Well, I explained it the best I could considering my speech to text app $uck$, lol
A final note on "confidence", in general, and let me preface this by saying that I am not generally one to proselytize, but I do think this is important to offer up given how helpful it has been to me:
My recollection is that you and your W were people of faith. If not, feel free to ignore (but hopefully at least thoughtfully consider) the following:
We are to some degree people of faith. I feel like that is where we failed and for our son's sake. The first 10 years of our marriage we attended church but not regularly. She grew up in a very spiritual household and she never missed a day of church while she was living at home. She has recently been involved more with exploring other viewpoints such as meditation, tao, yoga, and holistic beliefs to some degree in the past 8 years. I do believe going forward I must commit to a more Christian spiritual leadership and finding wisdom and healing in that avenue. This is what I feel drawn too, however she has been somewhat turned away from the Christian faith. She believes most southern baptist are spiritual due to fear and scare tactics preached from the alter. This is why we attended a non-denominational church for most of our marriage.
Her mother mentioned they dedicated her and their family to Jesus and that she will eventually have to return to the way she was raised. I do want to thank you for the encouragement and the scripture you have provided.
Your description of your wife reminds me of my wife. She was raised in a very devout Catholic family (I was raised Presbyterian, although in the south, so the Southern Baptist influence was everywhere...Liberty University was right down the road). Anyway, my wife... The oldest child, devout Catholic upbringing, always expected to be the "good girl", and the good example to other siblings... Always, as she put it, alot of expectations on her. So, while her faith was always important to her, at the point she became wayward, she rebelled against that, as she did against me and the marriage and even, to a certain extent, her family. She stopped going to mass, except occasionally, stopped taking communion, was DEFINITELY resistant and resentful of religious or faith-based reasons that what she was doing was wrong. That was actually one of the big clues that I knew she had "turned" back... When she resumed going to mass, and to confession, and taking communion. so, even though she rebelled, and turrned away from it for a while, I firmly believe that it was her previous firm grounding in her faith that was one of the big reasons that she came around eventually, and as quickly as she did, if you can call 16+ months "quickly", lol.
Maybe yours will eventually come around in similar fashion. If you still want it,bi pray that it is so. Until such time, however, even if it does happen, you have little to no control over it. Need to focus on yourself, and working on you.
Hang in there, man, and keep up the good work in your GALs, etc
H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18
"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7
"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
Your description of your wife reminds me of my wife. She was raised in a very devout Catholic family (I was raised Presbyterian, although in the south, so the Southern Baptist influence was everywhere...Liberty University was right down the road). Anyway, my wife... The oldest child, devout Catholic upbringing, always expected to be the "good girl", and the good example to other siblings... Always, as she put it, alot of expectations on her. So, while her faith was always important to her, at the point she became wayward, she rebelled against that, as she did against me and the marriage and even, to a certain extent, her family. She stopped going to mass, except occasionally, stopped taking communion, was DEFINITELY resistant and resentful of religious or faith-based reasons that what she was doing was wrong. That was actually one of the big clues that I knew she had "turned" back... When she resumed going to mass, and to confession, and taking communion. so, even though she rebelled, and turrned away from it for a while, I firmly believe that it was her previous firm grounding in her faith that was one of the big reasons that she came around eventually, and as quickly as she did, if you can call 16+ months "quickly", lol.
Maybe yours will eventually come around in similar fashion. If you still want it,bi pray that it is so. Until such time, however, even if it does happen, you have little to no control over it. Need to focus on yourself, and working on you.
Hang in there, man, and keep up the good work in your GALs, etc
Sounds exactly like my situation. I just suspect and know my wife that it will be difficult for her to let go but at the same time as time goes by I think she realizes the other side is not who she is at the end of the day. That’s why she all of a sudden gets back to reading self-help books and focusing on personal growth. Problem is last time it lasted for about 4 days. She gets constant scripture from her mom and she doesn’t like that.
I actually went to bars a bit when I was in limbo. Going out and having fun like that was something I had done fairly often. Now, I am a bit younger.
One caveat, I knew not to get drunk because that would make me very emotional and I didn't want to contact or beg my then WW.
I found interaction with women when I was out, and noticed my thoughts became more positive, my attitude turned into one where I knew I could get through my sitch, and that other women would still desire me. How foolish was I to think otherwise....
H 34 W 29 BD 3/12/18 Divorce Busted Spring 19
It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
I continue to take steps backwards. Most of it is emotional anger etc...... I have tried to walk away when feeling this way. This crap is so tough to deal with and handle. I feel like I continue to fail and fall backwards. Discovering her meeting up at his house on 12/21 has made me bitter and resentful. I know many say that you have to move forward and forget about the incidents where you step backwards.
Going to try and move forward. I am disappointed in how I responded this weekend. I learned she was trying to record me having an outburst or being upset. I feel like she was trying to push me to that point. She claimed the only reason she did it was so she could show her mother how unstable I am. This life has become a circus and I am convinced she truly sees me as the enemy. I just hate this for our 13yr old S.
One of the best things I learned along my journey is to learn how to control my emotions. You can’t blame her for you losing your cool. Something to work on.
One of the best things I learned along my journey is to learn how to control my emotions. You can’t blame her for you losing your cool. Something to work on.
I’m all for being in control of your emotions. Especially around a cheater. He shouldn't show the vulnerable little underbelly. But let’s face it — we all lose our cool when we’ve been cheated on. If he didn’t lose his cool, I’d wonder if he didn’t care. Best way to not lose his cool is to not be around them. Period. Try no contact. It really minimizes the psychodrama.
What gets their attention is no contact. What gets their attention is you getting your stuff together to protect yourself from their entitlement. Lawyers, separate finances, the cessation of kibbles. THAT gets their attention — your NON attention.
One of my favorite shows is Californiacation. It’s about an alpha male who is going through a midlife crisis trying to win back the love of his life.
There’s a scene where he goes into the bathroom to take a leak and he closes the door and there’s a dead man who hung himself on the door. He makes a joke and calmly calls his beta friend in the bathroom. His beta friend comes in and starts screaming and crying like a girl because he can’t control his emotions. Then his other beta friend comes in and does the same thing.
Who do you think is the most attractive of the three?
Going to try and move forward. I am disappointed in how I responded this weekend. I learned she was trying to record me having an outburst or being upset. I feel like she was trying to push me to that point. She claimed the only reason she did it was so she could show her mother how unstable I am. This life has become a circus and I am convinced she truly sees me as the enemy. I just hate this for our 13yr old S.
What did she do and how did you respond this weekend? I didn't see any posts from you from those days. Just from the hints you give above, she seems VERY wayward, still. Trying to justify her actions to go along with her selective memory of your MR (only remembering the bad and none of the good) so that (as she hopes) she can ride off into the sunset with OM and live happily ever after and get a favorable divorce settlement and every one will love her and there will be unicorns and puppy dogs for everyone etc etc etc. At any rate, i'd be curious to hear about it. From your perspective, just need to try to stay lovingly detached. Be as cool and indifferent as you can (indifference, btw, and not "hate", is the opposite of "love")
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I feel like I continue to fail and fall backwards. Discovering her meeting up at his house on 12/21 has made me bitter and resentful. I know many say that you have to move forward and forget about the incidents where you step backwards.
Yes, this is obviously a problem (and one of the most profound hurdles erected by snooping, or "intelligence gathering"... or otherwise finding out details about the affair): Once you find out about something, or see something, you cant "un-discover" it or "un-see" it. And in the realm of MRs and affairs, some of those things you discover or see can be extremely traumatic and damaging to the psyche. It (fully realizing or being confronted with, no filter, the degree or details of your spouse's infidelity/cheating) is one of the primary hurdles to reconciling a MR that has been subject to infidelity. It is one reason (along with eventually realizing how good your life can be even without your spouse) that LBSs often, by the end of the process, have no interest in "taking back" their spouse and eventually themselves become, in effect, the WAS. Sometimes you just can't overcome the damage and betrayal. I myself have struggled with this, even after my W and I reconciled, and even now almost two years afterwards. I had an IC session only a month ago... and I am not even certain my W actually slept with OM. It's just hard to get the images you conjure up about the possibilities out of your head... I can only imagine how hard it is to get them out of your head when, as in your case, your W describes it to you in rather graphic detail. So don't feel like there is something wrong with you for being bitter and resentful... it is quite normal. You can't control how you feel... BUT... you CAN control how you react to those feelings and how you respond and behave (partcularly around her and your kids). Be cool, calm, confident, and in control at all times... YOU have done NOTHING wrong.
overnbw:
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I found interaction with women when I was out, and noticed my thoughts became more positive, my attitude turned into one where I knew I could get through my sitch, and that other women would still desire me. How foolish was I to think otherwise....
Yeah, this is a really huge confidence booster, and i think it can really be helpful when you are going through this kind of sitch.... however... it can also be an important cautionary tale: I recall when my W was still in the "affair" stage, and I was finally revving up my GAL-ing and coming to grips with the fact that I might very well be moving forward as a single man... I came to a point when i was visiting my fellow LBH buddy out of town one weekend that i thought to myself: "Self, you know what? You just need to go with the flow tonight, have fun, enjoy yourself, live in the moment, etc etc." So I did just that. Didn't mope, got back into the mindset of being the man I once was demeanor-wise, confident, carefree. Talked to anyone in the bar who seemed willing. Talked and bantered, flirted a little (lightly, as I thought) Met alot of folks, including a few ladies, a couple of which, both quite attractive and younger, were definitely available and, at least in one case, very interested. It was... intoxicating. My buddy even at one point during a private sidebar when we went up to order drinks, had to talk me down a bit: "Hey, man, where do you think this is going?" ...and "Do you know what you are doing, here and what you want, both for you and your MR and then with this girl... and what do you think this girl is thinking"... and it made me stop and think, hard. Because I wasn't really looking to hook up or anything like that... I had just been letting myself go, having some fun, playfully conversing, etc. But I realized that I was getting very close to crossing a line, and I realized that this girl very well likely was becoming interested and the situation very easily could have ended up becoming something that wouldn't have been fair to me, or to her, or to my MR, and definitely wouldn't have been consistent with my own goals for my MR (I was still actively hoping for reconcilliation at that point, and still considered myself "married.") So I pumped the brakes just a bit. Still let myself have fun and be sociable, but dialed back the flirtatiousness a bit and made it a point to try to avoid leading anybody on or do or say anything inappropriate.
The whole episode really made me... idunno, "sympathize" is probably the wrong word, but at least, maybe... made me understand how my W could, after years of a SSM, be tempted and have her head turned by someone showering her with attention and exhibiting a "desire" for her and making her feel "wanted" romantically/sexually. NOT that i think that that excuses what she did... not even for a second. But I DID see (because I also was subjected to the distance and neglect and denial of intimacy in my MR) how, after being so denied, all of a sudden being exposed to it, by an attractive member of the opposite sex, could be difficult (though not impossible) to resist... "Well, maybe I'll just go flirt/talk with this person a bit more in a more quiet corner of the bar.." and then "Well maybe I'll just walk them out to there car or go for a walk with them or go to get a cup of coffee" and then "Wow, felt so good to talk to them, maybe we can get together again... just to talke" etc etc etc. The emotions and the draw of that attention is powerful. If you put yourself in that situation (talking/flirting) with single members of the opposite sex in a bar or other establishment where you will be drinking alcohol, you do have to be careful and you do have to know yourself, where you are emotionally, what you want and what you can handle both in terms of alcohol and in terms of interacting with members of the opposite sex. As i said above, I think that that dynamic can actually be good, and healthy, and confidence-building, and therapeutic... but it can also be powerfully seductive and enticing depending on your own particular disposition and situation. Don't cross any lines that might derail your own personal progress, permanently torpedo your MR (assuming you are still working/hoping for reconcilliation) or hurt an innocent person.
Mario:
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I’m all for being in control of your emotions. Especially around a cheater. He shouldn't show the vulnerable little underbelly. But let’s face it — we all lose our cool when we’ve been cheated on. If he didn’t lose his cool, I’d wonder if he didn’t care. Best way to not lose his cool is to not be around them. Period. Try no contact. It really minimizes the psychodrama.
Going dark, either completely or selectively (not always possible with kids involved to be completely dark) is usually a good idea/strategy, both in terms of your own emotional well-being as well as in terms of earning some respect back. OTOH, I do believe that it is okay to show/exhibit anger... as long as it is done in a calm, controlled fashion. In fact, it can be even more powerful this way. Not always easy to do, but a very powerful statement. Should be reserved for direct expressions of disrespect (say, where W decides to graphically describe to you her sexual liaison with OM from only a day or two prior). It's an art. One of the most effective, but tricky, manifestations of which is being able to drop a curse word or two in there, almost matter-of factly, without raising your voice or exhibiting any other signs of "rage". The key is that you are ALWAYS cool, and ALWAYS in control of yourself and your emotions and, in general, when around your W, always exhibiting kind of quiet confidence and mild cheerfullness/upbeat attitude (because YOUR life is going AMAZINGLY).
Last edited by hoosjim; 01/06/2007:38 PM.
H53/W51, R-ing 4/'18
"Do not arouse or awaken love until it so desires"-Sg.of Sg 2:7
"So oftentimes it happens,that we live our lives in chains, & we never even know we have the key"-Eagles III 1:3
This comment may get me a bit of backlash, but can I suggest you consider recording yourself..
When I lived with my WW I started to doubt myself from all the lies and gaslighting. I really did start to think I was going crazy at first. I started to go everywhere with an old iPhone in my pocket recording everything. My initial reason for this was to check when needed that I wasn’t going nuts.. After a while it served its purpose, I found this site and became familiar with the whole WW mentality..
But in the early days it really helped me... but I’ll never forget how WW would lose it and go into a rage... what added to her rage was the fact I always remained calm and composed... it drive her insane and she would scream at me “ why aren’t you shouting back” etc... Why was I always so calm... I knew I was recording myself and no matter how much she lost it ( got physical on one occassion) I was Mr Chilled... so in its own way it’s like having that person looking over your shoulder saying “don’t lose it”.... I was also concerned she was consider lying ( she lied about everything else) to get custody of the children etc.. I knew I always had to remain calm in case I needed these as evidence..
My Ww can never justifiably say I raised a voice to her... she has told people but I know it’s lies and can prove if I need to..Because that phone meant I was always calm...
Worth considering..
Previous username - Helpme123.. A name chosen at a desperate time..
Now Mr Brightside.. coming out of my cage, and doing just fine.
At any rate, i'd be curious to hear about it. From your perspective, just need to try to stay lovingly detached. Be as cool and indifferent as you can (indifference, btw, and not "hate", is the opposite of "love")