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Hello jujuB and peacetoday,

I can't thank you enough for your responses! I did google Gaslighting and Oh my...that's exactly what he's doing! I'm not sure how to protect myself from it though. I will have a talk with my D later tonight. I like the advice to just sit at the edge of her bed and listen. I'll do that.

He also said that his family is happy for him in his new life and love. Sickening, as we're not even divorced yet, and why would they want their granddaughter to suffer through this nonsense? He's just so happy now! So, they'll believe that I was the culprit, all along, even though I have told them that he's an alcoholic in MLC.

He said that he just doesn't want to "lie" about his life anymore. Well, that's what he does...he lies. He said that he found OW online after he moved out 2 mos. ago. That they've been dating 2 mos. So, he immediately found someone online the day he moved out? Also, what online woman falls in love and introduces her child to a stranger in less than 2 mos. time? Conveniently, she lives in the same city that he moved far away to. I do believe there's more to this story, but he won't admit it.


I wish I could go back to the US, but my D is not having it. She won't leave her father, and I really don't want her to be without a father, but it's difficult in that he does some good things for her but then does these negative things as well. He wants to treat her more like a friend than a father, so he tells her "confidential" things that I'll never know. He'd also battle me in court to keep her here, and I don't want to put her through that. I keep wondering if eventually he'll just stop showing up again, and then she'll get the picture. We shall see.

I was hoping he'd hit rock bottom soon, but he just keeps on going. He's gotten the finances of his business as messed up as he's gotten ours. I wish I could tell his boss the truth about him, but that would be self sabotage. I need his income to survive. Rent in London is expensive!

I couldn't find the posts from 2015 as julieh, but God bless you for what you've been through. I have questioned my actions over and over again, trying to see what I could have done differently, and I think the thing I did do was hang in there until my D was almost 15, as that's the age when divorce isn't as traumatising or so my therapist said. That's really the best I could do.

I also loved unconditionally, although he would disagree. In the end he kept saying he just wanted unconditional love. Does that mean that you can not come home for dinner, come home super late, not call, not communicate with me on a real level, not support me, and not truly love and respect me, and that's OK? Well, I still did love him through all that, but he doesn't see it that way because I wasn't happy about him crossing boundaries. So, I spoke out.

I love to hear that your D is successful and happy peacetoday. It's inspiring.

Much love to you both and thank you again for your kind and very helpful responses!


M: 48
H: 49
D: 14
MLC Bomb: 05/17
Sep:12/17
M: 16 years in 02/18
OW: 02/18
D: Pending
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Its hard to make sense of th MLCer actions

I'm not sure when /how my xh met OW

She was his secretary but I think he hired her after the A had started..they live secret lives,,He M her- now they are D

Have you seen a L yet..you many want to protect your assets and know your rights
Usually the MLCer will visit a lot in the beginning but visit less as time goes on
The MLCer becomes a Disney dad..they are usually terrible parents
extremely self centered

keep taking care of yourself
alanon will open new doors and new life for you


married 14 years
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bomb 2/07 IDLYA
D final 3 /09
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I’m pretty sure my WH met the OW at some work function/event. He is always staying out late and drinking with people at these things. Double life really. It was as if he’s two people. The one trying to be a good husband and father whilst at home and the one who once out the door becomes a single, party crazy, man. He did drink at home, a lot, don’t get me wrong. But on the couch in front of the TV and then fall asleep is very different than the late night binges that he does away from home.

The weird thing is that I’ve always viewed him as an introvert, but he claims he’s an extrovert. I know it’s the drink that fuels that for him.

I’ve been studying the Kubler-Ross cycle of depression and grief. It does feel like my husband has died and I have to see his ghost visiting my daughter every weekend. I revert to previous parts of the grief each time I see him and then have to start over again after he leaves. I breathe a big sigh of releaf when he’s gone yet at the same time am sad that he goes. I’m now on anti depressants so that’s helping.

I’m also going to two Alanon meetings this weekend so that should help. I need to regain my sanity.

Can’t thank you guys enough for hanging in there with me!


M: 48
H: 49
D: 14
MLC Bomb: 05/17
Sep:12/17
M: 16 years in 02/18
OW: 02/18
D: Pending
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I reread your initial post and just so many similarities between the exes. The only real differences between our situations are that my son is only 7 and I had absolutely no idea about the alcoholism or addiction.

My ex is high functioning. He is an engineer, went to top schools, literally perfect grades. Goes to work and was supposedly this superstar. He would act like he was the go to person and how he was greatly needed by all for his superior skills. I believe he stayed at the job because they had flex hours and they turned a blind eye to his coming in after 12. He would then work all hours of the night. When i went through his bank statements it showed that he would leave work at 3 in the afternoon and end up in bad neighborhoods withdrawing high amounts of cash. (I heard through the grape vine from a coworker that was a friend of his, that none of the higher ups caught on. They thought he was great)

I had no idea and believed that corporate america was taking advantage of his work ethic and "engineer mind". I was resentful that he would sleep all morning and then work all night because it meant he had no time for me or to help with house work and son.

He would never wake up in the mornings. With tons of alarms blaring. He even missed picking up our son a few times from preschool at 12 while I was at work. Then on weekends I would wait around for him to wake up and once he did, he would disappear on a mysterious errands. He never came home for dinners (supposedly because of traffic patterns and going to the gym). He never had money. He never had compassion for the things I was going through miscarriages, cancer, any illness because it meant I would need his help with son. He initially had problems with sexual completion (i later found out this is a common problem among opiate addicts) and then later with ED. He would complain about how we never had sex, but whenever we tried he couldnt perform. He was always running out to buy immodium. I thought that this was due to IBS. Later found out immodium has Loperamide which helps with opiate withdrawals.

When he was preparing to leave ,he talked about how bad i was and his marriage was to his mother and coworkers and friends. But of course it was bad. I was reacting to absolutely crazy behaviors. He made it out like I was needy and controlling and constantly criticizing him. How I did nothing for him. How I didnt even do his laundry (he never wanted me to because he liked it done a certain way) Everyone believed it, even me.

He said something very similar to me that your ex said to you. How our marriage could not work because we wanted different things that we couldnt give each other. Something about How I wanted affection and intimacy and he wanted someone that would either work full time or be a super house wife. That I was not ambitious enough for him(i am a part time physiotherapist and son is special needs)

It was at the point where I found about 18 hidden bottles of empty Jack Daniels in his desk. When I showed the marriage counselor she said "he was drinking to mask the pain from our marriage" That she did not think he had a real problem, When I showed his mom she said "he liked to collect bottles". (at that point I did not have the years of his credit card or bank statements)Even when I went to his mom with proof that his spending problems indicated a pain pill issue, she did not want to hear it. He lives with her now and she believes that he cannot afford anything because of child support.

He is well dressed, comes across to others as humble and quiet and polite. As a bit nerdy and all american. As a kind father that comes every other weekend and pays his child support on time. And on top of things (he is when it comes to money) but he has depleted his IRA, had tons of unexplained credit card debt)I have to keep on top of him for paying his share of extracurricular and medical expenses.

Im sorry this is so lengthy and I do not want to hijack. But I do want to point out all the signs I experienced of living with a high functioning addict. Because when I read some of yours, It just hit home and made me feel less crazy.

When they are high functioning, its so easy to be gaslighted. It is so so damaging. I think worse. Because we lose our sense of reality. They are not the typical addicts you see on TV. My ex can be quite charming.

Vanilla has some great posts on my thread that were helpful.


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I also want to say that there is a light at the end of this tunnel. Healing takes time. I am still triggered. (He left in the summer of 2015 and I only found out about the addiction within the past year)

I do not miss him nor do I miss our relationship. I just feel traumatized by it. By the double life. I am coming to terms with the fact that I was probably more of a cover for him then anything else. We were together for over 15 years. But he always seemed a bit empty to me. no real imagination or engagement or passion. I thought for a long time he was on the spectrum.

Since he has been gone, I barely get sick. I get more time for myself and now he is forced to contribute financially.

I am dating a man that is extremely generous. Wants to spend time with me. And has similar experiences with his ex.

Things are slowly getting better. I have ups and downs.


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How you doing WWHWU


married 14 years
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Wow! I am blown away by the kind responses and follow up by you lovely members. I haven't been here in a while because there's just so much going on.

I have mediation on Tuesday w/my soon to be X, moving closer to the D and I've been procrastinating getting all of the paper work together for that. I do feel overwhelmed, and I've put everything else first. However, I'm also trying to build a life for myself: Job hunting/interviews - I'm in software so each time I have to learn a new technology. Still working my current job.

Being a single mum now, and caring for my teen D, who's emotions go up and down every day, but she stays fairly quiet because she doesn't want to rock the boat. Sometimes, I'd rather her just yell at me. I just try to hold her, when she'll let me, whilst we watch TV in the evening. That's the best we can do together right now. I am learning to keep a zip lip and just listen when she finally does talk. It's usually about friends or school work though, and not her dad and I.I can only hope the counselling at the school is working for her. She refuses to go to Al Anon groups with me. (There's one on Sat. AM which includes children.)

All I can do is work my steps to recovery right now. I haven't really been that selfish before, but this is a time to be I think.

I have men that come around who want to date me. Some are good, some are bad, and some are in-between. I think it's too soon, but I do crave a close relationship with a man as well. I have one special friend who is an in-between, but I can see that he's got issues too. Doesn't everyone, though. I don't want to settle, though, and I don't want to make mistakes that would hurt me or my daughter, and our future. I've asked God to take the compulsion for closeness with a man away, but it's still a struggle.

Men are so very different in this department. They are able to be working on a relationship w/someone else in the background, whilst also exiting the one they're currently in. Hopping from one to the next seemingly without too much of a care.

I wan to see the light at the end of the tunnel for sure!


M: 48
H: 49
D: 14
MLC Bomb: 05/17
Sep:12/17
M: 16 years in 02/18
OW: 02/18
D: Pending
Joined: Jan 2018
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Now, about the soon to be X. Everything that you talked about JujuB resonated so much. I do believe your sitch was worse in that, unless I'm mistaken, I don't think my WAH had a drugs problem. He said that was all worked through in his youth...I still wonder though...and I'm also thinking if he didn't then, well he probably does now.

I did have a very nice talk with my DB coach this last week. Interestingly, we've come to the conclusion together that the initial option that I was going to try is not going to work for me. I was thinking of making him file for the D with no grounds = 2 years separation before D can be final. That would give us 2 years to possibly come back together (miracle of miracles) before the D actually went through.

However, when I shared with her about some of the recent discussions that I've had w/WAH, she's convinced that he's on a very long time trajectory of pain for himself and anyone who's with him. She agrees that he probably has several other addictions as well. I think sex is one, and porn. He's got the two extra phones and Viagra to prove it. Also, because in his mind he thinks he's moved on and can have a girlfriend, and he lies to me and my daughter and sais it's all very new. It's obvious that it's been going on a while. I told him I feel sorry for her, and he said that that's an evil thing to say. As if it's this beautiful spiritual relationship that they have. He's charmed her for now, just like he'd charmed me for so long. Still, he sais that it's my fault he moved on as I was too controlling. Gaslighting. When people try to convince you it's you, it's not true. These 3 A's are deal busters: Addiction, Affairs, Abuse. He's done all 3, and all repeatedly.

My DB coach told me that my daughter wants to believe him because it hurts not to. She doesn't want to believe that her father is this monster he's become. She keeps a photo of the two of them as a screen saver on her phone now. It's one I took when we were in FL and he was in recovery. I was walking behind them so it's just their backs and her beautiful shiny ginger hair flowing from her tiny precious head, proudly holding the hand of this her big strong Poppy. She was age 3 I think. They're walking on the sidewalk, on a bright sunny day and the lush tropical foliage all around. He had gotten sober for her back then.

When he was in recovery for the 4 years whilst we were in the US, (10+ years ago.) I had so much admiration for him. I watched as he spoke behind a podium about how wonderful his life is now and how he's so grateful for the program. He praised me and our D for helping him stay sober. We would often go to open meetings together, and our little D would play under the table. It was sometimes a challenge to keep her quite, but we were a family working things through together. He got his masters, and I supported him through that. He started a business. I was so proud. We had a beautiful home and money in the bank.

Something deep inside of him couldn't be satisfied with all that though. His demons wanted to get back to the life of drink and fiefdom that he had enjoyed in the UK before - making his staff his best friends and drinking buddies. Back then, he told me the reason for the move to the UK, besides the job opp, was to also help struggling/boring AA groups in the UK improve. Yes, I kid you not, that was one of a 3 part mission that he said he received signs from God for! He was drinking again w/in 6 mos. after we moved here. The other vision was to help struggling churches in renewal mode. We joined one, and his contribution was to play in the band. He's now turned church into his gig. He's now told everyone that the only real reason he got involved with church is because I forced him to in order for us to be together.

Addicts are in relationship w/their addiction, and that rules and controls their world. It's a slow suicide. Nothing in their world is about love because they don't give it to themselves. He's now in complete denial. I asked him if his girlfriend knows that he's an alcoholic, and he said "this isn't helping." Said he doesn't binge anymore because he's not having to deal with me. Translation = Doesn't need to binge because he can freely drink all day without repercussions from me.

In the mediation on Tuesday, I'm going to be open and honest. He doesn't want me to file on grounds of alcoholism, said he'd rather I just say it's due to poor finance management (he has indeed squandered all of our savings and my pension on the business he started in the US, that of course failed. He blames me for its failure.) However, my DB coach said that if I'm not honest he won't learn that his actions have consequences, and that's not helping him. This is not about revenge. Some things in life we will never regret: Being Kind and Truthful are two big ones. Bailing him out is not a kind thing to do.

In the end, I will be able to say that I left no stone unturned, I did my best and I spoke the truth.

Much love and gratitude to you all for listening!


M: 48
H: 49
D: 14
MLC Bomb: 05/17
Sep:12/17
M: 16 years in 02/18
OW: 02/18
D: Pending
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hi

best to avoid any new romantic relationships I think as you said
for a few reasons
1.we may and usually do pick another that may have same/worse issues than H
2.harmful for children
3.jumping in too soon may also prevent our inner healing and grieving from R breakup with H
Relationships may ne difficult to get put of-

I'm sure there are more
But you may want to concentrate on making friends with women right now and healing-(just my 2 cents)


married 14 years
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Hi there, I would echo what wise Peace has already said - far better to wait when it comes to dating. Looking back I can see that guys I may have been interested in the early days after BD would have been a disaster. As time has gone on, and I have moved forward myself, I attract guys who are in a better place themselves.

I've been on the forum for a while, and I have never once seen anyone post - hey, I waited a little too long before dating. There is no 'too long' but there certainly is 'too short.' I think it is healthy to wait at least until divorce - and until the dust has settled after divorce too - I waited until a year after divorce before opening that door. Others date sooner and don't seem to have regrets..

As for the advice from your DB coach - I would follow it as those guys know what they are talking about. And you can do so kindly as you say.

Good luck with everything - it sounds like you are doing pretty well, given all circumstances smile


T 13 M 7
Me 48 H 46
SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
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