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A Message from Michele
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Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 #2763976
10/02/17 12:47 AM
10/02/17 12:47 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
J
joejoe1 Offline OP
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joejoe1  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: joejoe1] #2764007
10/02/17 04:00 AM
10/02/17 04:00 AM
Joined: Jun 2017
Posts: 826
Houston
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Holding Offline
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Holding  Offline
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Houston
JoeJoe, I think you've still got a chance to save your M. The fact that your W is still using "if" statements is a good sign.

Is it hard to face this deadline of next summer your W mentioned? For me, I saw on my STBXW's phone that she was going to give it 4 months. So I felt a TREMENDOUS pressure to be the best I possibly could in those 4 months. I was walking on eggshells, beating myself up for every mistake, analyzing every interaction. It was he11. But you know what? I only got 3 months.

I understand how the ambiguity could slowly kill you. Not being able to envision my own future any more drove me crazy. That was honestly the hardest part, and I do wonder if it led me down the wrong path and tainted my actions.

Working on yourself is all you can really do. Try to be a better man and a good father.

There's no telling what the future holds for any of us. But how will you face it?


Me-47,XW-43
S13,S16
M:18
BD:4-23-17
W filed:7-17-17
(5 months of in-house separation hell)
W moved out:1-6-18
D granted:2-15-18
Decree signed:3-29-18

Your future is out there. Go find it.
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: Holding] #2764045
10/02/17 07:33 AM
10/02/17 07:33 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
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joejoe1 Offline OP
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Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
Holding,

You are correct in what you say about eggshells. Today we have been doing a lot of talking. She told me today she wanted to go to marriage counseling.

She says she hated me for a long time. She says she's angry as hell at me.

I want to not be around her one minute and the next I don't mind.

We laughed and talked all morning, but I dont know what to think about this M.

But I have a chance to become the person version of myself right in front of her. My W gives me alot of clues, for what reason I don't know. She told me she knows that her mood affects how I acted around her.

We also told each other there are days we hate being around each other.

People are crazy specimens.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: joejoe1] #2764049
10/02/17 07:39 AM
10/02/17 07:39 AM
Joined: Mar 2016
Posts: 3,952
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doodler Offline
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Originally Posted By: joejoe1
People are crazy specimens.


You got that right!

Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: doodler] #2764270
10/04/17 04:43 AM
10/04/17 04:43 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
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joejoe1 Offline OP
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joejoe1  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
Update,

So, on Sunday wife and I had a fall out. I told her I was tired of her attitude. She informed me that she told me she would be that way, and she needed space. She implied I should leave our home, I told her I wasn't leaving our home. She informed me she needed space so she could have time to heal. I told her I felt the same way.

On Monday, she had a long phone call, I think with her father. After phone call she informed me, that she want to go to M counseling, so we could work on our communication. I set up an appointment for Thursday with a counselor at the church I'm attending. My wife informed she was scared of counseling because of what would come out.

Also, Monday was a really good day, we talked all day and she told me how much I had hurt her, because of some of the things I did. She told me she was really angry at me, that I made her feel like I she really didn't matter to me and she thought I was sleeping with another woman, because, I wasn't touching or really pursuing her for years. She said Monday was a really good day for us. She was touchy and playful. On Tuesday, she was talkative still and not angry or moody.

We have our first counseling session tomorrow, I hope it goes well, but I have read on here how they can really go bad. I have been to this counselor and she provided me with a lot of good info, when I saw her.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: joejoe1] #2764300
10/04/17 06:38 AM
10/04/17 06:38 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 18,666
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sandi2 Offline
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Quote:
Sunday wife and I had a fall out. I told her I was tired of her attitude. She informed me that she told me she would be that way, and she needed space.


In other words, she is going to bully you until you consent to leave?

Is the OM still in the picture?


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: sandi2] #2764308
10/04/17 07:52 AM
10/04/17 07:52 AM
Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 815
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Tread Offline
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Joined: Apr 2017
Posts: 815
The audacity. She messes up, has the bad attitude and wants to be alone. But actually wants you to leave the him and figure out where to live. Glad to hear you didn't entertain that at all.


MR: 15 T:17
Me: 37 W: 34
S14
BD/PA/EA: 12/2016
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: sandi2] #2764309
10/04/17 07:53 AM
10/04/17 07:53 AM
Joined: Nov 2016
Posts: 469
Philadelphia
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Chris73 Offline
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Philadelphia
Hi Joe. Please take my advice with a grain of salt because it's all based on hindsight and speculation.

You should consider the fact that your W has agreed to go to MC as a good sign, but be very wary of what you hope to accomplish in the sessions. I had 4 MC sessions with my W and they went from bad to worse.

I think that when one of the partners is wayward and the other is fighting to save the marriage, MC sessions have a tendency to further polarize the couple. Of course, it depends a lot on the therapist, but in my case (and from what I've read) the therapist will probably pick a side, regardless what the couple's intentions are. If the therapist is prone to believe that divorce should be avoided at all costs (with the exception of abuse or addiction) they will be slanted toward the LBS. If the therapist has more experience with advising individuals and pushes the "you should always be true to your feelings" approach, they will be slanted toward the WS.

Either way, the result ends up being two against one and if your W is already thinking about divorce, being ganged up on and put in a position to feel guilty and defensive won't help to dissuade her. Again, this is not always the case, but that's definitely what happened to me.

In one of the relationship books I read, the author used the metaphor of surgery to make this point. Imagine you are scheduled for open heart surgery but when you show up at the hospital you have the flu. The surgeon is going to cancel the surgery until you're strong enough to handle it. Same goes for MC. When a couple is in the middle of heated arguments, hurt feelings, and the revelation of infidelity, spending an hour talking about the problems in the marriage usually just makes things worse. If/when the couple's relationship is on more solid ground, spending time in therapy talking about the core problems of the marriage can be productive.

So what DO you do?

F**k! If I knew the answer to that question I might be in a different place right now. I think it all depends on your specific situation, and the choices aren't easy ones.

Sandi's advice of taking a tougher/harder stance approach is likely the best way to go if you suspect that your W is still in contact with the OM. If she is agreeing to MC but still seeing the OM it's hard to believe her intentions are genuine. You really can't work on fixing your marriage while maintaining an outside relationship. All that does is allow your W to keep her options open. And I'm definitely speaking from experience here. When my W agreed to MC I blindly accepted because I was so happy that she just wanted to try. Had I taken my blinders off I would have realized that her intentions weren't pure. FFS! A week before we went to our first MC session she went to a Halloween party with a girlfriend and hooked up with some random guy.

Again, hindsight...

On the other hand, you seem to indicate that you and your W are getting along (at least some of the time). If you can find a way to confirm that her OM is completely out of the picture you might suggest a more light-hearted activity for the two of you instead of a heavy MC session. Put the problems on the shelf, temporarily of course, and see if you can find a way to reconnect and have some fun. Get a sitter and take a couple hours to go do something together where you interact in a way that doesn't exacerbate the issues with the R. Don't go to a movie (no interaction at all), but don't just go out for dinner or coffee (too much interaction and not enough distraction). Some suggestions might be a comedy club, bowling, quizzo, painting class, yoga class, bike ride, dinner theater.

If she still insists on the MC session, tread very lightly. Let her do most of the talking and really listen. Don't interrupt with objections or corrections and don't try to defend yourself.

I hope that helps. I don't want to steer you in the wrong direction, but I'm trying to find ways to give back to the folks on this board who have all been so helpful to me.


M46 W48
M11 T14
S11 D8
BD: 2016/05/27
In-home separation: 2016/11/23
Nesting: 2017/06/11
W moves out: 2018/01/07
W goes public with OM: 2018/07/12
I ask for a divorce: 2018/12/14
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: Chris73] #2764312
10/04/17 08:13 AM
10/04/17 08:13 AM
Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
J
joejoe1 Offline OP
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joejoe1  Offline OP
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Joined: Aug 2017
Posts: 1,110
San Antonio, Texas
Sandi,

I haven't seen signs of her talking to the OM. About 3 weekends ago, I told to get her stuff and get out after I a FB messenger thread between them two. She refused, then I told her, you can continue to talk to him and leave, or you can stop and stay. She sent the OM a message in front of me, saving she had to stop talking to him. Is she still talking to him, maybe.

What do you mean about bullying me? How is she bullying me, she tries to manipulate me, with implications, but it don't work.

Chris73,

She pushed for the MC. She told me she wanted it ASAP. Once I set it up, she said she was scared, because of what might come out of it. She also suggested we take different cars. I don't have any intentions on being defensive. If she said she wanted a divorce in this session, it won't surprise me. I have accepted that I can't control the outcome. Also, I want to ask her out on a date, but I don't know if she is ready for that. If MC goes ok/good, I might ask her out of Friday, if it don't she has already planned to stay by her parents.

Chris, reading all the other treads, has scared me a little on how MC can go, but it also has prepared me.

Thanks for all the info and suggestions.


M:37 W:37
T:11 M:10
S17, S13, S10, S4
BD:06/28/17
OM confirmed 07/20/17
Recon the M 10/29/17
Working hard:2gether

Onward and forward

This process is not a sprint it's a marathon! Patience, Patience, Patience.
Re: Lost on how to save my marriage! 4 [Re: joejoe1] #2764321
10/04/17 09:25 AM
10/04/17 09:25 AM
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 18,666
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sandi2 Offline
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sandi2  Offline
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Joined: Jun 2007
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Quote:
What do you mean about bullying me? How is she bullying me, she tries to manipulate me, with implications, but it don't work.


I'm asking you. Based on her saying she told you she was going to be this way b/c she wants space. Is that a threat? Bullying tactics? "If you don't do what I want (get out), I will make you miserable" type of thing?

Would this be new, for her to get what she wants by using her bad moods/temper? I have seen that characteristic run in a lot of what I call "spoiled" WW's. If you have NGS, then you may be use to walking on egg shells.

I wanted to get a feel in how you looked at her "warning".


It is not about what you feel should work in your M. It is about doing the work that gets the right results. Do what works!
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