afraid I have waited too long #5

[nit84]

Wonka,

She said back in August when I first presented a refinance plan, mind you at her request, That it would make it too easy for me to get the house and I wouldn't want to give up any retirement or property either.

I explained to her that I didn't want her to sign the house over to me, just sign a paper recognizing that I am borrowing money against a house that W is part owner of.


She got angry and said "I told you to refinance 3 years ago!!" I said" we tried remember? our debt to equity was not where it needed to be and we decided together to stay on that path and in couple years try again. Life happened you wanted out and then lost your job. it could have happened last year but all this stuff was going on so it couldn't. I never lost sight of our goal and I am very you did but that is your choice."


I then showed her the apparaisal I had done, again at her request, and she said "why isn't the house worth X "I said "we both knew it wouldn't be and now this just proves it. The bank is offering 10,000 more. it is a good deal IMO and it also saves you money. It is not all just for my benefit." She walked away angrily and I sat there in dismay.


I told my W way back that her Ideas to fix up the house were wonderful we had to wait for the dog to cross over. Once that happened(we were already S) I started making plans to fix the house. She got angry and said I was only doing this to throw it her face. I validated to no avail.

In her settlement proposal they are attempting to say the house is worth 23,000.00 more than the appraisal. With little back up just a possible internet value.

Also, if I was allowed to refinance I would assume all my W debt. she would be debt free and allowed to start over fresh with half my retirement and half of the property.

It is her contention that she doesn't owe any credit card debt but 99.9% sure since she used the card to buy things even though 2 out of 3 are in my name and she is only an associate user it will all be considered Marital debt at some point.


She hasn't paid any credit card bills in 8 months so it is getting tight and she knows it.

I am not sure if she know that if need be I will sell the house even though I love it and want to keep it.


It is a case of "If I can't have it, you aren't having it either" IMHO and also she knows it will hurt me and that is her goal as was the Dog death and now the Cat's death. When our dog Died she looked me right in the face and said "I don't want you with me when I put her down because I have so much resentment towards you I can't do it." after I asked to be there. The dog passed at home but she dug the hole and buried before I could home from work. She wasn't working at the time

[nit84]

Here is a possible email to my W.

I go back and forth on whether to send it or not.


W,
I am sorry you feel the way you do about the house and the refinance. It is apparent that you would rather sell the house than refinance it for what amount the bank was willing to give.

While it is disappointing to me I understand your position. I am thinking of putting up a sign "for sale by owner" to gauge interest and possible sale price of the house as is.

Of course, I can't and won't do anything without consulting you and I most certainly welcome your input.

I know things aren't the best between us. It is not my wish to get a D but I know this is your desire and I respect that. If we could talk between us it may save some L fees. I have to be honest with you I never thought this process would be as adversarial as it has become. I know we are both protecting ourselves. It is my hope that you don't not think I am punishing you in any way by anything that I have been advised to do.

You have made your decision and now, actually, for awhile now we both have been moving on with our own journeys. I wish you the best and it is my hope in your own time that you can forgive me for all that I have done to do allow our M to fail. There are numerous things that you have mentioned to me that have hurt you deeply. I have heard what you said and how you have resentment towards me. I can't begin to tell you and I know how you feel because that would be irresponsible of me. If it is 1 or 100 years we were together it was the best times of my life. No need to respond to this specifically but if you want to discuss the house or anything else I hope you will free to do so.

Sweet dreams, H

[Wonka]

Nit,

I'd suggest that you whittle it down to 1 or 2 paragraphs. As for the house, why can't your L send one final proposal to W? This will insulate you from her wrath as it is a legal matter. Suppose she disagrees, there's one option that you can consider: have it decided by the judge alone. There's a legal term for it...cannot recall it.

What is your real goal of sending out that email to W? Let's be real here.

[nit84]

Wonka,

That is what my W has indicated she wants to do is have the judge decide around the time of their 2 yr S date. Doesn't want to negotiate anymore till then. We have sent 2 proposals to my W both were unacceptable according to her.

My L feels they are holding out for 2 reasons 1.) for W to collect as much Spousal support as possible and 2.) My W L wants to add a little to billings.

looking at the Email again, It is showing that I am willing(begrudgingly) to sell the house but with a tinge of guilt sprinkled in. Also, It seems to be a bit of a LRT letter without saying it outright.

I am wavering on sending it and that is why I want to post it here first.


I am tired of chit as is everyone I am sure. But if a miracle occurred I would not be ready to turn it away.


I also am trying to open lines of communication with my W but I guess that is futile.

When she comes to the house I will be cordial and then STFU and let her take what she feels is hers and only speak up if I disagree.

[Wonka]

Nit,

Yup...you're reacting out of anxiety that your W isn't suddenly 'waking' up and falling into your arms sobbing. I wouldn't send anything to W. Can you put the house on the market now? Possible? Have you consulted with a realtor?

Aren't any D papers filed? Where do things stand right now? Just a S now?

[nit84]

Wonka,

I consulted a realtor back in Aug also. They do not write things down(I asked). She said the house was worth about 12,000.00 less than the written appraisal I had done and that was if the buyer were going to live in and fix up.

If it was bought by a flipper then I could expect about another 10,000.00 lower.

Side note yesterday I said my W valued the house 23,000.00 higher than the appraisal it is actually 33,000.00

I certainly could put it on the market now if my W agreed to it she still is a 50% partner in the house.

The email was to see what her feelings were about this idea of for sale by owner to establish a "real" value.


My W served me personally with a D complaint on 4/27/2014. There is no legal S in my state. Once everything is hashed out then the actual D would be filed and I could dispute it if I wanted.

That move was to enable her to get spousal support, which she was awarded on 6/30/2014.

More later.

[nit84]

I'm Back,

I thought she was moving out in July. That didn't happen. Then in Aug she came to me with property division ideas. that is when I shared my Refinance plan.

I asked if she would be leaving at the end of Aug she said no.

September comes and I just go on with life till I discover her doing OM laundry in my house I confront her she denies it is his. We talk about some things that she took that my L asked me to ask W to bring back till we had a signed property agreement. She blows up and says I will be leaving by end of the month. I said fine. I received her Settlement Proposal 9/25/2014. She moves out 9/27/2014.

She went to her Gramdmother's and is it not paying rent. Has a full time job which pays little above the average and is collecting 850.00 a month from me.

I have no problem paying her money to get to equal amounts per pay. My problem is the courts see it as rehabilitation payments to help my W start over.

Which I guess I see but not, when after she got paid by me, to still stay in the same house and pay reduced amounts on the mortgage and utilities and nothing at all on the Credit Cards.

Now at Grandma's she can save more money and still not contribute to any bills. I don't want her to for electric for example but the credits cards and some amount of the mortgage that she owes because she still is part owner and it just doesn't go anywhere if you pick up and leave.


If the refinance would have happened back in Aug Most likely we would be D by now.

[nit84]

At first right after my W served me the complaint. I told my W now we both have to protect ourselves and I understand that.

Her words were "you are going to get vicious aren't you?" I said" no why would I?" I said "My feelings will never change for you it will just be difficult to see this while my L is advising me to do things that will protect my future."

It still holds true today. My feelings haven't changed for my W and I don't want the D.

Taking a look back throughout this S, I believe I handled it well by telling the truth all the time and when I thought I couldn't I kept my mouth shut.

I feel horrible about the fact that my W has to lie to me. It doesn't hurt that much anymore when she lies because that is the way of the WAW.

I just wonder what surprise story or lies my W will have when she comes over to the house to get more stuff.

I actually thought things went well after the hearing communication wise until she dropped the dead cat Bombshell.


I will act "as if" when she comes over. I hope she comes when I'm here but she may change her mind and do it when I leave so that I can't see what she takes till it is already in her possession.

I understand that we can't be close right now or ever again but my old W wouldn't have acted so coldly to anybody as she did with my Dying dog and now the Cat.


This will come off as sour grapes but I really do think Something happened to my W about 22 months ago that is making her seem like she is suffering from a form mental illness. When I say happened I don't mean in a physical way but in a mental way. Maybe it is just that she is "done".

It is hard to explain, when it is just Her and I, how she acts to be able to paint an accurate picture for you to give me some feedback.

[Wonka]

Nit,

I would refrain from using the term "mental illness" when describing a WAW who just doesn't want to be married to you. It is being dismissive and minimizing her hurts that she's stuffed down over time.

Set her free. Move ahead with putting the house on the market and split proceeds 50%. Then place them an escrow until the rest of other financial issues are resolved. Then continue working with your L about retirement and other issues that matter to you. It may mean that those unresolved issues will need to be decided by a judge.

After they've been resolved, then the sale proceeds can be released from the escrow account.

I'd run those ideas by your L.

[nit84]

Wonka,

This is one of the few times I have used that term. You are correct it has serious implications if you used willy nilly.

I feel that I have not been dismissive or minimizing of my W hurts. But again I am inside this Sitch and probably don't see it.

I have extreme guilt feelings that I was such a horrible H that I hurt my W so bad and that is why she is acting in a way that is foreign to me. I get the fact that it is not suppose to unicorns and rainbows but she has become a very resentful person

I find myself defending my W against such illness talk sometimes.


I am not trying to be defensive sorry if it comes off that that.


My L just texted me. I should try to communicate with my W to see if the Idea about the house would be something she will agree upon.


It has been a bad day. I know my W is own her own journey. I guess the subconscious mind is powerful. When I wrote the draft email above I really didn't intend it to be an anxiety ridden piece that made it look like I was hoping for a miracle. It was just my thoughts about the house. Maybe if I got rid of the last two paragraphs it would be ok.

But you are correct Wonka I probably shouldn't send it at the moment because it is obvious my emotions have hold of me at the moment.

Thanks for the help!