Affair Fog-LRT 4

[SteveLW]

Do I keep her out if the bedroom? Do I continue on with our lives while working to be better? I am going to MC tonight, which my W has begged me to do. I just don't know what boundaries I set from here

Is she actively engaged in a PA? If not then no, do not kick her out of the bedroom. You are punishing her for something that has already been over and done.

WOrk through this in MC. "When I found out about the other earlier affair I felt..............................."

Betrayed all over again.
Hurt all over again.
All the old wounds reopen.

But again, I am going to caution you on demanding full disclosure. Do not obsess. Everyone makes mistakes, you should allow her the time to process, allow yourself the time to process, before doing anything rash.

I guess it boils down to this: You knew about the year long affair. Now you know about the 1 month affair prior to that one. Is that new knowledge WORSE than the former knowledge you had? What if there are more? Does that become a deal breaker for you?

If you go back and read my threads, you'll see that about 6 months into Ring and piecing, I hit a point where I was ready to walk away. I had won my W back. She was doing all of the loving things she had done years before. We were a team again. And then the realization that I wasn't happy for quite a while before BD started to creep back in. And you know what? I almost walked away. If she had had a slip up, contacted OM just to see how he was doing I would have used it as an excuse to blow up the entire MR.

I wonder if that isn't what is going on here. The reality of your marriage to her prior to her waywardness is starting to come back. Humans are crazy creatures....tell us we can't have something and that will become an obsession for us to try and get it! Were you fulfilled and happy before your W went wayward? Or were you unhappy about things in your marriage? When BD happens you forget your own frustrations. And if you R, sometimes those frustrations come back.

I've had to check myself. My W never was and never will put the importance on a neat and clean house that I do. I can either become the old Steve and handle that wrong. Or I can realize that difference and find ways around it. Cleaning myself. Hiring a cleaning service. Etc.

Personally, I think you overreacted to this new revelation. If she were actively in another affair then I could see you taking the actions you have and are contemplating. Read Gordie's quote above. Bumps in the road, twists and turns are inevitable. How you handle all of that is more important than the bumps and twists and turns.

[LH19]

My W (38) and myself (39) have a beautiful D3. She was so happy to have mom home. How do in break that innocent girl? I'm not saying I'm letting her stay but I'm not going to give up and just kick her out.

K,

I think you should educate yourself in regards to serial cheaters and the female brain. You are about to enter the decade where human beings are the most unhappiest. This is typically when a woman starts her midlife transition and starts to question all the decisions she's made in life. When a woman stops producing Estrogen (nurturing hormone) she starts to focus more on her needs and wants when she had typically set them aside to tend to the husbands and children's needs. If your W is doing that now I can not imagine that it will improve in the near future.

Again, not telling you what to do I am just saying it would be good to educate yourself to see what you are up against.

[kto626]

You're right, Steve. You really are. I was happy before BD but honestly, I'm a lot of ways I've been even happier since my W cane home. She looks at me like she used to. She is genuine and loving. I do think I'm overreacting a little but it does hurt but I realize it should.

My W is sending me texts today reassuring me over and over that she is here because she loves me and wants to do the work. I go believe she was trying to protect me from more pain so she didn't want to tell me.

After reading Gordie's quote, I'm riding the roller coaster right now. When I agreed to work in this I should judge our future based on her work now, not her past mistakes. I don't want full disclosure but I do want truth. It's the only way I'll build trust.

And LH, I hear you but I don't agree with you. Of course she doesn't want to talk about the A all the time-she's a human being who is embarrassed and ashamed. The key is, she does talk to me about it. She allows me my questions and processing so I can heal. But that can't always be just in my time, when I want it. I have learned to ask, " can we talk in an hour?" And she knows exactly what we will talk about. If I just jump right into questioning her without notice if any kind, she struggles more. So I can respect that and ask questions so I can heal.

And being a serial cheater and a WW are not too different. However, a WW can become someone they are not while a serial cheater will always remain selfish and rotten to the core. My W is not rotten...that much I know.

[neffer]

Hi kto. I´m here from the dark side. I was a cheater. My W let me come back to MR. I had all the typical cliches with me: affair fog, soulmate fairy tale, AP sex addiction. I needed to work on myself. I faced my inner fears, I found my DB friends...

Give W that chance. She must face her actions. She is working on herself.

I´m with Steve here. Everyone should have another opportunity. It´s from now on that transparency must prevail.

Hoping the best outcome for your sitch Kto.

Time, patience, love, honesty.

[kto626]

During MC last night, I woke up angry from everything. I'm not so much hurt and angry compared to the first A I found out about. More importantly, the lying about it. Our MC said he believes that she was trying to protect from more hurt but it's impossible for me to heal, therefore, allowing us to heal, if she keeps secrets, lies, or tries to protect me from her poor choices. He suggested she writes down any skeletons in the closet that I may or may not find out one day. By being honest she is actually depositing into the trust bank. Otherwise, the next thing I learn will get us back to zero. I said I don't want any details, just generalizations, of anything that I need to know. My W is adamant that there were no OM, that she knows what she lost when we separated. That she has always loved me but she was so insecure and depressed she did what she did. This is why I want her to go to IC weekly...which was suggested by our MC. He told her that she has a lot of work to do or we will be in the same place sometime in the future. She agreed.

She said the first guy was a one time thing, that it wasnt an affair. It was cheating but she never, ever, wanted him. A few months went but when the actual affair with the second guy began (the first one I found out about). That lasted over a year. She did build feelings for him but looking back now they weren't true feelings. He's a nice guy but nothing compared to me, something she lost sight of. She says as it continued, she became more and more depressed, ashamed, and lost. She lied to everyone in her life. After BD, she lost the most important people in her life (D, me, parents, siblings, friends), and she began to realize what was important to her.

Our MC notes the difference in my W from yesterday compared to when we met him a few weeks after BD. Yesterday was remorseful, emotional, and a whole lot of guilt. Compare that to meeting after BD which was anger, resentful, unapologetic, and accusatory. He pointed out that says a lot on where she is. My W admits she has a lot of work to do on herself. That she wants to feel secure with herself, something she hasn't in awhile. She said her family makes her more secure than anything else she has ever had. She just needs to believe that in herself as well.

In the end, I said I will take one day at a time. She needs to continue to work on herself and she has agreed to the following; weekly IC, quitting the bar job (opening in a few weeks), talking with my mother, continue allowing me access to all accounts (my W even has said numerous times she will delete all social media and get rid of her smart phone...which I don't want to do because I don't want the resentment later), and writing down all skeletons to clear the air to be able to rebuild.

I realize she could resent me wanting her to quit the bar. To give you a little background, she net her first H there, met me there, and met both OM there. We spoke about the drinking and how that leads to poor decisions. We both agreed to reduce the drinking (gotten a little out of control with being home for months). That bar she works at is such a bad influence so the MC said since there are so many haunting stories that came from there, it is time to close that chapter. Again, she has agreed to all of this.

I'm struggling with it all. I'm trying to give her another chance but I have nothing left in me to find out anything else. She needs to prove herself, her honesty, her faithfulness, her love to me, everyday. I need to continue MC and IC to process my emotions and work on my faults. I didn't do anything to deserve this but I'm trying to use this to make a better me.

As a always, thank you for your support and advice.

[LH19]

K,

I have to say it all sounds pretty good. I'm just a little skeptical because this has seemed to happy very fast. Usually it takes years for WWs to come to these conclusions.

My main concern for you is that you are relatively young and haven't hit the 40s yet when life is typically very stressful. How will she handle the adversity. I guess if you continue to work on yourself and implement strong boundaries you can cross that bridge if you come to it.

I am happy for you and your family.

[SteveLW]

kt, good update. I do think that a requirement for R of quitting the bar is a good one. You keep worrying about resentment, but look at it from this perspective: what causes more resentment, making quitting the bar a condition of R, or sleeping with other people?

It kind of reminds me of when a WAS accuses the LBS of invading their privacy by snooping, when the snooping results in finding an indiscretion. The last time this happened, I bluntly told me W, "snooping is in no way worse than there being something for me to find!" She couldn't refute that.

So decide what you need to move forward. Do not worry about resentment. She is not an innocent W that is the victim of things to be resentful for. All of your conditions for R are the consequences of what they have done.

I do want to challenge you on this:

"I'm struggling with it all. I'm trying to give her another chance but I have nothing left in me to find out anything else. She needs to prove herself, her honesty, her faithfulness, her love to me, everyday. I need to continue MC and IC to process my emotions and work on my faults. I didn't do anything to deserve this but I'm trying to use this to make a better me."

This is not a healthy place to be. You are essentially saying that there are no more mistakes she can make. I really need you to go back and read Gordie's post that I quoted earlier. Expecting perfection is a fool's game. There will be ups and there will be downs. Ring is NOT easy. At all. In my W's and my MC sessions there were a lot of issues that came up that I didn't know and had to deal with. I like your "take it one day at a time" approach, but I also think you have to be open that their may be more revelations yet to come. But it is impossible for her to be perfect, so don't expect that.

[kto626]

Steve, I agree with you. Bad news will surly come but I can't deal with anymore lying. Even if it's to protect me. I need to trust my W someday and by lying or giving me trickle truths will only delay or hinder that trust.

Side note- now I know who both these guys are. Matter of fact, they both live within a mile of us (which [censored]). Without sounding conceded, both are far less attractive, overweight, and somewhat unsuccessful. Why does she chose people who are beneath her? Is that related to insecurities? I'm honestly not trying to sound like I'm super handsome superhero but her own friends mentioned it to me....she downgraded. I guess it doesn't matter in the long run. Just a thought.

Abd LH, thank you too for your continued support and advice. You tell it how it is. Sometimes I don't always agree with you but your comments make me think. I do really appreciate your well wishes.

Steve, you have been so helpful and are helping me be more grounded and thoughtful in my processing of all of this. All of you are appreciated.

[LH19]

Side note- now I know who both these guys are. Matter of fact, they both live within a mile of us (which [censored]). Without sounding conceded, both are far less attractive, overweight, and somewhat unsuccessful. Why does she chose people who are beneath her? Is that related to insecurities? I'm honestly not trying to sound like I'm super handsome superhero but her own friends mentioned it to me....she downgraded. I guess it doesn't matter in the long run. Just a thought.

That's because she has low self esteem and loves the ego boost because these men fall all over her. My ex is the same way. This doesn't last long because people who jump through hoops for you are not valuable and are therefore not attractive. You value people who are confident and self-sufficient, and that you feel you need to work to get. When you get attention from those people you feel good about yourself.

Abd LH, thank you too for your continued support and advice. You tell it how it is. Sometimes I don't always agree with you but your comments make me think. I do really appreciate your well wishes.

I don't think it's worth while to blow sunshine up peoples arses here. I think your W most likely will cheat again and it's just a matter of time. Without motivation people in general don't change. But I do understand why you want to give her another chance and of course I wish you and your daughter well.

[MrBrside]

Without sounding conceded, both are far less attractive, overweight, and somewhat unsuccessful. Why does she chose people who are beneath her? Is that related to insecurities? I'm honestly not trying to sound like I'm super handsome superhero but her own friends mentioned it to me....she downgraded. I guess it doesn't matter in the long run. Just a thought.

Common - my WW lost everything she ever wanted in life and was so desperate for.. I gained a better life

Google "why did she affair down" - there are multiple articles on the rational ( or lack of it ) behind their mentality.