a mother daughter pair, but both grown women) were leaving the property at the same time. Whether they were leaving from my house or the rental flat, I donít know nor care.

Normally I leave my dog off leash and he goes up to the door to go inside. But since these two ladies were out, i put on his leash to keep him close by should he choose to run up to the ladies.

So, the dog walks up to the door and Iím bending down to get him unhooked but he just runs inside. I was like, dog let me unhook you, but too late. The dog ran inside and ex shut the door on me. Well, itís a retractable leash. So I can hear the dog pulling away from the other side of the door while the leash handle is still in my hand.

Iím thinking like, really ex, you canít just open the door and take the leash???? Whatever!! So I put the leash down and walk away thinking what a child!!!

So, I get to my car, and I hear the door open with the leash quickly retracting back to the handle. It hits the tile with a loud crash. I turn around and see ex quickly door shuts and the leash is just sitting there now on the stoop.

He really is a juvenile. What great lengths he must go to in order to avoid me. Whatever. Reminds me of the time we ended up at the vets office at the same time and he wouldnít take off his sunglasses indoors so he didnít have to make eye contact. He also stood as far away from me as humanly possible. That sure must take some effort.


Oh well. I keep picturing it like a cartoon scenario! It was really funny and rediculous from my vantage point. #manchild


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2844126
04/01/19 04:56 PM
04/01/19 04:56 PM
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I swear Pax, I know mine is a real gem, but yours really takes the cake. How can there still be so much hostility? I suppose it likely relates to his unsuccessful court efforts but still. I constantly remind myself that the opposite of love is indifference, and when they still have so much hate, they are the ones that are having problems letting go.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2844288
04/02/19 10:53 PM
04/02/19 10:53 PM
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Sounds like heís instigating and trying to get a reaction out of you. Your shows of indifference bother him cause he thrives on conflict. So keep up the good work! Itís about him not about you. I started reading a very quick book called the Four Agreements thatís from the Barnes and Noble spiritual section and one of the agreements is ďdonít take anything personallyĒ cause itís not about you. Sorry you are going through this.


M: 42
H: 43
Twins age 5
WAH in summer
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2844782
04/07/19 04:09 PM
04/07/19 04:09 PM
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Hi Pax - eye roll on that leash story. So silly.

Sounds like you are doing well. Keep going!


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2845317
04/12/19 06:51 AM
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One, juju, and hawho. Thanks for the replies. Good to hear from you.

Sadly... The man is so far out of orbit, there just arenít any words.

Itís a little late over here and I canít sleep. I have a little bit of excitement I think. Weíre finalizing up the details of the next medical mission and Iím just really looking forward to the volunteer experience.

I was thinking about where my heart and mind were during the last time I went on this mission trip (2 years ago) and it blows my mind how much people can and do change over time. I say it on here all the time, but once youíve been hanging out here for a few years while doing the work, it is nice to take a look in the rear view mirror and see how far youíve come.

While I was reflecting, I had a slight panic because I thought I missed my divorce anniversary and just didnít remember it at all. Haha. That was awesome! Itís actually a few more weeks away. Yep... Iím at the 1 year mark, and yet I still donít have the judgement because their side never submitted it (its since been ordered by the court) and i still donít have a settlement. Itís almost comical the s-show this has become. At least Iím at a place (right now) where I can sit back with some popcorn while watching this crazy story continue to unfold.

Been a quiet week legal-wise. The last week had a lot of stuff going about. The accountants have dug deep enough and are now uncovering a ton of info. It leads to more questions than answers, and definitely puts ex in the hot seat. He has some explaining to do.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2845498
04/13/19 11:03 PM
04/13/19 11:03 PM
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Itís so crazy what gets uncovered. The worst projectors are the ones with the biggest secrets. I went through 5 years of cc statements and 3 years of bank withdrawals and discovered alcoholism and a most likely very expensive drug habit he was keeping secret. I stopped seeking, when my lawyer bills got too expensive and I assumed he had nothing to warrant the legal cost of it was being spent on drugs, but a part of me worried ďwhat if he was hiding money from me for 3 years and not spending it on drugs?

Anyway, it sounds like his amo was a strong offense cause he has so much to be defensive over. I hope things work out as well as they can for you.


M: 42
H: 43
Twins age 5
WAH in summer
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2845992
04/18/19 06:45 PM
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Juju, Iíve followed your story for a while and yeah itís crazy how much gets uncovered. Iíve always wanted to let you know how much I empathize with what youíve gone through.

Itís maddening how my ex did so much scheming up to bd. So much financial infidelity. And yet.... I came out as the terrible wife who he needed to divorce after the years and years of me walking on egg shells around him. My whole life was tuned upside down and he walks away scot free. So maddening. I couldnít even imagine going through it with a child.


Anyway...
Wanted to pop in with a fun dB reminder.

I had a meeting this morning with the man who drives me crazy at work. Heís belittling and dismissive. Just awful. I was dreading this meeting and I knew it was going to be a doozy because we had a lot to catch up on and I knew exactly what items he was going to rant about. Anyway, I was preparing myself to set a boundary and was prepared to speak up for me and my assistant because he treats up both like weíre not even human.

Anyway, as I was preparing for the meeting, I told myself that I was going to ďact as ifĒ instead. I decided to be happy and super upbeat and even light hearted. I thought I could kill him with kindness.

And it worked!!! The condescension was replaced with kindness and appreciation. At the end of the meeting, he even took the time to gossip about corporate politics. Mmhmmmm not that I wanted to hear any of it...and it was so typical of him to talk poorly about others. But I acted as if... got on his good side.... and now I can go through the rest of my day feeling ok.

Iíll take it.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2846840
04/25/19 08:09 PM
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Hi, just a quick nonsensical check in...

Iíve had a few bouts of anger towards ex over the last week... which is good! I havenít really been able to conjure up that emotion and just feel furious about the situation. It means Iím processing and Iím happy with that component! The crappy thing is, when Iím angry, I cry so Iíve had some tears. Grrr.

You know the deal.... as the lbs, I spent so much time in fix it-walk-on-egg shells-mode with ex, , then I had the fear of the future, then the sadness of the marriage breakdown, then the grief over the marital death, then the remorse for things I could have done differently, then the uneasiness, worry, and trepidation over the legal stuff... and finally Iíve landed at anger.

Maybe I am in victim mode, but I hate him for putting me in this position and subsequently keeping me here by lagging and lying on all the paperwork. I despise him for everything he has done to me financially since the marriage began. It really was all a sham. I then get mad at myself for knowing better.... knowing he was capable of this... and still going forward with the marriage.

Iím angry that I did all the effort to make the marriage work and he still left me... he blamed me for being the reason he left, blamed me for all his actions. I know 10000% that blame is misplaced and itís a form of torturous gaslighting, but I knew what I was getting in to with him. Stupid stupid girl. Even when his own family told me I was a saint for putting up with him..... Iím still the evil one here.


And even with all of that... Iím angry that we didnít work on the marriage together. Iím angry I didnít have a partner. Now, donít get me wrong.... I know we were set up to fail from the get go, but Iíd like to pretend that even if it wasnít a normal marriage, we could have worked on things like a normal couple. But nope, I was robbed of that as well.


Iíve been dealing with this for 4 years. 4 years! I canít do it anymore. I want to move on, but Iím stuck. I have ptsd, Iím not very trusting. As much as I actually do want a partner and I want to be married.... I donít. Iím not confident that Iím going to find that partner that will let me know itís ok to let my guard down.

Iíve been in this hyper vigilance mode for so long, I canít even remember what itís like to not be in that state.

Donít get me wrong, Iím not walking around with a chip on my shoulder and Iím not this bitter woman who hates men.. I think Iíve just been burned very badly and Iím lacking significant amounts of trust.


So with that, I have no problem taking control of my future (minus the financial implications), so Iíve been doing my research for my next steps. Iíve mentioned going back to school so Iíve spoken with counselors, had a informal meeting with someone in my industry who has his phd etc. Ive been planning out my next physical pursuits and some classes I want to take (Iíve always wanted to learn to play tennis and play the piano) and get better at Spanish.

I have a plan to keep filling my own bucket, but I recognize thereís a void where an intimate partner should be and Iím not convinced Iím up for that right now.... even though I do want it. Itís a crappy place to be in.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2846868
04/26/19 12:36 AM
04/26/19 12:36 AM
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so. much. yes.
I get it dear pax. remember, this too shall pass, right? let's hope so anyway for both our sakes xoxoxo


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2847372
04/29/19 08:59 PM
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Oh yes, dear bttrfly, this too shall pass. Hopefully sooner rather than later. 4 years is a long time. I do like actually getting to the anger stage... I feel like I bypassed it early on. Time to rage on!!! Just kidding. Not my style.

Just having my lunch time salad and popping in with more nonsensical Monday musings-

I was watching a movie last night before bed.. It was a movie I saw in the theatre on a date a long time ago. I recalled the experience and thought to myself- holy cow, so much has happened since ex and I split. There really has been a substantial amount of life in those years post bd. Ahh reflecting is good.

Which got me to thinking about this-
My cousin is getting married in June. I have to turn in my rsvp card this week. She intentionally had a really long engsgemrnt... like 2.5 years. When she first started planning she was concerned about who was going to make the cut on the invite list. (We have a big family). Anyway, I told her that she needs to include me and a plus one because Iíll be remarried by then. I said so half-jokingly, because it seemed sooooooo far off and I felt equipped to be married again by now. Hahaha. About 6 months ago, she reminded me that I wasnít married and we still had faith that I could be in a relationship by now. Cringe.


Aye aye aye. I laugh at it now because this degree of healing, learning, and growing is an insanely long process. Too long! Anyway, she still wants me to use the plus one but I have nobody.... and that makes me a little bit sad.

Which leads me to this....
I need to get comfortable with casual dating. Itís just not my jam. I was ok doing the online thing a bit ago, but as I mentioned before I donít have it in me. No trust.

But Iím dying- dying-dying for some cuddle time or hand holding or butt holding or something! Not talking about sex per se, but just affection. Itís been a really long time. In real life Iím not a clinger at all, but I kind of want to be clingy! That sounds terrible.

My ex wasnít affectionate with me. He hated hugs. If I was a little flirty trying to get him to acknowledge me, he would say- ďwhatís the matter? Are you not getting enough attention or something?Ē Yesssssss I was starved for attention!

I havenít dated in over a year... itís time. I feel like itís the only way I can help things along. Iím just afraid of whatís out there. And Iím afraid of stds... thatís a whole different element, but it crosses my mind. So many hurdles.

Ok, musings over... looking forward to kicking off May, where Iíll have some more court dates in the month to move things along.

Hope you have a wonderful week.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2847378
04/29/19 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Pax_luv
But Iím dying- dying-dying for some cuddle time or hand holding or butt holding or something! Not talking about sex per se, but just affection. Itís been a really long time. In real life Iím not a clinger at all, but I kind of want be clingy! That sounds terrible.


Sounds perfectly reasonable to me! I'm not ready to date yet, as I'm still married and standing, but boy do I get this! I was starved for affection too from my H. H always said he was sensual, sexual, etc. Well, perhaps he was. Just not with me!


Originally Posted by Pax_luv
I havenít dated in over a year... itís time. I feel like itís the only way I can help things along. Iím just afraid of whatís out there. And Iím afraid of stds... thatís a whole different element, but it crosses my mind. So many hurdles.


I don't recall your age, but I'm 55, and I know there isn't a lot of quality people out there that aren't taken. I don't believe they are on the internet, so I wouldn't go that route if I was out there. IF I date at some point in the future, I would probably join MeetUps that are about my hobbies, and go from there. As far as STDs, well, don't sleep with anyone unless it's serious, and then I would get blood tests. That's really the only way in my book.

Good luck on your dating journey!


M: 56
H: 57
S: 22
D: 20

H Moved out: 10/1/18
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2847387
04/29/19 10:45 PM
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Grace - there's plenty of quality people on online dating - as well as not quality - just like in real life.

Honestly - that's where MOST people meet their dates nowadays, I think especially for Grace's and my age groups, as older people tend not to be in social groups with lots of single people, making it harder to find them. Since my divorce I only met ONE date that WASN'T through online dating (he picked me up while I was shopping in Big Lots, and he was 6'6", so he was known here as Mr Big Lots.) If I'd been waiting around to meet single men in my actual life I'd probably still be waiting for a first date after divorce. (But yes, I hear meetups are another potential route to meet people.)

Pax is younger so she has a better chance of meeting singles in her social life. Pax, you should think about going to the wedding alone - what if there are some cute single men there? You certainly can't spring a wedding on some new guy you just started dating anyway.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2849082
05/13/19 06:52 PM
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Hola,
Just coming here with a journal entry-

Been dealing with some obnoxious work emails so I need a quick break.
Woke up feeling really blue. Itís most definitely hormones, but I canít stop myself from saying out loud, I feel so sad!
No amount of ding dongs is pulling me out of the funk!

At least I know Iíll be out of it soon. Thatís another plus side of going through this experience, that hyper sensitivity and awareness of ones self and emotions that develops after walking through your own fog for so many years.

Anyway.... I actually had a great weekend. Celebrated my mom to the fullest. Had lots of fun. Got to meet my dearest friends brand new baby boy. Omgósoooo many babies. I know nobody is rubbing it in my face, but gosh- Everyone and their sister is pregnant. Just yesterday on motherís day, 2 of my friends announced their pregnancies within 5 minutes of each other. The baby craze is madness.


Things have been dead silent with ex. Thatís expected. There seems to be more life happening at my old house. There was a womenís wet suit and surf board hanging off the fence in the front yard. Mehhhh. Last week there was a tiny uhaul trailer in the front. Honestly, I canít think about it too much. Whatever is happening is of no concern to me.

Been feeling ready to shake things up for a while. My lease on my apartment is coming due and while I originally told myself thereís no fíing way Iím moving right now, it seems like I could get in a different place with more space and tiny yard for the same amount Iím paying currently. It may make sense to make a move. I reached out to a couple property management companies over the weekend. So... weíll see.

Also, I was waiting for a job to open up for a few months now. A person was retiring and I had my eye on his job.... well, it doesnít look like they are replacing him after all. Sadddddd. Thatís ok. The job would require a lot of inter-region travel and I know my quality of life is dependent on me NOT spending hours on end in so cal traffic.
With that, a different job just opened up. I am very qualified for it and it kind of aligns with the work I already do. It would be a little promotion but I would lose visibility. Right now I have an insane amount of visibility with the executive team. I could put my name in the hat just to see what itís about. While I love my job, it could be good to shake that up too. It would be nice to have balance. My current job does not allow for a lot of balance.

Ok... time to refocus on my desk. Hope you have a nice day!


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2850532
05/24/19 07:12 PM
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Popping in with a non update.

Itís the middle of my workday and I just canít concentrate. It was a busy week and Iíve given it all I got! I have a presentation due in 2 hours.... meh.... Iíll get to it.

Re: my sitch- we are finally going to be scheduling our mandatory settlement conference. Finally! I see light ahead! This four year chapter will have a close soon and Iím soooo ready. Blows my mind that he was the one who wanted this and now weíre the ones pushing as quickly as we can.

Technically, our marriage was bifurcated 13 months ago and they still havenít submitted the judgment paperwork. Insane.

Anyway... the last 2 months have been easier on me. I was severely stressed over the financial situation I was in, but since ex now has to pay his sanctions, I feel like I can breathe again. I can buy groceries and gas and not have to worry about which one is more important. That was so rough.

Iím NOT looking forward to the back and forth dealings of the settlement, but Iím thankful the end is near. Iím gonna use this time to build up my resiliency reserves for (hopefully) what will be the final battle with ex.

Life is good.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2850553
05/25/19 06:54 AM
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I'll be thinking of you. I still haven't come to a financial settlement with my XH either - his idea to hold everything up - and just want it over.

I know he's buying time to help soothe his guilt. The longer we go the less guilty he feels and the more entitled to what he promised me I could have.

I'm cheering you on for getting in and getting it done - I'm sure it'll be worth the stress in the long run!


Me:55 H:55
S:22 S:20
M:24 T:26
BD:Aug 15
D:Sep 17
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: devvo] #2850565
05/25/19 11:27 AM
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Pax,

Once everything has been finalized, you will discover just how much weight you've been carrying around on your shoulders. That weight will lift the day everything is signed and dated and life will be so much better for you. Hang in there....settlement isn't too far off.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2851585
06/03/19 08:14 PM
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Hi Devvo, thanks for the support. Interesting that your h may be dragging it out over his guilt. Either way, as long as you are ok with status quo and your finances are protected, then all you can do is live your best life.

Job, thank you. I already feel lighter knowing the end will be here soon. Iím actually like giddy-excited. Finally!


With that, Iím just a few days shy of 4 years physical separation! 4! Omg! I still donít feel settled in my apartment and my dwelling is still set up like a temporary pit stop but thatís ok. I just renewed my lease for another 10 months. I canít wait to see where Iíll be in 10 months. I remember my first night away in my first apartment. I can remember the exact feeling. It was like everything was moving in slow motion. I remember cooking my first dinner on the stove and reaching in slow motion for every ingredient and utensil. I made a whole box of pasta. Hahaha. I was used to cooking for two and having leftovers! I could barely eat back then, let alone a whole box of angel hair! Itís funny to me now. As always itís nice to reflect how far Iíve come and Iím grateful that so many of those tortured heart sick moments are in the past.

Speaking of, ex doesnít get much of my head space anymore. However, every now and again Iíll get my psychoanalyser out and make-up where he might be at. Itís interesting to me that he still harbors so much anger/ hatred towards me. While Iíll never know for sure, I think he has to hold on to that anger to continue to justify his actions. Could be very wrong. But I remember back when I was a teenager, my dad and I used to argue a lot. I was very independent and as the oldest daughter, he was very protective. We were at odds a lot. He was strict and I would get mad over something petty and I explicitly remember trying to hold on to the anger to prove a point. Even if it wasnít real, I still had to act like I was still pissed or whatever I was feeling at the time in order to hold my ground as a mature young woman (hehehe).

Thatís obviously something I grew out of, but I was questioning if thatís something my ex has been doing. I mean other than wanting a fair divorce, I have done nothing to him. In all honesty, if heís mad at anyone, it should be himself because Iím not in his life at all.how can he be mad at me 4 YEARS later?

Anyway, just a Monday musing.

I have a busy week ahead and a fun weekend. Iím looking forward to the activities coming up.

Have a great day!

Last edited by Pax_luv; 06/03/19 08:23 PM.

Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2851600
06/03/19 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by Pax_luv
I canít wait to see where Iíll be in 10 months.


Heck yea Pax! Iím excited for you! I think you are in for some big, positive changes over the next year. Itís going to be exciting!


Sun is shinin' in the sky
There ain't a cloud in sight
It's stopped rainin' everybody's in a play
And don't you know
It's a beautiful new day, hey hey
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2851620
06/04/19 12:41 AM
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He's mad because he thought dumping you would make him happy and guess what? He's still not!

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2852022
06/06/19 07:29 PM
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Hey pin!! Yes! The freedom will be exciting. Xoxo

Kml- youíre probably right. Also, one day I would like the validation that he feels he made a huge mistake. Wishful and selfish thinking on my part.... gotta let that go. The outcome doesnít change for me.

With that, just a little midday verbal ventingó-

Thereís some paperwork that needs to be done in order to get the settlement process going. My ex is supposed to initiate it. Iím perturbed that my lawyer is the one initiating it and then sending it to ex and his L to actually fill out. If my lawyer doesnít do it, theyíll just sit on it and not act. Much like the bifurcation. Iím now 14 months post bifurcation with no court papers submitted bc they havenít done it.

So, yes, I want this to get moving but why am I paying my lawyer to do their work??? Do you think itís intentional so I have to pay more or do you think theyíre that inactive/lazy?

Also, when I got the house appraised on my own, I got the report back for my use only. I paid for it because they wouldnít help. So his lawyer is trying to get a court order for me to share the appriasal. Ummm no. Thereís some legal stipulation that I donít have to. Anyway, thereís threats from their side... blah blah.

I make up that my ex is going to say that itís a bias appraisal anyway, much like he did for everything else- the CPA etc.


Grrr go away, ex!!!


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2853850
06/20/19 08:28 PM
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June tends to be a particularly reflective month since itís the month I moved out of the house four years ago. I donít feel any sadness over it, itís not really an anniversary or milestone... it just is a time-marker.

I have been working so hard at my job the last two weeks and when I got home from work yesterday, I passed out on the couch. I woke up two hours later and ended up going to bed a few hours later than usual since I was rested. Well.... I ended up not being able to fall asleep until 5am. Decided I would arrive at work late and allowed myself to wake up at 9am.

Being so groggy, Iím not in the best of moods and am feeling a little resentful... ok a lot resentful. I need to shift my thinking because itís robbing my focus today. So here I go to vent a little...

I have two small chips in my car windshield. I know I should get them filled, but itís not a priority. Driving to work today and looking at those chips was a trigger.

As Iíve eluded several times in my story telling, ex made me get rid of my dream car for the car i have now. He said he needed to get all assets out of his name because he was in a lawsuit and he needed to prove he had nothing to give should he lose the lawsuit. He was hiding cash, sold off other assets including a townhouse, etc. he wanted me to declare bankruptcy with him. Actually he told me weíd have to declare bankruptcy, but not to worry because we werenít actually bankrupt, it was only supposed to look like we were bankrupt. He said, it would only be on record for 7 years and our lifestyle wouldnít change except we wouldnít be able to go on vacation for a couple years.

Thank god in heaven I was adamantly opposed to fraud. I refused. Looking back, i could have had a REal Housewives of New Jersey situation on our hands (if you get the reference). Thank god he didnít manipulate me into filing bankruptcy- even though he was tryingó- ďwe need to do it for us. For our futureĒ. F you, ex! The compromise was that I would get a new car in my name only. I didnít want to, but one day he drove us to the lot after marriage counseling and we got the car. In my heart, it wasnít right, but I was soooo stupid. we were having issues but even though I wasnít going to commit fraud, I needed to show i still had his back so I got the car in my name. Dumb dumb dumb dumb.

Two weeks later, I got the ILYBINILWY and that was that. I was getting ready to move out because I loved him and would do anything to make it work. He wanted space. He wanted to ďmiss me.Ē So I made the ultimate sacrifice ďfor usĒ and I moved out because the house would be a lot for me to take care of on my own. My ex made sure I knew that.

So, then I was on my own with a $500 a month car payment that I didnít want nor could I afford.... and he was sitting pretty at the house bankrolling another womenís abortion. He had to help her because she was a struggling actress and it would ruin her career. <óó- there arenít enough expletives to explain how I felt/feel about this.

And yet....there I was.... struggling to make ends meet, filled with immense gratitude that I didnít commit fraud because I would be totally screwed trying to make it on my own with a bankruptcy attached to me.

Here I am 4 years later still unable to move on bc of what he has done to me financially. I know my lawyer is working on it, but Iím stuck. I hate him.

He no longer robs me of joy, but I get those moments where Iím mostly mad at myself for putting up with so much crap for so long... and then being the root of his unhappiness.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2858580
07/25/19 12:16 AM
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Hello. Checking in...
My posts are getting spread further and further apart. Itís good.

I find myself popping in because today would have been my 9 year wedding anniversary. Iíve officially gone through this day 5 times since ex and I split and this is the first year Iím not saddened by it at all. Progress!

Current state- Still not divorced. Still havenít received the bifurcation papers from April 2018. Insane. We have a mandatory settlement conference scheduled at the end of the year. For some reason ex recently pushed to get it done in the next 30 days. I definitely donít see it happening.

Since ex was sanctioned, and is now covering some of my legal fees, I am finding it slightly easier to breathe. I can afford my bills right now and thatís also progress. Now if only I could start saving up and get some vacay in there!

Iíll be honest, to this day I still get a little perturbed, jealous, angry that ex has gone through this unscathed. Now donít get me wrong, thereís a side I donít see at all, but he seems to be doing well. I feel like he just chewed me up and spit me out and went on his merry way. Thatís a little hard for me to wrap my brain around. Never once have I felt even a slight degree of uncertainty or remorse. Itís odd. I would understand if I was this heinous person who abused him, but I wasnít and it has been hard to process it all.

Also, people would say that the fact heís been sanctioned by the judge three times demonstrates that he didnít get away unscathed, but it doesnít seem proportionate to what he has done. Especially what he has done to me financially- during the marriage and even after. He wrote checks in my name totalling roughly 30k to his sister... and she cashed them knowing they werenít written by me (obviously that was pre-meditated). He made me go in debt over a car I didnít want, he tried to say my paycheck didnít go to the mortgage therefore I have no rights to the house. And Iíve had to fight ALL of this. Itís been so exhausting. And here he is sitting pretty. Since weíve separated, heís purchased 2 investment properties, multiple vehicles, etc. thereís even (another) new Range Rover in the driveway.

Ha! What financial restraining order? The rules donít apply to him. And so far (with the exception of those sanctions )the court doesnít really seem to care.

All that makes me seem bitter and I guess I am because this financial piece is the last piece I need to move on... I mean really move on. Well, other than 100% firming up dog custody.

Ahh.... this process really does take a long time, but as everyone says, there is light at the end of the tunnel. And for anyone new here, PROTECT YOUR FINANCES!!!! Donít second guess it.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2858583
07/25/19 12:48 AM
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Why oh why are you trying to get this done before 10 years of marriage? You know that after ten years of marriage, you can collect spousal benefits on his social security if its higher than you own benefits. Better yet, if he dies you can claim widows benefits!

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2858606
07/25/19 10:04 AM
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Ahhhhh Pax... you are getting there. Hope it will all be over for you soon. Your story is crazy though! Glad their was no sadness with the anniversary. Progress progress progress!


Sun is shinin' in the sky
There ain't a cloud in sight
It's stopped rainin' everybody's in a play
And don't you know
It's a beautiful new day, hey hey
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2858612
07/25/19 12:06 PM
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sorry honey and listen to kml xoxoxo

also bizarre as this may sound, don't take this personally ... it's about him. you will be ok and you are still in your 30s - plenty of time to take care of yourself on the finances front.

Last edited by bttrfly; 07/25/19 12:08 PM.

M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2860175
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Hey guys,
Iím not at all worried about getting to that 10 year mark. Weíve been going through this divorce longer than weíve been married, Iím just trying to re-coup what I invested in the house and my legal fees and of course equal custody of my dog (if not more!).

I have a good job and can take care of myself just fine (that is, when Iím not paying out 3k a month in legal fees).

Anyway, it was about a month ago that he was rushing to get this done in 30 days and so far.... not a peep. I guess thatís to be expected. Whatevs!

Iíve noticed even more shifting in myself the last few months. Iím no longer afraid of him. Iím not willing to walk on eggshells around him out of fear of his threats. Ahhh progress. I am mindful of approaching him for my own sanity.... as in..,. I just donít want to deal with him and the backlash, but he no longer terrifies me.

I do have to send him an email about the dog schedule today. I need to adjust my dates on two occasions. I used to be fearful that even asking to adjust would cause me to look like Iím not capable of taking care of my dog, but I know thatís not accurate. Weíll shall see how he responds.

Have a nice week everyone!


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2860281
08/06/19 11:10 AM
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Originally Posted by Pax_luv

Iíve noticed even more shifting in myself the last few months. Iím no longer afraid of him. Iím not willing to walk on eggshells around him out of fear of his threats. Ahhh progress. I am mindful of approaching him for my own sanity.... as in..,. I just donít want to deal with him and the backlash, but he no longer terrifies me.

I do have to send him an email about the dog schedule today. I need to adjust my dates on two occasions. I used to be fearful that even asking to adjust would cause me to look like Iím not capable of taking care of my dog, but I know thatís not accurate. Weíll shall see how he responds.

Have a nice week everyone!


so proud of you pax! as someone who still has ptsd from years of ex's spew, I know how hard it is to get to where you are. well done gf!!! :* <3

Last edited by bttrfly; 08/06/19 11:11 AM.

M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2860956
08/11/19 12:03 PM
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Oh btrfly- the ptsd is real. Hugs to you. Itís rough. I still get triggered over a few things and I do have that reminder that I wasnít enough for my ex. Just got to keep growing and learning.


Interestingly, I am at a bit of an emotional high right now. I watched a ďfeel goodĒ divorce movie before bed and found myself questioning my worth. Not really, but kind of. In this movie, the womanís ex greatly regretted his actions and really wanted to try again but it was too late. She couldnít go back. While it was a movie and completely scripted, Iíve never had any sadness from ex at all. Iíve shared that a ton here so no need to recap, but I still get pangs over it. I no longer blame myself for him falling out of love with me, but I have that deep rooted trauma of constantly doing doing doing doing for ex in order to meet his needs or support the next moving target. And never getting it right.

So, itís almost 5am here. Been up for the last 2 hours taking down a drunk driver with my neighbor. Ok. That sounds dramatic, but together we called the cops. That was actually the real reason I came on here. Just needed a release. Around 330 there was a huge crash outside my window, I didnít see what happened but I heard it, so I peeked out. I knew a car had crashed into something but it had turned the corner out of view. I noticed my neighbor across the way was out on her patio because she heard it too. Basically, the guy was wasted and then he tried to squeeze his little dodge-neon size car into the ďspaceĒ next to the handicap stall. He actually fit but drove too far ahead straight into the bushes. Neighbor ran out to watch him and she called the cops. Meanwhile, I was a creeper who filmed from the balcony. The guy couldnít even stand and I think he saw her watching him so he got back into the car and fled. I knew it was safer to stay where I was but feel terrible that I couldnít stop him from starting the car and driving off. Anyway, I was imagining him being on the road with my loved ones and that freaked me out. So stupid and dangerous. WItís really scary seeing someone that inebriated get into a car. A few mins later the cops came (4 vehicles) and as soon as they started questioning us, they got the call that he was found and would be taken into custody. Thank goodness

Not going to lie...it was scary. I absolutely hated seeing that. I was feeling a bit sad as I went to bed and to be awoken with that fear and adrenaline just compounds it. I have this slight feeling of doom and wonder if this is what people feel when they have a panic attack. Iím ok..., just emotionally fried I guess.


Last edited by Pax_luv; 08/11/19 12:08 PM.

Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2860961
08/11/19 01:22 PM
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panic attacks vary in intensity in my experience. slight feeling of doom can be a precursor, but it's generally more not being able to breathe, feeling heaviness on your chest, sometimes heavy sweats, hyperventilating, it's an ugly process.

I'm sorry you woke up to that. try a soothing bath and a nap, if possible to re-set.
xoxoxo

yes, I get that sadness. my ex has never ever displayed any remorse for destroying our family. I'm an adult, I signed up for marriage knowing there is always a possibility a marriage will fail, but our son did NOT sign up for this and that's the part I have the hardest time with. I just did a 4th and 5th step on relationships and I see patterns imprinted on me from birth which lead me to making the choices I've made. Hopefully those patterns are now broken and the choices I make moving forward will be more in alignment with my true self, rather than with the old ways.

You may want to do some writing on relationships you've had to see what percolates out for you. xoxox not today tho. today you need to re-set and relax.


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862031
08/20/19 07:35 AM
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Oh how things shift.
Itís late-around 12:30am and Iím just so exhausted.

Last month, my ex was trying to push this through as quickly as possible. And well... there was no peep.
Finally, they opened up with a settlement offer which is beyond anything comprehensible. I pay him, give him my retirement, he keeps house, all furniture, etc and heíll let me have the dog 2 days a month.

Obviously thatís bull. But Iím sooo tired. Iím soooo tired of this. I want this over so badly, but I feel like Iíll never get there. Iím not religious but I just have to pray and pray and pray that when this does get in front of the judge, sheíll be reasonable.... because I know we wonít find middle ground on our own.

I know Iím strong, but I canít take his bullying anymore. Oh my god..... I canít.
He was actually pleasant to me for 30 seconds the other day. I didnít read anything positive in it... and now I know why. He is beyond manipulative.

Somebody please smack me with harsh reality and tell me to trust the system and that the court has seen this many times. I have no faith right now.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862052
08/20/19 12:52 PM
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Pax,

The settlement that they are offering you is a bunch of BS. You have rights and you need to work w/your lawyer and stay the course. Sounds like he's had too much fairy dust blown into his face...the only way that he will get all that he is asking for is if you agree to the terms....don't do it!

Trust the system, know your rights and stick to them. Do not waffle one inch or he'll try to take everything from you. Stand firm. The bullying and manipulating will continue in order to try to break you down to say "enough, I'll give it all to you just to get you to go away". Don't do it!

Yes, the court systems have seen and continue to see a lot of this BS and the lawyers just eat it up because they can spot a MLCer a mile away...but you are the sane one and need to stand firm.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862055
08/20/19 01:30 PM
08/20/19 01:30 PM
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honey i hope a good night's sleep has given you strength.
this is absolute BS as Job said. Dig deeper. Lean in. You can do this. Do NOT give this S.O.B. your future. He's already taken enough of your past and present.

love you girl. hang in there.
xxoxoo


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862101
08/20/19 05:43 PM
08/20/19 05:43 PM
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What does your lawyer say about all this? That's pretty ridiculous. You were married for 5 years - in most states, even if it's no-fault community property and he earned nothing and you were the primary breadwinner, the most he could get would be 2 1/2 years of alimony and half of joint property. Maybe part of a 401k if you have one but only related to contributions you made during those 5 years. What was HIS earning history during the marriage? Who paid the down payment and mortgage payments on the house?

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862691
08/25/19 01:25 AM
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Took me a little bit to get back to center, but Iím mostly back. Thank you all for being the voice of reason. I desperately needed the input. Sometimes I need to lean on others to give me a reality check. I do still get sucked into his vortex sometimes.
My lawyer and I talked and he came up with our proposal which is VASTLY different and not on par with the direction ex wanted to go in so I do suspect it will all get settled out during the mandatory settlement. We havenít submitted it yet because my lawyer and I need to talk through some items.... he was incredibly fair and to the book. Which is good. Thereís literally not one cent over what it should be and zero inflated line items etc. Iím ok with it because itís reall... so weíll see what happens.

Anyway, I am feeling about 2 inches tall right now. And Iím sad/ hurt. When I Picked up my dog, ex was having a party and the women looked like they were straight out of real housewives of San Diego. Skinny, glam blondes like they were dressed for the race track or something. They were closer to his age so theyíre older..... but they have me feeling like a teeny tiny woman. I know Iím nNot supposed to say it but itís hard.... hereís little ole me trying to get by day to day. And there he is throwing parties with hot women and living it up. He even had my dog dressed up all cute. Wtf is that??? Iím the one that dresses my dog. Ok- I know my outlook isnít very becoming but Iím gonna allow my self to feel low for a moment.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862715
08/25/19 10:38 AM
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do not compare your insides to someone else's outside.

I'm glad you are mostly back to center. focus on your dog enjoy your time together.

As difficult as it is, try to put stbx and his activities out of your mind.

try to envision the life you want after this. it sounds like your lawyer is a good guy and good for you keeping it fair and reasonable.

you matter. xoxoxo


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2862719
08/25/19 12:17 PM
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hugs Pax! ugh!

Miss blfy is right though.... it's all surface stuff.... all of it. Hope you feel better today.


Sun is shinin' in the sky
There ain't a cloud in sight
It's stopped rainin' everybody's in a play
And don't you know
It's a beautiful new day, hey hey
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2866106
09/22/19 09:40 PM
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Hola! Just popping in to say hello.

I just got back from a week-long medical mission in the Caribbean last night and am currently napping the day away. As expected, it was a very meaningful experience. Lots of work, but very impactful. My soul needed it and I also needed an ego check to put things into perspective. I had been struggling with a few things related to my real job for several weeks, and admittedly I needed to immerse myself in this to give me a reality check. Plus I just like volunteering and giving back. Before leaving, I had been really frustrated with many things that, at the end of the day, donít matter. They just donít. Who cares if I donít get credit for a project when there are people in this world who never will be in this position, who donít even have running water! God, my life is good and I need to appreciate all of it.

Anyway, two days ago, at sunrise, I was in a tiny motorboat on my way to a reef to go snorkel before we wrapped up clinic. I was staring at the scenery and sparkling blue water and ex popped into my head for some reason. I hadnít thought about him once the whole week. It was nice to forget about the reality of the divorce for a bit and I long for the day that it will officially be behind me. I had realized that when I thought of him I felt nothing. It might have been the environment, but there I was cruising through the waters and I was checking myself for emotion. I felt NOTHING. No sadness, anger, nothing. It was weird, but good. Iíve definitely made emotional progress with all of this (only took 5 years. Hahaha)

The snorkeling was great... came out with 20+ jelly fish stings but they were the small zingers.... the sting didnít linger too long and now it just looks like I have an assortment of bug bites all over my body. The stings, coupled with mosquito bites, and a couple bruises and scrapes make me look like Iíve been through stuff.

Speaking of stuff- I met Bob Marleys sister. Woah that woman is a ray of light. She was singing a song on the piano (sheís crazy talented), and then came up and gave me a huge hug. She grabbed my hand, looked me in the eyes and said, youíve been through stuff. Youíve been enlightened. I see it in you. Iíve been through stuff, Iíve been enlightened. You keep that with you always. (And then she got a little woo-woo), but anyway, that is a moment I will remember for the rest of my light.


I was supposed to be with my dog today, but ex decided it no longer worked for him. Heís a POS, but heís no longer my POS. Iím not fighting this particular instance... I donít feel the need to. He doesnít rile me up. Yes I love my dog and yes I want to see him, but Iím not willing to die on this hill right now. I hope to have the court stuff outlined so he canít do this.

Thatís all I got for now. Life is good.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2866209
09/23/19 08:15 PM
09/23/19 08:15 PM
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Pax, so happy to see your update. I love the happiness and light it shows. I love that you didn't let him use the dog to hurt you yet again. It really is all he has at this point. I hope that he will quickly figure out that it isn't working and let you have your dog when you are supposed to.

I know what you mean about feeling nothing. I had that same thought today. Far different from the numbness at the beginning. This is a good nothing. Just a small object in the rearview mirror nothing.

Hope the divorce wraps up soon and with no more drama.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2866374
09/25/19 03:37 AM
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Thank you own!

Things have changed. It all takes time. I feel like myself again. Itís nice that Iím not struggling as much financially since ex was sanctioned 3 times and is basically covering my legal fees (for now). I felt very stuck for a long time. The situation was quite dire, and now Iím back... not totally free yet, but Iím back to myself.

Anyway, I was working on a presentation this evening and looking for a photo (yessssss I add pics of my dog to my PowerPoints..... when relevant, of course wink ) and I came across some old photos of ex that I couldnít bring myself to delete way back when. And now..... they are gone! I felt it was time and so I deleted, deleted, deleted. I did get sad when going through some of the pics because I could remember the fear and sadness at the time. So much sadness. It was so painful going through it. Ugh. Just awful. I looked at our photos from our last anniversary dinner together. He had no emotion in those eyes. You could tell he was gone. That was the night he said- if weíre not pregnant in two months thereís no point in being married.

Looking at where Iím at right nowó- That statement above makes me sad. Iím starting to accept that I might not be in a position to have biological children and should maybe think of adopting. At the same time that really opens me up to refocusing on going back to school and doubling down on career aspirations. I donít know. My birthday is in a couple weeks and Iím no closer to being in a relationship or being a mom. I have to accept this.... itís tough.

Other than that, I feel like Iíve landed on my feet and Iím ok.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2866383
09/25/19 09:49 AM
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Look at the mind games your XH has played with the dog. Can you imagine what a D would've been like if you and your XH had a child? I absolutely think a D would've happened too, by the way - a person who can do what he's done was never going to be able to last the distance required for a long term marriage. He is broken and a baby would have only made it worse.

I think if you focus on what you can actually, definitely do without the help of anybody else you are going to be in a great position when the Universe comes knocking. By then, you'll be well and truly good to go.


Me:55 H:55
S:22 S:20
M:24 T:26
BD:Aug 15
D:Sep 17
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: devvo] #2866386
09/25/19 11:58 AM
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Originally Posted by devvo
Look at the mind games your XH has played with the dog. Can you imagine what a D would've been like if you and your XH had a child? I absolutely think a D would've happened too, by the way - a person who can do what he's done was never going to be able to last the distance required for a long term marriage. He is broken and a baby would have only made it worse.

I think if you focus on what you can actually, definitely do without the help of anybody else you are going to be in a great position when the Universe comes knocking. By then, you'll be well and truly good to go.


^^ couldn't have said it better myself!

Glad you are feeling back to yourself Pax... you have been through a ton! Keep it up!


Sun is shinin' in the sky
There ain't a cloud in sight
It's stopped rainin' everybody's in a play
And don't you know
It's a beautiful new day, hey hey
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2866558
09/27/19 05:24 AM
09/27/19 05:24 AM
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Pax_luv Offline OP
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Hey devvo and pinn. I definitely agree wholeheartedly that ex doesnít have it in him to sustain a long term relationship. And yes, having a child with him would have been an absolute nightmare. It would have been pure torture to deal with child custody.
Iím grateful that I didnít have human children with him and Iím sorry my dog has to be shepherded back and forth but i think he enjoys his life.


Anyway, what a sad evening. I had to commute via the train today and on the way home, we accidentally hit a cyclist and this person didnít make it. I got a bit flustered that people were moaning and groaning that they were going to be stuck on the train for hours and hours while someone was literally fighting for their life right on the other side of the doors. It was so sad but I was a little disgusted by the lack of compassion. Whereís the humanity, people?!?!? Ugh. Iím sad for society. Kind of need some love right now and wish I had someone to give a big hug to. Iím grateful I got to come home tonight... even if it was a couple hours late. Someone else wasnít so fortunate.

Last edited by Pax_luv; 09/27/19 05:32 AM.

Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2866707
09/28/19 10:02 PM
09/28/19 10:02 PM
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Sorry that you had to witness both the accident and its aftermath. All we can do is try to do better ourselves.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2868551
10/17/19 06:06 AM
10/17/19 06:06 AM
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Hello there,
I continue to post less and less and am finding it more and more challenging to keep up with threads. Thatís the sign of progress, I guess. Itís a good thing.

Having a hard time falling asleep so I thought I would journal here. In terms of the divorce, Weíre getting closer to the mandatory settlement. If youíve followed along, you know Iíve tried to play a clean karma game this whole time. I had to be very firm on the legal side of things to protect myself from my ex. Funny, He thinks Iíve played every game in the book and Iím a gold digger because I havenít succumbed to his demands. Oh well. I know the truth. Interestingly enough, it was about a month ago, he got mad at me for dropping off the dog late (12 minutes) and gave me a big earful and was yelling at me from the porch. I didnt apologize like the old pax would do, and he ended up telling me that I was being passive aggressive. I actually thought this was amusing. I donít react to him at all anymore and now Iím passive aggressive. Oh well. Think all you want buddy! Sad that Iím actually to the point of complete indifference.

Going back to why Iím here. (And I canít remember if I shared this or not). As the years have gone on, I have become less afraid of sharing the details of my sitch out of fear of being found out. The truth is, this whole divorce has played out exactly as I expected it to so I Donít feel like I have anything to lose. All that can happen now, is ex will find this site and then sue me for defamation of character or something. Heck, he sued my lawyer for making degrading comments about him in court. They were all true, by the way. The case was thrown out because by law, ex couldnít sue my lawyer.

Anyway...

In my settlement proposal, my lawyer did put a dig in there outlining all the money that ex paid to another woman... the same woman whoís abortion he funded.... the same woman who pretty much had my ex in tears because he was so upset that she didnít ask him to keep the baby. That poor woman was a struggling actress and it would ruin her career if she had a baby. (You canít tell but Iím being very sarcastic as I type this out).

So, my lawyer thought it should be documented so he can pay back the community for misuse of funds. I actually agree, but itís a low blow on my part. And thatís not usually how I act. We havenít submitted it yet but Iíve been going back and forth on whether or not it should be included. Hmmmmm. Again... nothing to lose. He was responsible for his actions during the marriage. What a charmer.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2868597
10/17/19 04:11 PM
10/17/19 04:11 PM
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Pax, glad you are feeling more comfortable in sharing more.

What is to be gained by outing the abortion expense? I have no idea how much they cost, but I'm guessing not significant. If your gut is saying don't do it, then I would go with that. How you feel about yourself is far more important than what he thinks about you or feeling the need to get back at him in some way. If you do list it, why not put "third party medical expense" so that it shows you are focused on the money (which is your right) and not the salacious aspect of it. He knows that you know.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2868625
10/17/19 06:11 PM
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Alienation of affection is a seldom used law and not available everywhere but does apply. There was an interesting recent case in British Columbia / Canada reported on CBC News where the OW was sued in small claims court for costs. I don't think it went much of anywhere but did proceed so perhaps establishes a precedent.

As OwnIt suggests though - is the materiality worth the pain? I think for many of us that we reach a point where we just want it to end and will walk away leaving things on the table. In my case limping because when my ex counter-offered my leg was kicked quite firmly by my lawyer who was frantically whispering "take it take it take it" wink


On BD
H52, W50
T27, M26
S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good.
But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2868832
10/19/19 02:05 AM
10/19/19 02:05 AM
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whatever you decide to do, base your decision on how you will feel about yourself in the long term, when this is a distant memory. you've been through so much, I don't want you to do something that you may regret down the road. You're a woman of compassion, love and light. Don't lose sight of that. xoxoxoxo I like OwnIt's suggestion a lot, but it's your situation and you know best.

xoxoxo no matter what you decide xoxoxo


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2868907
10/20/19 06:09 PM
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Hi own, Andrew and brtrfly,
Thanks for the comments and sentiments. Own- I do like the term 3rd party medical expenses. You are right, itís not that much money. Also, I forgot to mention that he was also giving her petty cash out of his business account.

This is going to sound terrible but for a second, I thought-ok this is it... after so many years of his bullying, this is my chance to reciprocate. Iíve been solid this whole time, been completely drug through the mud, and now hereís the time where (hopefully) justice will be served. No, it 10000% is not in my nature to ďblastĒ anyone.... I just thought, here we are 4+ years out and now he has to face the music and face what heís done.

And when I say that, please understand that thereís no vindictiveness in there. It sounds like there is, but thereís isnít. Itís more like- Iím not covering for him anymore and sacrificing myself as a result.

At the end of the day, Iím not going to put the abortion in there. Iím ready to move on and get this over with. Itís been so crazy to try and recover everything that heís taken from me. Like when he wrote checks in my name to my sister in law totalling over 30k and how he withdrew over 100k from our account just a few days before we separated. Iím reliving all of this again and again. And Iím pissed. Iím leaving a couple things on the table, but I just canít fight it all.

Ughhh. I hope karma is kind to him.

Just a few more months and I will be free of him! I canít wait. Can. Not. Wait.

In other news, Iím very ready to move. I wish my lease was up now. Even though I would prefer to buy something, i would be ok with breaking my lease and finding somewhere else to live.
This place served me very well during my separation and I have no complaints at all except for the fact that itís not home. It was my temporary landing place and now Iím ready to move on. This girl is ready to soar! No more holding me back.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2869019
10/21/19 05:57 PM
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Pax, time passes faster than we think it will in the moment. Use the time you have left in your lease to decide what you want to do for you and where you want to be. I've changed my mind a few times, but have really settled into the idea of where I want to be long-term, which parts of town I will look at in my preferred location, and exactly the kind of house I want to have. I am so excited for you that you are envisioning this new life. I see you standing there trying out those nascent wings and getting ready to take flight.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2870448
11/02/19 02:46 AM
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Hi there....
Kind of funny and rediculously stupid story to share. But I have to dump it here because Iím like wth????

So I ran into a little snag with a meeting that I had a couple hours north of home. Long story short, there were a lot of things to coordinate and I wasnít going to be able to pick up my dog from ex today at the exact time that we normally swap. (We swap at 530 on the dot and not a second sooner (rolls eyes) )

Anyway, to manage my time in traffic and the unpredictability of a ton of fires in the area... I decided to train it home but I would get in 15 minutes later than usual. So I asked ex if he could accommodate and let me get the dog a few mins late. .

Of course he couldnít. (Rolls eyes again)- he has tickets and dinner plans and he canít help, but I could get the dog in the morning.

I say forget it because a friend of mine volunteered to get him at 530. Stupid me thought I could ask the favor in my moment of struggle. Lesson learned. I should have known. Take care of it myself NO MATTER WHAT.

Anyway.... so my friend goes and gets the dog. Sheís never been to my old house and never met ex. I give her the low down on how the swap occurs. So I tell her how ex opens the door and letís the dog run out and then shuts the door.

So she gets there at 522 and then at 530 he comes out and introduces himself to her! She was shocked because he was acting all familiar and super friendly. My dog was happy to see her and her dog because they are friends so he was extra happy and surprised to see them. So my ex tells her, ď wow- you get a better reception than you-know-who!Ē

Ummmm what!?!? So my friend is shocked that he would make that statement in front of her- heís never even met her! Then he says to her ďthank you, this works out so much better for me.Ē Again heís extra familiar and courteous.

So..... Iím still scratching my head over it. My friend (who dabbles in criminal psych) was like- I think heís a sociopath. ďThat was the weirdest thing Iíve experienced. Im still stunned. Just shocked!Ē


I donít know about sociopath per se, but mlc for sure. What an odd and very bold interaction from him.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2870686
11/04/19 07:34 PM
11/04/19 07:34 PM
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Yes, he is very disturbed. So he makes a stranger wait 8 minutes (when he has tickets and dinner plans) so he can come out precisely at 5:30. Then he insults you to your friend, puts on faux charm, and makes it about him. I have thought he was at least NPD and possibly something worse like sociopath. I guess what really matters is that you will shortly not be involved with him any longer except as concerns the dog. I cannot even imagine how you prepare yourself for these exchanges.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2870785
11/05/19 06:14 AM
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Ownit,
Yeah... it doesnít much make sense. Admittedly I did try to decipher it a bit. A pointless exercise, but itís my effort to find compassion for the guy and maybe justify my sanity.... not so sure.

I made up that he was being overly exaggerated and familiar with my friend because he was faking the fact that he had plans and was just being a stubborn donkey.
Who knows.

Quite frankly, I think he thinks that I play games with him... because he plays games with me. After all these years, I donít think heís differentiated himself from me at all. Iím a totally different person than him. I made this up after his recent comment about me being passive aggressive in which I wanted to respond.... nope... just donít care.

Not sure if that makes sense at all... itís all just mind reading and hypotheses.

Anyway, Iím about 6 weeks out from our mandatory settlement. I am through the roof excited. I really can see the light now. Itís almost over! After every set back over the last few years, I imagined myself physically climbing out of a huge valley onto the top of a mountain peak. I could sense when I made it to the peak and then would try to enjoy it as much as possible because I knew a deep valley would be next, but each time I fell into that valley I used new tools to get out of it. Soon, the pain of the dips became less and less.

And now here I am.... I almost see flat horizon ahead. Iím very much looking forward to it.

I really want to do something big for New Years this year to celebrate. Whenever I closed my eyes and pictured the light at the end of the tunnel, I imagined a million twinkly lights like that of the Eiffel Tower. Iíve been trying to make a Paris trip happen, but Iím not sure I could swing it.

The other option (and this is a major bucket list that Iíve always wanted to do) is ring in the new year in Times Square. Iíve heard it is a huge pain in the butt, but Iíve just always wanted to see it myself. There are still a few hotel rooms available and itís cheaper than Paris. (I still have a budget after all... I havenít completely recovered from this financially yet.. still have to be a little sensible!)

I donít know, but I feel like I need to do something to recognize this completely fresh start. New year, new decade. I can put the last decade behind me- my ex and I got married in 2010.

Iíve also always wanted to stay in an ice hotel and thereís one that opens Jan 2. So that might be an option too.

Either way, Iím excited to release the weight of this divorce that Iíve been carrying for too long. I actually caught myself saying today ďIím so happy. Genuinely happy. A little scared out of fear that something bad is going to creep up. But today Iím genuinely happy.Ē (Haha and these are my internal conversations that I just have with myself. Caught myself being all positive 3 times today!)

Iíve mentioned this before but it always catches me off guard when Iím feeling super good. I guess Iím used to walking around with stress, anxiety, etc so it surprises me when itís not there. Not that everything is all rainbows and butterflies at all. It certainly is NOT! But Iíve landed on my feet and I feel good.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2870814
11/05/19 02:55 PM
11/05/19 02:55 PM
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Pax, if you go to Times Square, reach out.


I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2870889
11/05/19 08:32 PM
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Completely natural Pax. Those of us who have been treated poorly tend to be anxious when things feel good. I bet after a while that will go away. Times Square is interesting and very lit up on a normal night (can't imagine NYE). I find NY to be very, very cold because of the winds whipping down those avenues. If you go, bring warm clothing (scarf, gloves and hat are a must), good shoes for walking (you will do lots of it) and eat at the Black Tap. Great burgers and insane milkshakes. You'll also be right where all the shows are, so if you go, catch a musical or a drama or something (go to the TKTS booth for discounted tickets). I always spend lots of time around Lincoln Center and there are some good restaurants and shopping there. The pizza by the 72nd street subway entrance (there is a Parisian bakery next door) is the best. Something about the crust. Chelsea Market is really awesome, probably too cold for the Highline then, but a walk around Greenwich Village is good too. I think you will have a great time. Take a friend if you can.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: OwnIt] #2870934
11/06/19 03:43 AM
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OwnIt, I see I was right about your daughter! Will you tell me next time you go?

Last edited by Gerda; 11/06/19 03:44 AM.

I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2871930
11/12/19 08:56 PM
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Just a non update journal entry-
A couple of things have happened in the last two weeks that have put me in a different headspace. Not in a bad way at all and Iím still feeling good- just a couple things happened that had me reflecting over ex a bit.

I still have some of my own ego to deal with in terms of accepting the fact that Iím the bad guy in his narrative. This feeling has creeped up a couple times over the years and while Iíve gotten better at it, I still get this sense of how ďunfairĒ it is for me to be his villain. Former friends and in laws completely and utterly dismissed me without even questioning the reality of the situation. I try to be a good human and no, it doesnít sit well with me knowing that someone out there has fabricated my integrity. Again... thatís my ego and something I have to deal with. It comes up from time to time and I try to accept it but itís hard.

I think this was all triggered by his interaction with my friend where he put me down in front of her. I wish I could go to him and say, ď donít you have anything better to do than minimize my existence?Ē But I donít.... and then bite my tongue as I have for the last few years.

I think this reflection caused me to have a dream about him. For some reason I had to take a shower in his new houseóin his master bathroom. When I got out, I was snooping through the womenís jewelry on the night stand to get a better feel for the woman he replaced me with. I was trying to get a sense for why and how she is so much better than me. Then, in the dream, ex caught me snooping and I commented, ďnice jewelryĒ and he replied, ďthis is what you wanted. Come on pax..... what did you expect me to do?Ē He was all sad about it.

The, I woke myself up. I distinctly remember the feeling of saying No to myself. ďIím not doing this,Ē and I woke myself up. I was pretty much crying out of frustration because itís hopeless.. I feel like Iím always going to have this mindf*ck. Where Iím always the bad guy, where Iím always going to be fighting him, where Iím always going to be wrong In every situation. I mean.... all we have now is the dog and that is a struggle.

And to be honest... I donít know how to relax and be completely myself in certain situations because of this conditioning. For example, I went to Costco the other day with a friend. I hate Costco... itís just chaos. Now..... I can deal with crowds that are more orderly like concerts, massive marathons, etc, but the free-for-all of Costco is too much for me. Iím the conservative one who lets people pass in front of me with their carts, and reach over me while Iím looking at something. Iím not the one cutting people off and being overly assertive. My ex is that person... he would basically shove carts out of the way with his cart and it made me very uncomfortable. He would get frustrated and get snippy with me because I was not that way.

So, last week, while we were at Costco, I kind of got into my catatonic self, where i just look like a deer caught in the headlights and I kept waiting for my friend to get mad at me like my ex would. I was expecting it! Long story short, she didnít, and was even supportive of me!! But I was on edge because I have a learned response in that environment and I got triggered.

Ugh. Same goes for a guy thatís in my life right now. Itís not really a defined thing, but I keep waiting for him to get pissy at me for being myself. I am myself and Iím not trying to be someone Iím not, but Iím still waiting to be judged and ridiculed for it.

I guess I just need to trust and believe that Iím good enough as I am. I spent a decade in a relationship where it wasnít safe to be me and nothing i did was ever good enough. And even though Iím 5 years out of that relationship, I still have those triggers. Maybe itís because ex is still lurking in the background.

Ahhhhh. Ok that was cathartic.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2871936
11/12/19 09:40 PM
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Hi pax

It actually helped me to own up to being the villain a bit. Not that I was. But in my mind, I knew what him and his friends and his mom thought and I just figured they already think it - so who cares. I can say and do anything and it doesnít matter. I can be the ďbad guyĒ and just make it about getting what works in my best interest. Itís a liberating way to think if you can get there.


M: 42
H: 43
Twins age 5
WAH in summer
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2871938
11/12/19 09:42 PM
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Pax:

Totally and completely relate. I feel done and over it and him, but I have two things that still crop up for me. The first is just WTF. Every now and again, I think how in the world did this happen. All of it. Not in sadness or anything, sometimes I even laugh about it. It just still catches me unawares and makes me do that.

The second is exactly what you describe. I can't bear that he or anyone else views me as the bad guy here. From the beginning if I would say it bothered me that he was lying about me to people (his people), my mother would say you shouldn't care anything about those people, what they think, or what he tells them. At first this upset me. I didn't understand why she had to say that. Now, I kind of get it. I really don't care anything he says to them and if they believe him, that is on them. He has treated all of them badly as well. And your friend instantly knew the problem was him, not you. So don't worry that the things he says look bad on you. People see him for what he is, whether they advertise that or not.

I still hate that he thinks he hates me. I don't know why that bothers me. When he refuses to talk to me (about kids, divorce, house) I feel like he is telling me that I don't matter as a person. That I am so insignificant that I don't deserve a response. Took a long time. But I think my son helped me on this one. I always tell the kids, when they say they hate him or don't want to talk to him, or anything, that he is not in a good place, he's depressed, he's hurting too. Finally my son said, "Mom, this is his choice. This is how he is choosing to behave. Stop making excuses for him. He is choosing to do this." Whatever the reason, whatever the cause. This man who gets up and goes to work and cares for the sick, and gets raises for his performance, and bonuses, etc. (and therefore a functional, adult human) is choosing to behave like a nasty piece of you-know-what to the woman who made that life possible for him and the only children he will ever have. He just isn't a good person. Sometimes that is the answer. When a bad person thinks you are the bad guy, should that hurt? I don't think so.

I recently read this book about the science of adult attachment. Very interesting because I've never subscribed a lot to all of that stuff. Well, very interesting to see how avoidants behave in relationships and how easy it is to spot them when you are not nose up against them. You are clearly an anxious attacher (as am I), so you are waiting for the new guy to treat you like the avoidant (avoidants and anxious attachments are drawn to each other but bad news). Sounds like he is a secure attacher, which is the kind you want to be with. Read the book, I think it will give you a lot of "ah has" and help you intellectualize your reaction when you feel this attachment injury in yourself.

You are doing great. Getting there day by day. You have your whole life in front of you. As you shut the door on the past, thank him for the things he has forced you to learn about yourself and what you want and don't want in your new life.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2871961
11/13/19 12:28 AM
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You guys are the best. Always appreciate the viewpoints. Juju- Iíve definitely tried going there. Just own it... I can be unapologetic for my actions because they already think the worst of me. Hmmm.

Own- ugh sorry that you can relate. Itís exhausting. Iím my heart I know itís about him and his choices. I know I will look back on this time and be ok with what Iíve done/ havenít done and be at peace with that. Thatís what matters. Itís ages though. This does feel like one of those bags I need to unpack before moving along on my journey.

I definitely want to read the attachment book! Thanks for sharing that. I was stretching on my yoga mat this morning and was trying to pin point parts of my childhood that are making me the way I am right now. (Especially with the attachment that you note). I couldnt recall any dynamic or instance, but doesnít all trauma stem from childhood??? Anyway, Iím not sure therapizing myself works but Iím not opposed to digging deep.

Interestingly, I just got an email from my ex with a cc to his lawyer outlining his thanksgiving travel plans and heís taking the dog because heís his emotional support animal. 2 first class tickets for him and a guest. He intentionally cut out the guests name. Must be nice being broke? The court order states that as soon as he gets back I can get the dog for my make-up time... and ex is trying to push it a few days so the dog can adjust at his home.

Nope...the dog can adjust on my time at his other home with me. Thank you very much.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2872607
11/19/19 08:05 AM
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Hola- Just a blah blah post because I canít sleep.

What an obnoxious two hours it has been. I think Iím going to be wired for a bit.

The weather in my neck of the woods has been extreme with swings of 50 degrees. Today was 93. The pressure inside of my head is having a hard time with the changes and Iím having sinus issues. Basically my head is killing me and itís so dry it hurts to breathe.

So... last night and tonight it is hard to get comfortable because I have my thick warm comforter on my bed but itís 80 degrees in side of my place. The fans donít help and I donít want to turn the air on because itís all messing with my head too. So I just deal with it.

Tonight Around 10pm, Iím trying to get comfortable and fall asleep, but I have a plug in air freshener in the next room8 that is so strong smelling that itís hurting my nose because Iím so dried out. This never happens, Iím usually completely fine with scents. So I get rid of it and get back into Bed.

I then thought to myself..., maybe I could run my diffuser to get a little bit of moisture in the air. I get out of bed, turn on the lights, I pull it out, add some water and plug it in.... I then hop into bed and wait for it to start working..... and nothing. The mist function isnít working but the light function still works. ( Rolls eyes. )

Ok.... so I get out of bed, Drain the water from it and then get back into bed again. I jussstttttttt start to fall asleep when I hear the deafening And echoing chirp of the smoke detector. Nooooooo!!!! Low battery.

That micro-second chirp is just piercing and my heart is racing. The way it echoes in the unit is horrifying. Ughhhhhhh. There are two detectors pretty close together in my unit ( I live in a loft with no official rooms).... so I stand between the two of them to figure out which one it came from.

Itís the one closest to bed.....dang it! I have a sunken bedroom with 12 foot ceilings and no ladder. Every chirp makes my heart race.

These are the detectors that make it pretty impossible to disable so I know I just need to replace the battery which I already know I dont have. Fml.

I go to the garage to see if I by chance have one in my car ( I schlep around supplies for conferences and i know I have at least one in my supply bag).... oh but wait..... my car is in the shop and I have a loaner.

Arg. I can hear my neighbors are awake. The chirping definitely woke them up.

I put on clothes and I track down the overnight security guard on the property who gets me a battery. Now.... I need to somehow change the battery.

I am not going to share what I had to do to replace the battery. I did create a dr Seuss-looking tower of misc odds and ends to stack on top of each other And give me height. It was 10000000% unsafe and i could have seriously injured myself. Not something I want to do again, but holy cow I needed that chirping to stop ASAP.

Ok...so now itís quiet, Iím back in bed for the fifth time tonight and I hope I can sleep. I also now have a step ladder on hold at Home Depot to pick up tomorrow.

But before I sign off.....kind of a funny thing I noticed with ex when I drop off the dog. So, he opens the door just a crack so the dog can walk inside. He always hides behind the door and I donít see his face at all. What I noticed, is that he tries to keep the door cracked as little as possible and my dog has to squuuueeeeeeze through to get in. Iíve had to laugh a couple of times because I cant even imagine what ex is thinking. I actually think he might Be paying attention to something else (like maybe peeking through the peep hole) and not even looking down to see the dog trying to squirm in. JUST OPEN THE DOOR!!! Let him in! Crazy!

Ok- the end. I think Iím ready to fall asleep now. Fingers crossed for no more interruptions.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2872678
11/19/19 08:02 PM
11/19/19 08:02 PM
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Dang that smoke detector saga sounds like a nightmare! They are SO annoying too.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2873726
11/28/19 08:30 AM
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Happy thanksgiving DB land!

Just doing some reflective journaling since I canít sleep. My neighbors smoke detector is now chirping and they arenít home. Why???????? Itís that tone that makes my heart skip a beat every time it chirps. Ughh these walls are way too thin.

Anyway, thanksgiving is a weird holiday for me. It was exís favorite so I always made a big deal for him. With his dietary restrictions, I always made a special meal just for him. It was the only time of year he seemed to genuinely like his family, even if it only lasted 30 mins. We often went back to his home town for thanksgiving, and I never felt comfortable there because he would talk so much crap about them. It was exhausting!!!!! I wonít get into the dynamic but it was no vacation thatís for sure.

We never really had a last thanksgiving before we split. We visited his family the month prior so we chose not to fly out and stayed local instead. Iíve shared this story before, but The night before thanksgiving my car had a really bad flat tire at work and I was stuck there for a couple hours. Ex couldnít help me out because he was with his actor friends and quite frankly couldnít give a crap about me being stranded in a parking garage late at night. Eventually, I got some help from a tow truck driver who helped me get the spare on. (Shame on me for never learning.)

Anyway I got home late- was pretty tired and went to bed. A couple hours later I had severe food poisoning. I remember vomiting My Brains out and laying on the bathroom floor and shivering so much I wrapped myself in a bath towel. I didnít let my ex know for a couple reasons. I needed to handle it, I didnít trust him, I knew I wouldnít get any empathy.

Anyway, long story short, we didnít have a thanksgiving because I was so sick. Looking back, that was a really hard time because I didnít know what exactly was happening. I hadnít officially gotten bd yet, but the writing was on the wall. I just remember pretzeling myself and pretzeling myself and pretzeling myself to keep the peace at home because he was so unhappy. It was a really hard time. I actually am getting emotional right now thinking about how hard that time was. Total mindf**.<

The following thanksgiving, this very board was my refuge. We had separated a few months prior and I didnít have a handle on anything yet. I was still a mess but I popped in here often throughout the day and was able to keep it together. I remember being with my family feeling like such an outsider trying to have the brave face when I was dying inside. I would sneak away to read the boards and check in on a few of my friends here. This place was such a god send and Iím so grateful for this community. Strangers supporting strangers.... itís a beautiful thing.


Anyway, here we are 4 years out from that first solo turkey day and Iím doing much better. I may be wrapping this divorce up in exactly 2 weeks and I canít even believe it. Part of me is nervous that I havenít done all my homework and Iím leaving a lot on the table (I think I am) and the other part of me has zero energy to even look at another legal document. I just want it to be over.

I think when it does officially end, Iíll have a little bit of a breakdown- not in a bad way. I know Iíve carried an obscene amount of stress and anxiety in my body over this situation and there will be a (very good) let down when itís finally over.

Last edited by job; 12/03/19 02:42 PM. Reason: added space between paragraphs

Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2873873
11/29/19 07:06 PM
11/29/19 07:06 PM
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Pax, reading these things always makes me feel so sad for what you have endured, but also that you are out of it. Your ex always seems to hit the NPD bells, not just traits, but the actual condition. I get the wanting to be over. I'm glad for you that after such a long time it is almost done. It will definitely be a time to celebrate.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2873920
11/30/19 01:34 AM
11/30/19 01:34 AM
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A big hug for Pax from Gerda. I too am looking at the past years, holidays and non-holidays, and all the signs I ignored or endured or enabled, all the times I was lonely and alone and not taken care of and thought it was okay to live like that. I am still confused about it. I am not sure if H had as drastic a change as I thought. I mean, I am sure it was drastic, but I am wondering now if he was holding it together all those years we were together and finally couldn't do it anymore, or if what he is now really is the opposite of what he was. I mean, it really was a drastic change, and even my kids refer to the two hims as 'good papa' and 'bad papa' or 'old papa' and 'new papa.'

I guess I am realizing that there were a lot more pretzels than I realized, for a lot more years.

I really recommend two books to you, they are helping me a lot. There are some cheesy or corny parts but it is helping me so much to become aware of my wounds, pre and post H, and to start to heal them. One is called, You Can Thrive After Narcissistic Abuse and the other is called, Whole Again.


I believe I will see the bounty of the Lord in the land of the living.
Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2874328
12/03/19 06:46 AM
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Thanks own- I do think there are some npd tendencies for sure. About two years ago I did look into narcissist abuse support groups. My brain was kind of messed up for a bit, but I think I detached enough and am well on the way to recovery. I donít doubt that I also had an attachment style that drew me to him in the beginning.

Gerda, thank you for the hug and the book recommendations. Iíll look into them. Side noteó-Funnily enough I have a couple of unread books On my night stand that I really need to get through... they are all on productivity and efficiency. I laugh at the fact that I havenít touched them yet. Hahaha.

Gerda, honestly Iíve found that reflecting on the past has been helpful. Not that Iím stuck there at all, but I continue to learn from that failed relationship and itís beneficial.


I will say, this was a really good Monday. I worked 10 hours, went and got my dog for makeup time since he was with ex
For thanksgiving, then hosted a work gathering for a few more hours and got to come back to my playful pup. It was pure heaven!

Last night I went to bed actually feeling genuinely grateful that this divorce process has gone as slow as it has because I do feel like I got some control back. I want this divorce, itís the best thing for me. Thereís no way on earth I would go back and I choose that.

If this divorce happened any sooner, I would have felt like he still controlled the situation and I was robbed of the marriage. If it happened any sooner I suspect I would have had some bitterness to work through.

I think heís a (insert expletive) and Iím glad to be done with it. T-minus 10 days until itís over for good!!


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2874548
12/04/19 10:43 AM
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congrats Pax on your hard-earned peace of mind. good for you! very proud of you!! xoxoxo


M 20+ T25+
BD 4/6/15
D Final 12/23/16


ďYour task is not to seek for love, but merely to seek and find all the barriers within yourself that you have built against it.Ē - Rumi
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2874666
12/05/19 12:43 AM
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Counting down with you Pax. Almost there.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2874698
12/05/19 03:08 AM
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Pax - better days are coming your way! You have been through it all girl.

The future is yours.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875057
12/06/19 11:14 PM
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Thank you all so much! I appreciate it.

So today, Iím just looking for feedback from non-partial bystanders...
Iím not certain yet, but Iím starting to prep my myself mentally for trial. My hope that weíre going to settle is slim to none. From what Iíve read, going to trial is not as terrifying as I imagined. What do you think?

Also... Iíve realized that Iíve done so much by the book that I really havenít created wiggle room for negotiation. Any negotiations would be a loss for me based on what I should get (ie: half equity, half savings, etc). My lawyer was encouraging me to put the abortion stuff back in there and call out how he didnít do his fiduciary responsibility as my husband by funding her abortion, giving her petty cash, etc so I could have a little leverage.

Hmmm. What thoughts do you have?

And Iíve consulted my lawyer... Iím looking for another perspective. Thanks in advance.

Last edited by Pax_luv; 12/06/19 11:15 PM.

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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875062
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I don't think the trial will be that bad. Your lawyer should be able to walk you through. Family matters are different. When you are dealing with someone who is so narcissistic, I think it is inevitable. If you have never googled negotiating with a narcissist, then you should. They literally aren't capable. He needs the judge to tell him how it is going to be.

The lawyer in me says go with your lawyer. The woman in me says do the honorable thing, even if they didn't. It isn't a lot of money and could make look bad with the judge. My guess is that he will reveal what an a$$ he is by himself and you pointing this out only sullies you.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875085
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Yeah but you should be reimbursed half of the money spent on her abortion etc. It gives you something you can give up so the narcissist can feel like he ďwonĒ.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875094
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Than you thank you. I agree with both of you. Itís tough.
Hereís the other part-
I feel like Iíve finally gotten ex off my back a little bit. Iíve been 99.9999999% no contact except for dog issues and itís rare to have to even discuss the dog.

If I put in the abortion, he will flip his lid. I donít need to poke the bear. He canít have anyone know that heís not the innocent golden boy he portrays himself to be.

I donít care about the minimal $ that would be reimbursed. In fact, I would pay NOT to awaken the beast. And I donít need him thinking that I care about him at all.... he would definitely think I called him out, out of spite.

I am making up how the next steps will go... I hope Iím not right. But I see this ending with us going to trial, then him selling the house. He will move away because nothing is keeping him here and his MO is to cut and run... and he will try to take the dog with him.

I say that, because those are the chess moves that he will take to ensure he tries to (Appear to) win. I wonít say more than that but that would 100% be the next play in his playbook. I hope he proves me wrong.


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D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875099
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The dog is the only way he can hurt you. Of course he will use the dog. What would happen if you let him have the dog? Sounds like he treats the dog well. If you were willing to walk away from the only thing that he could hurt you with, it may not be as much fun for him. While I understand that would be sad, it really is the only way for you to end this without a spiteful battle. Alternatively you could offer him a certain amount of money for the dog. Of course he wouldnít take it, but then you would have set a value for him to match. Perhaps the law has progressed and Iím sure youíve discussed it with your lawyer, but they used to be property. You could put the money toward a rescue dog and save a life by taking back your own. I hope you donít think me callous, but the mental anguish you would save yourself would be huge and if the dog is well cared for I would consider it.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875125
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Oh yes.... he does use the dog as leverage.

Me giving the dog up just isnít an option. Donít get me wrong, I understand itís an animal with a short life expectancy, But we do have a bond. I donít have kids and heís the creature that I get to nurture and care for. Iíve had him since he was a puppy... he got sick on me, he looks to me when he gets scared of loud noises.i have a responsibility to keep him safe and healthy and we sure do have a lot of fun. Heís my fur baby (and I get thereís some unhealthy attachment here, but yeah Iím a crazy dog mom).

But I understand the dog is the only thing keeping ex in my world. He wonít lift a finger for the dog, and yet there I am week after week schlepping the dog back and forth in traffic because the dog is worth it to me. Iíve been doing this since 2016 as thatís when mine and exís relationship blew up... when he realized I wasnít going to sign EVERYTHING over to him. Ive endured it all. Even in that period where ex held the dog hostage for 7 months.

But anyway, Iíve thought about what would happen if I gave the dog up. I understand itís an option, but itís not the option for me and I know that my decision will keep me stuck for a bit. Actually last night, I had a really really big cry over it. For one, Iím not feeling well and two, I canít even imagine having to willingly say goodbye to this dog. I canít do it. Last night, the pup could tell I wasnít myself and he didnít leave my side. He snuggled next to me all night. Heís up against me right now. He knows when Iím not well.

In my state, dogs are treated like children and not property so I think I have that going For me. That law came into play this year. My lawyer shared it with me when it became active. Heís a big dog lover too and has been looking out for my pup as well.

Itís weird how things can shift in a few days. I was sooooo optimistic a few days ago and I think I got lost in the fantasy of this being done. I think I was imagining ex saying,Ēíoh thank you pax for not gouging me and being very fair with this settlement. Let me sign right here and we can go on our merry way!Ē Hahahahaha. Too many hallmark movies for me.

I hope Iím wrong, but like I mentioned in my previous post, The reality hit me that thereís a slim to none chance weíre going to settle. I canít see ex all of a sudden being willing to settle for something that is 84 times higher than his very first and best offer to me waaaaaayyyy back when he tried to settle without financial disclosures.

Thank you own for your continued insight and feedback. I very much appreciate it.

Last edited by job; 12/07/19 06:36 PM. Reason: edited a word for Pax

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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875127
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Pax,

Others may say not to even consider what I am about to share w/you, but it may help you decide how to negotiate a deal concerning your dog.

Here is what I ended up doing at the last minute w/my xh. Before my hearing back in 2002, we all sat in the same location, so I took a gamble and told my STBX that I wanted $10,000 from his IRA account and that the money could be applied against what I would end up using towards purchasing the home out from under him. I told him that I had enough evidence on him to rock his world and wouldn't hesitate to tell the judge the real reason for the divorce, i.e., adultery and I would not hesitate to name the affair partner. He didn't blink an eye....I got exactly what I wanted because he didn't want his "soul mate's" name and his dirty laundry to come to light.

My lawyer wasn't aware until the last minute that I was going to lay down all of my cards. He kept saying that he wouldn't go for it, but I thought, nothing ventured, nothing gained. It was a gamble, but he was so desperate, I think he would have given me more if I had requested it, but I didn't want to push too hard. Sometimes, when dealing w/STBXs, we have to go the extra mile to get to the other side of a divorce/custody issues.

You may have to pull that final ace out of your deck and advise him that you will expose the abortion and his dirty laundry if he's not willing to give you full custody of the dog. He's been jerking you around for many, many months about your fur baby. He is just being a pain in the @ss and is enjoying keeping the dog away from you. He wants you to beg and plead because it is control and manipulation on his part. He knows that you've been trying to keep the peace, but when divorce and custody issues are on the table, there are times when you need to listen to your head and not your heart. This is a business deal that has soured and if you want your dog, then you are going to have to pull that ace and play it to the fullest. Trust me, if this were the other way around, your h would be playing his entire hand against you and he wouldn't give a fig about it.

Just my two cents.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875129
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Oh wow job! Im super glad that move was a success for you. Very interesting food for thought. Thank you for sharing that. Iím going to percolate on that a bit.


Oh and I have an edit on the post above. It wasnít 84 percent, I meant 84 times. (Ie the true value at hand is 84 times what his highest settlement offer was)


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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875130
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I agree with the idea behind Job's idea but I wonder if you could do something that would not give H the power. Job's idea worked amazingly but it was a real gamble!

For example -- Find the most amazing dog of the same age as yours who is at death's door on a rescue site and send listing as a Bcc so he thinks you are sending it to a lot of people with a message -- "A friend just sent me this, I wonder if anyone is interested in saving this wonderful dog?"

I don't mean that you should do that particular idea but I just wonder if can be a little more strategic and have love and confidence fuel your thinking on this instead of fear. We all know that MLCers do not negotiate and they often want to hurt us. If you really don't think your H loves your dog the way you do, he is probably doing this to keep the power and/or to hurt you. Mine is doing that to me by trying to keep me from buying him out at appraised value -- he would get the same money either way and get it sooner but he wants to rip my life apart.

If not, I think your clarity is good -- that you understand you are opening yourself up to this pain and the dog is worth it to you. You know that your dog's life will not be as long as yours and you are okay with sharing your dog with this man though it hurts you because of the love you feel for the dog. Just as long as you are clear. And I would put something in the settlement, if you don't end up getting H another dog somehow, that the dog comes to you when s/he is sick, and that the dog can't be shared during periods of illness, esp for when your dog gets old and infirm.

And on the fifth hand, there is a whole chapter in that book I keep talking about about how we can be released from the fears of what the narcissist is going to do next. Your post looks like came out of that chapter -- a lot of calculating what kind of abuse you will have to face. Maybe better to have peace knowing that you can try to get the dog to be yours alone but that you can face anything H throws at you, you don't have to worry about it in advance, you have confidence you'll be able to do what needs to be done. (Fearful Pot telling Fearful Kettle!)

Last edited by Gerda; 12/07/19 06:26 PM.

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Wait for the Lord with courage.
Be stouthearted, and wait for the Lord.
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875135
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Pax and Gerda,

Yes, what I did was a very, very "ify" gamble that paid off, but I was done being afraid of him and what he would or would not do. I was done w/his playing controlling games. MLCers do not like to lose, but my xh knew that I was not playing and he knew that his soul mate's name would come out along w/the photos that my PI had taken. I took back control of my situation in the nick of time. This strategy may or may not work in Pax's case, but it provides an example of what she may use, but in her own way/situation. Do not be afraid of him or his tactics. He's the one that is out there acting like a putz and being a selfish one at that. You have done nothing wrong but show compassion and attempting to work w/him on everything.

Pax, your h isn't going to give that dog up w/o a fight. In fact, if you were to put something out there about another dog, he would definitely suggest that you get it for yourself and not the other way around. As for finding him another dog just so that you can have your fur baby back...that's not going to work. Again, he would say you need to keep the replacement for yourself. He is a selfish, spoiled little brat in the sandbox.

MLCers are selfish people, i.e., just like that little tot in the sandbox that wants all the toys that another little one is playing with. When that selfish tot sees that the other little one has moved on to something else, that is when the selfish one will give up all of those toys he/she has taken. What I'm suggesting is that when you cease showing that you want your fur baby, i.e., showing that you just don't care any longer, maybe that is when he will decide the game is up and lose interest in keeping the dog for himself.

You know your h better than anyone. You know what he is capable of, especially at the present time. This situation is one that you need to sit and think about. Try to remember, you have nothing to fear but fear itself and of course, nothing ventured, nothing gained.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875172
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So Pax, I think I know your state and you confirmed it with the law thing, so some food for thought.

No matter how this works out, you are giving it serious thought and consideration. You are digging in to decide how important this is to you. I hope that you did not cry because of what I wrote, but if you did, I think it was a good cry to help you reach your feelings about this.

But, I will say, that people are either capable of loving animals or they aren't. It is more about you than the animal. If you love this dog this much, you would love another as much or more, especially if not tied to an exceedingly unpleasant person and a likelihood of ongoing battles, keeping him in your life, and likely huge financial issues (I can see him taking you to court over and over about this dog). That said, this is your decision and you have to do what you believe in.

The law says that interim orders affecting the dog are not to have any impact on the final determination. I'm not sure why you have been doing all the work to take and pick up the dog. Seems he should be sharing in this. So I would at least bargain for that. Just as parents of children can't up and move, he should not be able to up and move with your dog. It doesn't mean he won't, he probably will, because he absolutely uses this dog to hurt you over and over again. This is why I can see you ending up in court over the care, housing, and maintenance of this dog moving forward.

I understand what Job is saying and the way to beat a narcissist is to make them feel like they won. I don't think that using the abortion as leverage will achieve that trick though. I think for a normal human who experiences shame, it might. But that is not your guy. I think it will enrage him and make him out for more blood than he already is. If there is something else that you can give him that he does value (whether a thing or money) that you do not value as much, I would do it. Even if it was a lot of money. I think he will sue you over and over about this dog. Narcissists love court. Its why they don't settle. They also like filing actions after seeming finality. So whatever it costs you to have a final decision now that you can live with. I would try to get there.

At any rate, your final orders concerning this dog should address as much as possible, leaving as little as possible open to interpretation. You know he will claim that this is his emotional support dog and he needs it more. Just be armed with materials that show how this emotional support thing has been over done and be ready to point out that even if he needs a dog full-time, he doesn't need your dog full-time, and that is a bigger reason to give you the dog, since he can't share it.

Make sure you cover not only who pays for food/vets--regular and special (teeth), diseases, chemo, etc. Who makes end-of-life decisions about the dog. What the visitation schedule is, how much variance from the allotted time (at least 30 minutes I would say), who picks up/drops off. Who makes the call on vet appointments, immunizations, etc. (this guy doesn't cooperate with you, you don't want to have to work it out). Who picks the food the dog eats. Does it have to be the same food both places. What kinds of collars, leashes. Can the dog be around other animals, etc. Also what about relocation, voluntary or involuntary. You may want to talk about having a special master appointed (like a mediator) who makes the call when you guys can't agree. Something that limits the judicial review. Like you can each give a one page statement to the mediator on your position and the mediator makes the call kind of thing. Also, try to get a loser pays attorney fees provision added so that he has less incentive to sue you for stupid things.

I can't stress enough that because this dog is going to be the way he gets to you, you need to plan ahead. Also remember, whatever decision you make, it is your decision and you had the power. You are not his victim and whether you keep the dog or not, he has not beaten you if you are doing what is best for you.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: OwnIt] #2875173
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OwnIt,

I really liked your posting. You've given Pax quite a bit to think about. The list of things that need to be addressed concerning the dog, etc. are great.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875393
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Thank you so much for the feedback.

Own, I sincerely appreciate you taking the time to jot down all that you have. Just.... thank you. It was very helpful food for thought.

I did go to my lawyer about all the details in regards to the dog and he understands my stance. He doesnít want me to get ahead of myself, but he does get it. He did mention that the trial likely wouldnít be set until late summer or early fall and that we could have until then to work something out. But obviously we have to start with square one first.

I am very anxious about how this is going to go. Iím ok, but my heart is racing.... ughhhh I have a few more days to get through. I should try to calm myself down.

I had two people tell me in the last 4 days that Iím gaining weight. Freaking awesome. I know Iím not as svelte as I was when I was training for my body building comp, but it doesnít feel good to be called out for my appearance. I know Iím not bad, but Iím not as I was. Iím definitely not working out. I have had zero energy and thatís affecting me. Plus I know I have a lot of cortisol in my system to blame. Itís been a stressful 6 months. Bleh.

Oh and my friend just lost her dog to a tragic accident. She is devastated. I so feel for her right now. Whenever we go out, we always bring our pups with us. Itís just so sad. Donít know why I needed to share that here... obviously dogs are on my mind and I know how much they can mean to people.


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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875409
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Pax, did you ever read about the Stockdale Paradox? He was a POW and survived years of torture and captivity. In explaining how he survived, the following emerges: you have to have faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties, and at the same time, must confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be. The optimists in the camp, the ones who were sure they would be out in a month or two or whatever, didn't make it out. Don't give yourself a timeline you don't control and don't minimize the obstacles that you have in front of you.

The reality is, that you will get through this last part of the process. You are not in control of how long it will take, but it will end. You will have a beautiful life when it is over. You are making the choice for how you want to handle your dog. You are going to do that with eyes wide open of what you need to resolve and how you will handle enforcement down the road. None of this needs to be decided today.

In addition to recognizing the truths of the Stockdale Paradox, consider exercise as a means to combat the anxiety. It will also help with the weight. I'm surprised that people said something to you about it, but it was likely out of kindness and concern. Remember too that when it comes to the scale, that diet is significantly more important than exercise. I was morbidly obese and no one, except OD, ever said anything about my weight. I think had people expressed concern earlier, I might have done something earlier. Instead it was OD criticizing and it turned into a control thing. All problems are easiest if we handle them when they are small. Do your own evaluation and consult your doctor. Are you overweight? Is it a health concern? Does it bother you? If you answer yes to those, then do something about it, but don't stress more over whether to do something about it.

I'm sorry about your friend's dog and I'm sure it pulls you back to your situation, but none of us have any certainties in this life. We all have obstacles and challenges that we have to get around, over and through.

You are resilient Pax, you just need to remember that. You have stood up to him and won some important battles in this war and those will come to fruition when you get to the trial. Instead of slogging through this last part, start looking at it as preparing for the day it is over. Put your energy into the future, and not the past.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875428
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Thanks again, Own! Ahh yes, stockdale paradox. I just had this conversation with my mother last night. Basically, i think Iím burnt out and exhausted. From all of it. Iíve been hyper vigilant for far too long. It feels like like Iím opening Pandoraís box again and I have ptsd from last time. Iím just not looking forward to this, but will remain strong.

Oh and the weight thing... Iím on the lean/normal/optimal side of the BMI scale... so Iím healthy.... but Iím so psychologically messed up right now- I care what people think about me...

Iím like... canít I just BE for a bit..... stop judging me everybody. I donít feel good about myself, but everyone expects me to show up a certain way. Aka I care about others approval too much and Iím trying to grow beyond that.


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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875456
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I realize my last post was whiney. I donít like feeling like Iím being judged. Meh. Iíll get better.


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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875457
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I didn't think it was whiny.

Hypervigilence is difficult for anyone who has lived through an extensive period of trauma. If you are HWP, then it makes no sense that people should comment on your weight or appearance. If those are friendships you value, I would discuss how that made you feel. If they are not, I'd not give much weight to the comments, and maybe revisit whether you need that person in your life.

But remember, you are the only one who can take the comment and turn it into a judgment. Don't give people that power over you. Take any needed criticism that comes your way, and reject that which is clearly inapplicable or mean-spirited.

Yes, blows hurt when they land. That's why it's always good to cogitate and vent, so you can respond rather than react. Time helps that.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875832
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Letís just say the days leading up to todayís hearing have been wrought with the same oleí drama and shenanigans from ex and his camp.

Honestly, I donít even know how his lawyer gets away with this stuff! So unprofessional. As my lawyer suspects, exís lawyer seems to be a nice guy, but ex seems to be the puppet master and my lawyer canít figure out why.

I donít know why I expected anything different. Sigh.

Needless to say, I am pretty anxious this morning. The hearing is not until this afternoon so I have a couple more hours to endure before I physiologically get back to center. This [censored].

Canít get into it right now but Ex is up to his same BS. Deep breaths. I know Iíll get through this.


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I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
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Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875864
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Thinking of you - chin up. You will get through it, and however it turns out, you will be freer at the end. Yay!

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: kml] #2875898
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I will be thinking of you this afternoon. Good luck and no matter what happens, you will definitely have the load lifted quite a bit off your shoulders.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875933
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Wishing you luck and light today, Pax. You've got this.


W 31 | H 29
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Married 3
S2

BD | June '19
Separation | July '19
OW confirmed | October '19
I filed | December '19

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875981
12/13/19 05:40 AM
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Pax_luv Offline OP
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Thank you so much! Appreciate the support and positive vibes.

It wasnít as horrible as I imagined, but we are going to trial. Not surprising.

The mediator caught on pretty quickly and said it seemed like ex had been primed and, as such, the mediator was suspicious. The mediator started the convo by touting his amazing track record for settling tough cases and within 15 minutes was saying, no way are you guys going to settle. He even called exís lawyer an a**h***. Thatís what weíre dealing with here.... welcome to the party....

If any of you recall details from my story from like a year or two ago.... ex brought up the stupid beanie again. He wants a beanie back that he thinks I have. And itís an item in our litigation. Sigh.

Should I just go on amazon and buy him 50 beanies?!?!

I couldnít even believe it came up in the division of property/assets. Oh my word.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875985
12/13/19 07:29 AM
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A beanie?! That is nuts.

Itís unfortunate the mediation didnít work out, but it sounds like it was doomed to fail.

How long until trial?


W 31 | H 29
Together 8
Married 3
S2

BD | June '19
Separation | July '19
OW confirmed | October '19
I filed | December '19

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875988
12/13/19 07:51 AM
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Oh and some other thoughts-

Through an interesting circumstance, ex and I ended up sitting across from each other while the mediator and lawyers were getting situated. He has gone through great lengths over the years to avoid eye contact with me except for the few times heís scolded me. Iíve mentioned in other sharings that he often has his sunglasses on when heís around me to avoid eye contact as well. So today as we were sitting there, he was doing his usual fidgety business, but I was feeling pretty strong and I was checking him out. I can look at him and I can make eye contact. I was paying attention to his features trying to recognize the man I once knew, But he wasnít there.

I didnít see someone who looked terribly happy. He was dressed well, like how he used to dress before his Abercrombie phase that was followed by his sons of anarchy biker phase. He did have a lot of facial hair like a mini beard which isnít anything he used to have. His eyes though...i could see it in his eyes that something was off. Like it happens to all of us... heís gotten older and he now looks his age. I wonder if the beard was to cover it up. Also his hair was a lot darker than I remember. I donít know if heís getting much sunlight or if heís coloring it... or if it just darker period.

Also, I genuinely felt bad for him. He has an issue with elevators which is problematic. He uses them, but today he didnít/couldnít. And a lot of folks snickered when they heard that he was waiting downstairs bc of the elevator issue. In my heart I felt bad for the guy because I want nobody to be laughed at for something out of control. Then Iím reminded that itís ex and it could be an act, like as a way to set the stage to keep saying my dog is his support animal. Sad, but true. Regardless if it was ex or a complete stranger... I donít like when people are laughed at and my heart hurt for him for a little bit.

Maybe I just saw him as a hurt young boy today. True, he doesnít want to face reality and his actions have put him in a precarious situation (the mediator mentioned my ex did something that could be considered criminal), but as we know, hurt people hurt people. In my heart I want to believe that this whole thing has blown so far out of proportion that he doesnít even know how to reel it in because that would require ownership and accountability.

At first, I got a huge chuckle out of the beanie situation getting brought up. But as Iíve reflected on it... I realize thatís all heís got. Itís so minor to me, but itís An issue for him. And maybe that beanie actually did mean something to him. If heís still stuck in MLC, Iím dealing with an 11 year old boy who lost his brother and best friend, having a token from a special time likely means a lot.

So... I found a nearly exact replica (from what I can remember) of the lost beanie on Etsy. I can buy it and ship it to him without a word. Im not sure Iím going to do this, but itís an option. 1) it will get him off my back about the stupid thing and 2) for whatever reason he feels like he needs this beanie. Whether itís to get at me for something or because it is of actual sentimental value to him .. Iím not sure.

Last edited by Pax_luv; 12/13/19 07:57 AM.

Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2875998
12/13/19 10:00 AM
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Pax,

The beanie is a major issue w/him. If you can locate one that is very similar to the one that he thinks you have, I would purchase it. It is a small item and most likely not too expensive...but that beanie means something to him. They all have something that they want to hold on to and to us it's crazy, but to them....it's very important. I think I would give it to him versus sending it to him and I would explain that you don't have the original one, but you were able to find one very similar...otherwise, he will think that you've been holding the original beanie hostage. You have to make it very clear that you do not have the original one, but were willing to locate another one for him because you realized the original beanie was very important to him. He may come to realize that you are telling the truth about the original one and that you went the extra mile to give him another one. Time will tell on how he reacts to this gesture, but it is a gesture of good will.

It's sad when you can see clearly and can see that they are not the same people we loved. His eyes reflect his feelings about himself and the world. He's a very lost man/child and it's going to take him a very long time, if ever, to cross over and become a mature man.

For now, all you can do is pray for him.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2876102
12/13/19 10:08 PM
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Pax,

Well, you had a good idea it wouldn't mediate, and you were right. Glad it wasn't taxing. Now it is just the scales of justice creeping along, but with the expectation of any other result gone, you can instead focus on the ultimate finality. If he comes along before then with a ready-to-go you'd take, then do, but don't keep spending money trying to negotiate with a narcissist. It just doesn't work.

Mediators often communicate with the court afterward. If they deal in the same courts a lot, he may well have signaled to the court where the problem was. All you can do is continue to comport yourself. Great job on getting through.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2876149
12/14/19 04:45 PM
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So now that Iíve had a day to decompress... itís starting to sink in.

The trial will likely be 3 days in the fall, unless thereís a cancellation. I wonít have an official trial date until our next court date in Jan but the judge said they were booking into September already. Iíll pray for cancellations for something sooner.

The reality of the cost of going to trial is sinking in. Iíve been doing ok the last 6 months because of exís sanctions, but those will run out soon and Iíll be stuck scrounging to pay for a 25k trial. Surpisingly enough, the mediator said it would be worth the expense. It freaks me out... it was dire for me for a bit.

The mediator was definitely impartial but he let his feelings about the case be quite known. He thought ex and his lawyer were unrealistic and had a few choice words about them. Who knows what he was saying about me and my lawyer to them....

Anyway, he was very adament about not mediating the dog issue... ďhis time was too valuable for that.Ē But was certain we could come up with middle ground. Sigh.

He didnít understand what exís problem was regarding the house. All Iím asking for is my half of the equity. The mediator was like, I donít get it.... he pays her xxx, he keeps the house and still walks away with an asset worth 4 times what Iím walking with.

The mediator also poked some holes in my stuff too. Things I need to be aware of to protect myself from their arguments.

He mentioned the criminal/ illegal acts my ex did with our finances, and really tried to narrow down what their final # was. See, they didnít propose anything to settle....only that ex got everything. So the mediator said, stop wasting my time now and give me your number. Ex and his lawyer came back with a number that didnít even cover my legal fees to date. It was a hard no from me.

Ok and hereís where Iím reminded of what a petty arse my ex is. As we were dividing furniture, China, appliances etc in the house, basically Iím not wanting anything. Iíve moved on... itís just stuff and anything left is tainted to me. I loved my wedding China and consulted my lawyer on it... but the reality is... itís tainted to me. Marriage did represent something to me. I could have gotten it and sold it, but I donít care about that money. Iím really not trying to nickel and and dime this.

So I said, the only thing I want is a birdhouse my grandfather made (value $0)
And a small copper windmill that was also my grandfathers. The copper may be worth something but thats not why I wanted it.

So the mediator was like fine, great, and exís lawyer was like ďNO! Itís community property, she needs to pay ex half of the value if she wants it.Ē Meanwhile Iím giving ex EVERYTHING else in that house. The greed with these guys is off the charts.

Ok and this is when the beanie came up. (Rolls eyes). Petty petty petty petty.


Alright... so when I go to pick up my dog yesterday, the birdhouse that has been up this whole time is now gone. Yup. Petty petty petty. He knows I wanted it and was making sure I just didnít take it.


And I know you are probably thinking to yourself- why didnít you just get those things when you moved out, pax. Itís because he was the one who packed me up and I didnít even think to go there. I was too emotional. At the beginning of this, it was only supposed to be a temporary separation and I treated it as such. He manipulated me out of the house. I was so so so so stupid.

Lessons learned. Definitely wonít happen again.


Me- 30's H- 40's
T-10 M-5
I moved out b/c he wanted space- June 15
D filed by H: September 16
Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2876150
12/14/19 05:00 PM
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Yes, he is very petty and is acting like a two year old. If your grandfather made those things, then you should have them. They were a gift to you. I just get this impression that he is doing all of this BS to stall things and that he really doesn't want to go through w/a divorce.

I think they all get petty when it comes down to the home and what's in it. It's not about the fact that they really want the items, but the fact that they want control and for us to beg for things. My eh tried that, but he totally forgot who he was dealing with and my kindness and compassion were put on the back burner and the business side of me came out and he knew then, he wasn't going to have an easy time of it in negotiating w/me.

Know one is going to ask why you didn't get those things from the house because we all have made mistakes and many of us tend to think that maybe, just maybe these pod people will show a bit of compassion and give a little. We don't discover that they are complete and utter @sses until it comes down to splitting things up.

Now, you need to put your business suit on and look at this situation from the business side. You've been such a kind and compassionate woman thus far...but this deal sux and you need to toughen up. He wants a beanie, then he gives you the birdhouse. Time to play hard ball.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2876170
12/14/19 08:41 PM
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Pax, it is normal and rational to want to look at these from a point of fairness and balance. He will never be able to do this. Whatever the trial costs, it does not matter. Your guy cannot mediate. You will never settle with him.

Judges split babies. You need to up your request to end up where you should be. I'm delighted his attorney acknowledged the bird feeder and copper windmill are community property, which hasn't been resolved. Guess what, so is everything you "left" behind in the house. Add it all up, all of it on a spreadsheet and be ready to submit it at court. I bet your lawyer could send a demand to inspect the premises (a flavor of a request for production) so you can go and make a list and take pics. Do you want the stuff? No, do you want an offset for the value of the stuff-- YES! Go after half of every single thing he has, because he is going to do the same to you and more.

Why did he take down the bird feeder? Because were your positions reversed he would have taken it, so he expects that you would do the same. Pettiness, yes. But again, this says who he is as a person. Not you. Laugh about it, move on.

I'll wager you may have the same problem with the judge when it comes to the dog. Mediators are there for petty squabbles. That he wouldn't undertake that suggests that the court might not either (not that I'm implying this is a petty squabble, but it speaks volumes that he thought he was above it). Be ready. Emotionally prepare yourself that the dog could be awarded to either of you, or split time with no guidance (which is my biggest concern for you).

I would tell him one more time, I don't have your beanie, I have not seen it. Do not waste my time with it again.

No one questions why you didn't take the stuff. We all survived a tsunami and had to fight to survive. Remember though, at the end of the day, it is just stuff. Memories and relationships are the things that matter. While I hope you get your stuff, try not to put too much of yourself in an outcome you can't control.

Take some time now to relax and move past this part. Get ready by making yourself emotionally tough. Get back in the gym, whatever makes you feel like a warrior.

Re: Divorce and Acceptance Part 4 [Re: Pax_luv] #2876176
12/14/19 09:41 PM
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You can request a "home" visit and have someone there with you so that it can be stated that you didn't walk out the door with stuff, while you are making a list and taking photos. You are entitled to half of everything, as OwnIt has stated. If you don't want the stuff, then come up w/a dollar amount of what it is worth and he can provide you with the cash or deduct it from what you are paying him, etc.

Oh, yeah, I can relate to what OwnIt stated about him taking the bird house down because he thought you would take it. My xh did the same thing w/an older pickup truck. He came and got it while I was at work and I asked why he took it since it had been sitting there for months on end. His response, "I knew you would hide it from me so that I couldn't take it". He's projecting on to you what he would do himself. He's not the man you knew a long time ago.

He needs to look for that d@mn beanie where he's living. Truth be told, he may have tossed the thing out and has forgotten about it.

You are going to have to get stronger and more firmer. Go after what is rightfully yours and if you don't want the stuff, figure out a value on the items, make a list and state what you want in cash. After all, he will do the same thing to you.

New Thread:

Divorce and Acceptance part 5

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