afraid I have waited too long #5

[Wonka]

Nit,

My L just texted me. I should try to communicate with my W to see if the Idea about the house would be something she will agree upon.

Why can't your L communicate with W about this himself since it's his job to do so?

[nit84]

Wonka,

My L would communicate with my W L if I asked her to do so and has. She said it was up to me if I wanted to talk to my W about things for two reasons. 1) it saves L fees and 2) W L seems to be dragging it out for some reason. She said if I wanted to talk to my W I should do so. She was not trying to get me to do something for her in my opinion. I have been wrong before though.

If I could talk to my W in a rational manor(which I believe I can) it may get things moving again. My L knows I don't want a D but I have also told her I understand I can't stop it.


I am not sure I want to talk to my W about the house issue and if I feel I cant I certainly will have my L send letters to W L.

The email draft I shared was, like you said, filled with anxiety. My gut is telling me that for just this house issue I could talk to my W. Nothing else but the house.



I don't know if I will explain this correctly and it may not be wise to talk to my W but that is why I have you guys help me through.


Since day 1 I have always said I wanted the house and would hopefully be able to refinance it to do so. I said this without any knowledge that I could. When I found it was possible I was overjoyed. Bcause 1.) I could do it and 2.) strangely enough it was something I actually thought was getting me closer to D but it is what my W asked me to do and how it would help clarify things according to her.

So I was taken back when I presented this to my W that she was so against it.


When she served me the D papers. A discussion we had before bed was about this now being a business transaction.

I told her I hope it didn't come down to something like this and this was purely hypothetical. "Say the house is worth x and I offer 5,000 less you will get mad."

My W said "for 5 grand it would be worth it and I would take it so we could D."

I said "well what happens if the house is only worth x"(a number about 50,000.00 less) which honestly is where it is if we were to sell it to a flipper according to a realtor I had in.

I said "if the house is only worth x and we sell it after we pay the mortgage and 2nd mortgage that leaves us with 5,000.00 a piece maybe. this would be ok except our credit card bills are x which would leave us both having to take out loans to cover our portions."

My W said " well then that would put things on hold then." as I was walking away. I stopped backed up and said "wait, so if I want to get rid you. which I don't but if I did you would roadblock the D because you thought the house would be worth more?" She said " I guess we would have to. but I think the house is worth x so we won't have to worry about it."

I said "I hope"


Well when the numbers shook out they were much closer to the second example rather than the 1st.When I proposed the refinance option reality really upset my W and once I got her settlement proposal I saw why. She used my Hypothetical value as a starting point. This is her right. Heck. she could started at 1,000,000.00 if she wanted.

She kept telling me "you want the house that is fine because I can't afford it anyway." I said "you possibly could if you got a job paying you what you were making or even 10% less
"

She kept saying "I know you wont sell the house because you would have to split it with me." I said "it is half yours I don't think I would have choice."

My point of this whole thing and this is my opinion. I feel my W thinks I wont sell the house and I will cave to her settlement proposal to keep it. Her demands are outrageous and we have countered with my offer.

I don't want to sell but if I have to sell to save my credit score and my Financial future I most certainly will.

Most likely it will sell for around what I described in my 2nd example. leaving us to find ways of paying credit card bills that the proceeds didn't cover.

This would hinder my W in her goal to start over because she probably would be left to pay some portion of money and couldn't start over fresh like she wanted.


Up till now there has been no talk of selling the house. If I present it the right way my W maybe will see in the long run it is better for her if we don't sell the house and we can settle some other way.

Again my proposal for refinance will allow my W to be debt free going forward and then we can discuss the retirement which I am sure she would receive at least 50% which I have no problem with (well a little) but you have to compromise on some things and property is property nothing earthshattering there that I would dispute if it came down to it.

Talking to my W might not produce the results I want but at least it will save on some fees.

If it weren't for my dead cat. The conversation we had after the hearing went well. It wasn't warm, it was businesslike( I hated it but at least we were talking). If I keep it to that level, I believe even if I get nowhere with my thoughts, I might understand her thinking and why she is asking for what she is.

I feel this has become a money game to my W. I was foolish to think that if my W became debt free, got 50% of the retirement to which she contributed only 20%, and we split the personal property in a way that acceptable to both of us that we would just call it a M. I don't want it to end but if is had to at least it would be fair.

I have never been through a D so it is foreign to me but for my W and I, we have no kids, we aren't wealthy, why is this going the way it is?

I wish I had an understanding. maybe I am thick-skulled or just plain dumb..


I don't want a D but I have a vision of what it will be like when it is final.

Honestly, at this point if I didn't have to protect myself I would give in to my W. Not because I am weak but because I am tired of all the posturing, the sense of entitlements, acting like a victims etc... this goes for both sides Mine and my W.


I pray everyday for a miracle and I pray everyday for peace just wonder which one will come first.

Thanks for your patience with me.

[nit84]

well I must be getting closer to dropping the rope.

I wrote my LR letter to me W this morning. I am not sending it right now or maybe never but I wrote it.

W,
I am writing this letter to let you know I know that you are done with our Marriage and have been for some time. You are moving on with your life by and in the choices you have made. Our Marriage is one that I thought would last a lifetime unfortunately that isn't the case anymore. Throughout our Relationship both dating and married, I have done things that have hurt you.

-Bringing up your past or your family's behavior
-not helping around the house enough
-drinking or wanting you to go out even through you were sick.
-only bringing up our problems when I drank
-holding my feelings and not communicating them to you
-negative attitude and impatience
-not fixing up the house when you asked.
-not taking into account your feelings about children and waiting to long to ask you to start a family.
-doing things that you thought were controlling(too many to mention)

For all the above I ask your forgiveness because I know they have wounded you deeply from what you have told me.

Despite how unhappy you have been in our relationship your 16 year commitment has been remarkable. Although, I don't believe Divorce is a solution to our problems I love you and respect you enough to let you go if that is what you choose.

As painful and difficult as this situation has been the silver lining is that it has been a wake up call to the person I want to be either alone or in a future relationship.

This was really hard for me to write. I want to stand for my M but it takes two and at the moment it is just one.

Maybe I am still being too emotional after the hearing and feeling sorry for myself.

[nit84]

The last two lines ^^^^ are not part of the letter

[Wonka]

Nit,

Is that your Hail Mary letter?? What do you hope to achieve from it considering where your W is presently?

[nit84]

Wonka,

It is my Last Resort letter following an outline given to me by my DB coach about 8 months ago. At that time, she said "do not send it until you truly believe you can adhere to it." I don't know yet if I am ready to send it but it is written if I do.

With the little contact my W and I have only something really big will save this M. I still want to stand but not sure how at this point.

[nit84]

I suppose what I want to achieve if I sent this is to show my W that I have finally let go of standing for something that she wants to end.

Taking off all the pressure that she may be feeling from me off of her.

We both can move on with our journeys on separate paths and maybe those paths will cross again somewhere in the future.

I haven't been a on the rollercoaster of emotion in a long time but I am now and I hate it.

[Wonka]

Nit,

One just doesn't say to the spouse that they're moving on because as we say sometimes "talk is cheap." When one truly moves on, it is done through actions. Remember how you've moved on from your middle school or high school GF? Exactly.

Back to the letter, from my vantage point of view sitting in my comfy perch, I see a mixture of blaming, pleading, and overly focused on the negatives. Another concern is that, by sending it now, it would come across as manipulative to W with the full knowledge that you two are at loggerheads about the house and settlement. It will most definitely rub her the wrong way and just rile her up.

If I were you, if you really want to send a letter to W, I'd wait until everything is agreed to and a forward movement toward a settlement is firmed up. Only then you might want to send the letter to her.....with changes. I wouldn't send it as it stands.

Methinks that you're being driven by anxiety and unsettling feelings to write that Hail Mary letter to W. To me, for one to write a letter to the spouse, you must be completely done and accept the situation as it is. As you pointed out, you want to continue standing for your M.

This tells me that you're not completely done. Right?

[nit84]

Wonka,

No I am not completely done you are correct about that.

Talk is cheap and I am trying to let my actions show that 1.) I have changed and will continue to do so and 2.) I am moving on as far as envisioning a life without my W and GALing in a lot of areas. The only one that I can't do is date.

Do I have my eye on a couple of Women sure, but I don't think now is the time to do it. It is just not for me to date while still M. My W chose that path and it was choice to do so. Probably, neither my W or I are completely correct in our choice on the matter.

You are correct that it is not good to send the letter now. I see that now but I wrote it so I wanted to share with the board.

The Letter was advice by a DB coach. I have told my W I understand her frustration with me but never got to lay it out there we would hit on one or two of the things that bothered her but it always ended up becoming confrontational and one of us would remove ourselves. The letter was a way to show that there are more issues and I have heard my W loud and clear.

I don't want to hash out the past unless it would help us but I wanted to express the fact that I know how these things hurt our M and intend on never doing them again and showing it by my actions.

Thanks again for your insight

[nit84]

I guess I have to go back and refer to DR too see what it says, about when your WAW moves out and you have very little contact, other than working on yourself and GALing.

I feel like I am doing a good job at both, but waiting for my W to face the consequenses of her actions or to hit "rock bottom" is very tough because you never know when that is going to be.

I hope it is before we D but I have no control of that.

With the contentious nature of the settlement proposals, We both are trying to protect ourselves and I understand that and I feel like because I understand that I am able to keep resentment levels lower.

From things my W has said to me I feel that is harder for her to do. so it is what is for now.