The gift of time I received wasn't due to my MLC/WW being indecisive. It had to do w/ a critical health issue of a family member. That issue has resolved, and so the gift of time has run out. Things are in flux, starting now.
During this time, I was very supportive of my MLC/WW and as a result we returned to a relatively warm rapport. But the signal is still clear to me that she's not interested in any type of reconciliation. It's not a surprise to me.
I have done a modest job of detaching, although I have had bad days. And I recognize that the worst is probably yet to come. Still, I feel that the gift of time has allowed me to see my MLC/WW a bit more objectively. My infatuation with my MLC/WW has settled a bit. If there had been no time, a divorce would have been more crushing, I think.
I don't know if I DB-ed all that well. I think I'm too knee deep to have any objectivity about it. I can say the voices and ideas in this forum has constantly challenged me, as well as comforted me at times. I'd like to think that I've become a firmer, steadier presence in my (broken) marriage. And I'm learning to weather my MLC/WW's emotional storms somewhat better.
It's hard to know exactly what the right thing to do is. Especially with people reporting that DB coaches suggest a sunnier, warmer approach; while forum vets advocate a more militaristic, austere protocol of detachment and cake-bashing. Maybe the wisest approach takes from both concepts. My tack for the next few days is to just listen and observe, to get a better sense of what direction my MLC/WW is taking. Then I will plot my own course.
Me: 50, MLC/WW 45 Young kids Nov 2015: BD1 Apr 2016: BD2 Jan 2017: W filed Feb 2017: D final
ForGump - I had thought there might have been a health crisis in your family. I am glad to hear that it has passed.
Regarding your last bit - I'm not really sure what the "right" thing to do is. Our old friend CT1118 has done a lot of writing that I expect you have read as well. Fascinating stuff even if a bit philosophical even for me. There are a lot of contradictions out there on these forums and elsewhere. Inevitable because we are all individuals. For me I think that a lot of it is based on my interpretation of what my lawyer advised me 6 months go "Don't be an @ss". A simple 4 word set of instructions. I like to think that when I look in the mirror that I like the man that I see there and am proud of how I have acted. Yes, I'm very much one of the softer approach people even though I've not had the benefit of DB coaching. It's just who I am.
In Mathematics I was taught a methodology that perhaps might help you. You start in two directions. First you start from the answer you want and work backwards. Then you start with your original assumptions, those things that you KNOW and work forward. On a good day they meet in the middle. For me, the end point keeps shifting around multiple potential outcomes which if you've followed my thread you know that I am struggling with. The forward direction though has been largely consistent with a few mid-course adjustments.
It's certainly easier for me to do this without my W around and with no kids at home. I'm only accountable to myself.
Best of luck my friend. 2017 will be our year to get out of this mud.
On BD H52, W50 T27, M26 S21, D23 BD-9-Mar-16 D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18 I am a storyteller. The story may do you no good. But a story is never for the listener. It is always for the one who tells
Small phrases give me much to think about. Yes, I'd like to look in the mirror and feel proud of how I acted. Don't be an @ss is a good one. I have been an @ss on occasion, so I recognize it's an on-going struggle. Sometimes you do little dumb things, and realize you've backed yourself into a corner. And sometimes "the right thing" isn't so clear until in hindsight. I can say I've always had the best intentions, and never acted with any malice or petty feelings.
I think a big potential point of contention coming up will be the MBR issue. I don't want to get into the details of how it came to be, but the aforementioned health issue has put the MBR issue into flux, and we will have to come to a new agreement. I never felt very territorial about parts of the house, and I'm not a big nester, but I have come to feel a need to make a principled stand on the MBR (although I have continuing, niggling doubt that it's petty to care about it).
There is a loud, conflict-avoider voice in me that says just go w/ the flow, but I feel like I'm too accommodating on that front. I do want the MBR, and I don't want to be a refugee in my own house. But how to do it w/o sounding petty ... I'm not sure.
Me: 50, MLC/WW 45 Young kids Nov 2015: BD1 Apr 2016: BD2 Jan 2017: W filed Feb 2017: D final
The gift of time I received wasn't due to my MLC/WW being indecisive. It had to do w/ a critical health issue of a family member. That issue has resolved, and so the gift of time has run out. Things are in flux, starting now.
During this time, I was very supportive of my MLC/WW and as a result we returned to a relatively warm rapport. But the signal is still clear to me that she's not interested in any type of reconciliation. It's not a surprise to me.
I have done a modest job of detaching, although I have had bad days. And I recognize that the worst is probably yet to come. Still, I feel that the gift of time has allowed me to see my MLC/WW a bit more objectively. My infatuation with my MLC/WW has settled a bit. If there had been no time, a divorce would have been more crushing, I think.
I don't know if I DB-ed all that well. I think I'm too knee deep to have any objectivity about it. I can say the voices and ideas in this forum has constantly challenged me, as well as comforted me at times. I'd like to think that I've become a firmer, steadier presence in my (broken) marriage. And I'm learning to weather my MLC/WW's emotional storms somewhat better.
It's hard to know exactly what the right thing to do is. Especially with people reporting that DB coaches suggest a sunnier, warmer approach; while forum vets advocate a more militaristic, austere protocol of detachment and cake-bashing. Maybe the wisest approach takes from both concepts. My tack for the next few days is to just listen and observe, to get a better sense of what direction my MLC/WW is taking. Then I will plot my own course.
Everything you have written here is completely normal, which I hope is comforting for you to hear. Keep working hard at it and life will unfold as God wills it.
-PM
M:12y - BD:12/11 - D:6/13 - 4Ds
"The ultimate measure of a man is not where he stands in moments of comfort and convenience, but where he stands at times of challenge and controversy." -MLK Jr.
FG -- I wish I had something better to say to you that would help more. I'm confident that you have what it takes to weather whatever ends up coming your way. I know how difficult in-house separation is, but you have strength and honor in spades. Your kids know it and will always know it, even if your W has gone off on a different path. Hang in there. Here's to 2017 being a better year for all of us.
Me: 46 W: 44 Married: 17 Together 21 D13; S10 BD: 03.03.15 (Not attracted to you) Almost 2 years trying, alone, to save marriage Status now: Divorced (effective 06.13.17)
Thanks. It is encouraging to know that y'all are out there and share a (somewhat) common experience ....
I'm finding myself feeling lots of ups & downs in the last few days. I think outwardly I'm steady, but in my head I'm all over the place.
I'm focusing on seeing reality for what it is. Seeing my W for who she is, and seeing myself for who I am and who I want to become.
Sandi2's words ring very true right now, that no reconciliation happens through a live-in separation. So at the very least I have to be willing to go through a physical separation for there to be any chance of a reconciliation. And in my case a physical separation is a divorce, because my W is not willing to do a separation (and in my state, a separation is legally/essentially the same thing as a divorce). But also, I'm not hanging my hopes on my WW suddenly waking up from her quasi-MLC after the divorce. That's where the Stockdale paradox comes in: I have to see, and I do see, that her character and her outlook on life isn't something she's just going to snap out of. It's a big part of who she is, and has been for a very long time.
Me: 50, MLC/WW 45 Young kids Nov 2015: BD1 Apr 2016: BD2 Jan 2017: W filed Feb 2017: D final
AP-- I can say I've always had the best intentions, and never acted with any malice or petty feelings.
FG, this speaks to the strength of your character. We all end up doing "little dumb things" because none of us are perfect, so it's not worth dwelling on. But knowing that there is truly no malice behind your actions, even in the face of such a horrible situation, is something to be proud of. End of the day, stand tall because you are a good man my friend.
Originally Posted By: ForGump
I think a big potential point of contention coming up will be the MBR issue. I don't want to get into the details of how it came to be, but the aforementioned health issue has put the MBR issue into flux, and we will have to come to a new agreement. I never felt very territorial about parts of the house, and I'm not a big nester, but I have come to feel a need to make a principled stand on the MBR (although I have continuing, niggling doubt that it's petty to care about it).
There is a loud, conflict-avoider voice in me that says just go w/ the flow, but I feel like I'm too accommodating on that front. I do want the MBR, and I don't want to be a refugee in my own house. But how to do it w/o sounding petty ... I'm not sure.
I know that conflict-avoider voice very well. Seems to be a trait a lot of us share here. To your statement before about being well intentioned, just ask yourself if making a stand on the MBR is the right thing to do. If it is then absolutely stand for it and push back on her. If it's important to you, then it definitely is not petty. There's bound to be another option to accommodate the change in health situation (which I'm sorry to hear about brother).
I'm sorry you're going through a rough spot right now FG. The ups and downs definitely suck. How're you doing w/ yourself right now? Sleeping ok? Exercising? As you know from my experience, I tend to get those ups and downs when I'm lacking on either of those fronts. anything you could be doing for yourself right now to help alleviate some of the ups and downs?
The in-house S thing IS awful. It's not something I'd wish on anyone. The sheer uncertainty and amount of emotion that comes from being martially S, but constantly physically in contact with our WWs wears on us. It feels like being stuck in a hole w/ no way to get yourself out of it. I completely understand what you're going through right now.
That said, you are one of the stronger folks on here my friend. You always have a rational, well thought out approach to things and you're a great man. I think you already know that these ups and downs won't last and are only temporary. Be strong brother and know that we're here for you.
Me39 M11 : T13 D9 BD 5/31/16 In House S until 6/21/17 Divorced 10/5/18
I'm finding myself feeling lots of ups & downs in the last few days. I think outwardly I'm steady, but in my head I'm all over the place.
I'm focusing on seeing reality for what it is. Seeing my W for who she is, and seeing myself for who I am and who I want to become.
Sandi2's words ring very true right now, that no reconciliation happens through a live-in separation. So at the very least I have to be willing to go through a physical separation for there to be any chance of a reconciliation. And in my case a physical separation is a divorce, because my W is not willing to do a separation (and in my state, a separation is legally/essentially the same thing as a divorce). But also, I'm not hanging my hopes on my WW suddenly waking up from her quasi-MLC after the divorce. That's where the Stockdale paradox comes in: I have to see, and I do see, that her character and her outlook on life isn't something she's just going to snap out of. It's a big part of who she is, and has been for a very long time.
(((ForGump)))
Wow, I'm feeling the same things these days. Thank you for sharing.
Gordie 40s W 40s M20+ kids 2016 BD W fantasy affair w OM1 I do everything wrong 2017 I start to DB W says TLTL files for D PA w OM2 2018 I do LRT W drops filing and OM2 situation slowly improving
Hello, my WW had PA EA with another man 2.5 years ago. She has not only taken hers off but wears other rings on other fingers of that hand. Totally screwed the kids up since the ring was always SO important to her. I have never taken it off unless construction made it unsafe since the 2.5 years ago. At first I did it for her to know I had truly forgiven her, then I did it for me because it felt weird off and made me think of why it was off more than healing and why I wanted to have it on, then I did it to remind me that no matter what someone else does, I can be who I want to be. I am committed, honor my promise to her and need to stay true to my beliefs until I'm not married. We still haven't told the kids that she filed for divorce, they know they are so much smarter than she thinks, and they see her manifesto every day. I had taken it off to work on a construction job and went to pick up my oldest from school. She saw that t was off and not being surprised that I had it off asked me. I told her why and then I put it on. I then said, maybe I should take mine off. It just doesn't have any meaning anymore. My child told me. You have always taught us to be who we wanted to be no matter what. That isn't you is it dad. Then I wore it for them, to give them a constant of truth since that is what it had meant in our family. Now that she is figuring out how to leave, goes out to party looking sexy, etc in front of everyone, I wear it because I need to be the best me. I don't believe in this divorce because it is just happening for stupid reasons. I don't need to advertise that I am a free agent yet. I probably will wear it after the divorce for a bit for the same reason. Not sure.
ME 47, WW 36 Kids B19, B17, G14, G12, B6 WWPA May 2014, EA revisited Oct 2016
