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A Message from Michele
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Jumping in (1st post) #1780324
06/09/09 01:24 AM
06/09/09 01:24 AM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,831
Connecticut
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Gardener Offline OP
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Gardener  Offline OP
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Joined: Jun 2009
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Bear with me, all. Discovered this website 6/01 hoping against hope there was something like this out there. Read everything, plus hundreds of posts that first night. Called for DB Telephone Coaching app't 6/2, Coaching session with Dottie 6/3 (thank you, Dottie!). Been reading DR and the posts of all you brave, compassionate people all week (feel like I know you, Coach!)

Long version: Great 2nd marriage for us both for 14 out of 17 years: good friends, companions, partners, lovers, everything. Built great blended family who all love each other, no one has ever used the term "step"-anything (her 2, my 2 all now in their 30's and settled into their lives and passions).

One rough patch:I began abusing alcohol '04, hiding my nightly, self-medicating buzz until I was called on it by wife in '06. I quit , we went into joint counseling, wife went to Al-Anon, I chose Rational Recovery over AA because it resonated more with me.

Last year, we seemingly inexplicably went through peaks and valleys of great-as-usual and quiet and distant. Wife was seeing EAP counselor (who doesn't support our staying married) and on Bomb Date (11/2/08) said "I got us an MC app't; I'm getting an apartment. And it's been mixed signals ever since. MC had her work on her, me work on me, we talked about communication styles but never really addressed issues. Talked about talking but never talked. After W asked for divorce last month, MC announced that our last session was our last session ("M was DOA when you walked in door 6 mos. ago, too much water over the dam, should have come to me 2 - 3 years ago.")

So, I certainly did my share of crying, pleading and all the other DB no-no's for first few months then started backing off a bit, DB Coach Dottie said I was starting to do a lot of correct things, then she (and you guys) gave me so much more to do. I'm on my way to a better me, my best friend (W) is confused and in a tremendous amount of pain and that's the way I'm approaching it.

I'll have more details and many more questions in due course, but need help with a few immediate questions right now:

1)After she asked for D, I removed my wedding band the next day (she hasn't). Not out of spite, but because it became a source of pain, not joy and by not wearing it I thought I was reminding myself that this is REALLY bad (and I didn't even know about the Stockdale Paradox then!), Should I leave it off/put it back on?
2) W's b'day is in couple of weeks, our anniversary shortly thereafter. What if anything should I do (gift, acknowledge, ignore)?

Thanks, all. And thanks in advance for all that I'm sure is to come.


Gardener

"My soul, be satisfied with flowers,
With fruit, with weeds even; but gather them
In the one garden you may call your own."
Cyrano deBergerac


Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Gardener] #1780718
06/09/09 05:46 PM
06/09/09 05:46 PM
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 7,943
Colorado
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Ready2Change Offline
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Ready2Change  Offline
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There are threads about the wedding ring. It is your call. Some believe it is a symbol of the commitment the marriage. Some believe it is a symbol so their current state of mind. I left mine on. I was ready for hers to disappear at some point, and did not react to it going away. When I was served with D papers, I took mine off, respectfully handed it to her and said good luck.

As for the bday and anniversary, I would think a 180 would be in order. Think about what you normally did, and do the opposite.


"What is best for my kids is best for me"
Amor Fati
Link to quotes: https://www.divorcebusting.com/forums/ubbthreads.php?ubb=showflat&Number=2879712
Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Ready2Change] #1780778
06/09/09 07:07 PM
06/09/09 07:07 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,831
Connecticut
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Gardener Offline OP
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Thanks, R2C. I'll look at those threads.

The b'day/ann'y 180s idea sounds real good. I hadn't thought of that (real new at this).

Gardener


Gardener

"My soul, be satisfied with flowers,
With fruit, with weeds even; but gather them
In the one garden you may call your own."
Cyrano deBergerac


Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Gardener] #1781768
06/11/09 04:20 PM
06/11/09 04:20 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,831
Connecticut
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Gardener Offline OP
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Gardener  Offline OP
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Joined: Jun 2009
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Hi, all

Help! Anyone have any add'l advice re: my sitch? Should I provide more info on my sitch? Should I go to TLR forum. Is there a TLR forum? (Gonna go look right now.)
Thanks.


Gardener

"My soul, be satisfied with flowers,
With fruit, with weeds even; but gather them
In the one garden you may call your own."
Cyrano deBergerac


Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Gardener] #1781772
06/11/09 04:31 PM
06/11/09 04:31 PM
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 5,299
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Coach Offline
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Coach  Offline
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What is the source of pain for taking your ring off?
Why keep it on?
It's your choice.


B-day/Anniv - don't go overboard, maybe just a simple card acknowledging the day.

What are your goals?

180s?

GAL - how are you taking care of yourself?

Just keep asking here for what you need, read and post on other's threads - you make friends and you will learn alot.
Whatchya growin in ya garden?

Cheers
Coach


M22,H45,W45 S21/18D12
Retain faith that you will prevail in the end, regardless of the difficulties and at the same time confront the most brutal facts of your current reality, whatever they might be.
Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Coach] #1781855
06/11/09 06:36 PM
06/11/09 06:36 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
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Gardener Offline OP
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Gardener  Offline OP
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Connecticut
Thanks, Coach

Taking off the ring was a post-"I want a divorce", pre-DR/DBing move along the lines of "Face it, this is over, you tried everything these past six months while she just moved further and further away." And a bit of a 180 for me, in retrospect. Why keep it on? We're still technically/legally married and now I have some hope again. But off feels right so off it remains.

Yeah, a simple card/acknowledgement feels right, too, re: b'day/anniv. Although, I immediately wonder should I sign it "Love, Gardener"? (L word is like her kryptonite, now) "Always, Gardener"? (always=less scary than L) or just "Gardener"? Am I overthing all this? Is it possible to overthink this stuff? Also, I'm going away the weekend of our 2 annivs (day we met, day we married)

Two present goals: 1) She will begin to seem at ease/less awkward when she comes over (very briefly once a week right now for mail, etc.) 2) she will ask to spend some time together. Though I don't know how to reconcile these and showing her some of the changing me while making myself scarce when she's around, saying little, etc. and other Last Resort guidelines.

180s include being positive, upbeat, not calling/emailing her. No pleading. Agreeing with her. maintaining my heart's one basic approach to her that this is my dear, dear friend who is "very confused and in a tremendous amount of emotional pain" as the MC once told me privately.

GAL: got back into nutrition, started exercising again, meditating again, Saturday/Sunday hiking again, joined a local hiking club, volunteered w/local organization, reaching out to friends and just getting the heck out of the house in general.

The garden has many bulbs, perennials, sunflowers, spinach, peas, carrots, herbs, beans, tomatoesetc.

In the real garden, I'm nursing shoots of hope, perseverance, PMA, patience while forever weeding out the gloom, doom, self-pity and other insidious invaders.

Thanks, again


Gardener

"My soul, be satisfied with flowers,
With fruit, with weeds even; but gather them
In the one garden you may call your own."
Cyrano deBergerac


Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Gardener] #1781861
06/11/09 06:46 PM
06/11/09 06:46 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 626
Florida
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stillloveshim Offline
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Gardner
Is she still wearing her ring?
If it feels better off for you then keep it off. Purely your call as you are still technically married.
What steps has she taken toward divorce?
How much time do you spend with her now?
Did you kick the MC who was so incredibly crappy?
You are doing an awesome job with the GALing. Good stuff in there.
What is your first course of action here?

Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: stillloveshim] #1781888
06/11/09 07:26 PM
06/11/09 07:26 PM
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 3,831
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Gardener Offline OP
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As of two weeks ago, yes, she was wearing her ring. Last time she was here, she was inandout, holding some things in her left hand, so I couldn't tell without being real obvious. I see you're not a WAW, but as a woman and having read my sitch, would my not wearing the ring make you curious, pi**ed, or what? Or should I stop thinking about what she's thinking altogether?!

W mentioned getting a mediator once at last MC meeting (3 weeks ago). No mention, no movement at all (that I'm aware of) since. 2nd hand reports (fwiw) I've gotten from DIL is that W is very, very confused, doesn't know what to do.
Other 2nd hand report is that W's C, who used to push for divorce is now pushing for a decision (go for D or go for reconciliation). Right now, I think someone should tell her that status quo is a good, if not permanent, option, too.

Like I said, I see W once a week, very briefly. small pleasantries. She started emailing/calling a bit more for a while after I stopped initiating, but she's pulled back since then.

stilly, I sure wanted to kick the MC, but only in retrospect because he gave me the bum's rush out of his office! After his "DOA" announcement, "this is our last session", I said "But you said and your website says that you specialize 1) in reconciling and if necessary, in 2) the walking-away-amicably process, where's the that process? My w started to cry a bit and - I BS you not - the MC said "We're done now and I'd like to have a few words with W. I got up, dazed, went to the door, turned around (he was inches behind me) and he said, "Good-bye, Gardener, Best of luck to you." This all took 5 seconds and I was outside his door, flabbergasted. We had come in separate cars, so I just left. And get this, My C is in the same building and when I went to see him the next week (I switched our app't to the old MC slot since it was now free) I pulled into the parking lot and W was there and when asked, awkwardly said she's "still seeing MC". I just don't know. Sorry, stilly, I've crossed the line from answering you to venting. Back to answering:
Thanks for encouraging words on GALing. I'm trying.
First course of action is to keep up what I'm doing. There's more, so much more, but it's overwhelming right now (read, write goals, write action plans, write an answer to your own sitch post as if you were answering a stranger, schedule 2nd telephone coaching w/Dottie, somehow stay positive and focused, etc.

Whew!!! Thanks. I needed that


Gardener

"My soul, be satisfied with flowers,
With fruit, with weeds even; but gather them
In the one garden you may call your own."
Cyrano deBergerac


Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: stillloveshim] #1781889
06/11/09 07:27 PM
06/11/09 07:27 PM
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Posts: 1,478
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Kimmie Lee Offline
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Kimmie Lee  Offline
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Posts: 1,478
I don't think I would bother with birthday and especially anniversary greetings.

She's sending mixed signals? Send one to her that is very clear: You are through simpering after her. She wants space, give it to her. Gradual weaning isn't dramatic enough.

And I would leave the ring off. I did because it was too painful for me too.

Re: Jumping in (1st post) [Re: Kimmie Lee] #1781894
06/11/09 07:34 PM
06/11/09 07:34 PM
Joined: Jan 2009
Posts: 626
Florida
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stillloveshim Offline
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See, I'm on the fence about going dark. I think each situation is very very unique despite the fact we all are fighting for our marriages....
You know her Gardner. Does she want space, or would it be better if you initiated some contact, to let her know you are still there and thinking about her?
I kept my rings on. My message was/is I am married. Until the ink is dry, you gave these to me and I love them so I will wear them as it's my right to....for now.
My H never wore a ring so that was nothing for me to be concerned or hurt about if he were to take his off.
I think the second hand information probably came from a reliable source. Maybe it's time to find a new MC. If she's confused capitalize on it. Show her you both can be happy.
Start DBing. But I dont' think you are in the Last Resort phase by any means.

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