Previous Thread
Next Thread
Print Thread
Page 4 of 5 1 2 3 4 5
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
H
Hermes Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
H
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
Originally Posted By: Ginger1
There is something you really really really need to do.

Every hear of STFU? Yes, that's exactly what it means. I don't mean this in a mean way either. You need to stop talking. Just stop. Answer questions regarding the kids. You need to not talk to her at all otherwise. No more apologies, explanations, relationship talks, trying to solve her problems.... (you really took the time out to make step by step instructions on how to do something she couldn't figure out???)


Yeah I did. Thought it was the right thing to do. I let her down and failed to be there when she needed me soo many times in our M. Since I’ve finally seen the light and understand not only how wrong Thi was but the emotional damage I inflicted. I no longer feel right about acting this way even more in the face of what she’s done and continues to do.
Originally Posted By: Ginger1


STOP EVERYTHING! It's been suggested by many before to make a 50/50 schedule, just as if you were separated. Then there are no questions about GAL time, too much, too little or whatever. Split your GAL time evenly. Done. Because that's the way you are going to be living.

In house separation is so hard, especially with someone who exhiits zero respect for you. SO you need to just be very quiet, do your thing, and she does her. The only communication you need to work on is her GAL time, when is yours and regarding the kdis. Nothing else.

You can do this if you desire a better life for yourself.


So we had discussiOn divorce messaging. It got a little on the emotional side

She feels incredibly hurt about the thousands of times I left her (wasn’t there for her said bad things) and how I discount all of these because of the Affair (her words)

She’s angry I want to wait until mid January to not associate Xmas with D)
She’s mad that she gave me her version of this and I “waited intentionally” until now to give my version to her a week out from when she wanted to tell.

She is almost hysterical in her need to get away from me.

I suggested we each have 50/50 split on days because we will when we move out. She said of course I’d still help with pickups and drop offs (shuttling kids around) I said while we still live together sure. Once we each move on we each have our own weeks and I don’t think it’s fair to expect me to do this on my weeks off. She started crying got hysterical etc. said she can’t believe how mean I’m being and hurtful.

I just walked away with her crying but not sure if this was the right thing to do.

Did I f up in stating this??? I thought this is what 50/50 split was about we each have our own weeks... it’s not me having to continue to run kids everywhere on her weeks even though it will probably remain more convenient for me to do so...

She said she didn’t want to be anywhere near me anymore.

She Demands we start mediation ASAP in Jan feels like she’s given into my timeline repeatedly and I’ve given nothing....

Finally told her let’s just tell parents and kids day after Xmas like she wants... told her I’m done.


Me 47
STBXW 44
M ~20
D13
S15
BD mid 17
A Disc. 2 months after BD but evidence found ~2yr
OM decade older
S Imminent
D Soon after

Be the rock that can weather the storm...
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
H,

Why would to forego the truth? Why would you degrade your morals?

DonH and ginger has given you great advice. You aren't adhering to the advice being given here because you keep talking to your W about the R.

You are putting your W before all at the moment. Why would she put you before herself when you haven't put yourself first yet. You need healing. How is your W going to resoect, if you are not respecting yourself. I just want you to think about these things. And like Ginger said STFU. Pls.

I have been where you at. We all have. And we know first hand what won't work, please don't make the same mistakes as we did.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
H
Hermes Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
H
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
Trying hard to STFU.
I'm just trying to be even keeled. Smile and be moderately happy around her, and not talk R,A,M any more (although we have to when we discuss D a bit with counselors and mediator etc). Went to a session with a divorce "counselor" advocate for children with her (my suggestion) to talk about how to message this for them and when to do it. (she wanted to do it 2 days post Xmas... (Now she claims she never said that, and she's ok doing it Jan 6 or 13... So I suggested 13... and she said, no she wants the 6th so I said why did she offer the 13 then...
sigh

Tonight she told me she wanted to update me on her Brother... And then while we ate she gave a brief (things aren't good)...
A while back she said it was ok to talk to him... so I reached out to see how he was doing... I also checked in with him last week... and he's called me a couple of times... I didn't say anything to her about this as we weren't talking (she didn't share anything about her brother in the interim)...

I mentioned to her later tonight that I had spoken to him several times (and that it was after she said it was ok...)
She went ape... that a) I spoke to him and didn't reveal this to her at the time, b) I didn't mention it to her when she texted me about wanting to talk to him, nor when she mentioned super briefly that it wasn't good. c) that this is further confirmation she needs to be done with me, and she can't believe I'd hold this from her.

I tried to validate her feelings, but it only made her angrier... she said how would I feel if she did this with my sibling... and her whole family has been working diligently on this issue, but I've obviously been solving his issues... etc. etc. etc. just more and more venom.

I tried to explain I just wanted to be a friend to him... and he just needed someone to talk to as he's in a lot of pain... and how he asked me not to talk about what he said to me as he didn't feel comfortable etc. (Note: I didn't share with her what he said to me that is confidential and private... and is only about his feelings etc.).

I finally just walked away... and left her be.

Later she's back to cold and cool detachment...

and I'm back to trying to be pleasant around her...

did I F up again??? not that it changes anything... I wasn't looking to lord something over her... or hide anything pertinent... she hadn't shared how bad things had gotten... and I didn't get this sense from listening to him... I also didn't advise him to do anything other than I think he should look for a counselor (which I shared with her)... and this also made her mad...


Me 47
STBXW 44
M ~20
D13
S15
BD mid 17
A Disc. 2 months after BD but evidence found ~2yr
OM decade older
S Imminent
D Soon after

Be the rock that can weather the storm...
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,152
Likes: 24
D
Member
Offline
Member
D
Joined: Jun 2005
Posts: 2,152
Likes: 24
Hermes... In what universe and on what planet does W get to dictate who you can speak to, about what, when and how? Think about it. At this point it's clear your W is going to complain about anything you do and want the opposite. That is painfully obvious whereby she asks you if you prefer the 6th or the 13th and then tells you your answer is wrong. How much do you want to bet had you chose the 6th she would have said she wants the 13th? You really have to stop allowing her to dictate YOUR LIFE. If you don't she will continue telling you the way to live - mostly by wanting, actually demanding, the opposite of whatever you say or do. Walking away and letting her sit is the best thing you did in that interaction. She wants to be mad, wants to spew, wants to complain and regardless of what you do it will be wrong.

I know this is hard, we all do. You have been YOU for a long, long time. Changing to a more confident, alpha you is going to take time. Just continue to put yourself first, be friendly and say as little as possible. "I'm really sorry you feel that way," is often all that is needed. If you are trying to make her happy and agree with you - on pretty much anything - it's not likely to happen in the short term. As Sandi often says, you can't nice a WAW/WW back into the marriage.


DonH
Midwest
Me 56
WAW-EXW 55
Met 11/95 / Married 5/00
Bomb 6/20/05 / She Filed on 6/2/06 / Divorced on 10/9/06
4 who'd qualify as GF since D & dated about 25 women since D
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
H,

Its hard and I know it. Detaching with love is a hard concept. If your brother law needs help, you should share that with your W.

When it comes to communicating with your W, think about it like this, if its something she can live without knowing them don't tell her. But if you know it's something she has to know them tell her.

You shouldn't be calling her up and saying, "guess what I did today". But you can call her amd say I talked to your brother he's seems to be not doing so well. If you truly couldn't pick up him not doing so well, then send a text to W saying I talked to your brother today.

Now, stop playing your W games. She asked you what date, and you chose. Next time, she gives you options and you chose and she then takes away that option you chose, you simply state, "you gave me two options I chose the option that works best for me, I will be there on that date I chose, if you are there or not". She will test you and she won't show for your date, but you won't show for hers either. Then she will be forced to have to work with you once she realize you are no longer part of her game.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
H
Hermes Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
H
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
So things didn’t go well at Xmas.
Spent time with her family.... made and took cookies back hers were in a sealed box.
I stole making cookies and overshadowed hers with the several varieties I made... “no one even cared about hers”.
I also was somewhat affectionate to her and she Hated this... and called me out on it when we got back (either I don’t get it which is disturbing or I do and don’t care which is even more disturbing and hurtful).

I was also helpful at her parents (and I “took over everything” her words). And she’s worried about my mental state as”it seems to be deteriorating” and I look “physically ill” and she “can’t look at me” after going from
Morbidly obese to just slightly overweight.
I also stole skiing from her (she’s asked 5 years in a row and I said no. This year because I’m not morbidly obese or depressed I said yes to my son asking... so she decided not to go as “I’m more important to spend time with S15).

Now today it’s an argument over me trying to help a family member of hers out by being a friend to them while they are going through a rough patch... she asked me 10 mins after I was on phone if I spoke to them. I said yes then it became an argument about how I wasn’t going to tell her until she called me out.
I told her I would always tell her immediately.... she said it doesn’t matter.

She asked me what we spoke about. I just mentioned vague details about how they were doing better which became an argument about how the next time they fall apart I can pick up the pieces as I obviously know more than they do. And how they save up their venom for family members....

I said we didn’t even get into any of that...

I then made the supreme mistake of saying that in just s few days you won’t ever have to speak to me again.. and she said we will need to collaborate on the kids. I said we won’t need to speak about anything else ever again... and I volunteered how I know I’m evil incarnate for her.... she got angry about me going to extremes and making i all about me when she’s just upset over her family member and me hiding speaking to them...

I said yes and mentioned the other things she is upset with which became I knew I shouldn’t have shared any of that with you.... you always assume the worst...

So I finally said I am going to remove myself for a bit as I’m getting emotional right now.

I am to the point where I almost just want her out of my life. She’s mean spirited, toxic, unforgiving, lying to me constantly about the OM and her A... and hiding the fact that she’s leaving me for him.. (even though they’ve got mad plans together....)

Oh and she found my DR book in my car glovebox and says she didn’t look at it (found it on my desk face down) she claims she didn’t want it floating around her car for kids to find....

I tried to validate her feelings early on about her family member, if I were in your shoes I’d probably be upset and feel
Like I am undermining what you and your family are trying to accomplish with him... I’d feel pretty anxious about this... but I feel like this I’m making a connection with him so I plan on continuing o speak to him.

She said you just validated me.... so now what... then you need to go learn a few more lines...

I’ve been trying to act as if for almost 2.5 weeks and it appears things are getting worse not better the closer we get to telling kids, parents, and separation.

She refuses to acknowledge the role of the afffair in any of this.

Everything I say or do is under an increasing microscope with her and she’s getting progressively angrier at me.

I have tried pretty hard to be more consistent these past several weeks. To be more even keeled and stick with something long enough to see if it works. I don’t spy in any way shape or form anymore which has helped immensely with my ability to remain much calmer around her...

I am not responding with anger nor am I rasing my voice to her. I can’t seem to get through to her with validation or making a connection that I get how she feels.

Know she’s leaving either way at this point.


Me 47
STBXW 44
M ~20
D13
S15
BD mid 17
A Disc. 2 months after BD but evidence found ~2yr
OM decade older
S Imminent
D Soon after

Be the rock that can weather the storm...
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2,103
Likes: 2
N
Member
Offline
Member
N
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 2,103
Likes: 2
If she is leaving then help her leave.
Tell her that you have decided to improve your life and the incoming new year. That she must leave.

What else can you lose. Get the strenght and do the click.


WW H(me): 51
W: 47
T: 26 M: 21
S: 16
Piecing since 03/2016
Saw the light in the storm
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
H,

You need to make yourself unavailable to her. Let go!!!!!!! Let her be!!! She is using you as a punching bag. Stop her, by removing yourself. GAL!!!! You are not available anymore. Why don't you go for a drive and talk to her family member? Get away from her while having a conversation with that person. Sounds like they need you undivided attention.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
J
Member
Offline
Member
J
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,132
H,

Was you really expecting it to go well? She is WW and resent you that won't change because of the holidays.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
H
Hermes Offline OP
Member
OP Offline
Member
H
Joined: Nov 2017
Posts: 203
Its been a while...
Update...
I went to my oldest Brothers and shared with him/wife... He's been in the know for some time... and very supportive.

While there, WW told me she wanted to tell her parents... I said I thought we were doing this together...
She did it anyway while I was going to Airport to fly home...
I spoke to her parents separately and took responsibility for my part in this.
They said it's between us and I'm family and they want to be part of my children's lives. they are only concerned for them.

I told my parents individually... again my part in this only...
they cried... but by Dad said he saw this coming in 2007 (but didn't say anything to either one of us... so not sure why he needed to share now).
They also said they want to be friends with her and have grandchildren in their lives.

She told her siblings... the oldest one knew things were rough because I'd shared that much while trying to help him.
The middle sibling told WW that this was the last thing she ever expected her to say and she was just shocked... She is still crying daily about this.

I reached out to middle sibling and her husband to say how much I enjoyed being their Brother-in-law and getting to know them over the years.
Sister said she still can't talk about it without crying... but when she can she will reach out. brother-in-law, said he knew it was coming as I'd shared how difficult things had grown btw us.

Told kids this past Saturday night... S15 just stared D13 cried and then went to her room.
WW hugged them both as did I...

We each said something essentially that they are our focus now.. we cannot agree on what to do @ marriage so we now need to get divorced, and they are best decision we ever made.

That said, we've been arguing a lot more recently and inevitably she says something that triggers me to calmly reply... (e.g. this is really hard for me, I know you think it's easy... Me; Not as hard as it is for me... you are getting what you want, have a great life planned with OM, etc.) I also tried to get her to be honest with me about anything (e.g. last Friday she again came home at close to 7pm... I asked if she stayed at work until she came home... she of course dodged q and refused to answer..). She said she knows that I think what she did is wrong, she feels bad about it, she knows she's I think she's going to hell (I told her at one point that she really out to go to confession for all of this I never said she'd go to hell [just pointing this out]).

I've told her variously that 1) I wish I had kicked her out the moment I found out about the Affair last Summer; It's so damn hard even seeing her around knowing what she's doing, next week can't come soon enough. She's offered to leave now... I said, where would you stay OM's?

She now says she just sit's back and takes all the rocks I want to throw at her on a daily basis (I don't think it's daily but again her experience is different than mine and she takes ANYTHING I say like this (e.g. you going to celebrate Valentine's with him?)), she says she's strong enough to take it and throughout this whole thing she hasn't thrown any of the things I did to her in my face (which is mostly true; but all of these are 95% historical; over half a year in the past; I pointed this out to her whereas what she is doing continues unabated).

Know ultimately none of this matters; I've even told her that I know I'm only pushing her farther away by arguing with her at this point...

It's been really hard with Kids as she keeps telling them how this won't be so bad... (Her apartment has a Pool, lake behind it so S15 can fish whenever he wants, etc.) She also is trying to tell them that nothing will change with Holidays... I told S15 we don't know that, I don't know if I will still be welcome at Her Parents after everything is said and done, or if I would be able to as it would be extremely awkward... So sometimes they will be with me on holidays and we'll figure it out.

She wants everything to be "the Same" e.g. the holidays that we went to her families, we'd alternate and one of us would take the kids there... the holiday they all come to our house (soon to be my house)... they'd still do this, and she'd just come over and help cook meals before going back to her apt.)...
I don't know that I want that or will be able to do that...

Last night I pointed out to kids that this was the last Sunday meal we would ever have as a family together... WW got upset at me later. She said If I have to destroy her in the kids eyes to feel better, that's ok but she hopes I can live with it.

I said back, wow, I could say the same thing about you and AP and what you are doing... What's your plan... wait 3 months 6 months and then magically start dating each other publicly and hide the 3 year affair that destroyed the marriage? (again never raised my voice, said this very calmly etc.)

She pointed out once again that this isn't why she's leaving... and that even now how she feels doesn't matter to me... she will always feel less than my equal... that I am incapable of placing her needs before my own.

I know I failed to be able to show her this given what was going on... and at any rate It was unlikely at best that I could have shown her this... she refused virtually everything I tried.

There's so much negative history (2/3 on my side as it turns out now that I'm really introspecting on it...) that I really should just let her go.

I realize we need to be great co-parents for the kids... and that I've likely just cemented the Divorce 100%... If it wasn't already (The only thing that might tank it is the AP is Incredibly Anxious around her... want's constant affirmations of love... emails, calls, etc. multiple times/die but she is so far actively engaging so time will tell...). Even if/when the A tanks... I'm pretty certain she will never come back as she only sees the negative in our relationship... and the mountain of negative things that happened in the past... I've acknowledged that I acted like a child a lot of the time, held things in, argued historically, got upset rather than communicating with her. etc.

Just [censored] that I know what largely went wrong and I know all these things are "fixable" but she can't doesn't want them to be fixed between us (given just how long they went on for). She's wasted too much of her life with me already.

I've decided that I need to move on with my life...
I told her when she moves out, I will only speak to her about kids and only when necessary... Until the Affair is over. I've ignored this for far too long.
I also told her she no longer has the right to come into my home without first contacting me... she feels like she has the right as she will be paying for half of the mortgage and that in any case there is a time period where it's ok for her to do this to get her stuff...

I have a trip in Feb for work... she said, she/kids would come over each day to take care of pet... I'm not really comfortable with this... I'm thinking of having a neighbor do this and just pay them.

She's also said to me that she wants to be flexible with me, she will help out when she can and hopes that I will as well if I don't have plans... she also said, she'd be willing for us to still get together for family dinners if/when the kids want this.
I know as far as divorces go, I should be really happy that she's being so "nice" (at least right now).

I know I need to treat her with respect... not throw her under bus, etc. It's just REALLY hard as NO-ONE in her family or my parents knows what the real deal is @ affair.

My S15suspects as WW is always late and stays at work until 7-8 every night, goes "Out" and doesn't say what she's doing or with whom (just a friend etc.).

My WW older sibling had this happen to him years back and he STRONGLY suspects Infidelity... It was really hard not exposing this to him/parents... says it will all come out eventually...

One of my siblings also feels this way...

Know exposure won't bring her back... after D is final I just want close family to know this was what finally tanked our relationship in addition to all of the things I did and things she did.

I am still waffling with if/when she introduces the OM to our kids (which I'm relatively certain will happen in the next year) letting kids know just that mom started dating/seeing him back in March 2015 and this was one of the final reasons that we needed to get Divorced, she wouldn't stop seeing him. (I've already told her I don't want this guy to be a part of our kids lives after the pain he's caused all of us.

I realize now through Talking with WW... that when I was in my depression, and had shut down emotionally... essentially ignoring her, or lashing out at her... she felt like she was abandoned on a daily basis and it hurt so bad... until one day it didn't anymore... and she decided to move on...

I'm just sad as even though I know given where things are at, this is what needs to happen...

Know I have to look out for my financial interests at present (Mediation starts really soon).

As to letting go... I am contemplating starting to date again once she's out of the house and we're separated... It's been 6 months without female companionship/contact, and I do miss just having someone to do things with (looking for casual not a new partner). Know everything MWD teaches says not to do this until D is final... I can move this along faster if I choose (she REALLY wants this all behind her... but is being nice in allowing me to control this to some extend for a while... She's got her paperwork done for mediation, I just need to get mine in order so we can start).

as to custody 50/50... so we're trying a couple different patterns for kids... 5/5/5 then 7/7/ then 2/5/2/2/5 (she wants the latter as going a week without seeing them would be too hard)

She's trying to get kids excited about new apt... S15 told me today it's really nice... there's a pool... I said, there will probably be a lot of kids there... he asked why, I told him with a lot of 3 br apts... I'm willing to bet there are other kids there who will be hanging out by pool in Summer.

Sometimes it feels like I'm just being upset/obstinate about this because she's so OK with it all... deep down inside, I don't know that I'm truly bothered by this anymore.

Know this was somewhat disjointed... but a lot on my mind lately...

Thoughts on any/all of this


Me 47
STBXW 44
M ~20
D13
S15
BD mid 17
A Disc. 2 months after BD but evidence found ~2yr
OM decade older
S Imminent
D Soon after

Be the rock that can weather the storm...
Page 4 of 5 1 2 3 4 5

Moderated by  Cadet, job, Virginia 

Link Copied to Clipboard