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Yail,

We still have not been intimate. I know I need to have that awkward convo with her about testing. I agree it is widely under-discussed in our community, I'm just nervous about the weirdness of it all. This probably stems from the fact that I have not had many partners (less than a full hand) and when ww and I started dating we were young and dumb - never had the talk other than the I've never had an STD blanket statement. Ugh it turns my stomach to even think about her with OW. Alas, before getting to that point it is something I know needs discussion.

I am definitely proceeding with caution. I am also finding myself a little fearful of jumping back in too quickly. She has asked me to come over every night since reconciliation. I guess I'm just craving my own space kind of thing. It's like my brain is telling my heart:

"Wait! Slow down, do don't this too quickly because you could get hurt again. Go back home and make sure single KG is still happy without W."

Don't get me wrong. I'm elated inside thinking that maybe we could get through this on the other side together. It's just like a "pinch me, is this real" kind of feeling.

WW is being very thoughtful, caring, and affectionate. I have noticed she is self correcting if she acts like a jerk. This is new behavior. Previously, when she got snippy or hateful, she would sulk and want to be alone until it passed. The last couple of weeks if she has said something short or hateful she quickly acknowledges her mood and apologizes. Much improved.

KG


LBW 32 - me
WW 31
T 7 M 4
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This is all good, I'm glad to hear her behaviors are changing and that you're craving some alone time. Take it! And be upfront with her. "I've spent a lot of time alone this past year. Sometimes I find it helpful and enjoyable, and I don't want to be with people every second. I still want to hang out with you and work on this, but I've gained a lot by being alone as well. I don't want to lose what I've gained."

Or maybe even just, "I think I'm gonna chill at home tonight. See you tomorrow for lunch?"

I think the trick (at least to me) in starting the awkward conversation is to just be bold about it. Just remember it doesn't need to be a conversation - just a statement. Recognize that you are a whole new person now. So you will act differently to her in some ways. If things start going in the direction where you feel you will be intimate in the near future you can simply state, "W, things are different now. Looking back to when we were 25 and dove in without any real discussion to our health I cringe a bit. So now with this new start I'm going to ask that you be tested before we are unprotected".

This question is NOT about OW. It is NOT about specifics or details or asking in any way about OWs health. Stop her and let her know you don't wish to discuss it. This is about you and your request for her clean bill of health.

Have protection available with you for the time before she does so.

A couple scenerios could happen. She could balk. Let her. Any person - ANY person - who balks at someone for this is not someone we should be sleeping with. Immediate permission to pack up and excuse yourself for the evening. I remind myself of this all the time in preparation for this exact about health.

She could come back with the "Well what about you?". I suppose this dependson how it's intended. Is it blame shifting? That's a reason to step out for the night and let her stew in it. No time for temper tantrums. Is it a legit concern of hers? You could offer to go as well (alone or separate). Never hurts anyone for additional clean bill of health.

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Hi KG,

So happy to hear how things are going for you. I have been trying the validation practice with my kids and it is AMAZING. (Of course, my D9 had to tell me directly... she was telling me something she was upset about and I interrupted her with a solution and she was like Mom!! I wanted to tell you how I was feeling! And you're not even listening to me! I was like.... oh. Giant forehead slap. Like how could I not see this and my nine year old had to tell it to me directly... so I listened through her whole thing, validated, asked more questions about how she was feeling, and she came up with the solution herself. I wanted to cry for all the opportunities I've missed to do this the right way with her.)

Hope your performance evals went well. I know that feeling well of dread before giving someone difficult feedback. I think I tend to sugarcoat things too much-- it is really difficult for me (in person) to be as clear as I need to be when behaviors really need to change. Now, I write it all down ahead of time and read it aloud (good and bad) so that I know I spit everything out I needed to say.

How did the IC visit go?

Also, agree with Yail that there is no need to rush anything (which I also know you know)-- this should be at your pace, where you feel comfortable. Don't feel guilty about it.


Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs
9/20 - present: R and piecing
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May,

I'm so glad you're finding validation and practicing on your girls helpful! It is amazing when we actually start listening to those around us and keep our big mouths shut to let someone else get to a solution on their own. If nothing else, your daughter will feel heard and loved.

Performance evals went pretty well. I probably sugar coated a little more than I should, but I definitely got the message across that change must happen for continued employment. I still have one difficult one left, but it's the easier of the three bad ones.

First IC appointment was this morning. WOW, what a difference in finding a skilled therapist makes! I don't know if I had mentioned previously in my thread, but I tried a local counselor that didn't give any feedback/homework/advice. It was terrible. I could get more from talking to my dogs (and most of the time, they don't talk back HA). The counselor I met today was wonderful. She doesn't sugarcoat anything and isn't afraid to call me out on my own faults. e.g. setting a boundary and then bending the line. We have a plan on working through setting boundaries v control which I know is something you have struggled with as well May. I realized in speaking with her today that I am generally very laid back, but when some form of crisis happens in my life I go into "fix-it" mode. My IC pointed out that what I really move into is "Control the situation" mode. Very enlightening and more true than I would like to admit. I hope to learn a lot and really continue in my own self growth on this journey.

Yail, I did indeed tell ww that I needed to stay home and take care of a few things last night. I used your suggestion and offered to meet up for lunch today. She was kind and understanding. Today, she picked up some things from the store that I was needing, went shopping for dinner ingredients, and even has a "few surprises" she also picked up for me when I get to her place after work. All in all, it's been a pretty stellar couple of days. I hope you are still hanging in there May. I am keeping up with your thread daily and you are in my thoughts often.

KG


LBW 32 - me
WW 31
T 7 M 4
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Well guys - I blew it. Went for evening plans with WW and all was going so well. She had drawn a hot bath for me when I arrived, picked up a few small thoughtful gifts at the store, and made me dinner. Very romantic and sweet. We had a few too many cocktails and a relationship talk ensued. I asked if she was still speaking with OW. She said yes, everyday. I got emotional and told her that I am trying to have patience, but that we will never work as long as OW is in the picture. I told her exactly what I need to make this work.

Her head is still all over the place. She says that it's getting easier to not talk to OW, but that she feels guilty for hurting her. That she has this need to check in on her everyday to make sure that she is ok. I'm not proud, but I let my frustration at the whole situation show. It hurts to hear her tell me about her feelings for OW. It is like she feels like I should be thankful that she is here and working on us (in her mind she's working on us). I told her we aren't working on anything as long as OW is in the picture. I told her that she's been having her cake and I'm done serving my share.

This morning she was distant and cold. Left for work. She text me to let me know she made it work and she won't be bothering me anymore. I replied that I love her and that I hope she fights for us and works through it. She said that she feels it's best to just move our separate ways. Nothing is ever going to be good enough and that I deserve better. Ended with a "have a great life". I sent her a final message in return stating that I understand if she feels that way, she is enough and the one I want to spend my life with, but that with things as they currently are we will never be able to make it work. Gosh, this s*cks. I know I'm still going to be ok, but I would be lying if I said that I didn't have my hopes up and put expectations on reconciliation. I feel like an idiot.

KG


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KG ~

Sorry to hear about the latest.

Don't beat yourself up. You didn't "blow it" and we all make mistakes. She sounds all over the place. One night she's planning a romantic evening, the very next morning she's telling you "have a great life". She is confused.

I think Steve85 has a great saying for this but it eludes me. Something about how until your partner is consistent in her actions and words, you won't know how she truly feels. If you are confused, you won't know. While you are confused, continue to DB. So assume you don't know what she wants, and keep doing what you need to do for yourself.

As part of that, yes, I think removing yourself from R conversations is best to protect yourself and relieve pressure from the whole situation. It is soooooo hard in the moment when you get those texts. They know how to rile us up and get a response. Try implementing a rule that you won't reply in those situations for some amount of time. Or come here and ask for advice. As much as they can make it feel like an emergency, they are NOT emergencies.

I know in the moment you feel like a ship in the storm, at the mercy of the raging seas. In the moment it can feel either like "she's back!" or "all is lost". The reality is she is confused, and the more you dive into her world, the more you are at the mercy of her yo-yo see-saw drama.

Hang in there, you're doing great. Things will get better one way or another.

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Oh KG. I'm so sorry.

I don't see how you blew it, at all. Maybe by letting yourself have hope... but to be perfectly honest, I don't see that as a bad thing. I don't actually want to be a robot who can control my emotions 100% in these situations, or someone who looks at how your W has been treating you and has a knee-jerk reaction of skepticism and pessimism rather than hope. Yes, you might open yourself up to be hurt. But you're a strong, amazing person and there is no need to feel like an idiot or that you did something wrong. I think the ability to love and to let yourself be vulnerable is a wonderful thing.

I think even in the best of circumstances it is hard for the WS to cut off all contact with the AP. This "needing to see if she is OK" is the same thing my H is saying to me too. And, that by not walking out the door, he believes he *is* working on us... which is of course impossible for the WS to do without being 100% committed to the R and breaking off contact with the AP forever. And you will never have emotional safety until you know she is totally out of the picture, and so cannot heal.

Anyway, it sounds to me like you made your boundaries crystal clear. She's clearly still bouncing around in her head-- maybe sounds like she knows what she wants (you) but still doesn't have the fortitude to do what it takes to really commit to making that work (NC with OW). And not to try to be a mind-reader but probably in her mind she has been trying, she's doing her best, doing all these romantic things and just trying not to be an a**hole to this other person she's hurt in all of this (OW) and that isn't enough for you. (Nor should it be!) Anyway. She should feel more guilty for hurting you than for hurting OW. She should put herself in your shoes and see all the damage she's done to her WIFE and stop feeling sorry for herself. But, she isn't there yet and there is no way to know that she'll ever get there. It isn't your problem, and she is the one missing out if she can't.

Hugs... you know what to do. Focus on YOU.


Me (46) H (42)
M:14 T:18, D9 & D11
4/19 - 12/19: series of escalating BDs
9/20 - present: R and piecing
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Thanks May and UC. I know that I am strong and will get through this either way, but it is still awful when, as U put it, you feel like you're at the mercy of a raging sea. The thing that makes it so hard is opening up and becoming vulnerable because of hope and then feeling crushed. They are just emotions and they will settle. Also not trying to mind read here, but I do feel like she has been giving her *best* and trying so hard. Part of me wishes I could stay emotionally healthy and give her time to end things and find closure. Continue to focus on my PMA and growth, that way I'll be ok and happy with either outcome.

KG


LBW 32 - me
WW 31
T 7 M 4
No Kids
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Separated 1y
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Originally Posted by KristinG
The thing that makes it so hard is opening up and becoming vulnerable because of hope and then feeling crushed.

It does. That's why R testing is usually not recommended until our partners become more consistent. It's both self-protection and a removal of pressure.

Originally Posted by KristinG
I do feel like she has been giving her *best* and trying so hard.

Remember that feeling of desperation that you just wanted to fix things overnight? That's what she is (possibly) feeling. Trying really really really hard does not fix a broken MR. It's good but not sufficient.

KG you are doing a great job at DB. I think your W sounds like an emotional hot mess and until she gathers her own inner strength she will be that raging unpredictable sea and not know what she wants. The more you can detach and get off that roller coaster, the more you will be able to have a healthy perspective and make decisions for your own happiness. Keep up the PMA, validate, detach *lovingly* (important distinction)... all that good stuff.

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Kristin,

Originally Posted by Kristin
Well guys - I blew it.

Omigosh, I'm so sorry!! It's BD all over again. frown

Originally Posted by Kristin
I know that I am strong and will get through this either way, but it is still awful when, as U put it, you feel like you're at the mercy of a raging sea.

I get it. Dark days ahead. Our emotions take a long time to catch up with our logic.

Originally Posted by Kristin
1/10 - We are officially over week 1 of no contact with AP. I haven't verified this info, but so far it seems true.
1/14 - I do know that OW has been reaching out.
1/16 - I asked if she was still speaking with OW. She said yes, everyday.

I replied that I love her and that I hope she fights for us and works through it. She said. Nothing is ever going to be good enough and that I deserve better. I do feel like she has been giving her *best* and trying so hard.

I believe you. My ex wanted me in her life and she didn't want commitment. She tried really hard to straddle the line between them. She felt frustrated when she tossed me a bone and I didn't jump for joy. Hey! I'm driving over breakfast. Shh.. ignore I had dinner with a guy and told him we're still broken up.

Kristin, if WW was trying hard to break from AP, why was she in contact with AP everyday? Why wasn't she asking for your help to cut AP off responsibly, sharing her password, or aggressively going to counseling to try to fix this, or taking a step back when you said you love her and wanted her to fight for you?

You deserve a partner who values your loyalty and strength and will fight for you!

You DESERVE it. You are an amazing person. (((HUGS)))




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