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BluWave Offline OP
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I only have a few minutes, but was thinking about something and wanted to share while it was fresh in my mind.

So most of us are here because we are the LBS, because our S cheated and/or left us for OP, and because we want our M back. we feel terrible about ourselves, we feel hopeless, and we are further desperate for them to come back. We are increasing our cycle of low self esteem and dependency. We feel weaker, we look weaker, and we try harder. So we come to DB land in hopes of a fix.

We read Sandi's rules, and many of us post, only to read 2*4s, and then we feel more like a failure. We just can't seem to do it! All we want is our S back. Why isn't this working? It's not working because we are not actually doing it at all. I see many of you reading, posting, and reading and posting, but you are not actually doing it--you are not letting go, stepping back, going dark, 180, GAL, detaching, and to make matters worse, you are then beating yourself up for your failures. ... and round and round you go. ...

Haven't we all heard the stories of the people that cheat and then the W/H kicks them to the curb and moves on??? What does the cheater do? And why do they do it? ... The H/W that was cheated on are not posting here? Why??? Think about it for a minute. They have their S begging for forgiveness and to come back? What is different? Just chew on that for a few minutes ...

Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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Once again, great post Blu!! Thank you for the positive feedback!! I have not let go enough or been dark enough...I have kept up with GAL which helps so much!

Thanks again!


W:42 M:48
T:9 yrs M:1yr
BD: Feb 2016
EA Confirmed: Feb 2016/PA July 2016
D: Feb 2017

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I agree Blu, in retrospect if I would have gone completely dark after having confronted my W on her cheating I would have sent the message that I am not going to put up with that behavior and that I am worth it. Instead I talked ad nauseum about it with her and conveyed a mixed message and weakness. Nobody is attracted to weakness.


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T:8, M:5
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Startof NC 7/22/16
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It can feel hard not to know what to do for the best when we feel so desperate to hold on to the R. When I saw XH after BD, I could see that he looked kind of pleased that there were two women both wanting to be with him. That and the reading I did at the time convinced me that I needed to take myself out of the mix.

He said that when we met he felt swept away by love for me and wanted to hold my hand. I told him that we would not have any sort of romantic R whilst he was in a R with someone else. I actually haven't seen him since that day and he decided to D me and is still with OW as far as I know. I'm not saying all of this was a fail - because it was good in the main way it should be - for my own sanity and self-respect.

Now I feel if XH and OW want to be together in all those circumstances, and with such an awful start to the R - I wish them best of luck...

Xx


T 13 M 7
Me 48 H 46
SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
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Originally Posted By: BluWave
Haven't we all heard the stories of the people that cheat and then the W/H kicks them to the curb and moves on??? What does the cheater do? And why do they do it? ... The H/W that was cheated on are not posting here? Why??? Think about it for a minute. They have their S begging for forgiveness and to come back? What is different?


I think it's a natural fight or flight reaction. Those people that "fly" as you described above are getting away from the pain. Meanwhile, those of us that choose to "fight" have to continue to endure the pain.

Sure, flying away may lead to the WS coming to chase after us, but I feel that it doesnt actually solve any problems or lead to any growth. I think we grow BECAUSE of the pain, not in spite of it.

When I first experienced BD, I would have done anything to save that marriage. But having gone through the pain and struggle and come out for the best, I imagine that the remaining years I have left will be better for this experience. If my old marriage was a 7, I intend to make sure my next one is a 9. It isnt my fault that my ex didnt want to join me in it.

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Someone in another post referred to me as a celebrity, and while I am slightly flattered, lol, I am more so feeling a need to be more cautious with what I post! Please don't think that because my H came back--and I have turned the table so to speak, as he is now the pursuer and I the distancer--that this means I am an expert. Not at all! Like I said, I blew it. I blew it often and for a long time. However, when I did finally let go--started to plan a life without him, stopped spewing, and allowed myself to focus on other things, he quickly turned around.

Knowing what I know now about our history and timeline, if I had followed DB principles and Sandi's rules from day one, I don't think H would have ever left. We have talked about everything and I can see story line with clear lenses now. Don't get me wrong, it would have been tough and the recovery still gruesome, but I do not think we would have separated and he would have not have ran to OW. We were separated for almost a year, and I put a lot of energy into thinking about him and his every move, I was emotionally devastated and spewing, and I didn't allow myself enough time to step back and reflect on me and what I could change about myself. Not to win him back, but for me I mean.

So let me clarify why I say what I do about those people that kick their cheating spouse to the curb. Sure, if you cling on (which most posters do), that doesn't work. You are needy, you are desperate, and you further give your S reasons to leave you. I am not suggesting that by turning your back on them and having them chase you, that that alone will restore the M. Not at all.

Here is the difference. Those that have enough confidence to say, "I deserve better than this, and I am not putting up with a cheating spouse," are able to begin the process of detachment sooner. Is it healthy to "fly" away, close the door on the M, and never reflect back on what happened? No, not at all. These are not mutually exclusive. But is it more healthy to allow detachment sooner and accept the end of the M, while also reflecting on your part in the M, and simultaenously putting up boundaries? Does that also lead to being the better option and more attractive to your S down the road? I think so.


Blu


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At one point I kicked WH to the curb, exposed him and OW to their families and felt everything was copacetic. This resulted in WH taking the affair underground (secret second phone, going dark for days without talking to the kids) and even more damage being done. My coach was even frustrated with me, he felt my approach was vindictive and further enforced my WH's belief of my hardness.

I think the trick is to lovingly detach. Too often kicking the cheating spouse to the curb is done in a harsh and self righteous manner, thus making the path back home too bumpy. I was a member of another board and was following their suggestion to put down hard lines and were cheering me on. I felt (at the time) that I was justified in my actions. But I lost focus of my goal, which was to not just save my M but to build a better one with WH. I think it set me back at least 6 months. What's my point? Not 100% sure but there are parts of the technique that weren't working for me so I had to adjust my method.


M 10yrs T 13yrs
BD #1Oct 2015-PA between WAH and COW
BD #2 April 2016-WH resumed PA, she broke it off
Jan 2 2017 WH says he wants divorce
April '17-Letting go
2018 D busted
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Originally Posted By: Kaizen
Originally Posted By: BluWave
Haven't we all heard the stories of the people that cheat and then the W/H kicks them to the curb and moves on??? What does the cheater do? And why do they do it? ... The H/W that was cheated on are not posting here? Why??? Think about it for a minute. They have their S begging for forgiveness and to come back? What is different?


I think it's a natural fight or flight reaction. Those people that "fly" as you described above are getting away from the pain. Meanwhile, those of us that choose to "fight" have to continue to endure the pain.

Sure, flying away may lead to the WS coming to chase after us, but I feel that it doesnt actually solve any problems or lead to any growth. I think we grow BECAUSE of the pain, not in spite of it.

When I first experienced BD, I would have done anything to save that marriage. But having gone through the pain and struggle and come out for the best, I imagine that the remaining years I have left will be better for this experience. If my old marriage was a 7, I intend to make sure my next one is a 9. It isnt my fault that my ex didnt want to join me in it.


Terrific post. I agree.

We all contribute to marriages, but remember, we are ALL flawed humans. One of the biggest contributions to a marriage you can give is to forgive your spouse. For little and big things. If you hold resentment and anger within you for your spouse not being perfect, or not doing what YOU want, you are doomed. The marriage is doomed. And you will live a very sad existence.


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M15 T17
D20, S19, D13
M - Addiction since 1998
W EA/PA #1 2013/2014
W EA #2 June 2015...
BD 1 Big D talk 9/15
BD 2 - EA/PA disc 10/30/15
Served D 1/22/16
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BluWave Offline OP
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I think you all bring up really good points. If I could do things over again, I would have done things very differently. I can think back to so many moments--leading up to BD and after BD--that I did the opposite of what is advised here. I would have kept my emotions under wrap in front of him and shared them with safe and supportive people. I would have taken more actions that would help with detachment much sooner.

And yes, I would have kicked him to the curb. I don't mean in an aggressive sense or to be vindictive. I would have stood tall and matter of factly told him that I don't want to be in an M with infidelity and that he should leave. Then I would go dark and focus on myself and kids. At that time I could in no way "lovingly detach" because the A was a huge assault on me and our M. It's just not realistic and I can't (and will never) ignore my feelings.

I agree that we are all flawed and that we all contribute to problems in the M. No one is perfect and I know I have screwed up a lot. But this comparison is apples and oranges. Choosing to have an A with your wife's "friend" and then breaking apart your family, are choices I cannot respect. They are life changing and very difficult to overcome. The only honerable thing to do would have been to let go of him and move on. If he decided to end his A, make changes on himself, and (only) then decided to recommit to the M, that would have been the time to decide if I could be with him. To simply accept that he was imperfect and let him stay in that state of mind, would have been foolish. And It doesn't work.

While he did go through this process--of ending A and self reflection--it was much more bumpy, and I think that was because I didn't let go. I was emotional or angry and he ran further away from me and towards her. I also think I let him back too soon and too quickly. In terms of holding anger and resentment, sure those things need to be worked on and overcome, but we owe it to ourselves to put ourselves first. DB is all about focusing on the self, and so by letting someone cheat, hurt, and walk all over you, you are in turn being a doormat. No one respects the doormat and it feels worse to be one!

Kaizen, I can relate to what you mean about going through pain. In many ways I think I am stronger for what I have learned and been through. I hope over time I can be a better partner too, but the forgiveness piece cannot be forced. The M still needs to be healed and redefined and I see that this can take longer than I ever understood before. When I was just focused on if and when he would come back, I didn't allow myself to do the hard work that I have been doing now.

Blu


“Forgiveness liberates the soul. It removes fear. That is why it is such a powerful weapon.” – Nelson Mandela
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I like this thread.

I really need to start my own thread. Basically I caught my wife in 2/16, almost a year ago. Affair with coworker.

She still works with him. Many forums I've been to recommend her quitting immediately. She admits she should've done that, but her IC and our MC (since fired) said she should stay due to finances and it would show her running away from the issue.

I've dealt with them working together for an entire year. Breaking point a few weeks ago where I demanded she quit. MC started chastising me. I blew up at MC. We got so heated at the MC session that we both agreed it would be a good idea to separate.

Since then, we saw a new MC and he's allowed me to vent properly to W about the work sitch. W has promised to leave once her private business takes off, which should be no more than 6 months. She will quit regardless.

I wanted to tell his wife. Old MC insisted it would be a bad idea. New MC says its definitely something I can do, but need to talk to him first. I kinda see WHY it would be a bad idea, citing PsySara's post above - how its punishing them. My wife is a super-religious woman who said when I first found out, she wanted to end her life. She said she could never handle the fallout from friends and family if everyone knew. Her reputation would be destroyed and any chance of her own business taking off would end.

I admit my faults in all this. Hell, I may have cheated on me if she treated me the way I treated her. We're working our butts off making this work, though. 30 years together is a lot to throw away.

Looking forward to more on this thread.


Me: 52
Her: 48
2D 26 & 16
M: 25 years (together 30)
EA/discovered by accident Valentines day 2016
Admitted SOME physical but no IC.
We know that's a lie.
Status - tryin to R
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