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Hey cville, any secret methods to get the WAW, to notice that I'm not the man her peers and mind have made me out to be?


Me: 37 W:33
S: 2
M: 9/5/09
Suspected: 1/7/12
Confirmed: 2/10/12
Served: 3/29/12
W moved out 3/30/12
First court 5/17/12
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I'm gonna warn you, this is long. But I've been in both shoes, so maybee my story could help you. Hint: it wasnt 'till he moved on and no longer wanted me that I fell back in love with him...


I am new to this site and look forward to sharing and growing with you. First off, I believe I have some valuable insight to offer: I have been in both positions of this ugly situation. Let me explain both scenarios...


(scenario 1)

We have been married 4 years and have 2 little girls. We weren't prefect, but man when the times were good they were soo good. (fast forwarding to the fall out) My H started being just so mean and cruel and once our lease was up, I got my own place. I knew he wanted me back, he told me, text me, called me, everything. I had no respect for him and treated him like crap, but he just kept on loving me. He would come over and make love to me whenever I wanted him to. I gave him just enough attention to keep my foot in the door. (I'm just being honest) I knew in my heart that I loved him, but I didn’t open my heart to him for several reasons

1) I wasn't forced to, he made it so easy just to enjoy him and then push him aside
2) his behavior let me have my cake and eat it too
3) I was selfishly enjoying all the desperate attempts he was making

That started in January. And you know what happened? By March he opened his heart to another woman. Granted she was married and was his boss, but he did it. That man did a 180 on me and omg it stung!!! Man it works, I'm telling you! He went from being my slave to please me to focusing on his own life and moving on. That got my attention so fast and it hurt. Before this I was so intent on moving forward with my life, I had even had several relationships during this time. For those of you who are intimidated by the "other" in your spouse's life, let me tell you this...

I was so sure that I could not spend another minute with my husband. I forgot everything good and focused on the bad. I rekindled a relationship from before hubby and I were married, and I fell back in love with this other man (Mark). I bragged about us to hubby all the time, but mostly as a way to hurt him and make him jealous. Mark and I even had matching tattoos that we designed together. It didn’t feel perfect, and we had our fights. I knew I was going to miss the person I was when I was with hubby, but I pushed it aside. I just focused on the newness of Mark and all of the exciting butterflies. But as soon as hubby did a 180, I dropped Mark like a hot coal. I even emailed Mark, telling him that I loved my hubby and also sent it to my hubby. So trust me guys, that "significant other", no matter how sure they seem, is really just a Band-Aid and a mental distraction. So now let's get to scenario #2....

(Scenario #2)
How funny life is that we have switched places. He is still so serious about his relationship with his OW (other woman). They are living as if they are married. (Her husband is in another state) My children's car seats are in her car, her stuff is in his shower, she loves him so much, blah blah blah..... sounds like what I had been saying months earlier. Him doing his 180 literally made me fall back in love with him. Where I had reasons to leave I now only have reasons to stay. Damn-it, love is tough, and so am I.

Reading DR helped tremendously, as well as reflecting on scenario #1. I have complete faith in my marriage, and appreciate this journey. If it weren't for this craziness I would not have fallen so in love with my husband, and I fully anticipate the same happening with him. If you look at people who have been married 50+ years, they will all tell you of hardships they have overcome. This is the stuff that strengthens marriages, not breaks them. Don't you dare listen to anyone who would tell you otherwise~just feel empathy that they are not as strong as you are.

In case anyone is wondering what I have been doing to handle scenario #2, here's a breakdown...

March 4th -walked in him & OW, flipped out and went psycho. BAD MOVE
March 16 -had sex together. who knew? But felt used afterwards
March 27 -sex again, yup, feeling desperate
April 1st -he is complementing and loving towards me
April 3rd -sent open heart email
April 4th -good phone call, did the letter work???
April 5th -it worked! Most amazing love making ever!!!
April 6th -yeah, didn't work. Saw them in the car together. Feel disgusted

Weeks go by, I'm not changing. Still crying, pleading, feeding his ego...

May 12 -went a while without contacting him. We meet and have sex. Man I gotta stop doing this! Lol
May 12 -he is aware that I'm moving forward with my life, have made some major personal changes

Decided no more "have your cake and eat it too" sex, no more reaching out and contacting him. Started 180 wink

May 16 -he calls for no random reason. I'm happy and keep it short, end it first
May 20 -he texts me to say he's glad to see me so happy and is proud of me
May 20 -ok, he actually sent me several "small step" encouraging texts"
May 24 -calls me for something that didn’t deserve a phone call. Honestly think he just wanted to talk. I Kept it short.
May 24 -I contact him needing the girl's SSN for the divorce paperwork. Possible bad move, pissed him off! Lol but if he's so happy why would he push against the divorce? Um can't have your cake and eat it too buddy, I'm moving on with or without you...(no, I didn't say it, just thought it)

So here we are. Thanks for sticking with me! Hopefully it gave some of you insight. But here's the thing, even learning from my OWN mistakes I still struggle! I feel like I have been perpetuating this scenario and just feel weighed down. Trust me, I'm doing all the right things...not contacting him, living my own life, being positive, yada yada yada. But wow this is hard. He's still with his MARRIED boss and not making and real change. This huge chunk of me wants to file for divorce. I know, I believe in us so much, but I just can't live like this anymore. After walking through all of this mess, I have realized how great of a person I am and that at 31, I am ready for something SO REAL. This isn't real, it's a game.


Me-31 H-24
D3,D2
M 4 yrs
WAW(me) 12/2011
role reversal 03/2012
(H)PA 3-6/2012
(H)D filed 6/2012
D deemed "inactive", closed 8/2012
I've moved on 9/2012

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Hey Peringo,

The only advice I have for you is to not BE the man they have you made out to be. One of my favorite quotes is, "Those that have nothing to hide, hide nothing." If you live your life 100% transparent, then anything they throw at you that's not true will bounce right off. But you'll also have to accept that her beliefs are her reality. So if she says you're X (overweight, for example) and you think you're not, reality doesn't matter. If you're trying to get to HER, you need to meet her where she's at.

Sorry, read your sitch. You've got a lot going on. You may have to let her finalize the D and let her live the life she's chosen, and then hope she'll miss what she had, if you're willing to take her back. Some aren't. And some don't come back.


Me:49 WAW H:59
T:19.5 M:19
S:13
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Thanks, I have 3 difficult battles... 1) overcoming my wifes peers viewpoints on marriage.
2) getting my wife to remember the person she was that led to our marriage.
3) fighting like hell for primary custody of my son.

I really wish I had the gift of time....


Me: 37 W:33
S: 2
M: 9/5/09
Suspected: 1/7/12
Confirmed: 2/10/12
Served: 3/29/12
W moved out 3/30/12
First court 5/17/12
HELP!
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Hi JG333,

Thanks for your post! It looks like you were still on moderation and I just noticed it. I've heard your similar sitch several times now. I'm really trying to take it to heart. I'm just having a hard time finding anything to build on. I hope I'm not here some time down the road telling the same story.


Me:49 WAW H:59
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S:13
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Originally Posted By: 1702
CV, thanks so much for responding. There are 3 sides to every story... Hers, mine, and the truth. So you can take this as my side, but we didn't have years to go by that she felt that I was "pulling the hairs out one by one". Less that 6 months after we were married, she gave me the ILYBNILWY speech.

that's pretty fast and early on. WHY did she say she was unhappy?

I read all of THIS thread but assume there's another one?? Anyhow, I found little or nothing of you owning your stuff. Sure, You pay lip service to it but what, specifically, is it you are working on IN YOU?

Here's the crucial KEY to realize:

If your w does not feel marriage to you will be better/different, than she's not likely to return. Period.


So what are YOU CHANGING to reveal this new relationshiop to her?



Many issues started this, but i truly feel this was a by product of her undiagosed depression.



"Many issues....BUT" and then you point at HER....look, I'm not into assigning blame but that's pretty much all you are doing in this thread. Assigning blame TO HER

and she's the one person in this situation YOU have NO control over, so, back to YOU....

and btw, a recent study revealed that 90% of women who take anti depressants OR who suffer from depression, have spouses that fit the behavioral criteria for being "critical people"...


She was addicted to non-narcotic pain pills,

what "none narcotic pain pills" was she "addicted" to? I happen to be familiar with this subject matter, and off the top of my head I can't think of one that fits that description.

So my next question is, Who diagnosed this addiction? How did it get treated? Were you supportive in her recovery program? Attend any NA meetings?



came off those only to be addicted to something alot worse. When she came off those, for the reason of us being able to have another child, the wd's were terrible. (cold turkey).

wow, so
she went off of one medication "Only to be addicted to something a lot worse" that remains nameless...(were they narcotics? Benzos? What?)

What's with going cold turkey? WHY? If she went off either of those meds, cold turkey, her blood pressure would go up and she could suffer so much more by doing it that way. Withdrawal from benzodiazapines can be fatal. IF she had been pregnant and gone cold turkey, the odds of a miscarriage are much higher.

I was taking narcotic pain medication for a ruptured disk, when I learned I was pregnant. I learned that opiates themselves, (i.e., narcotics) do not cause birth defects, but the child would be born dependent on them. and would have to be weaned, which sounded like a real drag for a newborn.

So I went off the pain meds when I discovered I was pregnant and I curtailed many of my activities due to increased back pain, which was then not being treated.

B/c of the side effects of withdrawal which sukk big time anyhow -much worse than most imagine-

I had to be hospitalized, w/BP and vitals taken every 30 minutes, so that I would not miscarry (b/c among other things, blood pressure sky rockets in opiate withdrawal and that leads to miscarriages).


So my gut reaction, which is biased/informed, I admit, is that your wife went thru hell, alone, when she could have used a lot more medical and emotional support.

The fact she did this cold turkey speaks volumes about how little insight there was on your end or hers, unless she felt she "deserved" the hell of cold turkey b/c she felt ashamed. Shame is a huge reason many people don't seek out help for this. And shame is depressing.

If she were really physically addicted, whose idea was it that she go cold turkey? WHY? Why not get help? ALSO-since she was taking PAIN medication I'm assuming she had some actual pain. Chronic pain is also very depressing.

Is anything being done to treat the underlying cause of her physical pain?

so, where's the part where you "own" your flaws and are working on them?

BTW- There are almost zero success stories of addicts recovering by cold turkey methods alone...no wonder the woman was depressed. THAT ITSELF is very depressing...



thigs got better with us for a couple weeks, and it has been downhill ever since. Things she complained about were issues I had the entire time like spending time together, not communicating., ect...

Did she relapse?

You are VAGUE here about her complaints. She said you did not communicate or spend enough time with her? Is that it?

Those are not small items. It hurts to feel ignored. It feels like rejection. And it Sounds like she did not feel like a priority to you and that made her unhappy. No shock there. BTW, try reading "The Five Love Languages" b/c I think your w's love language is quality time together and yours isn't. I recommend the book for nearly all couples.

Instead of working on THOSE issues she complained of, it SEEMS you believed she was wrong to feel that way b/c you make no mention of a single change to address those complaints. Somehow you conveyed to her that she needed fixing b/c she was "depressed" and "addicted" so may I assume you supported her taking medications so she'd feel better (and coincidentally, you would have to do nothing??)

Can you please explain to me how you can be married for 6 months, hear that your wife is not in love with you, have these other problems, and then decide that was a good time to start a family?

Whose idea was it to try and have a baby THEN?

If it was her idea, she was probably lonely enough to believe a baby would assuage that isolated feeling AND OR, the motivation to stay clean, is highest when a child is coming...if It was your idea, I don't know what to think.
You tell me.


After a short conversation with W last night, I have found that she blames me for the breakdown of our marriage because I couldn't compromise about things.


take this information as "intel" that has value b/c it shows you what YOU can work on. Stop blaming her or defending yourself, and start looking at things you can do something about.

Be grateful she's giving you some answers even if you don't like them. There is less mystery here than you think. And that is good news!

If she believed SHE was to blame for all of this and had no motivation to change, then it would be hopeless.

instead of wanting to be "right", try wanting to be happy.

Only if there are things YOU can change, is there really any power on your end. So if you want to blame her for all this so you can be "right", then so be it. Be right but be alone.

Be right, but powerless to do anything b/c after all, it's ALL HER fault...

or be empowered by identifying what YOU CAN WORK ON, and begin.





When I called her out about these things and the fact that of all those things, she ended up getting it the way she wanted, she then told me that it shouldn't have been a big deal to begin with.

First off, in a way she's right. If the conflicts you two had, resulted in her getting her way - it's either b/c she had good points to begin with, but your stubborness or other flaws blocked them, AND that's on YOU.

If she wasn't "right" but you simply gave in, then you clearly didn't do it with love, b/c you were so begrudging and resentful, it didn't seem like a gesture of love to her. You sure do keep score. That's a lose lose proposition btw.

And when you challenge her RECALL of the marriage or her reasons for wanting out, you get nowhere.

The more you challenge the choices she's making, the more you force her to defend them. Do you get that?


And when I told her the reasons they were a big deal for me was because I wanted to have a marriage and family, she proceeded to tell me that those are what "did it for her".

this^^ is so very vague. You just said she got her way on things and that somehow proves you are a compromising man...but then you say it was "a big deal" for you, whatever those compromises or issues were, b/c you wanted to have a family. The big deal was what? You compromising?

What are you talking about? IS there some other thread that contains the secret code here? When you resolved conflicts were you discussing a purchase of a television or car or having a child? The latter is a decision both must agree on.

Too many missing pieces of the puzzle here. But that makes me wonder why you are skimming over it...


I am so confused because after her depression kicked in from the meds,

again with the diagnosing AND mind reading and again with the "nothing YOU could have done about it" so you are NOT accountable for any of this...do
you see how self serving your diagnoses seem to be?

If you want to change your situation, change YOU. It's a tough thing to hear, but we have all been there and done that to stay married,

or we did not and we're divorced, or we changed and divorced anyhow - but are better people than before. That counts for a lot.


and even though I am not a dr., (believe it was depression, all signs and symptoms), she became a different person, not wanting all the things that made her fall in love with me from the beginning.

You said she was unhappy early in the marriage, correct? So this has been happening awhile now?

How long had you dated before marriage? WEre you a better boyfriend than husband? Do you think she expected you to improve/change after becoming a husband?


Now she is running, not walking away from our marriage without even trying anything to fix things.

given YOUR description here, what do you think would motivate her to try and fix things?


Basically after only a few short months of things not being good with us, she is adamant that she never loved me, shouldn't have said yes to proposal, and that this is better for both of us.



When were things good with you two? Your description more or less made it sound like things were rarely good.

And when things were "not good" for you, they were damn bad for her.

If she really became addicted to pain pills (though I have a lot of questions about your use of the word "addicted for a non narcotic pain pill" b/c frankly, it sounds more like someone who had under treated pain, and probably still does, but I digress)

Withdrawal, being in moderate to severe pain, chronically, are both reasons for depression in most people.

If a spouse isn't supportive of his wife in those circumstances, when you are both relatively healthy and young, it may have seemed to her she simply chose the wrong man to be her life partner. After all, what would happen if she got cancer or became wheelchair bound and was sad? Would you be "working late" a lot? I say this b/c I am wondering if those are things that might have crossed her mind...

any insight on any of this?

I know it feels like I am hitting you with a 2 x 4 and i probably am.

But you are not challenging yourself much here, at least not on this thread. You are just here venting (which is fine as long as other REAL WORK is happening) and' blaming her...

I don't see "real work" happening on your end. By that I mean working on YOU.

Have you read the Div Remedy book? What did you think of it?


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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M-43 W-40
2D - 9 and 5

Emotion, yet peace.
Ignorance, yet knowledge.
Passion, yet serenity.
Chaos, yet harmony.
Death, yet a new life.

RECONCILED AND WISER
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thanks Bond. I have not finished the first thread yet, just about 4 pages. I did notice the first post in the first thread, says pretty much the same thing this first one in this thread says...all about what SHE is doing to him and how it doesn't make sense.

I'm not yet finding the insights on his part about his role OR the possibility that she has a point--maybe, just maybe, they weren't on the same page from day one. It seems they don't recall who agreed to what, when.

Bond, are you suggesting she's a WAW? She doesn't fit the MLC scenario but I think dividing people into two groups as if that's all emcompassing over simplifies. It's got to be more complicated, don't you think?

Just wondering what point there is to saying she's nutty or confused, if that's all we say.

What's he going to do with that?

And 1702, I'm sorry to tell you this, but if you live in the USA, there's no such thing as you refusing a divorce nor does not signing something prevent a divorce from happening. I understand you don't want one and you don't want to assist her in ending the marriage. I get that. But you have to know,

If your w wants a divorce, she can have one. Whether you sign papers or not, all that does is force her to get a waiver of signature, or whatever it's called in your state, so she can move forward. It'll cost more in time, and possibly money.

I have had to tell many people, mostly older women, that the days the Television still portrays, of people like Joan Collins telling her wayward h that she'd "NEVER GIVE HIM A DIVORCE" are over. That's b/c the state grants divorce, not the spouse.

The most you can do is delay it, which may be worthwhile. I don't advise helping her to divorce you, but know that sometimes, delaying the inevitable adds costs.

Plus, this may be a journey she's on that doesn't involve you directly, and in her mind, it may require her to finish this "task" before she can discover that the grass is greener where it's watered. IOW, she may have to feel "free" in order to choose to commit. Right now what I'm getting from her is a sense of feeling trapped, regardless of whtether it's right or wrong, that's the vibe I get from her.

Perhaps you ought to Detach, back off and leave her to her task...?


But you ought to know your legal rights. Try not to get offended by a lawyer who feels she has seen this before and knows the likely outcome. She probably means well.

I'm a L but when I interviewed the lawyers I thought of using, I found one I really liked and related to. I told her that I wanted to save the marriage but not at all costs.

SHE is the one show suggested I file for a sep rather than file for divorce b/c she held out hope for us to reconcile and she was right. She could have made a lot more money off of me than she did. (Actually, I see her as a Godsend and a friend, now.)

After learning my rights, I felt empowered to CHOOSE to stay married and knowing I was not stuck or a doormat, helped me find the strength it took to stay and work on ME and creating a good life for myself and the kids.

Information is power and hiding your head in the sand isn't a position of strength, nor is it attractive.

I think some reality of what your w may face as a single mom, would possibly help your cause. I don't know what role the father of her daughter has there.
But will she really be better off without you? There may be only one way for HER to find out...

What can YOU do to slow things down, (other than not signing something)?
Can you give her more space and relax and be less predictable?

Can you GAL? What changes do you want to make in YOU? Can you begin them now?


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
Embrace the Change
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crazyville, the things you sad about trying for years to tell your husband what you needed, him saying he would address it, and things never changing sounds exactly like what my wife has said. Also the part about the M being fine for me but not for her. I am only a week away from our D being final, and....she is right. I just passively let her hurt and leave. now I wish I had time to fix it all.

What kinds of things would you be looking for? Words don't seem to work, but I am not sure I have time for her to see actions.

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My husband walked out on me after an argument on August 2, 2012. he was supposed to leave that weekend to work on a racecar (that is his hobby). He left me hanging because he wouldn't come home, he wouldn't talk to me about anything other then business things. After being gone 2 1/2 weeks, we talked after meeting at a mutual friends house. He told me he was deciding if he loved me enough to come home and resume our marriage. A few days after that he told me he was coming home. He has now returned home, he did apologize for hurting me, but we have not talked aboput things. I have been working on myself with a counselor who is solution oriented and I had a session with a DB counselor.

My question is: now that he is home, how do i trust him? I don't ever want that to happen again. I am working on myself and my parts of our problems, but how do I get him to work on things? He is unwilling to go to counseling at this point. I am trying to GAL, which I see is my main problem. All of focus has been on him and not myself. Any suggestions would be appreciated!!
Terri

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