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Check with your lawyer about whether or not you can change the locks. In my area, you can change the locks once the spouse has removed his/her personal items and the legal separation paperwork is done. As for tools, etc., they are not considered personal.

I, too, agree that you need to have yourself checked out by your Gyn. You never know who he has hooked up w/and what he may or may not have contracted.

I had to laugh about the salt and pepper shakers, etc. They tend to take whatever strikes their fancy and they happen to see it at that time. There is no rhyme or reason for what they do. I suggest that you go around your home and thoroughly look...there may even be more items that he's taken that you aren't aware of. In fact, take photos of each room so that you can keep track of the items in your home until the locks are changed.

As for the stuff in the driveway, he didn't care if they were stolen or not. Like a teenager, they can be very forgetful and that may have been his way of telling you how he felt about having to remove items or it could have just been that he didn't think about putting stuff back. I would suggest that you place the stuff that you want him to take in one place, advise him to come get it by a certain time and if he doesn't, you will donate it, have a yard sale or you could even get a storage locker (put the lease in his name and pay the first month). They do tend to leave a lot of stuff behind and it could be his way of having an excuse to come there periodically or he just doesn't need that stuff from his old life. Whatever the reason...after you have notified him and given him a reasonable timeframe to get it, it will then be up to you as to what you want to do with it. However, be sure you document all of your communications w/him.

Continue to keep the focus on you and your family. Your h's trip to Oz has begun and it's going to take quite a bit of time for him to finish his walk on the Yellow Brick Road.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Good Morning Scout

I did smile at the salt and pepper shakers. It’s weird what strikes their fancy at the moment.

You can see the teenager in H’s behaviour. Just leaving stuff out without a care of concern about it being stolen.

I like your acknowledgement of the advice not feeling like the right thing to do. Yep, counterintuitive at first. Your other stated reason is also valid and good, it takes time to get one’s feelings under control. Finding detachment and indifference is a process, and you are well on the way.

I’m glad H replied well to the Christmas schedule. Keeping our expectations at zero has the analogous of expect anything. Same kind of thing, just a different view point.

Nice to see you calmer and with less anxiety. That also takes time to find, that balance within the storm. Some more advice, realize this moment, your calmness and anxiety level. You can achieve it, you are doing it right now. Your mind now knows you can find it, your feelings will take some cycles to realize it as well, and then you will start to believe it and live it. As odd as that may or may not sound.

Enjoy your much deserved peace and calm.

DnJ


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
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scout12 Offline OP
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I appreciate the sage advice from you all. I have to admit I never even considered getting a wellness check but sadly it seems I must assume the worst.

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Continue to keep the focus on you and your family. Your h's trip to Oz has begun and it's going to take quite a bit of time for him to finish his walk on the Yellow Brick Road.


Focusing on myself and S1 is the only thing getting me through this - thanks for the reminder to be patient, job. It feels good to be in control of the legalities and to be able to detach that process from the relationship outcome.

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Some more advice, realize this moment, your calmness and anxiety level. You can achieve it, you are doing it right now. Your mind now knows you can find it, your feelings will take some cycles to realize it as well, and then you will start to believe it and live it. As odd as that may or may not sound.


Not odd at all. This is mindfulness at its simplest, which is funny because it can be so difficult to implement. It requires a degree of SELF-detachment that itself requires a high level of emotional intelligence. I've been practicing yoga for years but never put much effort into the mental side of it until now.

Also DnJ - I found your thread and read your account of BD. I'm so so sorry that happened to you and your family. I think I was in shock reading it.

Last night I spent some time scrolling through photos from the last year, not specifically looking for red flags, but noticing little things as they popped up. It was rare for us to take photos together; aside from our wedding, we probably only have 10 photos of us as a couple in nearly 10 years. Once S1 was born I made a big effort to document our life, so I often snapped mundane little moments that had the potential to become lovely memories. H rarely offered me the same favour. Whenever we showed up in a picture this past year, the common theme in our appearances seemed to show:

Me: timid, unsure, pitiful, sad eyes, dull, unkempt
Interpretation: struggling to cope, not taking care of myself, feeling alone, reacting to love withdrawal and deprioritisation

H: fake smile, bored, obsessed with screens (phone/TV/computer in nearly EVERY picture, even with S1)
Interpretation: maintaining or not maintaining the facade, depending on his mood, trying to escape his unhappiness

With the benefit of time and space, I begin to question if there is anything of value in this marriage worth saving. And yet I'm still committed to my marriage and the vows I gave.


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Just reflecting further on those thoughts. Did I drive him away with those behaviours? Even though they were likely part of our dynamic and not my personality?


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Scout - you did not cause this and you could not stop it. Sadly, anyone who “snaps” in this fashion is broken and has poor coping skills. It’s a train no one can stop.

Curious - in those photos, do you see h has “shark eyes,” - cold, dead eyes?

My ex h had a tough time turning 30. He had an MLC in his early 40’s. Looking back at old photos, he had shark eyes upon turning 30. I downplayed it as silly because aging was never an issue for me so I never imagined it could be for him. I mean we can’t stop time from marching on so why worry about it; that was my philosophy, anyway. Aging was a HUGE issue for him; every single year was a slog for him.


Me 41, H 47, M 15 yrs, S11, S13
BD 1: 11/4/14 we work on it; really I pretzel myself
BD 2: 3/31/15 H goes down to "dorm room"
8/15: H back to MBR
10/15: H back in dorm room
1/18: H files, now divorced
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HaWho is right

Nothing you did caused this and you cant control it nor stop it

There are things all of us can reflect on in our M that we did wrong..that is life and we are not perfect

Its good to know what you would change and start practicing the new patterns as much as you can

If you want to stand for your M, practice new skills with him

Gal, confidence, kindness, friendship...overlooking all his behavior

Setting boundries when needed...kindly, firmly
especially around OW and child-
this will also make the separation process easier


As I reflect..I can see also my xh being discontent in his mid thirties and after our 2nd child was born and he became successfull...he snapped

I dont think his script from childhood could allow him to succeed, so instead he followed the call to fail and let everything he had go..and it was a lot-i
including his kids, business and sobriety


married 14 years
H 42
bomb 2/07 IDLYA
D final 3 /09
M ow D ow
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It was rare for us to take photos together; aside from our wedding, we probably only have 10 photos of us as a couple in nearly 10 years.


This is a red flag right here. Why wasn't he snapping selfies with his lovely bride? Why weren't others taking photos of you two together and sending them to you? Especially early in a marriage, those things are normal. (Even in the pre-cell phone days, I have lots of photos of me and my ex husband together from the early years of our marriage. Even from the end, actually, but he had shark eyes in those.)

I'm getting the feeling that whatever is wrong with your husband now, he was never the husband you deserved even early in the relationship. The best thing about a good relationship is being truly seen by your partner and valued for who you really are. A relationship without that becomes very painful and drains the life out of you.

You are questioning whether your behavior was the cause - it wasn't. A man who truly loves his wife would be loving and attentive through a postpartum depression or whatever, and would at least try counseling if he was unhappy in the marriage. You can't fix his mental illness or personality disorder or just lack of values, whatever it is.

I'm curious - did he ever show signs of dishonesty in small things before? My ex was not a dishonest person per se, but was more willing to bend the rules than a straight arrow like I was. Little things like lying to return something, or a bigger thing like giving paid lectures that were actually prohibited by his employer. I suspect that if I had not been the one doing the taxes, he might have cheated a little on those too. I realize that lots of people think those kinds of things are normal, but not me. And I think it's a slippery slope of justification that makes things like affairs easier to lie about too. I should have paid more attention to this trait in him when we were dating.

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Hello Scout

As others have said. No, you did not drive him away.

He is in crisis, and that is a slow moving train wreck - and you aren’t driving it.

Originally Posted by scout12
I begin to question if there is anything of value in this marriage worth saving.

This is normal.

It is good to see accurately.

It’s good to challenge.

Be accurate; just ensure you don’t rewrite your history.

DnJ


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
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Originally Posted by scout12
Also DnJ - I found your thread and read your account of BD. I'm so so sorry that happened to you and your family. I think I was in shock reading it.

Thanks for reading along.

Yeah, that night was quite a shock.

I spun in pretty hard. smile

I’m serious when I talk about what an incredible opportunity this is for the LBS. True, I wish it didn’t happen, and Im pretty sure I wouldn’t change it even if I could. I like love my life.

DnJ


Feelings are fleeting.
Be better, not bitter.
Love the person, forgive the sin.
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I'm getting the feeling that whatever is wrong with your husband now, he was never the husband you deserved even early in the relationship. The best thing about a good relationship is being truly seen by your partner and valued for who you really are. A relationship without that becomes very painful and drains the life out of you.


I am starting to believe this.

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You are questioning whether your behavior was the cause - it wasn't. A man who truly loves his wife would be loving and attentive through a postpartum depression or whatever, and would at least try counseling if he was unhappy in the marriage. You can't fix his mental illness or personality disorder or just lack of values, whatever it is.


We attended MC about six months before he left - at my insistence. I was feeling desperate, ignored, and unsupported enough that I told him if things didn't change, I would leave. We went three or four times and the psychologist told us that most couples attend counselling when it's too late, but that we just seemed to need some small corrections. Funny in hindsight. That psychologist is now my IC and he is of the opinion that H is on the NPD spectrum. He gave some insights about our MC sessions that he didn't share at the time - he felt H was blase, didn't take it seriously, and was more concerned about how he appeared than actually achieving any outcomes.

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I'm curious - did he ever show signs of dishonesty in small things before?


100% yes. Both avoidance and active deception, mainly towards his parents, but also me. It took three years for him to tell his parents he had a girlfriend and that we were planning to move in together. He failed out of uni due to non-attendance (video game addiction) and told his parents for a year afterwards that he was getting good grades and on track to graduate. He took out a $10k loan on a casual wage to buy a sports car at age 20 and didn't tell his parents or let them see the car for a long time. He took out a $6k loan to buy a motorbike when we moved in together without telling me - just turned up with it one day when we were trying to save for a house deposit. Even for happy events - when we got engaged, when we got pregnant - he clammed up in front of his parents and hid the news until they asked him directly, or I told them! I understand hiding bad news, but why good news?

His behaviour stinks of rebellion and entitlement, doesn't it? It wasn't this clear to me at the time. What the heck is he fighting so hard against? From what I understand of his upbringing, he wasn't denied much and was always a high achiever. As a teen he would brag about having all the newest and best things because his dad was well-off. In the last year of our marriage he became obsessed with wealth and growing it fast enough to retire early. His retirement dream? Buying a $150k supercar at age 40 and driving around Europe. Not sure how his wife and would-be teenage son figured into that plan... And yet, he took out a $50k loan this time last year to buy a brand new truck, ostensibly for me, that I didn't want and wasn't comfortable spending money on, against my wishes. Which he took in the settlement and now belongs to him, debt and all.

It doesn't make a lot of sense, until I reread this quote from peacetoday:

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I dont think his script from childhood could allow him to succeed, so instead he followed the call to fail and let everything he had go


Is he programmed to self-sabotage? There are so many questions I won't ever know the answers to.


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