I suspect because you sometimes are more likely to act or act faster when he's pushy. From a psychological perspective that's "positive feedback", and it rewards that behavior in the future.
Originally Posted by KitCat
H: do I have mail at the house
There are 3 pieces of junk mail so my response in 2hr was going to be no.
However he is impatient
So I replay "no mail"
I gave my D ice cream yesterday. It'd been there 3 days and I was surprised she hadn't mentioned it. I asked if she'd noticed it was there. She said, "Yes, but if I'd asked for it, you'd have said no." (Recently my son asked for it 3x in a row when I was in the middle of something important, so I skipped dessert.)
Yeah that’s fine but wouldn’t it be better to get it over with quickly?
All of our stuff is extremely co-mingled... outside of the motorcycle, boat and camping supplies there will be a lot of sorting to do.
I'm still working - long hours like most who are necessary workers and at the end of the day exhausted just meeting my own needs and that of the dogs.
He is living out of suitcases anyway right now. Why the rush for hunting gear that isn't used until fall? And, because of that is buried deep in the walk up attic... Will have to remove lots of stuff first before getting to it. Is it fair to put me through that right now? I get it that a lot of world isn't working or working from home.
I think I will stick to those answers.
I have a 4 day weekend for my birthday which is Saturday. He should know WAY better than to expect me to spend my birthday moving out his crap.
In my opinion since you are looking at recon then you want to get him moved out as soon as possible. Time and space is the only thing that turns this around long term.
I know I cannot back down on the financial order until things are settled with who pays what/gets what. H seems to think we still have this verbal agreement even after how he has treated me and I got and filed with atty. Honestly, I have no idea what is going on his head.
OK good. As for what's going on in his head, it's Crazy Town in there right now. There's no figuring it out. No matter how calm and collected he may seem on the outside, there's a Class 5 hurricane inside.
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AS - its not a matter of "nice"ing him back. Its I don't want this knock down ugly fight were he says "this is why we cannot be together". I can't deal with any impact that I have a dug a bigger hole for myself. I don't want to be a doormat but I also don't want to create so much animosity that he wouldn't consider recon.
Yeah this is why we push no or limited contact so hard. Because he is going to do that NO MATTER WHAT YOU SAY. For example, he asks you if there is mail at your house. You say "no", he thinks "OMG she is being so cold and distant, no wonder I needed out of this." You say "No, nothing here, I hope you are enjoying your day though!" and he thinks "wow always with the relationship pressure, she just never lets up, no wonder I needed out of this." You say "Get your mail out of here, I want nothing to do with you or your mail." and he thinks "she is so angry and vindictive, no wonder I needed out of this."
YOU CANNOT WIN. PERIOD. So you pull back and go silent. All discussions are about business and discussed in a business-like fashion. Just the facts, nothing less, nothing more. When I say you can't "nice" him back I don't mean you're being too nice and you need to stop it. What I mean is you can't reason with him, or bargain, or negotiate, or anything. The only way to deal with someone like him is to treat him like some stranger you are doing a business transaction with.
I only emphasize this point because I can tell you are a nice person, and it's in your nature to be nice to others. You want to please people, right? Even now after all he's done you still want to please him. But he is not at all receptive to that right now. Tough love is the only thing that will work with him. You've got to be firm in protecting yourself, but not in a mean or angry way.
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I truly believe he has other avenues to get funds. He may end up using the funds he took out of another account that was supposed to pay off the vehicles. If he does that he is in contempt and I will have ownership in the house. He could get the funds from his father who would do such a loan and be paid back when the dust has settled in our finances.
As long as you are protected financially, where he gets money or if he gets it or when or what he does with it is none of your concern.
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I think that is why he inquires about the order every few days but isn't harping me about it - he has a plan b for that???
If I were to guess I'd say he's afraid that if he pushes too hard you will shut that down completely, so he's trying to keep it front and center while at the same time trying not to anger you about it.
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I had in my head been waiting for warmer weather and having the bike up and running and asking him to take me to this or that place for dinner... long winding roads maybe an hour travel and a unique place for dinner.
If I would have just said to H in December that I couldn't wait for warmer weather so he could take me to X, Y, Z on the bike he would have been thrilled that I was partaking in his thing... but I never did. I just thought I would bring up when the bike was up and ready. What was wrong with me???? Why didn't I say anything.
That cuts both ways. I don't remember you posting about him making elaborate plans for you two to go on a nice road trip together either. The garages of America and filled with motorcycles with dead batteries. We men, we're in love with the IDEA of motorcycling and boating and 4 wheeling and such. But most of us just don't make the time for it. That's not your fault.
KC, I have been wanting to share this story with you because I think it shows you the importance of working on and focusing on you through all of this. Believe it or not, this whole thing is less about him than you think it is. You have established patterns of behavior, codependency, and reactions that he has come to not only depend on and expect, but that he can count on to manipulate to his own advantage.
In 2005 my wife had an EA with a guy she had gone to high school with. They reconnected through a high school reunion website, and since they had dated in jr. high, struck up a "friendship". He was unhappy in his marriage, she was in ours. And so it grew into a full blown EA, and was headed towards a PA until I discovered it. As soon as I found it and confronted she immediately said she didn't want a D and that she wanted to work on the marriage. But she was resistant and not all in at first.
To cope I reached out to some message boards related to marital strife. I connected with men and women that were committed to trying to make their marriages work through EA, PAs, and bad marital dynamics. I meant a guy named Pat. Pat and became pretty instant friends. Calling and emailing each other. Pat's wife was much more lost in her EA fantasy and wasn't willing to give it up. While we had similarities in our sitches, his was much worse off than mine was. At least my W ended her EA and was wanting to want to work on the marriage. Eventually he and his W agreed to D. My W and I struggled forward with our marriage.
Though Pat and my sitch ended very differently, we had one thing in common. We didn't focus on ourselves, nor work on ourselves through out our sitches. We didn't take it as an opportunity to improve, become better husband and fathers, and to really look forward to a MR 2.0, with or without our spouses. We both missed a huge opportunity, because we were so micro focused on our Ws, and their behaviors and what they were saying.
A few months after he agrred to D, Pat met a new woman. He was thrilled and head over hills in love with her. Within a year of his D being final, he and this new woman got married and started a life together, while he continue to coparent his kids with he is ex-wife.
I last talked to Pat ~2012. Having been remarried now for ~5 years he expressed sorrow that the same dynamic that ended his first marriage was happening again. His new W was now distancing herself from him and he suspected an OM in the picture. He was not very hopeful that he would be able to save this marriage, and was pretty sure it was going to end like his first marriage had.
I felt bad for him. Poor Pat I though. And then 5 years later I found myself in the same boat. With a distant W reaching out to an OM in another EA.
KC, the thing is that you can make this all about your H. And the doom yourself to the same fate you find yourself in now, either with him or someone new. Or you can take all of the focus off of him. Put it on yourself. Work on yourself to become the best KC that you can be. So that a new MR 2.0 can replace what you're losing now.
Him: "Do I have any mail?" You: "No, however you make an excellent point. Where would you like your mail forwarded?"
You see you gave yourself away the last couple of days. You LIKE that he texts you and contacts you. You pretend and try to convince yourself that you want X days without contact, but you really don't like it. And so you relish when he is reaching out to you, even when it is mundane garbage like "do I have any mail"? You are caught in a pattern. And unless you work on that pattern, self-improve, and remove any reasons he would still need to contact you, you are going to continue to be trapped in that pattern. And then you will be doomed to repeat history, just like Pat and me, even if you end up Ring with your H.
M(53), W(54),D(19) M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017 Ring and Piecing since March 2018
You see you gave yourself away the last couple of days. You LIKE that he texts you and contacts you. You pretend and try to convince yourself that you want X days without contact, but you really don't like it. And so you relish when he is reaching out to you, even when it is mundane garbage like "do I have any mail"? You are caught in a pattern. And unless you work on that pattern, self-improve, and remove any reasons he would still need to contact you, you are going to continue to be trapped in that pattern. And then you will be doomed to repeat history, just like Pat and me, even if you end up Ring with your H.
This is true...
I have been trying to focus more on myself and have been doing some really hard work.
But you are right. I want him to notice. I want him to miss me.
He takes my special store that was ours and shares it with her. I hate him for that.
You’re contacting him over bath supplies?! If you feel it’s illegal, you can notify your attorney, if not best to let it go.
PS - I had a similar reaction when my then ex-gf went to “our” bar when we were apart.
Okay --- I'm hurt and licking wounds.
I am being controlling. I have controlling issues when it comes to my H. Despite my best intentions/motives in my behavior I see from H's perspective its dismissive, not respectful, and rejecting. It not accepting him for who he truly was - its not about my intentions but my spouses perception.
I need to stop doing the things that destroy love and start doing the things to build love.
