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Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2912001
01/06/21 09:10 PM
01/06/21 09:10 PM
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sandi2 Offline OP
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A big thanks to everyone for your kind words. We learn from one another. I've learned a lot from the LBS's.

Quote
Originally Posted by sandi2
B. Accept the fact that the bomb was not your wayward wife’s way of warning you that the marriage was in trouble. She was not trying to wake you in order to work on the marriage. It was her way of telling you it is too late and she is done with it. Do not act upon your urges to plead with her for another chance. Do not try to prove how much you love her. This is not the time. She doesn’t want it and will reject it.


Quote
Originally Posted by Joe2017
This really is a good point. It takes a little while to understand this because oftentimes the BD is a surprise to the LBH, while the WW has been thinking about doing this for a considerable time. There is little room for negotiation at this point. It's a huge bummer to realize this, but it is essential so that you can move on.


I think that's why some LBH's see their WW as being in a big hurry to move things along. It causes him to panic and frantically search for a quick solution before time is up. What he doesn't really grasp is that time is already up......as for as she's concerned. Therefore, all his attempts at winning her back, does nothing to stir her desire for him. Trying to win her means he is pursuing her.........which is the last thing he should be doing at this point. I think it's difficult for him to see his actions as pursuit.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: SteveLW] #2912003
01/06/21 09:14 PM
01/06/21 09:14 PM
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sandi2 Offline OP
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Quote
sandi, any chance you could try to help Steve_ out? His WW is especially difficult.


I'll be glad to take a look and see if I can add anything. Thanks Steve85.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2913121
01/21/21 06:20 AM
01/21/21 06:20 AM
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Drh2001 Offline
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Hi Sandi, great post and very timely!

My own comments and observations....



I. Accept what you cannot control or change.

"B. Accept the fact that the bomb was not your wayward wife’s way of warning you that the marriage was in trouble. She was not trying to wake you in order to work on the marriage. It was her way of telling you it is too late and she is done with it."


Very true! You wrote in an earlier post about a WW's unique way of disrespecting her H. This was true of my WW. I didn't realize it at the time but she would dismiss me whenever I wanted to talk to her about anything. She wouldn't even look at me but would say things like "I'm busy", "I'm reading", "I'm watching my show." Even when we were in the car on a long trip she would put her headphones in and refuse to make any conversation with me. I put it down to just moodiness but now I look back and I can see exactly what you described.



"C. Accept that no matter how badly you wish to correct your faults in the marriage and only want a chance to prove yourself as a better husband, she has moved past that point."


This is so true. Nothing works at this point and the 180s are for us. They might get her attention but WW's heart and mind is set for rebellion. They want out.



"D. Accept the painful fact that your WW does not want to work on the MR. She does not feel in love with you, and is not the same person you married."


A few days after WW told me she wanted a separation, she texted me "I'm a single woman." You describe the WW mindset as cold and dark. It's as if they've become the worst version of themselves they could possibly be. Her behavior got more and more erratic, emotionally driven and unpredictable. Every day was a battle for me.



"E. Accept that your WW is not going to snap back into the wife and mother that she was in the past. This is not going to be a short run. She has to go through a process, and there is no snapping back into normality."


The part about the "mother" is interesting because it's not just the H she rebels against but her role as a mother. Last year WW completely stopped cooking for six weeks, telling me she had "mentally checked out." I told her you don't have to cook for me but at least cook for the kids. She told me if she cooks for them it makes her feel like she's not moving on! My kids were upset with her and I had to pick up the slack as we would take turns cooking. I told her she carried them for nine months and now she doesn't want to feed them and her reply was "I don't need to cook for my kids. I provide for them emotionally and financially."

What was weird is I caught her taking a pot and saucepan with her so she could cook for OM and his kids. After a time, the guilt got to her and she started to cook for my kids again but it was sporadic.

Another thing she did was come home from work and them immediately leave to be with OM. WW told me the kids felt abandoned by her whenever she did this. She spent less and less time with them.

Recently, she made a FB post about being in a new relationship with OM. She gave people the impression she took the kids and moved out a year ago but didn't tell them she was living with me all this time. We are now separated. She posted that "the kids are fine" and then tells me privately the kids are going through trauma. I was the one who got them in therapy while she did nothing.



"F. Accept that you will not be able to control the lives of your children when they are with her. You will not be able to prevent her from introducing them to whomever she wishes, including her affair partner."


She introduced my kids to OM and within three months she moved in with him and now my kids spend long weekends with her at OM's house. I was really upset about this. She kept bringing the date forwards all the time and told me OM wanted her to move in early so they can get used to being around each other. The irony is she is a full time mother to his kids and a part time mother to mine. How messed up is that?



II. Regain mental stability and clarity.

"B. Break your habit of rescuing her. It is not your responsibility to make her happy or fix things for her. Allow her to deal with consequences of her behavior and decisions. Stop putting forth effort to be her husband, in the practical sense."


I mentioned in a recent post how this was difficult for me to do. Even after she moved out I still reminded her to check her car fluids.



"E. Do not make any rash decisions. Whatever decisions you are thinking about, run it by the DB board or your confidant, to get an unbiased opinion. You are vulnerable to your emotions."


This is good advice especially for new members. Sometimes we need a 2*4 from some of the forum members to knock some sense into us.



I have a few questions.

1. Is it more likely that the WW leaves the marital home to be with OM rather than the husband move out?

2. What do you think of in-house separation? In my case, WW's behavior got progressively more erratic and emotionally driven which had a negative effect on me and my moods which in turn upset the peace of the household. It's even more difficult when you have children. Her outrageous behavior created a toxic atmosphere.

3. When I found this forum I thought the 180s were to get WW to notice our changes and maybe they would want to R but as Sandi said, they are done with the marriage. The 180s are for us to improve ourselves. It seems then, that a physical separation must occur first, in order for the WW to experience natural consequences.

4. I've read of the term "affair fog" on some other websites. How does this fit into the mindset of a WW?








Last edited by Drh2001; 01/21/21 06:27 AM.
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: Drh2001] #2913143
01/21/21 05:29 PM
01/21/21 05:29 PM
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sandi2 Offline OP
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Quote
Is it more likely that the WW leaves the marital home to be with OM rather than the husband move out?


I'd guess it's about 50/50. It depends on the individual situation. WW's have an extreme sense of entitlement and think the LBH should just be a gentleman and move out and continue paying the bills........ while she gets to remain in the home and carry on with OM. It also depends on OM's setup. Does he want to live with her, or is he married, have kids, etc.? Can she afford another place, or can she stay with her relatives/friends? Is this a long distant affair, and things of that nature that would determine her moving out or staying? I think the H who moves out are those who have not sought advise about this move, and/or they think that's just something that a man does when his W is cheating. There are extreme cases where the WW is causing so much havoc in the home (nasty bullying, calling cops, domestic violence, etc.) that he has to get away from her if she won't leave.

Quote
What do you think of in-house separation? In my case, WW's behavior got progressively more erratic and emotionally driven which had a negative effect on me and my moods which in turn upset the peace of the household. It's even more difficult when you have children. Her outrageous behavior created a toxic atmosphere.


I think in-house separation stinks! They aren't truly separated. It's the epitome of cake eating for the WW, and a slow tortuous death for the LBH. The best description I've heard from a LBH who was IHS is "it's soul crushing".

Quote
When I found this forum I thought the 180s were to get WW to notice our changes and maybe they would want to R but as Sandi said, they are done with the marriage. The 180s are for us to improve ourselves. It seems then, that a physical separation must occur first, in order for the WW to experience natural consequences.


Well, that's the way I see it, but I'm sure there are grounds for argument. Once the LBH gets the idea in his head that 180's are all about pleasing her........becoming what he thinks women want in a H (which is completely wrong).......it's difficult to get him to see it differently. What really gets me is when the first 180 many LBH's do.........is house keeping, cooking, laundry, etc. cry I haven't seen a WW yet that was swept away by her H becoming the housemaid.

Another point about the 180's is that some newcomers think they are suppose to do the opposite of EVERYTHING. Usually they put their own twist on it, but it all leads back to justifying their NGS and trying to win back the WW. I use to give a lot of examples of 180's and things to do to get the WS's attention and curiosity ......but now I see some of that stuff as a bit superficial. Nothing is more effective than letting her go and focusing on his own self respect and growth as a man........not as her husband. That's the biggest 180 the LBH can do, when he has a wayward W.

Quote
I've read of the term "affair fog" on some other websites. How does this fit into the mindset of a WW?


It's not the greatest term, but I think it's to help the LBS understand the thought pattern and/or mindset of the one having an affair. The wayward spouse is acting out of character, and seemingly unable to process things in a logical manner.......b/c their brain chemistry is effected by the affair. Her fantasy is attached to the affair, and it's overtaking her reality. In other words, she's in la-la land. It's not a good combination with her resentment, disrespect, & rebellion she already feels toward her H.

Thanks for your comments, Drh.


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2914574
02/07/21 04:32 AM
02/07/21 04:32 AM
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Drh2001 Offline
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Sandi,

I have a question that I don't believe has been asked here.

Shortly after BD, WW told me I should start dating and that she hopes I'll find happiness with someone else. This was definitely not what I wanted to do. I wanted to save the marriage,

Do WWs say this to make themselves feel better about what they are doing?

Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2914575
02/07/21 04:40 AM
02/07/21 04:40 AM
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BL42 Online
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Drh2001,

I'm not Sandi, but tend to believe you're correct - many do feel bad about what they're doing because they know it's wrong and are hurting someone they cared about enough to marry and vowed to love, so they're trying to be "nice" about it (if that's at all possible).


Me:39 W:36
M:7 T: 9
S:5 D:2
BD/IHS/Suspect OM: 2/15/20
Discovered EA & PA: 3/5/20
W/OM1's work & OM1's W know: 5/20
W moves out: 6/20-7/20
W w/OM2: 6/20-7/20
W files for D: 7/20
OM2 confirmed: 9/2020
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2914576
02/07/21 04:59 AM
02/07/21 04:59 AM
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Drh2001,

I've also seen it used to help explain the situation to family and friends--you agreed to an open marriage. That's only for the LBSs who fall into the trap, of course!


May'19 - Separation... Dec'19 - Breakup #1... Oct'20 - Breakup #2.... Jan'21 - Breakup #3
"We are never, ever, ever getting back together." -- T.Swift
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2914580
02/07/21 02:35 PM
02/07/21 02:35 PM
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Drh2001 Offline
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BL42,

I think you might be right.


CWarrior,


When WW first announced the separation, she asked me for an open marriage. She was given this advice by a friend of the family who was also cheating on her husband. I said no to this, and that it's not something I feel comfortable with.


At that time, she wanted to keep the house and buy me out but on her salary it wasn't possible, so she would need to get a better paying job. We agreed to have an in-house separation and she wanted a separation agreement in writing. We went back and forwards on the separation agreement until we agreed (reluctantly, I'll explain why) on everything. We would have designated areas to sleep in and would co-parent our kids. At that time, she did not currently have OM. She wanted a clause that allowed her to date but she agreed not bring anyone back to the house, even telling me "I prefer a guy with kids but who doesn't want any more kids."

I very reluctantly added that to the agreement [and I add here I guess I fell into that trap you speak of CWarrior], though I myself had no intention of dating. I still wanted to save my marriage. I have children at home and didn't want to put them through all that and expose them to that lifestyle. One could say I was fearful of what would happen if I didn't agree to her dating other men - part of me hoped she wouldn't and I actually believed she wouldn't because she was a good person with morals and a good mother. Boy was I wrong about that.

The agreement was signed and notarized but less than two weeks later, before the ink had barely dried, she was already seeing someone in secret, lying to my kids about who she was hanging out with and coming home after midnight. She told me she didn't want to find a better job or buy me out and was focused on OM.

She kept lying to me and told me she was separated. I told her you are a married woman who lives with her husband and kids. You have not left the home nor have you filed for divorce. You are not separated and that is just a pretend status to justify your actions. she screamed the place down when I told her this.

Her response was: "Separation was in August. I was faithfully married to that point and after that I considered myself free. That's all there is to it. You feel betrayed, I get it. Clearly you will never see it for what it is."


Four months later she decided he was the one and started planning on moving in with him and he has children from a previous marriage.







Last edited by Drh2001; 02/07/21 02:38 PM.
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: CWarrior] #2914581
02/07/21 02:43 PM
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Originally Posted by CWarrior
Drh2001,

I've also seen it used to help explain the situation to family and friends--you agreed to an open marriage. That's only for the LBSs who fall into the trap, of course!



This is an interesting comment. My WW was in an A with OM for almost a year while she lived with me and the children. A couple of months ago she posted on FB she was in a new relationship but made it seem as though she had taken the kids and left me a long time ago.

This allowed her friends and family to believe she had physically lived apart from me for a year and made it seem as though she had just met OM. Lies and deception on her part.

She is getting some push back from ppl who know the truth and are shocked by her behavior but many of her social media friends have never met me and don't know the whole story.

FYI I blocked her on SM but someone informed me of her post and told me she is being deceitful.

One person who does know me called and sympathized with my situation and told me "you probably don't get to see the kids that much" and I told her the truth. I said I have the kids during the school week and she gets long weekends. This person was shocked and didn't know what to say because she believed WW's lying post that she'd left me and taken the kids a long time ago.


Last edited by Drh2001; 02/07/21 02:47 PM.
Re: Quick outline for H's who have been BD'd by WW [Re: sandi2] #2914582
02/07/21 02:49 PM
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I wanted to add a followup to my prev post.

WW told me that "it's not cheating if you tell your spouse you're separated."

She was fed this lie by the same friend of the family who told her to ask me for an open marriage and who also cheated on her husband with a married man.

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