Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 2 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
And as for the topic after that - your responses to why I'm trying to be his friend instead of his wife - you're right on ALL counts. I got nothin' to add to that one.

I'm feeling like a beaten freaking dog.


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
S
Member
Offline
Member
S
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
I'll have more thoughts on all that a little later . . . gotta run, but those are pretty key thoughts and questions. You are on the right -- (((ahem!))) -- "track," Train! grin


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
smile Well, that makes me feel a little less beaten, maybe. Or at least one wound out of 100 feels patched up. Lol.

Thank you, Starsky and gabbysmom, for your insight this morning.

I have NEVER felt more confused and off-balance in my entire life. I get my legs back here. smile


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
More later, but just made up for some lost ground today.

Starsky, get your high-five ready ...


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,319
W
Member
Offline
Member
W
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,319
Train,

I want to expand a bit on what Puppy said about the "friends" part.

From what I've read around the boards over the years, reconciliation occurs because the WAS remembers and misses the true essence of their LBS that underpins the friendship in the M. That is why I am constantly reminding you to re-attract your H for he misses his best friend: YOU.

It is okay to be in the friends zone for now...because that's what lead you two to get married in the first place. H is experiencing some withdrawal symptoms as he breaks things off with the OW. It will be a very bumpy road for all of you as he tries to cut ties with the OW. She may very well try to use all sorts of tricks to draw H back into the A.

However, I would suggest that you draw the line at hearing some of the intimate details about H and OW. Not happening! You can say, in addition to what Puppy said about H cleaning up his mess, "H, I know you can figure this out yourself. I have confidence that you will be able to do this."

Listen to H like a lover...no criticisms or trying to fix him. Become the 'OW' to the XOW! LOL!

Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
Wonka, I adore you. And your advice.

I am still on my phone instead of on my computer. So still more to come ...

BUT, I think you'll BOTH be happy with the conversation this evening.

I feel really, really good about it.

Having a one-on-one with D16 on the back patio right now. But I'll be back here soon.

Y'all rock.


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
As an aside, H is meeting with OW tonight ...

But more on that later, too ...


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
Things are moving quickly. Maybe too quickly. The conversation I was so proud of yesterday is almost a moot point now because H has said since that he wants back in our M. He decided not to meet OW last night, after all. Instead, he sent her a text - which he sent to me for approval - telling her, in no uncertain terms, their relationship is over. And then he came to our marital home to avoid her for the night.

Let me backtrack a little:

I received an email from L yesterday, saying H's L wanted all four of us to sit down and try to reach a settlement outside of court. My immediate concern was that H has been talking about following us to the mountains, which means his income is going to take a huge hit. What's the point of paying Ls to reach a settlement now when H and I would just be right back at that table a few months from now if he plans to move? In addition, how am I supposed to plan where I'm going to live if I know my support could change so drastically in only a few months? H still has me on a string ...

I texted H: Call me when you have a few minutes to chat?

Then I thought: No. This is what he wanted. And I'm ready to move forward. So, I emailed L back and told him - while I didn't look forward to the meeting - I'm willing to do it. And I texted H and said: Actually, never mind. (Remember, his phone is locked in his car, so he wasn't getting any of these texts at the time.)

But the more I thought about it, the more I thought: H doesn't have a track-record of thinking through things. Going through this *twice* is going to cost us a fortune. I couldn't think of many downsides to talking to him about it - and my L was okay with it - so I texted him AGAIN, right at 5 p.m., when I knew he'd be checking his phone: "Ok, so maybe DO call. Or better yet, stop by for a few. Kids and I are outside playing."

He came right over. Sure enough, he hadn't even considered it. I told him: "When I first heard from L, it occurred to me that this could be an expensive step we may need to avoid if you're going to move and change jobs. That's why I first texted you to call. Then it occurred to me: I'm ready to start moving on with my life, and being legally separated is a big step toward that. So I emailed L and told him to go ahead and schedule the meeting, and I sent you the follow-up text that said never mind re: calling me to chat. As it stands, we'll be having a meeting to work out the support order and sign our legal separation within the next week or so. But the more I've been thinking about it, the more I realize that it's in the best *financial* interest of the kids and me not to move forward with a support order right now if I'm going to have to pay my L now and again in just a couple months. It's going to cost us thousands to go through this twice."

H thought about it and said: "You're right. Are you good with what I'm paying you now?"

I said: "Considering I'm not paying mortgage, I'm good with it *for now*."

He said: "Okay then. I'll call L tomorrow and tell him we're holding off for now."

Then, he said: "I still have most of the tax money left over I was planning to use to pay the Ls for our D. How do you feel about using it for counseling instead?"

I was a little shell-shocked and don't remember much about my response except for asking, essentially, if he meant he was suggesting we put the D on hold indefinitely.

And then, he pulled his chair really, really close to mine and put his face close to mine ... and said yes. He wants to work things out. He wants back in our M.

THEN, however, he told me had plans to meet OW later in the night. I told him, if he truly wanted to commit to our M, that I would not be okay with that. I reminded him what he had told me in the conversation the other day about not being able to promise they wouldn't have sex. I told him, first: "I'm not your BFF. I'm your wife. It's incredibly disrespectful for you to talk to me about 'christening your apartment' - or NOT - with OW. It's disrespectful for you to talk to me about sex and OW *at all*. Second, no. You can't tell me in one breath you want to work on our M and in the next breath that you're meeting her later tonight."

He said: "Well, she's the one who said she wants to meet. I'm going to listen to what she has to say."

I replied: "Then I'm not ready for you to be my H again. And you're apparently not where you need to be to really be open to working on our M."

He said: "Maybe I'm not then. I don't know."

And I said: "Looks like we both have some big decisions to make."

Somehow, things turned less tense. He promised me I would hear from him later in the night. He hugged me, assured me he wanted to be with me - and was making plans for that - and left.

He had a meeting at work at 7 p.m. He texted me something at 8 p.m., once he was back at his place. I didn't respond. He texted an hour later: "You there?" I said: "Yep." And he started texting about random things - a computer, furniture, etc. He said his "meeting with OW" was at 11 p.m., when she got off work.

I told him to have a good night and that I would see him tomorrow (today) when he picked up the kids. He said, "Are you not gonna want to know the outcome?"

I said: "Depends. I'm still not sure I understand why you're meeting her in the first place if you've already told her you don't want a relationship."

He said: "She has a phone that I had gotten her to talk to me when OH was all over her as$. She's the one who wanted to meet, for whatever reason, and I want my phone back."

I simply replied, "I'm no fool. F*** a phone."

He wrote: "Huh?"

I didn't reply.

He wrote: "You know what? F*** meeting. I'll write her a text. I might come over there to hide out for a while though."

I said: "Just let me know if you decide to come over."

And he responded: "I'm gonna have to, she's liable for some crazy sh!t. How should I word this (text)?"

And, Starsky ... wait for it ... wait for it ...

I said: "Your mess. You clean it up."

He said: "K, on it!!!! :)))"

That felt good. smile

We texted a little more until he finally wrote, jokingly, "Hey stop texting me. I'm trying to write my 'out.'" I asked: "Your 'out' for GOOD? Or just for tonight?"

And he said, "For good d@mn it!!!!"

Then, he came over here, and we had a midnight drink on the back patio. We started talking a little. I told him I would need him to author a no-contact letter to OW. I also told him I would need him to agree to a transparency plan and, obviously, counseling.

The one thing that bothered me is that when I got to the part about the transparency plan, he said, "Yeah. Not a problem. You find everything out anyway."

I'm going to chalk it up to him being tired - for now. I could tell, even before that comment, that we were both wayyyyy too drained - physically and emotionally - to be having an in-depth discussion about our relationship or our future. But I knew I needed to at least get out my "demands" asap.

He's not exactly balking anything. But he's not showing me the remorse I feel he should have. It's more of that "power dynamic" thing. I'm not seeing him begging me back ... or even trying to understand the pain he has caused me.

Am I expecting too much, too soon?

Or is this a sign that he's not where he needs to be to actually begin the long, tough road to recovery?

H just texted to tell me he left a message for his L, telling him to stop everything, send him a bill and he'd be there to pick up all his paperwork soon.

He told me he loved me last night and this morning, and I felt my insides cringe. Is that normal?? I don't believe him!

I have a million more questions and concerns and fears swirling around in my head. But if I could get sorted out on those couple first, maybe I can start to pick apart everything else.


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,319
W
Member
Offline
Member
W
Joined: Oct 2004
Posts: 7,319
Train,

Baby, you rock! cool

Originally Posted By: Train

And, Starsky ... wait for it ... wait for it ...

I said: "Your mess. You clean it up."

He said: "K, on it!!!! :)))"

That felt good. smile


^^ deserves a Puppy 4-whistle!!! whistle whistle whistle whistle Good job on using this script!

He's not exactly balking anything. But he's not showing me the remorse I feel he should have. It's more of that "power dynamic" thing. I'm not seeing him begging me back ... or even trying to understand the pain he has caused me.

Am I expecting too much, too soon?


It took a while for the M to fall apart and it will take TIME to piece it back together. In a way, you are expecting way too much from H in terms of showing remorse and groveling. That is not the forgiving way to go about it. Focus on solutions going forward. I am liking what H has done so far in regard to wanting to work on the M and WANTS to be with YOU!

Or is this a sign that he's not where he needs to be to actually begin the long, tough road to recovery?


Honey, you cannot actually pin the recovery all on H. You do have a role in this as well. You do NEED to contribute to the recovery. It takes two to tango to make this new M take off in new direction.

He told me he loved me last night and this morning, and I felt my insides cringe. Is that normal?? I don't believe him!

Train, why did you have this particular reaction? Why didn't you believe him? Why are you not able to take his "ILY" comments at face value since he has declared that he wants to be with YOU. Yes, YOU!!!!

Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
T
Train Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
T
Joined: Mar 2014
Posts: 1,433
Hey, Wonka!!!

Baby, you rock! ... Good job on using this script!

Yay!!!! Thank you SO much! I was like: Dang! I was waiting on an opportunity to use that one, and Starsky promised I'd get my chance. laugh

In a way, you are expecting way too much from H in terms of showing remorse and groveling. That is not the forgiving way to go about it. Focus on solutions going forward. I am liking what H has done so far in regard to wanting to work on the M and WANTS to be with YOU!

Thank you for this, Wonka. It makes me feel a lot better. I guess I've just read so many stories of cheating spouses being incredibly remorseful, even as soon as the A is discovered ... and I have A LOT of leftover anxiety from the first time this happened. I don't trust myself, or my judgment, anymore. What *has* occurred to me is that something I've learned through reading these boards and hearing from you, actually: I need to pay more attention to his actions.

- He sent her a text last night and sent it to me first to approve.
- He didn't meet her.
- ... instead, he was with ME.
- He is actively looking for homes in the mountains.
- He invited me to the mountains with him and the kids on Sunday and is now saying we will use that opportunity to drive through different towns to look for our new home for our new life. He is already mapping out the towns through which we will drive.
- He called off the divorce and even asked his L to send a bill.

I can't ask for much more than that, especially considering this is only Day 2. wink Thanks for keeping me straight and level-headed on that!

Or is this a sign that he's not where he needs to be to actually begin the long, tough road to recovery?

Honey, you cannot actually pin the recovery all on H. You do have a role in this as well. You do NEED to contribute to the recovery. It takes two to tango to make this new M take off in new direction.


Yes. I worded that question wrong. I should have said: "Or is this a sign that he's not where he needs to be FOR US to actually begin the long, tough road to recovery?"

My fear is that I'm going to be working on it more than him. That's just in my nature. I asked him last night, since we haven't had ONE conversation about the breakdown of our M: "Can you give me ONE thing for now? ONE area I can improve on, starting today?

And he said, "I want to have sex with you more. And I want you to sext me some through the day."

I swear, that's ALL he thinks about! laugh But that's exactly what OW gave him that I didn't.

He did add, though: "And I know I need to pay attention to you more for you to want to have sex with me. I need to have conversations with you, take you out to dinner, buy you flowers. I get that."

Actually, H is VERY GOOD at all of those things ... except conversation. He's always bought me flowers and asked to take me out. His work schedule just got in the way. I think we are both looking forward to a fresh start, moving to a place with no triggers and somewhere that we can live better within our means and without him having to work so much. He DOES say he wants to live together when we move. We will start counseling soon, while we still live separately, and see where that goes.

Train, why did you have this particular reaction? Why didn't you believe him? Why are you not able to take his "ILY" comments at face value since he has declared that he wants to be with YOU. Yes, YOU!!!!

I haven't heard him say "ILY" to ME in so long. It almost sounded odd. And I guess I have a hard time believing he can possibly love me after the way he has treated me. The A was one thing. But his venom and meanness and the awful things he said just make me wonder: How can you love me this week when you were saying those things to OW as recently as last week? I mean, he was still forwarding my texts to her LAST WEEK so they could bitch about me. So how does he love me NOW, less than a week later? I just don't get it. At all.


M: 40 H: 44
Married 14 years
S11 & D6; D20 & D19 from previous M
2BDs/PAs, 8 years apart
Piecing: April 2014
Page 2 of 8 1 2 3 4 5 6 7 8

Moderated by  Michele Weiner-Davis 

Link Copied to Clipboard