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Hi Blue

A few rambling thoughts.

1) like you, I find myself frustrated with witnessing LBS doormat behavior in the face of an utterly remorseless WAS.

the "fog lifting" and the "affair fog" and the "MLC" terms are phrases that irk the heck out of me at times. Here, You never read about narcissistic behavior that does not improve and or personality disorders that are very hard to treat (so the disordered person is exceedingly unlikely to change)...

2) like Juju, I have not seen any sign of my x awakening at all. On the contrary, he's engaged to his OW and marrying this month, and he is not inviting our kids to the wedding.

To be honest, his not inviting our kids is a relief for me. (My ego would have taken such a hit to feel replaced and have OUR kids with his new wife and new life...and he posts now on facebook and instagram (!!??!) with her and they are "so happy" and "So active"...

But it also suggests that his narrative of our m vastly conflicts with what our children might say up there. (=Truth).

Actually I do think my x has some form of personality disorder b/c his views and statements of "fact" that were proved false yet which he clings to, are just crazy.
So that makes me feel like a real dolt to have spent so much energy on maintaining an illusion...

I KNOW I bought into the db world and saving my marriage like a cult member in a new church, a church that reassured me that what I was seeing with my eyes was not the culmination of years of abusive crap by an increasingly selfish man, with an insatiable ego and need for chaos and - ironically - control,

but was somehow an "MLC fog"...which I often question the value of now.

A part of me is furious at myself (working hard on it in therapy) and a part of me is furious at db for helping me waste a decade of my life putting up with so much deceit and blindly "reframing" h's horrific behavior.

You can argue - and I do - that I benefitted by having that time with my kids and living in a beautiful area of the country then, too. There was a trade off and I'm not a victim.

yet The fact that x sees our m totally differently as if HE is a victim and without regard to deeply wounding the 4 people who loved him the most, reassures me that he's hopelessly screwed up. NO matter what label you put on him, he is bad news for ME.

I want him to have a r with our kids BUT not at all cost. He has hurt them far far more than he will ever know or admit or face or work to amend.


Blue's situation is one which we all thought we wanted...and God knows I credit her h for being one of those rarely seen unicorns who screws up and gets it! AND wants to do the work to undo as much as he can and rebuild what they can!

I wanted that but I mistook x's self pity and missing us, as true remorse and self awareness, which it was not.

Knowing that Blues case is the best case scenario is what newbies must realize. And without a long shared history and kids, and the type of h she has, - who won't flinch when reminded of her pain - I'm not sure many would want to do it.


Just my .02

Blue, keep posting. It matters. And thanks for stopping by my thread.

I don't feel like a success since x has thrown away 35 years of marriage, a woman who loved him deeply and 3 children who deserve so much better than he gave and his integrity - the lying under oath and hiding income OMG OMG, and it seems as if he sees not a single problem with it.

In fact in his narrative I am the villain and he is the victim. It feels insane and infuriating to write and read that, and it kind of is...

hmmm

when I read that^^^ - those are the moments wherein I wonder "maybe I'm just around the corner from seeing what a favor x did by leaving me when he did - (ie when I was so sick -no way to reframe that crappy choice.)

Maybe I have dodged a bullet. My golden years would have been a nightmare and now, instead, I get my turn."

So maybe that's the success part, eh?

Last edited by Cadet; 05/01/18 04:53 AM. Reason: Start a new thread message

M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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25, most of us on here are or were in relationships in which we looked to our lying, cheating spouses for validation that they were not in fact lying or cheating. Of course we were. We didnt want to hear anything else so we grabbed on to that.

Coming here was an easy transition once they left, cause again we were being told what we wanted to hear. That theres a chance they will come back. That we can improve that chance if only we change and make some 180s. Hope as long as we are capable of turning ourselves into lighthouses.

There were posters here that straight out told me to just let go. That he wasn't worth it and others that left me feeling like I needed to hang on and fight for a marriage my ex had already pulled the plug on.

The theory was that I was not to give up on marriage just because he left and was sketchy, not paying child support etc.. because then i would be doing the same as him. That his reasons for initially leaving, (me not doing his laundry, not being ambitious enough, getting mad when he didnt pick our son up fron preschool at 12 in the afternoon cause i was at work and he slept through alarm clocks consistently) hurt his poor little feelings just as much as his leaving and gaslighting had hurt mine.

That i could not argue against his lack of committment if i myself was to break committment based on his action of leaving. If that makes any sense. (I'm writing from a cell phone)

But here's the thing. I clung to those arguments for a reason. Sure, i debated back that I was not an innanimate object. That he once threw a paperback book at my stomach when i was pregnant cause i was nagging him too much about saving money instead of going to expensive football games.

But i still clung. And im annoyed that I clung for as long as i did.

My ex is an empty, addict, narcissist. But like yours had a high IQ and dressed well and was quietish so i never believed it was possible. But like yours is, they are simply bad people.

Sometimes I think we just need to hear that instead.... they are bad people.


M: 42
H: 43
Twins age 5
WAH in summer
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I am a newcomer and I'm finally starting to realize how much of a doormat I've been. And I feel really stupid. To answer you're question of "why does someone want a person back that has treated them so badly?" I think we are all in denial at first. We can't believe that the person we love so much is actually a bad person. We convince ourselves that they are confused and not the real version of themselves. That they can "be fixed" or return back to the loving people we thought they were. In reality, many of them are just sh'tty human beings and we never realized it in the first place. I'm as guilty as anyone on this board for having that frame of mind, but the more and more I think about it, like a previous poter mentioned, my WW is not "in a fog", she most likely suffers from a serious personality disorder that isn't just going to magically disappear. And I've learned that my kids and I deserve better than that. As much as we come here hoping to find a way to save our M, the real value of this board is coming to the realization that we need to love ourselves and stop worrying about our crappy spouses...


Me: 38
W:31
Kids: S16(mine from previous R), D10, S9, S4
M: 10 years
T:12 years
BD:Jan 3, 2018
W moved out: Apr 13,2018
Filed for D: Jun 2018
D final: Sep 2019

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JujuB - I agree with you. Sometimes we make ourselves jump through amazing semantics to cling on.

Yeh I think there are people who are just bad at this. I mean with the volume of divorces and affairs and all of this, it just makes me believe that we as humans are really adept at f#$#ing this up. However, that becomes a pretty neat excuse because there are tons of us who didn't make that choice.

I wonder how this 'badness' works with WW/WH vs WAS.

In my case, I am not entirely convinced that W is 'bad' per se. I know that she's got a lotta stuff she's never dealt with and didn't have the architecture of being a self-aware and independent person. For that matter, I don't think I was either, but I guess I put some stock in commitment compared to her. Otherwise we wouldn't be here.

So I dunno if she's 'bad' people... I don't want to assign another label to make it sound they're pathetic or pity them in a paternalistic kinda way....

I just think all the $hit that was put under the rug caught up and she wasn't able to handle it all.. and decided that shedding everything including me and the family life was the answer to it.. time will only tell if she was right...

I am also annoyed that I clung for a long time... I just had a breakthrough yesterday and I haven't felt this settled in a long time. I am through and done now.

My W is an anxious stressball with bad self-image issues and now when I look back, it was right there from the beginning - I just didn't see it the way I can see it now.

Last edited by Cadet; 05/01/18 09:11 AM. Reason: Start a new thread message

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“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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