The day before my youngest sons 4th birthday my wife sits up in bed, says we need to talk. I ask her about the spike matt that she is leaning against and offer to massage her. She says no, we need to talk first.
As you can guess this is the point that a chill runs down my spine. I sit up straight near the other edge of our bed and say: "ookay? What's wrong?"
I could try really hard here to remember the exact words back and forth, but it's been almost a month since then so I'll bring up the highlights: 1, "I have been miserable a long time and I think you have too." I agree, she's been hiding behind her phone on the couch and screaming at the kids, getting headaches from our youngests constant screaming. I've been trying to give her space from the kids and inadvertantly from me even though I would have been in her face and cheering her up before the kids were born. She loves our kids, but she told me when she started working as a preescool teacher that she needed peace and quiet when she got home. 2, "We need to separate. I saw my parents hate each other as they moved to separate bedrooms. I don't want that for us" I conversely have the opposite experience, my parents got double booked into the same apartment and fell in love by simply being near each other. Less than a year even. My parents divorced because mom was dying and dad asked her to help him get a new spouse. This is relevant, but we'll get to that. 3, "I love you but I'm not in love with you and I know the same to be true for you." To which I responded that I wasn't sure what 'in love' meant but I was absolutely certain that I LOVE HER. Yes, I was fairly annoyed at the third point. It still feels like a nonsense statement a month later. I find it difficult to separate love from in love personally. 4, "I don't feel attractive anymore" obviously I had neglected our love like I'd been neglecting her plants. By overwatering and underwatering them on alternate weeks. 5, we had gotten too comfortable around each other and we needed to separate to find ourselves without the other. To grow as people. Almost all of that sounds good. The only thing I don't like is the separation. 6, I agreed with her that things weren't good and maybe she needed a quiet place away from the kids screaming and I sort of fell in a heap crying on my side. Yeah.... Not my proudest moment there. 7, She asked me as she was done; "David, why aren't you fighting this?" Suddenly my hope for the future was re-lit! She WANTED me to fight for her love. I would be in charge of fixing our emotional distance. She wanted me to pursue her. I could do this! (emotionally exhausted and not thinking straight and quite frankly the reason I wasn't fighting was because she'd given me an ultimatum a month or so earlier that I hadn't done anything about. It was still on my to do list. So I felt I'd been forewarned even if it came as a shock)
I hid my phone from her and started looking for ways to reconnect when married with kids. Found the wikihow of to make your wife feel attractive: compliments, gifts, acts of service, touching her back whenever remotely appropriate, and so on.
The next day i gave her compliments, tried to do everything around the house, didn't say I loved her, because I was confused about her definitions of love.
By the end of the day she wanted a footrubb. Glorious, I thought, we're meeting halfway. I stuck to footrubbs, massages and clicking of backs. Seemed to be working out fairly well for a few days, until she was sms:ing her "happily divorced workmate", current best friend and future flatmate.
She looked up from the phone, saw me rubbing her (as shed asked me to do a few minutes earlier) glanced briefly at her phone again, pouted and pulled her foot away.
A day went by and we didn't even hug anymore. So I started my campaign of "accidental" touches. To make her feel attractive. After a week or so she seemed happier in general, so I felt encouraged. A week later again she told me that she would have liked to work things out between us but that she felt disgust whenever we touched.
A week has gone by since then and I've not touched her. But suddenly she asks for a footrubb.
I feel so confused. She tells me that she wishes that she could stay, because we could live in separate rooms. Financially we could still support each other and life would be easier. But the easy descision isn't nessecarily the right one and now that she is seeing improvements in the house and in my physical appearance (I'm wearing dress-shirts when I go working at preschools now. Impractical as heck but I'd rather loose shirts than her.) it would be even easier, but the feelings are gone and the is NO WAY that they're coming back. You can't force love! To me though, love is a choice. To be with someone in good times AND in bad even when your dreams are shattered you have someone to walk that life with that can depend on your support and you on theirs.
Looking back there is one thing that she has been asking of me that I cannot fix. I can no longer try to initiate sex or romance. I wish I could, but she won't let me.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
Doodler, that's so true. Same with my situation, always behind the phone on FB or texting non stop. Enough to drive you mad.
Duvae, I'm also sorry that circumstances find you here. Doodler is spot on that you couldn't have found a better spot w/ more supportive people. I'm sure some vets will be in here to help out. I'm still early in my situation, but can offer some advice that may help.
First, know that your situation is not unique. There seems to be a common thread amongst most folks situations and our Ws tend to follow a similar pattern. Also, there's some solace in knowing that you are not alone on an island and that others are suffering w/ you, as odd as that sounds.
Second, the more details you can share of your history w/ your W the better folks will be able to help. Stuff like your ages, how long you've been married, etc.
Third, there will be large emotional swings for you as you grind through this thing. To help control that, make sure you put a large amount of focus into yourself and bettering who you are. It's easy to lose focus on yourself when you are laser focused on fixing your MR. That's when you tend to hit the peaks of the emotional swings and that's no fun.
Hang in there bud and know that we're all here to lend a hand where we can.
Me39 M11 : T13 D9 BD 5/31/16 In House S until 6/21/17 Divorced 10/5/18
Duvae, I'm sorry you are here. This is not the place I expected to find myself a year ago but here we are. I can't offer you much advice as I am also new to this site and I'm seeking advice for myself. I know it appears that you are alone, but you are not. My W also has said some of the things you mentioned. We are living under the same roof, for now. All intimacy has ended, by her demands. She has a best friend as the OM. Ironically as their friendship grew out marriage dissolved. We are emotionally, spiritually and for all purposes physically divorced now. We are not legally divorced yet but this will also happen soon. I choose to salvage our marriage. W chooses to end our marriage and destroy any hopes or possibilities of ever reconciling. This is devastating to everyone involved. I will try to keep a watch on your situation as I think there are things that I will read and see to help with my own situation. Take care of yourself.
ROE
ROE 48/WW 49 M24 Childrenx4 BD1 Jan 2016 EA/OM conf'd by WW : BD2 Apr 2016 WW wants S : BD3 May 2016 WW wants D Oct - Separated Dec - PA confirmed Jan 2017 - I file for D / Enough is Enough
Sorry you are here. The keys to successful DB'ing are to detach, 180 and GAL. You must do these things and you must do them for YOU, not for the benefit of your W. Despite what she is telling you (that she wants you to fight for her), pursuing her at this point will only drive her away. If she's telling you that she wants to divorce or separate, she is done. She has already checked out. The way you save your M at this point is by detaching, 180 and GAL. Get the book and read it. Follow the rules. Read Sandi's 37 rules. Nothing you can do at this point will "bring her back." She has to want to come back on her own. Show her what she will be missing. Become awesome to your core. Become the best Dad you have ever been. If she's vacillating between talking about separation but at the same time wanting you to fight for her, that means she is VERY conflicted. That is a good thing. All hope is not lost. Detach, 180 and GAL. That is how you save your M.
Me: 48 y/o W: 47 y/o Together: > 20 yrs BD: Dec '15, then S 2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D April '16: started piecing
As you can guess this is the point that a chill runs down my spine.
The last time I tried this with my H, he looked wearily at me and said, "We aren't going to have another one of those talks, are we?" I suppose every H hates to hear the W say, "We need to talk".
Everything your W said could have come straight out of the wayward wife textbook. In other words, it means that those same statements are so commonly said by WW's that it seems as if they read from the same script. It's b.s. for the truth behind why she wants her freedom. So, although it's serious......don't buy her b.s. excuses.
As for you not understanding feeling/being in love is different than just loving someone, it's about emotions and how that person makes you feel. It is a special "love", different than what you have for your relatives or friends. Surely, you felt something special when you were first dating your W. Women like those feelings......a lot! What some couples don't seem to realize is that it takes hard work to keep those "in love" emotions alive.
Quote:
The next day i gave her compliments, tried to do everything around the house, didn't say I loved her, because I was confused about her definitions of love.
You may show your love by doing acts of service and maybe words of affirmation. If that isn't her love language, then she probably won't respond (especially if she is wayward). If she's wayward, she won't respond to any of those types of action.
Quote:
By the end of the day she wanted a footrubb. Glorious, I thought, we're meeting halfway.
You may be in for a rude awakening. She wasn't meeting you in any kind of way by allowing you to touch her feet. She was selfishly using you. Might as well been working in a saloon giving her a pedicure. If she is a WW, you could kill yourself doing all the housework, cooking, catering to her needs, etc., .......and it won't fix the problem. This is completely different from anything you've faced.
Don't know your ages, but I won't be surprised if she isn't into playing a lot of games of manipulation. Throwing out a hook every so often, just to keep you in place.
Instead of you acting as if you are her unpaid employee, consider how you might draw her attraction in some of the same ways you did before M and kids. Let me give a hint, if she's wayward.....you won't attract her by chasing her. You won't do it by "fighting for the M".....at least, not in the way most people think it's done. Stick around and learn more.
Tell us more about your marital history. What are ages? Any previous inappropriate behavior with the opposite sex?
It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
My wife and I were both born 1980 though her birthday is the last day of the year and mine is in march. We have 2 sons born 2010 and 2012. Our marriage: We met in the summer of 2004. We were in a christian theatre ministry together. When we first met the most remarkable thing was that we shook hands instead of hugging and then we talked about our lives. (It was that kind of organisation. People thrown together at random, shyness isn't allowed so people forget to be shy) she stayed behind in the house when I was being taken to my room for the night and as I stepped into the car a thought struck me much like a separate voivce speaking to me, "that is the woman I will marry."
I then spent the majority of the summer avoiding her because... Commitment was scary I guess. Anyway, we left on tour (separate groups) engineered it so we spent christmas together and I proposed the day after her birthday.
Then came back for one more tour, this time too was separate in spite of company policy of keeping engaged people together.
We married on august 9th 2005 on practically no budget, family pitched in to help in all sorts of ways and the wedding was really nice.
Half a week after the wedding we moved to a small island off the coast of sweden and I went to university to become a gameprogramer. She studied Swedish and started working part-time in a cafeteria.
Once my studies were done 2009 we moved to landskrona (south tip of sweden) were I tried to find a job for a few years. My wife started studying to become a preschool teacher in 2011. Got pregnant with our youngest and I started studying to become a preschool teacher myself.
Our youngest had colic (screamed almost constantly) and my wife had yet again started a part-time job as a hungarian teacher (paid enoug to buy the ticket to get to the job and back) So evwn though I was studying and she was still on maternity-leave from studying we separated our beds, I slept with our youngest and she slept with our older calmer son.
I remember that in the beginning we both had fears about losing closeness, but we'd persevere, nothing would tear us apart.
The summer of 2012 my wife joined me in school, left her job and we had a lot of fun. Summer of 2013 we moved our beds back together and... Sex was underwhelming. Mechanical at best. And my wifes period which previously lasted 3 days like clockwork now had week of pms, 1 week of severe bleeding and 1 week of light bleeding, leaving 1 week open for sex before the cycle would restart. The doctors weren't worried. This would lessen by itself.
Looking back this is were I started masturbating quite a bit. I was and still am ashamed of it, but a 1 week window per month is..... not good.
We wrote our thesis together in the summer of 2015. Graduated end of january 2016 and my wife immediately got a jobb whilst now, september 2016 I'm still looking for work, in a field were they're desperate for workers. Especially educated workers.
Add to this that my wife feels shoved aside and underappreciated at her jobb and I suggested that she reach out to her coworkers instead of switching jobbs withing 2 months like her 10 predessesors.
And shortly after I was literally garanteed a job by the employer (we were already celebrating at home) and then got slamdunked with a "we hired someone more qualified, sorry". Shortly after that she demanded that I initiate sex. Something I definetly used to do before our youngest child was born but now felt I could no longer keep track of my window of opportunity. No time limit was put on this demand, but I still felt like I'd failed her when she told me she wasn't in love with me.
Addendum to my previous post. My wife has in the beginning of this summer gotten pills that have fixed her period somewhat (now down to 1 week & 1/2 to 2 weeks) which may also have increased her sexdrive somewhat.
And for the last 2 years I may have spent more time with the kids than her, mostly to gice her "peace and quiet"
It's not like I can't see a clear cause and effect going on as I look at what I wrote. I didn't initiate sex! There's a few orher things, like I didn't redo the walls in the dining room for 6 years (bothof us we very vocal about our current apartment being temporary... For 6 years!) and I didn't dress as nicely as when we for married
Actually that's wrong, at one time I did initiate this summer, but she claimed that she was the one to do so due to the inviting pose that she had. I am still a bit hung up about this.
Just keep POSTING and one other bit of advice from Wonka that I totally agree with.
Originally Posted By: Wonka
Get DR/DB book. Keep this to yourself. DO NOT share this book or this site at all with your spouse. It is your playbook and not to be shared with the "opposing" team.
It is important to clear the search/browsing history from your computer on a daily basis to prevent the possibility for your WAS to stumble on the DB site and discover your posts here on DB. Erasing the search history will protect your posts and you as well.
We have seen too many Marriages blow up in pieces after the WAS discovers the DB site or DR book. Why is that? It is because the WAS thinks, erroneously I might add, that you are "manipulating" them back into the M.
Keep the DR book and DB site very close to your vest.
