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Oh dear,

Seems like the old boy did everyone a favour by popping his clogs at just the right time and her D also gets a shiny new car to boot.

frown

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Originally Posted by bttrfly
Andrew, you didn't co-sign that loan, did you? I'm confused by Kml's 'left holding the bag' comment.
(Hangs head)

All her past debts including to her former partner and payments on her van were rolled into one loan that is secured by the van. The payment is roughly what she was paying separately. As a "couple" it made a lot of sense to give her a clean break and fresh start. 4 year term I believe and fully open. She's already commented about making additional payments on it, presumably with the money she's been squirreling away. If she stops making payments then she loses her van plus her credit rating would be thoroughly trashed. She went through that before and I can't see her being willing to do that again. I know that when I co-signed a loan for my Dad (I'm a slow learner) and he defaulted that caused all sorts of problems with his credit and eventual bankruptcy.

We need to be careful here that we don't get ahead of ourselves. We can't put this all to bed and presume that she's going to go on her merry way since that's not happened. We are still a couple, still engaged, still co-habitating, her boys still think of the house as home and still - yes - financially entangled.

It's fun to speculate and muse but I need to focus on the here and now. I asked S via Messenger yesterday afternoon about the counseling. She never did respond to that being "busy". I expect she's got a lot on her mind right now and hasn't been communicative but that's not abnormal. I'm still expecting her to come home late tonight and for everything to be as it was.

I don't know how communicative she'll be about the estate, her plans etc and that will be a telling factor on where this will be going. If she's open and wants input then we're a couple. If not - she could be presumed to be looking for the door.

I did have a minor epiphany yesterday. I like to be able to summarize things in simple aphorisms "easy to love - hard to live with". I just Googled and it turns out there's a book with that title. It may be worth a read - I'll see if my library has a copy.


On BD
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S21, D23
BD-9-Mar-16
D-15-Jan-18 Final-19-Apr-18
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i would keep that counseling appointment, perhaps using it to give her an opportunity to discuss her plans in light of recent events. no way would i cancel it. if ever one needed counseling, now would be the time, imho.

i would speak to some of my items if the opportunity arose in that session, but i would tread lightly and push for that to be an ongoing thing until you got your message across completely down the road.


M 20+ T25+
S ~15.5 (BD)
BD 4/6/15
D 12/23/16

"Someone I loved once gave me
A box full of darkness.
It took me years to understand,
That this too, was a gift."
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I echo bttrfly's sentiment...SO much to comment on. That is a LOT to "unpack" and digest, so to speak. Several things from your post hit me and then some comments by others as well. First and foremost, I do NOT think you are cold. Like others said before me, you didn't get to fully develop a relationship before you got steamrolled into being a fiancé with a live-in partner (and ALL her chaos) and talking of planning a wedding when she isn't even divorced yet. That's a LOT Andrew. A whole lot. I honestly don't use this phrase very often because I just think it is kind of stupid and I'm too old to use it, but S and her whole situation are one big old hot mess.

As far as the "new" developments, refresh my memory again (sorry, I'm old and forgetful)….is S13's dad (the one who is talking of moving into the house with S and brood) the husband that she is not actually divorced from yet? I'm sorry, but that whole conversation about him moving in just seems super sketch to me. And, then you casually mention it has been talked about before? I'm wondering if this is the guy that I (and I think bttrfly agreed with me too) thought a few weeks back was her "waiting in the wings" guy. Number 4, maybe? I can't recall….I need graphs and charts to keep up with them all, but there was one who I had the distinct impression she might come back around to and I think this is him and now you are saying that there has been talk before of him staying with them wherever they were. Things that make you go hmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm…………………………..

Honestly, I'm not sure why you say that this is an opportunity for her to be fully on her own. She isn't on her own, she's still living off another man, who just happens to have passed on. S clearly is not a money manager so I can't imagine that she will be able to be fiscally responsible for a big house in nice neighborhood by herself, but then again, maybe that is where S13's dad comes into play...not sure. Whatever actual money she inherits will likely be frittered away. And, good luck to S13 on getting his $2000 at 18. It will be long gone, likely before he turns 14.

There is a lot more I could say, but I'm going to just let it lie for now. To me, I think the best outcome would be for her to decide that living in that house is what she needs to do and you could get her shuffled over and then kind of fade into the background. I think, in that scenario, the likelihood of her son wanting to stay on with you is probably higher, but that is something that you will have to work through between yourselves.

I don't know, Andrew, and I know there are things that are going on that you aren't sharing, which is fine, but just from what you are laying out there, I'm getting the feeling more and more like S is incredibly opportunistic and always looking for the next big thing. I suspect that if she can get into that house and she can move S13's dad in that you will be a distant memory, baby sitting all her crap until she can be bothered to come retrieve it, which will be around the 42nd of NEVERember.


Me 52, H53
Bomb drop 9/29/2014
Divorce from XH final 12/17/2014
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Oh and by the way, Westo totally wins the internet with that "popping his clogs" comment. I am still laughing!


Me 52, H53
Bomb drop 9/29/2014
Divorce from XH final 12/17/2014
Marriage #2 12/31/2019
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Originally Posted by Dawn70
Oh and by the way, Westo totally wins the internet with that "popping his clogs" comment. I am still laughing!


lol! Yes I believe it’s a British term,

Also.....kicking the bucket grin

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Kicking the bucket is pretty common for my southern vernacular, but popping his clogs was a new one. That was why it struck me so funny. Of course it isn't funny that the man died, though...……..


Me 52, H53
Bomb drop 9/29/2014
Divorce from XH final 12/17/2014
Marriage #2 12/31/2019
5 adult (step)daughters (3 from XH's first marriage, 2 from current H's previous relationships)
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I again typed a whole post and deleted.

You co-signed a loan with someone who is awful with money and barely has any of her own.

You are waiting for her to go on her merry way, which she may not do, instead of doing what’s right for yourself and choosing to go on her merry way.

She is horribly irresponsible with money. I would not imagine she is going to use it to pay down those loans. It won’t destroy her credit, she already had bad credit, that’s why you had to co-sign. Yours on the other hand is in grave danger.

I would bet the farm on the fact she will waste her money away on stuff like hoarders do rather than responsibly paying off debts. She just has more play money in her pocket now.

This isn’t going to play out like you hope. You have hinged hope of her doing the right things. And she hasn’t .

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I agree with what G said. It would be a neat and tidy little wrap-up if she did just go on her way right on to the dad's house. But, you have already said it may not be that way and you are still very much a couple. I know her dad's passing threw a wrench in the works, but Andrew, you can't sit around and wait for her to decide. You are going to have to take the bull by the horns on this one. I'm not saying you have to do it now, since her father just died, but I don't think this is going to play out in any other way than her maybe temporarily walking away because she has this money (and leaving you holding the bag on the loan that she won't pay) and then try to come crawling back when she fritters away what she gets from her dad so that you can support her again. She is not equipped to live totally on her own and that is no one's fault but hers (and those who enable her). She's got to have a fall back guy and, sadly, I think you are going to be that guy unless you cut ties firmly and finally. Again, not saying you have to do this now...give it a few days or weeks, by all means. But, I think what happens in the next couple of weeks is going to be very telling.


Me 52, H53
Bomb drop 9/29/2014
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Agreed that you don’t need to do anything right now - after all, the poor man hasn’t even been buried yet.

But this is a very important time to be observant. We are all making educated guesses here but you will see a lot in the next couple of weeks that should inform your decision. Is she grieving the loss of her father ? Or just gleeful about taking over his house and letting her dog on his couch? Is she trying to be fair in executing the will? Or is she trying to cheat her brother out of major things? (I’m not talking about ordinary household furnishings, which are probably worth very little in resale and brother has already demonstrated no interest). How does she respond when you bring up the idea of paying off the loan?

And - Andrew, it’s ok to be sad about the romantic side of this relationship. That was a positive thing. It just may not have been enough to overcome the many obstacles and differences.

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