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A Message from Michele
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WF, is dead on here. smilie, when these things happen they cause us to question EVERYTHING. Especially with the rewriting of history that the WAS does to justify their actions. In my sitch, my W had never been happy a day of our MR (according to her on BD). Now, I knew this was patently untrue and I could name dozens, hundreds, maybe even thousands of instances where I knew she was truly happy throughout the almost 19 years of our MR to that point.

BUT, her claiming that made me start to question if it was true or not. Maybe she wasn't happy at all from the time we started dating, through to getting married, being newlyweds, traveling together, working on our house together, getting pregnant and having our D, etc, etc, etc.

So yes her behavior right now has you questioning the basis for your relationship this whole time. Howeever, WF puts it beautifully: "I think you're time could be better spend researching how to deal with bouts of anxiety and stress."

BAM, there it is. This is what I was trying to get you to see with my GAL comment. You claim you are keeping busy, that you have time for nothing else, but then you post long posts on narcissism and how it is exactly what your STBXW is. So what? Even if she is a sociopathic psychopath, what does that change? In fact, the more you diagnose her the more it just proves that you should be spending every minute of every day trying to get on with your life, move forward, and stop fixating so much on her and what she is doing.


M(52), W(53),D(17)
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Ring and Piecing since March 2018
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Originally Posted by smilie
This isn't emotionally violent. This is her doing what in her best interest without any consideration for you. [T]he likelihood that she's actually the narcissist or the sociopath that you'd like her to be is beyond slim.

smilie, another solid post by wayfarer. I agree with her 110%.


May'19 - separation. | Dec'19, Oct'20, Jan'21 - painful breakups. | Jan'21 - freedom!
"We the ones who play hard, we live hard, we love hard, we light up the dark." -- Kesha

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I know you are all right - thank you. You keep re-enforcing what you are saying and I really appreciate it as it allows me to see from different perspectives.

I have been reading others posts here for a while now and I see how common this situation is. There is so much pain and anguish in all that I have read here on the forum and you guys give out so much wealth from your experience. It's difficult to search for posts and for some reason I can only search for the past 3 months using the search function, so if it's possible to point to anything that may be similar or worse, than my situation I would welcome the read.

As far as my stbxw is concerned, I am still in disbelief at her change of actions. If this is truly just an act of selfishness, then it has to be one of the worst extremes of it that I have witnessed in anybody in my entire lifetime. Yes, if I had been a b@stard husband I could have fully understood her actions, but I wasn't and in my mind I haven't deserved anything that she's dished out, seemingly for no reason. I do not like and will never like the changes that I have seen in her. She is obviously that person deep down and will therefore play out those characteristics again at a later stage, but they have either been hidden since I've known her, or she has established them in recent years. I know that it's not about me.....

Wayfarer has such a compassionate way of writing that hammers things home. I really wish that I could spend the time GALing more. I have so much on my mind to get sorted out that I haven't got the time to concentrate on anything else too much, but I do. I spend an hour each day at lunchtime in the park reading - to learn, to relax while having lunch, to unwind as much as I can. It's like I'm working a full-time job at the moment and my head feels the worst it has in years due to my condition being triggered by too much stress, wearing reading glasses for too long and sitting in one spot on the PC searching for houses.

Detaching I can see is the goal here and I just wish there was a switch in my mind to switch that on, just like there seemed to be a switch in hers that kicked in this sudden change of behaviour. GAL is part of the detaching process I would assume. I am in the process of trying to build a new life somewhere else and I don't seem to be getting anywhere too fast and there is lot of red tape to go look at houses - they can't confirm with the landlord if they would accept a year payment up front as I can't show an income, until I have had a credit check. I can't get a credit check until I have submitted an application and I can't submit an application until I have had a viewing of the property - seeing as they don't do virtual viewings, I have to drive almost 300 miles there and another 300 back, just to look around a house. It's madness, especially in 2021, but maybe it's part of GAL? Not sure if I'm staying up there as I don't want to pay too much for a hotel, but I do wonder if a night away would do me good - I don't fancy it alone though.

Stress and Anxiety is the hard bit. I've had a day and a half where things have been a bit better, then like a high-speed train it hits you, with the piston in my chest firing at full speed ahead and making my body feel weird. Yes I need to get a handle on that and I do try. Speaking to people helps calm it down. I can try deep breathing until I'm blue in the face but it triggers my neurology and makes me spin. I shall have to do more research to get a different method as I cannot even force myself to sit still for any more than 10 minutes. I was meditating at the beginning of all this when she first left, but when she said she had somebody else and then as time's gone by and all the other things have been uncovered, it's no use. Now she's admitted adultery, I can't close my eyes for a second in silence before images of her and some OM come flashing on the screen in my mind. I've had my 3rd Hypnotherapy session tonight, it's helping.

Yes I am hurt and it feels like I'm in some sort of dissociated virtual reality and walking around in a daze and other people's live's just continue to go on around me as if I wasn't there. I sit and watch as couples spend time together, people are with their children or sitting with their friend chatting about stuff. It feels like I'm on the outside looking in - I've never felt like that before, I've never felt so alone. Even the town I am in isn't familiar as I've only been here a small amount of time and that makes the hurt, hurt worse.

The rewriting history bit that SteveLW mentions, and various other people also, I am seeing unfolding in-front of my very eyes - and it does unfold. It starts small and gets bigger and more elaborate as time goes on, as does any lie.

I don't want to blame and that's not my intention, understanding is but as you say I won't be able to .. not yet and that's the part that I can't/don't want to accept, but I must as I know it's true. Trying to make sense out of something you can't make sense out of, is senseless - if that makes sense? And I can see it's futile.

What makes it worse is this condition I have. The stress makes it so much worse and when it's that bad I find it hard to move around too much. My brain feels like it's being clamped in a vice and spun in a washing machine, my neck is really uncomfortable, my eyes are so blurry and my tinnitus is excruciatingly loud. It hasn't been this bad for a couple of years and it's made worse by stress, as the engagement of the limbic system pushes it into overdrive. As far as my hormones are concerned - who knows - all I know is that the tumour on my pituitary gland makes them go weird when stressed. It has also been responsible for decreasing my sex drive and probably makes me feel fatigued a lot of the time - and that's probably part of the problem I face now. It's a shame I've got this as it makes things so much harder. It would be nice to see the back of it one day.

"Get some distance, you say?", well.....Here's the good bit:

I have arranged to go and see a couple of potential properties about 260 miles away or so (4.5 hours). It's in a colder part of the country which is a shame as I have lived in one of the best parts of the UK all of my life and I dislike the cold, but it's much too expensive to live here and too close to my stbxw's work places (scattered all over the county 30 mins - an hour in every direction), plus wherever she is living, which I don't have a clue. I don't want to risk bumping in to her/them as I know it would kill me and I don't want to keep looking around or getting tempted to just "pass by" her work - not that I would and I haven't yet (well I have but not specifically for 'that' reason), but I don't want to be in that position. Moving away will be a clean break and if it's the wrong area, then I'll have an entire year to find the right one. So I have arranged this for Thursday.

I have also had a rough quote on removal costs as I can't do it on my own and it was cheaper than I thought too! They also pack for you, but I shall do most of that anyway.

A woman I was speaking to on Sunday told me that there was a clothing sale at an outdoor shop just outside of town and the savings were up to 70%. I thought that things would be expensive anyway, but I went up to have a look. I got over 200 of clothes for under 70! 4 T-shirts, an autumn/winter jacket and a pair of casual trousers. All high quality branded stuff that I would never have brought before as they would have been out of my price range. The jacket alone was priced at 67 and was just 22.99. This is the first time I have been shopping for clothes on my own for 20 years and it was both lonely and quite refreshing - not having to ask anybody's opinion, no validation apart from my own to consider. Is this type of thing GAL? I think so and it made me feel nice having some clothes that fit, however few.

In a selfish way, part of me is glad that other people have travelled this road before me as they/you have been there and you know how it really is. They know the territory and what to expect. I respect that. It will have to get better though as I can't get any worse (I hope)?

Detaching is all well and good if there was a method to do it, but as I eluded to earlier, I guess it's just working on GAL and working on me. It will be nice when I can go out somewhere, for a walk or a drive and not have to wonder if I will bump into her or not. I don't want to. Even the girl in the coffee shop told me that my stbxw was in the other morning. She knows us. "Ah", I replied. Told her we split up, she asked why, I said she left me for another bloke. She couldn't believe it as "you always seemed really close", she said. "I thought so too", I replied. That was the end of that conversation - I want a different one. Too many memories, such a small town and I need to get away, as you said, put some distance between us ... it ... them.

Hopefully physical distance will turn into emotional distance and the scars can then begin to heal and detachment can really start to work its magick.

Sorry about another long post, it's taken me ages to write over the course of the day. But I just wanted to work through what has been shared. I know you are right, both of you ... all of you. I hear you all! I just couldn't see it as clear and now it's becoming slightly clearer. My focus is on finding a place to live and I think that this will be the turning point for me. I'm not like other people and it takes me a while to work through things since I've had this condition, so please forgive me if I'm coming across resistant. As wayfarer said, I'm just hurting.

Thank for all of your input and for listening. smile


M(55), W(45)
BD1: Apr-2011, BD2: 23-May-21, NC (15 June '21)
Divorce Filed (16 July '21)
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Smilie,

I also want to reinforce what WF is saying. Stress is awful. Have you tried meditation at all? There are a number of free apps you can try that have very simple, short guided meditations that might help. Even just taking 10 deep breaths with your eyes closed when things start to feel hard could help. This helped me a LOT in my sitch. And it might help with your condition too-- my H used to get truly debilitating migraines and had to stop using the medication that really worked after his stroke (at age 35). He now immediately meditates for 15-30 minutes as soon as he gets his aura and it has really helped to manage the pain. I can't recall exactly what your condition is, but if you haven't tried meditation I would totally recommend it.

Another thing I did that helped me was the supplement 5-HTP. It helped me sleep and really did improve my mood. You might look into that.

Finally, it occurred to me as I was reading your list of covert narcissistic traits... dang, I'm going to guess that my H would have said check, check, check to most of those during the SSM phase of our M. I don't think I am a covert narcissist, though-- I also was feeling emotionally alone and like I had to do all the housework and physical touch was simply not my primary love language. Anyway, just another voice to suggest you stop trying to figure out what is wrong with your W and put all that enormous energy into healing yourself.


Me (45) H (41)
M:13 T:17, D8 & D11
4/19 BD #1 ILYB
8/19 BD #2 Long-distance EA
12/19 BD #3 Actually 2 year PA
2-5/20 R attempt #1
6/20 limbo again, back in contact with AP
9/20-present R attempt #2
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Waking Up is a really good guided meditation app. I think you get a few weeks free, then if you genuinely can't afford it, you can email the support team and they will give it to you free.


Me: 39 W:41
T: 14 M: 11
S: 5

BD & OM Jun 2020
W moves out Aug 2020

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Smillie - i found the best therapy as people have said is to GAL!

i am an introvert by nature
i joined Meetup and signed up to 9 different groups around my area! i seem to be never home, my days off fly by! whatever you are prepared to put in to it - you will get out in heaps!

i have met some lovely people and socially away from the groups! nothing more than friends. talking about all sorts of subjects and interests! i know it will slow down during the winter - but hope i have found enough people to spend time with and who are happy to spend with me!
i am not looking for romance - i am looking for social interaction!

my STBXW is out there somewhere and i have got to the stage of i don't care what she is doing anymore - i am enjoying my life, and enjoying the freedom it has given me!

but you need to put effort in to get anything out!

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smilie Offline OP
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Originally Posted by OnlyBent
Waking Up is a really good guided meditation app. I think you get a few weeks free, then if you genuinely can't afford it, you can email the support team and they will give it to you free.

Argh! It doesn't work on my phone. Got an older one, hasn't got Google on it. Downloaded and older APK file and installed it, but it has issues when entering email address, so can't g et past that. Then it went to update and went straight to Google Play Store rather than update the app directly as my other apps do. I will search for another later. It's a shame.


M(55), W(45)
BD1: Apr-2011, BD2: 23-May-21, NC (15 June '21)
Divorce Filed (16 July '21)
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Originally Posted by may22
I also want to reinforce what WF is saying. Stress is awful. Have you tried meditation at all? There are a number of free apps you can try that have very simple, short guided meditations that might help. Even just taking 10 deep breaths with your eyes closed when things start to feel hard could help. This helped me a LOT in my sitch. And it might help with your condition too--

Yes I have. I can't concentrate though and get images of my wife and OM. Guided meditations may be better.

Originally Posted by may22
my H used to get truly debilitating migraines and had to stop using the medication that really worked after his stroke (at age 35). He now immediately meditates for 15-30 minutes as soon as he gets his aura and it has really helped to manage the pain. I can't recall exactly what your condition is, but if you haven't tried meditation I would totally recommend it.

Wow, that's pants! Migraines are awful, however my condition isn't dependent on them and you don't ever need to have had a migraine to have Vestibular Migraine (VM)! Although I do get them sometimes. I also have a plethora of symptoms 24/7, mainly revolving around dizziness and it's fairly bad this morning after a stressful morning as my stbxw has cancelled my car insurance payment out of her bank, without prior notice and a subsequent conversation with my friend on the phone.

This is interesting though as how does meditating help migraine pain? Would you think there is an element of stress involved? I have always thought that my thing is repressed stress or something, however I also have a pituitary tumour, so don't know how that affects anything, if at all. Don't know how long it's been there as it only got picked up on a brain scan when investigating VM

Originally Posted by may22
Another thing I did that helped me was the supplement 5-HTP. It helped me sleep and really did improve my mood. You might look into that.

A while ago I got some L-Tryptophan as I heard that it can help with brain injuries. It's in powder for and I was told that if I haven't felt any different within 4 days, then it wouldn't be what I required. I've got an entire pot left so I took some this morning. I'll have a look at the 5-HTP as that's Hydroxy Tryptophan, whereas I only have the L-Tryptophan amino acid - not sure if there's a difference?

Originally Posted by may22
Finally, it occurred to me as I was reading your list of covert narcissistic traits... dang, I'm going to guess that my H would have said check, check, check to most of those during the SSM phase of our M. I don't think I am a covert narcissist, though-- I also was feeling emotionally alone and like I had to do all the housework and physical touch was simply not my primary love language. Anyway, just another voice to suggest you stop trying to figure out what is wrong with your W and put all that enormous energy into healing yourself.

Thank you for your input, it's nice that you have taken the time to share your experience. Yes, I think I am getting the message, firmly now, to just let it go.


M(55), W(45)
BD1: Apr-2011, BD2: 23-May-21, NC (15 June '21)
Divorce Filed (16 July '21)
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I used to get migraines terribly. For years I had no cause for these. When I changed my diet and removed diet soda, my migraines went away. I didn't even realize it until a couple of years ago when Orange Vanilla Coke Zero came out and I started drinking it fairly regularly and the migraines returned. Stopped consuming it and haven't had a migraine since.


M(52), W(53),D(17)
M-20, T-23 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
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Originally Posted by SteveLW
I used to get migraines terribly. For years I had no cause for these. When I changed my diet and removed diet soda, my migraines went away. I didn't even realize it until a couple of years ago when Orange Vanilla Coke Zero came out and I started drinking it fairly regularly and the migraines returned. Stopped consuming it and haven't had a migraine since.

It's amazing how things affect our bodies, especially the processed stuff. I've tried a 2 year plant-based diet, plant-based tyramin-free diet, 7 day water fast, CBD oil, a range of vitamins & minerals used for meniers and even a 7-day water fast - twice! Absolutely none of these had any effect on my vestibular system or got rid of my dizziness, which is currently getting unbearable due to the stress I think. I also think that maybe the anti-depressants are also making it worse, although I can't tell for certain, but I just feel light-headed and weird all of the time now.

Hope I feel ok during the day, as I've got a long drive to look at a different area to live and 3 houses to look around tomorrow. This is the kind of thing 'we' would have done together, now I'm going solo - travelling, staying in a hotel, looking around the area, checking out houses - all the things I haven't done on my own now for a couple of decades since we've been together. It feels wierd just thinking about it.


M(55), W(45)
BD1: Apr-2011, BD2: 23-May-21, NC (15 June '21)
Divorce Filed (16 July '21)
---
When you can't see the light at the end of the tunnel, you need to trust it's there.
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