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Do some research on how divorce harms children and families and print that up...

It's easy to say "fine" but its a lot harder when there's a pile of research in front of you proving you are being an a$$...

Especially if he hears from his eldest son and daughter that they both feel misrable about his threatening to abaondon the family

And ya I am expressing it as abandon and family, not move into an apartment which is likley the way he would spin it

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And if you do decide to sit and have a state of teh union do it as a family with all three of you speaking to him as a unit...

If you show your son and daughter the script above and tell them this is how you are going to approach him and invite them to sit in in order to support his working with the family

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OK. That sounds like a healthy plan. D18 and I talked for quite awhile today. Her biggest fear is that either she or S16 will get so upset with H that they will just blurt out stuff at him. I told her that it's OK to have anger - anger is not wrong, but you have to express it right. She and S16 are on board. We will just have to see how it goes this coming week I suppose.

Meanwhile, no more talk of leaving or whatnot from H. He's been somewhat cooperative with the family but still is not "all in." D and I went shopping today for college stuff. Tried to get him to come along but he did not want to. I told him that financially, it would be good for him to have an opinion on what we spent on what...still did not want to go. I discussed the budget for the shopping trip and he agreed. We did go to the movies later as a family. SO...all is calm for the moment.

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Just show your D and S the script so they know what's going to be said... they may even have suggestions... Tell her its upsetting for you as well which is why you will say what's on the script and exit the convo...

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It doesn't help that all of this comes right at when D has to go to orientation, cheer camp, and move to her new place all in the next 10 days! I hate the timing, but you play the hand you're dealt in life.

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As long as she understands you are trying to save her family I can't imagine she's going to be frustrated with you.

YOu want them a bit frustrated with thier father. You want them dissappointed enough to express it so they pressure him to cooperate...

If everyone is civilized and calm then your H won't feel any pressure and an exit will be easier...

If he is going to exit that's his choice, but his family's job is to make that a difficult choice for him.

I don't communicate with my family, but they make it very easy to avoid them.

Don't worry if the kids are frustrated or scared (this usually appears as anger, but anger really is simply a mask for a deeper emotion)... They need to feel something in order to pressure your H.

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Yeah - she and S16 are not frustrated with me at all, but they definitely are with their dad! I have told them righteous indignation is nothing to shy away from.

Right now things are still calm: H went to church with us this morning and out to lunch. We went to the movies last night as a family... Yet, he's there but not there at the same time. He is still distant even though he's in attendance. It's not as bad as it once was though. At least it isn't "arms folded/scowling mode" when he's around now. Hope4Us could be right in that maybe he's in WD from the EA and other escapes... And btw: no more carrying the cell into the bathroom while he showers either.

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It sounds like he's trying... If he cans the negative talk and starts following your boundaries implicitly you may not need to confront.

What is he doing now that is violating the boundary list you have set up?

Did you add anything to the boundary list posted?

Are your kids ok with that list?

They need to know if he crosses a boundary that they need to call him on it and WALK AWAY

If all three of you call him on boundary violations and then EXIT before he gets defensive and all three of you KEEP that UP I think that's a pretty solid wall he won't break

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Well, he is trying, but I'm not sure of the motivation for it, which is the hard part right now. If I had to say, it's not because he wants the M but because he doesn't want me to force him out of the home.

Honestly, right now he is not crossing any boundaries. That's the positive. The negative is, he's not doing anything to work on the M either, other than our daily 30 min. conversations: no counseling, no book reading, no seeking to improve the R by activities for just the 2 of us, etc... Of course, I have not forced that issue because I am giving him his week to consider things and that week is not yet up.

I'm not sure what I will do if H doesn't bring up it being the end of a week and doesn't have a decision of any kind, yet is not crossing boundaries. It's like doing the bare minimum to not be forced out yet stagnant at the same time.

All of this gets even more complicated right now, with D only having basically 4 days left at home! It's an emotional time. On a practical level, she won't be around to help build that wall.

S16 is a different story. H came to bed last night and told me that S16 told him he was ticked about the sex texting with the old gf. I had asked S16 not to say anything to H about me telling him about that, but it's unfair to ask a 16 year old to keep quiet. That was the one thing he was really ticked about, more than anything else because it's a definite wrong in his book. H was probably miffed that I told S, but he did not get defensive. I told him that all 3 of the kids are trying to be strong, but they are upset about what's going on and rightfully so. I didn't focus on the text msg but on the bigger picture. I told him I explained to S that there were bigger issues to deal with other than the text message - but S had a right to be angry about it.

I keep reiterating to S16 that the bigger problem is that H refuses to work on the M and is willing to walk away after 20 years, not the text message. That was just a symptom. I wish he would see that more clearly. In any case, just goes to show that these private conversations need to halt. I guess I will cross that bridge this week as well, come decision time.

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Yup... well, its just exposure so there's no reason to be angry. It's better that the truth is out there.

Your H can be as embarassed as he likes. HE chose to send messages to old gf's and he has to own that. Do NOT APOLOGIZE for that... He's already cheated on the family once and he was starting again... He just got caught early... He has no case there and will have to own it and keep his anger/embarassment to himself... Did he even apologize to his son for that or did he just walk away angry?

The problem with your son is he likley wants specifics... The text message is a specific... "not working on the marriage" isn't... Try listing to your son the things he should be doing like you did in this post :

1. Reading
2, Homework

etc.. be as specific as you can so he gets it... many people work much better with specifics than abstractions and your son is likely just working with what he's comfortable.

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