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SteveLW #2867676 10/08/19 05:59 PM
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Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Counseling, and a comfirmed active affair? Tell you what? Ask to see her phone. Reject any shaming language that you "are controlling" If all checks out. You have no literal or behavioral evidence. Have her make the appointment. If she won't or doesn't or hesistates? Proceed back to NC. I've experienced such twisting of perception of myself wanting to counseling, to being outright rejected 5 times to be allowed to go, only to have them blame it on me that "I didn't want to go if we weren't working on the M" Its complete insanity of what they make up in their minds from month to month with their perception, that I had to take notes of all conversations. Then? I just stopped. I stopped all interacting except by email. Let her actions speak louder than words. But like everyone here says. Don't get roped into being plan b or plan c. Don't use M counseling as a validation check list for her to just air all of her grievances to get a counselor to agree and validate with her too and cement her justifications. But do listen to them. You have your perception, your truth, and your story too. Don't ever let someone justify that it is your behavior that led them to cheating. That is something that narcs do.


She made the appointment for the counseling. I told her I was open to going if the A was over. She said it is. I don’t believe her. To much of the A flags still going on. I haven’t asked to see her phone at this point. I probably should.

Originally Posted by Steve85
Originally Posted by MJ1980
Am I even being realistic that this could break the fantasy bubble?

Is the only thing that breaks the fantasy bubble time and reality setting in?


No.

Yes.

Your first question tells me you are still in denial. Prepare for the worst, hope for the best. The former means action (hiring a lawyer, GAL, moving on, etc), the latter means no action. Hope is something you do internally, not externally.

If you are going into MC hoping for a miracle, you are attaching expectations. That will get your grapes crushed. Hard. Then all you'll have left is grape juice.


I have good days and bad days with denial. I had been doing good with it until she told me she wanted ya to go to counseling. That sent me into a bit of a tailspin since she was completely against anything to do with our M. Then out of the blue she hit me with counseling. I feel like I have a lot of 2 steps forward 1 step back. Trying to follow the advice and the book. I’m partway through DB and I have DR waiting in the wings.


M:39
W:36
D: 4
D: 2
BD:8/22/2019
Currently dealing with a WW
MJ1980 #2867677 10/08/19 06:06 PM
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Most WWs do this so they can say they tried. My fear for you MJ is her and OM are laying low until the D. Her going over to his house the other day is a huge red flag.

Keep DBing.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
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Originally Posted by Many worries
It sounds like your GAL isn't GAL at all but more to get her to Notice your GAL.

That's not GAL, you keeping talking bout her reactions to GAL. My understanding was that is not the point of having an activity. It's more to get out there and see what else life has to offer.

Putting on cologne....come on man. It's pretty transparent you were trying to get a reaction.

Michele writes in DR that putting on cologne, taking cares of your body and appearances are all good things. I don't see why it's wrong.

GAL is twofold IMO. It's for you and for your WAS to see that you are going to be fine. This is divorce busting after all.


H 34
W 29
BD 3/12/18
Divorce Busted Spring 19

It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
MJ1980 #2867680 10/08/19 06:22 PM
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And don't go to counseling without proof of A ending in my opinion. I've been there done that. It's a waste of time and money. Your W isn't an idiot. She knows she can't work on the marriage while having an affair. You'll come off as smart, practical, and emotionally strong.

You can do this.


H 34
W 29
BD 3/12/18
Divorce Busted Spring 19

It is not things that bother us, but the stories we tell ourselves about things.
MJ1980 #2867681 10/08/19 06:45 PM
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I was thinking about going to the first appointment and bringing it up then and there about the A and say I need concrete proof that the A is over. As in show me you phone and send a no contact text for me to be willing to continue. I figure with a third party there it should help me stay on track.

Even with paperwork being filed a D will not be a quick and easy thing in the state I live. Even if things went without hiccups it would be at least a year possibly longer. We have disagreements on child care for starters. I want 50/50 and will not budge on that. She was seeking primary so she could have additional support so she could continue to be primarily a stay at home mom. She hasn’t had a true 8-5 job in 10 years. I’ve always supported her to follow her dreams from a employment stand point.

I have been GAL this week. I have to be careful how much I’m not around though as I know she plans to use my work schedule against for the kids. Even though it’s flexible with a lot of days off. The hours are not typical. It’s basically 6am to 2:30-3pm or 12pm to 9pm. So I will have to keep it to 1-2 times a week. My lawyer has me logging every time she goes out and isn’t around from the kids. I would assume her lawyer told her to do the same.


M:39
W:36
D: 4
D: 2
BD:8/22/2019
Currently dealing with a WW
MJ1980 #2867692 10/08/19 08:37 PM
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MJ,

It’s so amazing how these sitches are all the same and us vets can predict exactly what the WW is going to do and exactly what the LBS is going to do. Heck we can even predict what the what the MC is going to do.

You don’t have to go to MC to accomplish what you are trying to do. If she has any interest in trying to save the marriage she we be happy to prove to you the A is over.

Since she’s not she will accuse you of being controlling and since you’re desperate to try to stop the pain you will go. Your MC will be neutral and after about three sessions your W will say she doesn’t want to try anymore. She will then tell friends and relatives and your children some day that you tried everything and couldn’t make it work.

Then about a year or two from now you will be on here advising newbies that they shouldn’t go to court while W is in an affair because it’s a waste of time and money and checks the box that we tried everything.

You can set your watch to it.

MJ1980 #2867697 10/08/19 09:23 PM
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Originally Posted by "LH19"
If she has any interest in trying to save the marriage she we be happy to prove to you the A is over.

it’s a waste of time and money and checks the box that we tried everything.

MJ you set a boundary, she crossed it, now she gets her way?

Last edited by CWarrior; 10/08/19 09:24 PM.
MJ1980 #2867728 10/09/19 12:03 AM
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Is your state a no fault divorce state where affairs have no consequences on the divorce decree or dissolution? A lot of them say they want to move out for their space away from you. True? Untrue? Your playing Russian Roulette with 3 out of 6 loaded. The vets here says its to have their freedom and sleep with other people. Guess who I believe from experience? I hear you about the 6am to 230 schedule. I'm the same schedule. Currently its keeping me and STBXW at odds on 50/50 custody. Good idea to log her hours. I still don't have a L but a mediator. But I have been logging hours intuitively. What is the purpose for this? Case against her for custody?

IHCLACS #2867745 10/09/19 12:22 PM
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Originally Posted by CWarrior
Originally Posted by "LH19"
If she has any interest in trying to save the marriage she we be happy to prove to you the A is over.

it’s a waste of time and money and checks the box that we tried everything.

MJ you set a boundary, she crossed it, now she gets her way?


Your totally correct. That doesn’t mean it’s easy.


Originally Posted by IHCLACS
Is your state a no fault divorce state where affairs have no consequences on the divorce decree or dissolution? A lot of them say they want to move out for their space away from you. True? Untrue? Your playing Russian Roulette with 3 out of 6 loaded. The vets here says its to have their freedom and sleep with other people. Guess who I believe from experience? I hear you about the 6am to 230 schedule. I'm the same schedule. Currently its keeping me and STBXW at odds on 50/50 custody. Good idea to log her hours. I still don't have a L but a mediator. But I have been logging hours intuitively. What is the purpose for this? Case against her for custody?


We are irreconcilable differences. I have to check on no fault. The logging of the hours is because she is trying to get primary custody and will be using my work schedule against me I’m sure.

She filed first and we are replying this week. I believe affairs can determine marital support and also be used for character when it comes to child custody. I’ll have to check with my lawyer on that directly when we talk about the response.

She is going to be in for a wake up call when she sees our response.


M:39
W:36
D: 4
D: 2
BD:8/22/2019
Currently dealing with a WW
MJ1980 #2867747 10/09/19 12:50 PM
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Originally Posted by MJ1980
[quote=CWarrior][quote="LH19"]
She is going to be in for a wake up call when she sees our response.


This is why it is so important to not have expectations. In my sitch, whenever I thought I was dropping a bomb on her that would wake her up and get her to see what she was losing, she shrug it off like an elephant shrugs off an ant. I remember sitting her down and telling her that I was not interested in being in a marriage with someone that would be chatting with people online, and that my boundary was for her to agree to full transparency. Her response was "Okay, well I will get my resume done."

The exact opposite of the reaction I expected. The very next day, after she had spent the evening previous, and the next morning and afternoon working on her resume, of which I was completely supportive, she started having second thoughts. I happily answered her resume questions, gave suggestions and feedback, offered to buy any resume writing and interviewing books she would need. She came out of the office that evening, very emotionally, and started saying "what if I am not doing the right thing?" I said: You have to do what you need to in order to be happy. "Yeah but God hates divorce." I said: That's true, but he also hates sin, so if the best way for you to avoid sin moving forward is to get a D, then so be it.

I thought I dropped a dose of reality on her on Friday night. Nothing.

The dose of reality came when suddenly I was supporting her decision (to get a job, to get and apartment, to get a D).

MJ, I am not sure if I had this conversation with you or not, but when we as LBSs do what they WAS expects us to do, nothing usually changes. By time the WAS cheats, says they want D, BD's you, etc, they've already decided that their actions are going to hurt you. To upset you. To make you anxious. They expect us to be angry, sad, and to hold on for dear life.

When we do the exact opposite of that, when we are happy, content, and willing to let go, it makes them go "Hmmmm, what is going on here?!" It can be the seed that gets planted to make them question whether or not they really know what they are doing. But here is the kicker: it can't be fake. They will see through that and it won't work. Trying to manipulate your WAS into staying won't work. You have to genuinely find a place where you are happy, content and willing to let go. WASs can sniff out manipulation attempts like a bloodhound.

So guess what, she expects your response. She expects you to fight. She expects you to not go quietly into the night. Here is your goal: Find a way to be accommodating to a fault, but still protect yourself. Money is money. Don't get caught up in the drama of trying to fight with her over money. Go for what is most important, 50/50 with your kids. Most of the time WAWs use custody of the kids to try to squeeze every drop of support out of the LBH. So don't make it about that. Go for 50/50 custody AND accommodate her with support. Try to avoid the temptations of fighting over material things, because they are not worth it.


M(53), W(54),D(19)
M-23, T-25 Bomb Drop - Dec.23, 2017
Ring and Piecing since March 2018
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