We've been married more than 10 years. Two younger kids. Marriage hasn't been good for most of it. We are emotionally distant. Wife has been unsure for years, but has admittedly stayed because of the kids. Now she wants to separate, but is unsure about divorce. She says she wants to separate to see if it will help re-start things.
In the early years I had a tough time connecting with her due to not knowing how and not listening to her needs and/or stonewalling her when she attempted to connect. She states she is now very lonely and hurt from my years of not being there for her emotionally. After years of going along like this I started to wake up. When I finally understood what she needed and figured out how I should do it, it was too late. Her walls were up by then and I can't penetrate them. Her heart is shut off to me.
We have talked a bit about how, logistically speaking, a separateion would work and we are also trying to figure out if we should try counseling. We tried counseling years ago and it was not a good experience. (I can get into that later if needed.)
I'm trying to figure out how to follow the DB and DR method when at the same time I feel like we need to emotionally connnect.
You may be on moderation now, post in small frequent replies and stay on this thread until you reach 100 posts (for your thread, you can also post on other peoples threads to give support). Especially on this Newcomers forum, where the posting activity is very active, and your posts can quickly fall to the bottom of the page or even several pages down. Keep journaling and asking questions - people will come! Most important - POST!
Get out and Get a Life (GAL). DETACH.
Believe none of what he or she says and half of what he/she does.
Have NO EXPECTATIONS.
Take care of yourself, breathe, eat, sleep, exercise.
Take the parts of this advice that you need and don't worry if I have repeated something that you have already done.
Here are a few links to threads that will help you immensely:
For the recent past several months I have put forth much more effort in several areas. She has pretty much run things as far as the kids and house go. I've done some half a$$ efforts in the past, but now have committed to removing some of the load. She hasn't mentioned she's noticed, but there is no way she couldn't have.
I've also held back compliments and verbal affection since she told me a long time ago she doesn't want that and somehow it makes it worse.(???) Again, in the recent several months I have not held back. When she looks nice I come right out and tell her - I compliment her once a day at a minimum. She has noticed this and told me she has, although she says it is meaningless (but I know that I can't beleive anything she says at this stage.)
The counseling we did several years ago didn't go so well. My W felt criticized. I can't remember all the specifics, but I know the counselor seemed kinda kooky and didn't hide from taking sides on issues.
Criticism is something that comes up frequently between us. W feels I am very critical and that I don't like her. She will bring it up well after the fact and it is hard for me to see it or recall it exactly how she does. I'm hyper aware now and monitoring this very closely.
My question is this - I know everyone says the DB and DR methods are often counter-intuitive, but how do things like Sandi's rule #15 (don't initiate conversation and be scarce if spouse initiates) help bring two people closer? This in fact has been how we've been operating for a long time and has led to us not being close. Also, I's struggling with #8 (don't buy gifts). I bought her flowers for the first time in a long time a few weeks ago (not roses, just a Springtime bunch) and she brightened up and started taking pictures of them. I'm not going to buy her jewelry or even shower her in gifts, but an occassional card or flowers feels like it might help. Finally, Sandi's rule #9 (don't schedule dates) is something W and I talked about if we are going to separate. We both feel we would need this in order to spend time alone and figure this out.
I'm relatively new to all of this DB stuff, so don't take anything I say as gospel. I'll be brief...
It sounds as if your wife is not in an affair (EA or PA). I believe that most people in this forum have spouses that are in the midst of an affair. I think the affair situations require a little different approach than the approaches used for a spouse who's been neglected but has not had an affair. My concern is that some of the techniques discussed in this forum may be a little heavy-handed for your situation.
I have a DB coach and he's emphasized that GAL activities (things you're truly enthusiastic about) seem to have very good results.
This has been building in your W for a long time so its not going to be fixed overnight. Sounds like you have a lot of issues to work on but that's ok. We all do. So.......Start fixing those today. Take a good long look at yourself and figure out what needs to change. No bandaids here. We are talking about permanent life changes going forward. Its time for you to become a new man. Find out how to be the man that only a fool would leave. A lot of us do have WW and it sounds like you have a WAW so I think you don't want to be as heavy handed. Maybe you can be a LITTLE softer on the rules. But do know that even if you separate, if you truly implement 180's and GAL, she WILL notice. I kicked my WW out of the house after I discovered the A and even though the A was still going on (and I didn't know it), I've now learned that she DID notice all the changes I was making. She noticed them because they were genuine. No matter what my faults in the past, it didn't justify her having an A but I did have lots of things that needed to change. So I found out what those were and started making changes. Real, meaningful changes. That's what you have to do. You W will notice if you do this and follow all the rules. Make her see what she will be missing if she walks out on you . I was also guilty of being critical, non communicative and emotionally detached. But when I kicked my W out, I went dark. Only communicated when it was in regards to the kids. But it has worked and is still working. I know it all sounds backwards but I do believe this process and I am still DB'ing even now that my W and I are piecing our M back together. You can do this. Start now!
Me: 48 y/o W: 47 y/o Together: > 20 yrs BD: Dec '15, then S 2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D April '16: started piecing
Sorry that you find yourself here. But you will find a great deal of support.
I agree with LIM, some of these tactics may seem a little heavy if you have a WAW. But changes that you make, real changes will help. I think it takes time, obviously they are reluctant to believe these changes to start off, that's why they need to become genuine.
Start to think of what changes you can make, what will make you the kind of man she would be a fool to leave?
Read other people's threads too to gain some insight. There's some bets on here that give fantastic advise. Good luck and keep posting
Me 26 H 25 M 4 T 5 Baby born 4/14 BD: 1/15 EA: 2/15 PA: 4/15 reconciling: 4/15 ILYBINILWY- 11/15 ILY-1/16 ILYBNILWY 4/16 ILY 6/16 ILYBINILWY 6/16 Baby due 3/17 BD 8/16
The good and the bad. First the bad. I'm hurting right now. The place I'm sure many of you have been or are right now. The place where your legs shake, you feel nauseous, you could puke at any minute, your chest is tight, your heart aches, a feeling of desperation overcomes you and you feel a complete loss of control. But, you've got to keep a smile on your face and not let your W or kids know that you are about to fall apart.
Why do I feel this way? The separation is about to happen - found an apartment and will move next week. Also, I'm doing what I can to save our marriage. I'm studying everything I can get my hands on as far as emotional connection and relationship repair. I'm putting my best foot forward. My W is doing nothing outward. I'm sure she has a lot on her mind, but is she figuring out ways to save our relationship or work on herself? Not that I can see. This has been her M.O. throughout. I'm the one to blame and I'm the one to find a solution. Her solution for the last 8 years is that we need to split. It is always either or. It is hard to see someone complain about a problem and just sit back expecting the problem to go away. She wants a strong emotional connection, yet admits she has put up impenetrable walls and is completely unreceptive to my attempts to connect.
The good - I have a sliver of hope. I display a positive attitude. I realize I need to be patient. I know I can only control myself. I have been working on GAL for a couple years now and have put forth even more effort recently. I'm improving myself.
I feel your pain tjcran. It hurts like nothing else. You'll have to find your way through. No way around it. I see that you are very focused on your MR right now. Although that seems like what you should be doing, it will probably work against you. You need to detach. Let go. Turn your sights inward and focus on YOU. This is HARD. But you must find a way to do this. I believe it is the most fundamental thing you must master if you are to save your M. When you detach and work to fix your issues, she will notice. She will begin to see what she will be missing if she decides to continue down this path. There is no guarantee that she will in turn start working on her issues but you've got to be prepared to take care of yourself whether she is in your life or not. I am a firm believer in this process. I see it working in my life. I kept up with it and kept posting here even when I had NO hope for my M. But then I started to see cracks in her armor. Slowly but surely, her walls began to crumble around her. And when they did, who was standing there for her to see? A new an improved LiM. The LiM she fell in love with and the LiM that she wants to be with. So much so, that my W is now willing to say and DO the things necessary to repair the damage she has caused. She's willing to do that because she see's that I've been working on myself this entire time. Focus on you right now. That's what you've got to do.
Me: 48 y/o W: 47 y/o Together: > 20 yrs BD: Dec '15, then S 2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D April '16: started piecing
Thanks for that. This is a lonely place to be and knowing others are going through it or have gone through it and support you is huge.
Had my first heave cry today. I'm sure there's more to come.
I am focused on improving myself. I see where I was unavailable to my W when she needed a connection and some empathy. I am working on my skills connecting and being emotionally available. I am finding ways to connect with friends and become more socially active. I've always been physically active and healthy and that won't drop off.
Nothing wrong with a good cry. I probably cried every single day for the first two months. But do it by yourself. Dont let her see that. The only thing she should see is a strong, confident man. You can show her your hurt later. But not right now. I'm really glad you are able to see where you have been deficient in your life. Its key to moving forward. It too was emotionally absent and far too focused on my own needs for a long time. The emotional needs of my W and family came second and that's not ok. Reconnecting with others and becoming more social is an EXCELLENT way to show your W that you are not that same person anymore even though you are not directing that attention towards her. This is a perfect example of how you can be detached and yet still be engaged in behaviors that will attract her and bring her back to you. You can do this! Get to work and come back and report your progress often.
Me: 48 y/o W: 47 y/o Together: > 20 yrs BD: Dec '15, then S 2nd BD: Mar '16, then I filed for D April '16: started piecing
