1. We are seperated but living together, he is sleeping on the couch. He wanted to leave the house but I am concerned about the children, they still remember the first time we seperated and occasionally discuss how much it hurt them. I asked him to stay and he at first reluctantly agreed but now is happy to. Should I keep him at home or in the interests of speeding this along ask him to leave in order to LRT more effectively?
I find that most LBSs, and especially LBWs, that want to do IHS for the "kids" are actually doing it deep down for themselves. Be honest with yourself about this. Are you really wanting him there for the kids or for you? Also, doing things for the sake of the kids is rarely the best thing to do. Right now what your kids are being taught about relationships is that it is okay for married people to be cold, distant and sleep separately. Oh except when they want some nookie. As my favorite bald Texan TV psychologist says: "Kids would rather be from a broken home than in a broken home."
Asking him to leave would send a strong message that you aren't settling for half a husband.
Originally Posted by Michka
2. Should i continue to sleep with him? He has made it clear that his attraction is purely physical and nothing else. We are very compatible sexually. I have read on the forums here for a WAH that sexual/physical attraction is important. But I am not sure if he is cake eating or if I am being a doormat. Sex was an issue pre BD as I was always too tired when he initiated it. I am not feeling the same now as I have had some health issues rectified.
So this guy gets to act and behave anyway he wants, act like a single guy....but then come get into your bed and have his way with your body? THIS IS CAKE EATING. Completely and totally. It sounds like deep down (be honest) that you are using sex to try to get him to recommit. Your brain says you know it is just sex and physical, but deep down your heart thinks that a way to a man's heart is through sex.
This is up to you, but you have to decide if you want him in 100%, in 50% or not at all. Because what he is doing irght now is living a single life with the benefits of being married. That is a man's dream! But it will not get you to reconciliation.
Originally Posted by Michka
3. He is only minimally contributing to household chores/taking care of the children. However, he does keep telling me if i want to do something or take out some time to myself that he is more than happy to take the kids. Should i take him up on his offer and insist we have a plan for the week so we both do our fair share? This was an area of conflict pre BD as I felt he wasn't contributing equally. My motivation for doing this is so I can GAL more effectively and in the interests of showing him how much worse off he is as this will eat into his current bachelor style life he is leading.
So he has free child care, a maid, and a sex slave. (See my point above about a man's dream!)
Get a childcare plan in in place. Stop doing his laundry. Let him be on his own for meals. Stop the sex. Take away his cake. When he gets angry, upset, belligerent, etc, calmly tell him that you refuse to be in a MR with someone with one foot in and one foot out.
Originally Posted by Michka
4. Finances. He is a spender and I am saver and this has been an issue since we first met. My savings and assets have been used for us to be in the position we are currently in. However, i am concerned because should he leave the home, I will not be able to afford running the household expenses on my own. Should i request we create a budget ( we tried to pre BD however he never committed to it). Again, my motivation in doing so is to show him how much worse off we all would be should we actually divorce.
Drop that last reason. The reason that you get a financial plan is place it to protect yourself and your kids. If you get a D, he will be on the hook for support for a long time. He knows this. This is exactly why a lot of WAHs in particular drag their feet on D. Have you talked to a lawyer? I would highly suggest talking to one. You can usually get a free consult, but regardless there are legalities to all of this and you need a legal expert.
Originally Posted by Michka
5. Mental health. He was never formally diagnosed but I have long believed he suffered from depression or some sort of issue. His current behaviour aligns with the descriptions on here of having a MLC. Lost weight, has a fitness regime, better dressed, was going to buy a new car, all about enjoying the now and getting out there and having fun. I don't think he is having an affair but again who knows? Does my thoughts on this change my approach or is LRT and GALing enough.
No this changes do nothing you should be doing. MLC, new outlook on life, new woman in his life, your goal is the same: prepare for the worst (hope for the best), GAL, 180 (get yourself into IC, you have no control over him but you do over you!), and work on detachment! You need to get to a place emotionally where nothing he says or does causes you to have an emotional reaction. It take time and effort to get there.
Originally Posted by Michka
6. Finally I am taking the approach of the less said the better, I am not arguing with him or engaging with him in conflict. When things get "testy" between us because he is one of his moods I deny any face to face contact until he stops. he can only TM at those times. That seems to be working. However, I am concerned that he is misusing business funds and has twice now deliberately sold some cryptocurrency we had despite me asking him not to. Do i leave this for now? How do I go setting boundaries with him? Should I be setting boundaries or should I simply be standing back, detaching and worrying about myself? I have read some posts on here and I am confused. I have sort out legal advice regarding the business as it is in both of our names but my lawyer assured me that anything he does will only impact him.
Get a lawyer. Financial concerns are legal concerns. Don't get advice, get representation (see my comments above). Oh so you have a lawyer, good. Assume you are going to D, and make sure you are legally covered.
Michka, I can tell that you desperately want to save this. He knows that. Your best path forward is to embrace that you two are splitting up and act accordingly. Everything you are doing is to save the MR, and he sees that. He has you right where he wants you. Desperation is as attractive as pig rolling in the mire. Stop being deperate and start moving forward. He will either move with you, or he won't, you have no control over that.
Sorry you are dealing with all of this, but your best path forward is to stop trying to save the MR. Read this post:
Take all your focus off of him and put it onto you.
Steve,
Thank you for your post. It both resonated with me and confused me.
1. If he leaves, it will really impact the children and unless we are actually divorcing its simply something I am not willing to do. Yes, I want to reconcile, its why I am here. I truly believe that if he was to leave currently, it would probably be the fastest way to reconcile, especially based off what you are saying. But at what cost? I am not going to put my children through this unless its actually happening, if that makes sense. Right now is not ideal for them, but I see it as being the lesser of two evils.
2. Sex - surprisingly he has requested to back off. It makes him feel guilty and confused apparently, I have happily withdrawn from this. BUT i am confused by the advice I have received around it. MWD has on some posts encouraged sex while seperated and previous to BD I guess you would define the marriage as SSM. Not sure how to define it then... is it cake eating? or would you consider this to be a 180?
3. Domestic Duties - I did nothing for him except the sex. He did his own laundry, meals and makes breakfast for the family (toast and coffee) and this was his main contribution. I have raised this with him and he has agreed to a schedule of duties to divide the housework more evenly. Would this be considered taking his cake? He has thus far (two days worth) been sticking to it.
4. Finances - we are splitting finances for now, I will see how this goes. I also told him I will be getting a part time job (sat only) on top of my current full time job. He was very taken aback by this.
5. Getting better at detaching. I have also been actively planning my house renovations which is why I need the second job. This is something which I am very excited about and have told him he isn't part of it. Told him (earlier) that since he is leaving he has no say. He keeps wanting to get involved but I am standing my ground.
6. I am legally covered. Seperating our finances will also help me stress less about all this.
SteveLH,
I do want to reconcile. I do want it all. He also knows this is true. I have, however, been acting "as if" I will comply easily with this request to divorce but have stated to him that I wont lift a finger to do anything about it. He is has not done anything either.
Desperate is not the word I would use to describe how I appear in front of him. He likes to use the word "hard a$$" when I have a challenge as I dont like to give up.
Thank you again for your time and insight into my stitch.
We seemed to have a false positive. I was trying my hardest to GAL/180. Seemed to be responding to my sudden charge in attitude. Perhaps lasted two weeks before he told he wanted to try but was unsure. This concerned me as everyone on here has warned about this. So I asked him to lets try and be nice to each other for a week and chat at the end of the week.
Well S$%& hit the fan that week. We were fine (so it seemed) mon to thurs. All i asked him was to be civil to me and vice versa. Friday morning he woke up in a foul mood and the day just descended into chaos. By the end of the day he was adament he was moving out in two weeks.
I asked that he do the following before moving out
1. Create a budget dividing financial responsbility 2. Create a parenting schedule 3. Tell the kids
The budget was his biggest concern as he kept mentioning he would need cash in order to purchase furniture etc for the apartment (he was moving into our investment property one suburb away) I was trying to be as civil and polite as I could but I did tell him I would only discuss it once we established each others financial responsbilities. This was really important to me because of his gambling.
We also split some investment money we had (by agreement).
Well he wasnt happy it seemed that I expected him to do any work for his move.... by friday the following week his contempt for me was simmering under the surface. Friday (this seems to be a bad day for us) morning comes around and again he asks about buying furniture. I again reminded him of our agreement and the fact he had not done the budget.
He exploded, threatened me with my life, (this was all verbal at no point did he touch me) and took my share of the investment money (its all on apps on his phone so it took him literally a few minutes while he was in the bathroom - it was about 20k) and left.
I was shaking. I had been trying so hard to act "as if" stay positive etc, but he just lost it that morning and so did i.
I decided to file a statement with the police. They decided to take it further than I intended and had him arrested at his office in front of his clients. A very sobering experience for him by all accounts.
I had the locks changed and asked some family to stay the night.
He has now moved out officially. He has set up the apartment for himself and future visits from the children. We speak and see each other when he visits the kids and our exchanges are either very tense or indifferent until today. He kept telling me how much he wants to "help" me with the kids and the house. I detest that word "help". I suggested that we would benefit from family counselling as well as counselling for us.
This literally has happened over a span of two weeks.
I have been speaking to a DB coach over the phone and just trying to get through it all. I have again met with a lawyer and am ready to file if I need to. However, his advice was surprisingly similiar to what you have all been telling me and things I have read. He asked me to wait, consider my position and only file when there is no other options. He asked that I go through this on my own two feet with professional help as family can often make things worse. Financially he has reassured me that I will be fine based on the numbers we went through. He also said to simply detach (i nearly asked if he had been reading these forums/MWD books) and focus on myself and the children.
I feel at the moment surprisingly calm (mostly). Not sure what that means but between praying and reading all your advice I feel like I will be ok no matter. Just like the WAS has to hit a rock bottom of sorts its almost like I did too. I mean what else can he do?
The children have been really struggling, I made it clear to them that this was their fathers decision as he "had a change of heart as to how he feels about me" but tried to be as positive as possible. Just trying to reinforce that they are still loved and we are still their family.
My question now is how do I stay on track? How do I best support my children? How I stop myself from saying/doing something I will regret? He has a a tendency of rewriting history to his benefit - I have a tendency of quickly correcting him and pointing out he is wrong. What do I do?
I feel so much for you Michka. You must be struggling to cope!
You don’t need to make a point to your children that this was his decision. I too felt that incredible pressure that my children knew my wife was blowing up our family and that I was the one honouring my vows.
But it does more harm than good. Your children will work it out themselves eventually, and normally this naturally occurs at an age where they are more equiped to deal with it. Secondly, I assume you still want them to have a good relationship with their father - these sorts of discussions can undermine this. Kids will always love both their parents no matter what - you’ll strengthen your relationship with your kids more by upholding your H than demeaning him.
It will get worse before it gets better, and it’s going to be a tough year or two for you. But based on him verbally threatening your life, you need to get out of this relationship now.
So sorry to hear about the latest developments. I cannot in good conscience encourage you to fix this relationship.
Get out while you can. Work on identifying the reasons why you would want to stay with someone like this, and heal. And then find someone who isn't an addict or abusive.
He also said to simply detach (i nearly asked if he had been reading these forums/MWD books) and focus on myself and the children.
Yes, do this!
Quote
Just like the WAS has to hit a rock bottom of sorts its almost like I did too. I mean what else can he do?
Well, quite a bit. Kill or hurt you or the kids for one. In a lot instances, the buildup to physical aggression happens in multiple steps. If you aren't familiar with the signs, it may be confusing.
Get help, use the help, get through this. Be very reasonable.
I'm not sure if there are other aspects you'd rather not share here, but I am concerned about everything you have posted. What do your family and friends say?
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
Sounds like you did the right thing Michka. I, like others on here, am concerned about your H verbally threatening your life as well as the addictive behaviour. As much of an A$$hole as my XH was, he never, ever threatened my life nor would he. That’s a whole other level of messed up that you need to pay attention to. It is good you have met with your lawyer and he thinks you will be okay financially. That is something LBS can really struggle with if finances are a concern. It was definitely a blessing in my sitch that I was okay too. Also, give your H’s state of mind and his gambling issue, the sooner you separate your finances from his, the better - regardless of whether or not you want to reconcile.
Also agree with everyone’s advice about what to tell your kids. Daddy and Mommy are going through a hard time but we both love you very much, is all they need to know. My kids are 13 and starting to remember things from their perspective (being introduced to random women) and forming their own opinions. If they ask me something, I answer as honestly as I can without giving them more information than they need. At the end of the day, they love their dad and I am grateful for that. Kids need to feel free to love both their parents. If they don’t, it really messes with their emotions. In this situation, forgiveness isn’t just a gift you give to yourself, it is also a gift you give to your children.
Keep posting and coming here for support. I’ve been here for two and a half years and it has helped me immensely...even when people were telling me things I didn’t necessarily want to hear. (((HUGS)))
He also said to simply detach (i nearly asked if he had been reading these forums/MWD books) and focus on myself and the children.
Yes, do this!
Quote
Just like the WAS has to hit a rock bottom of sorts its almost like I did too. I mean what else can he do?
Well, quite a bit. Kill or hurt you or the kids for one. In a lot instances, the buildup to physical aggression happens in multiple steps. If you aren't familiar with the signs, it may be confusing.
Get help, use the help, get through this. Be very reasonable.
I'm not sure if there are other aspects you'd rather not share here, but I am concerned about everything you have posted. What do your family and friends say?
The worse of what has happened I have posted on here. There have been no other issues or concerns. I am conscious of the fact that I am only posting the worst of him and this may create bias in the responses.
My family and friends want us to reconcile. They have always said we are such a great couple and we do well together. I have thought the same to be honest. I also feel the majority of his issues are a result of his mental health.
Sounds like you did the right thing Michka. I, like others on here, am concerned about your H verbally threatening your life as well as the addictive behaviour. As much of an A$$hole as my XH was, he never, ever threatened my life nor would he. That’s a whole other level of messed up that you need to pay attention to. It is good you have met with your lawyer and he thinks you will be okay financially. That is something LBS can really struggle with if finances are a concern. It was definitely a blessing in my sitch that I was okay too. Also, give your H’s state of mind and his gambling issue, the sooner you separate your finances from his, the better - regardless of whether or not you want to reconcile.
Also agree with everyone’s advice about what to tell your kids. Daddy and Mommy are going through a hard time but we both love you very much, is all they need to know. My kids are 13 and starting to remember things from their perspective (being introduced to random women) and forming their own opinions. If they ask me something, I answer as honestly as I can without giving them more information than they need. At the end of the day, they love their dad and I am grateful for that. Kids need to feel free to love both their parents. If they don’t, it really messes with their emotions. In this situation, forgiveness isn’t just a gift you give to yourself, it is also a gift you give to your children.
Keep posting and coming here for support. I’ve been here for two and a half years and it has helped me immensely...even when people were telling me things I didn’t necessarily want to hear. (((HUGS)))
I have been on quite the rollercoaster. I am currently seeking advice from a DB coach and this forum/books.
We have been up and down.
There has been no abuse or any sort of issues to that degree... just minor spewing as its called here.
I have been trying to GAL. its been hard with all the extra work I need to do at the moment being a single mum to three little ones.
But I have started renovations on my house which we always put off for various reasons. Just minor cosmetic stuff. This seemed to pull him back in - a little and spoke of his sadness and regret over the marriage.
I tried DB principals... validating, etc not always successfully. But it did seem to have a positive effect.
He even started telling me he wanted to reconcile and was being loving/affectionate etc. We were ML frequently.
But I think we fell into a pursuit/distance cycle. He would pull away again even when he was the one initiating the R talk and talk of reconciling. As of last night, he is again saying there is no use its over for him.
So my question is, what do I do now? Is it simply a matter of focusing on detachment again? What do I say or do when he brings up reconciling? I am pretty sure he will based on his behaviour of the last few months.
My advice on the push and pull you're in right now is sit down and take a serious inventory of how long you and the kids can stay on this rollercoaster your H has you on. SteveLW like to tell people to think seriously about a drop dead date. At date at which you are no longer willing to ride this out and see what happens. Having that date gives you a small amount of control in a rather uncontrollable situation. It also gives you a light at the end of the tunnel. H gets his act together by X date or I will be the one to file. SteveLW's was a year from BD. Mine was a year from when H began his R with OW. Some people put down much shorter timelines because they can't emotionally handle the turmoil longer than that. Some of these crazy amazing MLC LBS hang on for years, but most of them have decades invested into their relationships. If I were married 20+ years maybe I would've picked out a longer drop dead date. Who knows? But it's a personal number and it's yours so you can chose to move that date forward or backward in time as you please. I know that it's helped a lot of people get a handle on how long they'll ride the crazy train for.
Along with that drop dead date, yes detach. Keep detaching it's a process. It's not a one and done kind of thing. And it sounds like you're pretty attached right now so definitely. Keep focusing on GAL and your 180s. Keep focusing on yourself and your kids. Even if you're choosing to "wait around" for H to figure out what it is he's actually doing here that doesn't mean you put everything else on hold. You can wait and see with H while going on with your life acting "as if" you already have a life that doesn't have him in it. Because technically you don't. H puts himself in your life when he feels like it. He's not there when you need or want him to be. He's there when he needs or wants to be. Sometime you just get lucky enough that those things over lap. Don't for get that. You may be sure about him but he's still very unsure about you and your MR. Keep living your life as if he's gone and by the time he makes up his mind you'll know if you really want him back or not.
