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Thank you ladies... lately I have a hard time to see what I am doing, how I am behaving. I feel like I want so hard to detach that now it became automatic for me to just ignore XH, keep distance and basically run away from him.

Coly23 - I did not write all the details about what happen the day we were at the house of the lady from the church. It was way more intense. Everyone there were sitting in front of us two and reinforcing the value of a marriage. For us Christians it is something sacred that God put together in the first place. We were crying but there was almost everyone in a room crying too.

Our journey has been sweet and a way very painful. Hate is an easy way out and I could easily done that because that is who I was. But life has been teaching me a lot. This forum and I what I learned here, my faith and all what I learned and trust in my God, the fact that at some point my life was gone and I needed to pick up the pieces and keep walking with my head tall.

It all made me see some things with a different perspective and made me want to learn more and really become someone with real values. Those ones that don't come from emotions alone, but the core ones that become your DNA, the choices you make to not just walk the nice walk, but from a person that is intimate with pain and joy.

Sotto and Ginger1 - I agree with you too. There is much work to do for XH. He says he has to work on himself and that he still have wounds from our R and the R with the French lady. What he doesn't say is the most important, is that he has deeper wounds from his childhood. He was abandoned more then once, robbed, neglected, left to his own luck.

Many times when we were together, I felt that he was taking all my energy. It was a strange feeling and a bad combination since I believe that one must give but also need to receive.

XH is still confused, scared, insecure, afraid. He may want to give me more room but I know he is afraid of what it can be if I am not the person he is seeing. He feels that I can be a nice person but is afraid his life can become a nightmare if he does not change and with time we go back to the same issues we had before. He shuts down and I create a wall.

It seems to me that he is starting to believe in my changes because I have been more consistent with him. Part of it all is because I have been more sincere and outgoing. Just who I was when he first met.

I had no fear... I exposed my heart to him in a big way and gave him just LOVE. With the help of my faith, I have been able to go back to what I was one day. A fresh, happy and pure love person.

The problem with XH is that now my fear of rejection is a big deal inside my heart. I hear his words of love but I do not see the actions of his love. He uses excuses to be around me and I can see that. But I would like to see him coming forward to give us an opportunity to try.

Maybe it is a goal for me. To keep steady and wait to see if he will ever make time just to make me important in his life.

For example, when he told me that he had coffee with a lady that was very sweet and a very nice person, I was jealous, I was hurt. Here is a guy that tells me he loves me and also tells me he is looking for someone else.

Inside my head, I felt very crushed, XH can make time to invite someone for a coffee and spend some time talking to that person and yet he just use his time to talk to me when he gets to the house because he needs to pick up or drop off the kids.

The way I see it is that he is there anyway and then check on me. I feel like he talks to me because I am there. Then for me it has been hard to decide. Do I make myself available and keep the talking going even if it is this way, or do I make myself unavailable and even absent so he will need to run after?

At this point in time, I do not know what is the right thing to do that I won't hurt the chance of getting together some day. The truth inside me, is that I feel like his convenient plan B. I do not like it that he is not going out of his way to spend time with me.

When we talked about this the last time I saw him. He said that we are talking and it has been a huge progress. That he could easily just pick up or drop off the kids and leave, but he choose to stay and talk. He said that nothing would stop him to be away from me if he wouldn't choose to be close.

So, I try to see from his perspective. But, I still don't like it. I still feel like plan B and I got hurt that he can plan to be with someone else in a date and not with me. For me, he is not really giving us a chance. In my understanding he is trying his luck out there, but still keeping the idiot in a short leash so if nothing works out for him, he can always get back to someone that would take him with all his gaps and failures.

He even play mister nice guy, telling me that he doesn't want to hurt me anymore in my life. That this is the one thing he is having a hard time to forgive himself. That the only person in this world that he never want to hurt, the only person that he loves the most, is also the only person that he hurt the most.

So he says that he has no right to hold me, hold my life, that I can meet another man, a nice man and decide to be happy without him. That he has no right to ask me to wait for him until he is done healing himself.

So I take those words with love, caring and compassion and I am happy he cares about me. Or, I can take those words with salt, criticism and caution and understand that he is making a clear decision to date other women, look for love somewhere else and keep me in "between" as he even said to me. That he understands it is very hard for me right now because I am in "between".

It may sound like hate when I right this but it is not. I have no hate for him, I do really love him for all the good things and also for the bad ones. No one is perfect and I can live with all what is not so perfect in him. I do not have a problem with that.

I guess now I have to make a decision if it is better for me to be unavailable and see if he will do something to run after, or keep myself available so to give a chance for us to develop more closeness and spend time together.

In my opinion, I feel like it is a right time to pull back and show him I am giving up. I will see him often, I can be his friend when he needs my friendship. But I can pull back all my emotions towards him and let him see that I am giving him what he asked in the first place, and that is his freedom to walk his own path.

I feel the strength to get myself there. Even with this pain in my heart, I feel I can stop being selfish and wanting him back. I feel I can let him go and be happy on his own life if that is what he wants. I actually feel that now my love for him is real and genuine. I am able to love him so much that I can let him go if this is what makes him happy.

But, and in my life there is always the BUT word. Is that I am not a people's person, I mean I am not very good when it comes to read people. Can I be totally wrong? Can maybe it be that everyone is right and I am super hard on him? Can it be that I still hold some grudge and wounds that he actually gave up on me two years ago or even longer?

Yes, it can be all the above and some more. I need to be careful with my decisions because I am a runner. I run away from pain and this mechanism is very old in me and sometimes it is just automatic. For self protection, I very often get blinded side and miss the real meaning on what is happening.

Job, I am actually taking it slow. I know and you know I would like to sit down, laugh and say, lets start working hard towards making our family stronger then it ever been. But, I understand it is all a huge process. I am not closing my door to whatever shows up in my life. I am not looking for something else, but at least I am open to what can happen, even if it means someone else.

I still have a lot to do in my own life. I have been working on getting the house in my name, refinancing. Looking for a better job with time so to find something that suits me now, I look much better these days, my kids are my friends and life goes on.

So, what you guys think I could do? Maybe I need to put a list with new goals?

By the way, I have been reading "Bluewave"'s thread. Amazing as it is, I got to a better sense of detachment once I started reading her journey. It has amazing stuff in it and I got so much strength from all the words she wrote and also from poster on her thread. It has been a pleasure to use her words to give me strength to detach, let go.

Love you ladies.
And thank you for helping me. Soon, very soon, I think I will be in that position to give back to this forum. I getting to the point where I understand enough about this process that I can help other to achieve it as well.

With much love to you all,
Pink


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Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
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Pink I think you have a lot to offer newbies and not so newbies here. I too think bluewave is a great asset to this board.However whist she is undoubtedly helping others I fear she is being affected negatively by being here. Please be sure you are fully ready before paying it back. Take the time you need. There will still be people to help afterwards.......unfortunately

Best wishes.


R 25 years
M 14 years
S11 & S13
Working on it alone since Oct 2014
M in trouble a lot earlier (~2 years)
Feb 2016. 1st R chat in a yr.
Next R chat Aug'17
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Hi Roist,

Thank you. This is a website that gives so much without judging. I know one day I will be in a position to give back, and even unfortunately, I know there will always be more people in need of help and direction. The support I always got here during my good, not so good, bad and darkest moments.

Now, updating on my situation...

The week of 11/7 to 11/11 there was no contact from XH. Total silence. I sent him a nice text on 11/8 but nothing back and left it alone for the rest of the week.

11/11 he came to the house to pick up the kids. He was very pleasant and one of the boys mention that saturday morning I would be helping the church on giving breakfast for the homeless. He asked me and I confirmed. He saw I had stuff to prepare sandwiches and cookie bags on the kitchen table.

Well, this time I did not ask for his help and tough he would not help. They came back and XH comes in. He then asked if he could help with the sandwiches and I said of course, that would be lovely and that I need the help.

We did it, he helped a lot and we talked a lot too. It was very nice. We did everything together, helping each other. There were no conflict. I was super calm, not anxious at all. He was smiling at times.

We talked about different stuff but there was also things about us here and there. We also talked about us and were we are. I said to him that it is still very difficult for me and that I was thinking to stop going to the church and avoid being around him.

He said I was making a mistake, that all what was done till now and I think it will be better to give up on it all. I said that he never invited me to go to that church, that he never really come to the house to see me or to talk to me, that I am the one putting myself in his way. That I am tired of all this and that I feel it is easier to just accept and move one.

He insisted I am making a mistake and then said that he does not have any right to ask me anything and that he understands if I don't want to be close to him.

When he left he said he was not sure he would go to the church saturday morning since he was tired and just coming back from a week long business trip.

It didn't feel good the way he was leaving and I didn't like what I did. So, I walked to his car and we talked more:

Me - XH, I am sorry I said all what I said. I wish you can understand how hard it is to feel this way.
XH - I understand what you said. But I also think that you feel a little different then you say.
Me - I do, but I am afraid I am lying to myself and there will be more pain because I am a romantic idiot.
XH - You are not an idiot, you know I have no life anywhere else. Pink, I am a man that is divorced for 1 year and 3 months and I am still alone, I could not have anyone else in my life. I do not have any life. The fact that I told you I went for a coffee with a woman other day, is because I never want to lie to you again. I want you to trust me. And that woman meant nothing to me.
Me - If I believe in what my heart knows about you, then I will have hope. But, this hope can hurt me again.
XH - I know, you are afraid and I am afraid. That's why we need to be friends.
Me - You and this friend stuff again, like I am not your friend.
XH - I want you to see a part of "The Last Samurai" movie, where the samurai talks to Tom Cruise for the first time, and then you will understand what I mean.
Me - Ok, I will.
XH - And then let me know what you understood.
Me - Alright. XH, one thing that bugs me the most is that you can fight for your job, career, school, golf and whatever, but you can't fight for your family, not even give it a shot.
XH - I really want you to see that movie and then you will realize what I am doing.

We then talked about his father. It was his father's death anniversary. He said that now he feels sad but he accept his father was sick and died when he was so young. That his father never abandoned him, that it was never his father intention to get sick and die. That he came to terms with this in every cell of his body.

It is very sad. I always felt very sad for him and all what happen in his life. But this time I actually showed him I have sympathy for his pain and respect it.

Well, he left and we were in good terms. When we hugged goodbye, I said to him that I would love to love him this way we are now, that I feel so much freedom when we talk. He smiled and said that we are in the right path.

I was a little late on saturday morning and in the way to church got a call from XH.
XH - Morning Pink, where are you?
Me - I am in my way to church, wake up late but I am almost there.
XH - I am here already, will see you soon then.
Me - OK.

When I got there he came to my car to let me know about some parking because the church parking lot was full. Weird, but he took his car from parking and went to park close to me. Then we walked together to meet the other people. He was very nice and smiling again.

We did the food distribution walking all over the city - XH was close to me most of the time. We even separated in small groups to cover more areas and he said: - Pink, we should go to X place. I did it all, but I confess that it feels awkward.

At the end we were walking back to church to meet with the big group and it was just so pleasant. We got there and he said he would go to the restroom. Wow, even that he tells me now.

I saw there was only two breakfast burrito left and got one for him and one for myself. When he came, he said he was hoping there was some left and I said that they were all gone. He made a sad face like playing and then I said: Don't be sad, I got one for you. I know you are hungry, we have been walking a lot.

He was happy, thanked me and gave me a kiss on my chic.

We were together with other members from the church and I checked the sweet pastry they had at the table. XH asked what I was doing and I said that I was dreaming about some sugar. He smiled and said that he was thinking the same and asked if we could share one. We did, and then we shared another one.

Towards the end he asked if we could leave, and then we walked together to the car. We hugged for a moment before getting into our cars, and he said he would be at the house in about an hour.

And he came, and we talked more.

Then he left with the kids to see a movie and to have dinner. When they came back he came in the house and asked if he would see me at church next morning and I said he would. He smiled and said that he was looking forward to it.

I need to go now but I want to finish and there is a lot more to come... Later

Pink


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Continue... updating

So we see each other at the church and we are very nice to each other. XH continue to come forward, smile.

There was a get together after the church and he asked me if I was going. I said I was, but needed to do something before it and he said he was also going there for just a little bit.

When I got there, he was sitting with some of our friends but there was an empty chair beside him. I got some food an then asked if I could sit there and he said it with a smile, that of course I should.

One thing that I notice is that he is showing a lot more how much he cares and that he really enjoy my presence. He even says that.

Later I decided to go inside the house because it was getting cold outside. I excused myself and left. Later he came inside and asked if he could sit beside me. I looked at him and said that: Of course, it would be a pleasure.

Then he sat and said that he liked that I was being funny, then I looked at him and asked if it would be better if I squeezed him too against the cough, then a girl that was sitting beside me said that I was being very coquette.

He looked at her and said that it was my sweet side, the one that made him fall for me. He then told this girls how it all started between us. He even remember some details that I have forgotten.

As he was telling he was also embellishing all events and saying how beautiful I was then and how beautiful I am now. That I am still that same girl, full of life.

Then I took the chance and told her my side of the story and how gorgeous he was when I first put my eyes on him.

She basically looked at us and said that she never met a divorced couple that are so much in love with each other. I didn't contest what she said and neither him.

Then, a little later he left to go to my house and I stayed there a little more. When I got home he was there and watched a movie with us, then he left.

On Monday, S18 and I were very sick. I took S18 to the doctor and he has Influenza A. XH came to the house and cooked dinner. It was really nice to talk and cook some food too.

Since I am in a pretty bad shape, XH came to the house again yesterday and cooked dinner for us.

We have been talking and talking and it has been pleasant. I confess that it is not very good to be hanging in there because there is no guarantee on anything, but I feel we are moving somewhere now.

I want to have some guideline of what to do, so I will work on that and then post it here soon. Sorry, need to go again. Time is limited.

Love and Kisses,
Pink


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D:8/5/2015



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I would watch that movie. Apparently the answer is with Tom Cruise and the samurai master!!!

Best wishes and keep us updated


R 25 years
M 14 years
S11 & S13
Working on it alone since Oct 2014
M in trouble a lot earlier (~2 years)
Feb 2016. 1st R chat in a yr.
Next R chat Aug'17
Still together
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Sorry you haven't been well Pink and wishing you a speedy recovery.

As for your XH, I don't think my advice there has changed for a good while. It is early days, and he is making some forward moves. Equally he is saying his life is a mess and he just wants to be friends.

I would continue with no expectations and let some more time pass - and if you have a gently building friendship during that time, then great. But I would try and draw back from R talks like you described above....maybe tell yourself, I will continue as I am until the New Year, then I'll reassess and just take it from there.

And continue to move solidly forward with your own life and make plans for yourself.

Get well soon! Xx


T 13 M 7
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SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

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Thanks for stopping by Roist and Sotto...

Roist - I watched the movie and the part he wants me to watch and there was some kind of answer for what he is intending for now. These two characters are in each others path because life did it, the first step was to introduce themselves. Tom Cruise's character says he has questions and is very impatient. The samurai is content with the introduction of their names and is looking forward for the next conversation.

Throughout the movie the conversations continue, they start sharing their views on life, values. They start feeling comfortable with each other and their differences.

But the most important of all is that they cross each other paths as enemies. It is through those conversations that they become best friends that trust each other with their own lives.

This is the main point that XH is talking about, the message is that we need to keep talking to develop the trust and respect that was broken between us.

He is not wrong and the approach is the correct one if you want to build up a health R again. For me in specific, it is very hard because I would like to put the past beside us and work hard towards something we think can be good for us both.

But, lately I have been thinking that I changed a lot and that the best way is to take the time to develop a friendship we have lost. Is to get to know each other in our new skin. And even if my heart desire to work on some R, I know we are just trying to start something from new.

It is very tricky, because we can still see and smell the ashes of what have died.

Sotto - you are very right and I know that is what I should be doing. Moving forward and let the pieces fall whatever they fall. Unfortunately, as I wrote above, it is not much in my nature to let things go and live the moment.

Being very sincere, I can't say I have zero expectations. I don't get anxious as before, I am not consumed by what he does or doesn't, I keep dealing with my own life and moving forward with it. But inside my heart, I think about his words, his kindness.

It is almost impossible to ignore that he is trying his best to show me he cares, that he has changed and is working hard to change further and be better for his family.

On Monday, when S18 and I were very sick, he drove me to the pharmacy to pick up S18's meds, then he made tea for me. He went to the supermarket to get some food to prepare dinner. He actually called his work to let them know that he would be in a hour and half later because he was helping his family.

In the past it would never happen, his work was always in the first place. Above us all. I then made a point to send him a short message saying that I was proud of him, that even knowing that his work is very important, he manage to do both and put his family first. He was happy I said that. He said he used to think about these things but would not do it.

My only complain about this whole new events is that I would like to be important. I don't really know if this is still some post divorce drama that I have. Maybe I still feel very hurt and have too much of the rejection feelings hanging on me. Maybe is the simple fact that I was born a woman and like it.

I really don't know. But I would love if XH ask me for a coffee at least. Maybe dinner, or a movie. Something simple, but a time that would enable us to feel happy and relaxed. At home is nice, but he is cooking or there are the kids. It is almost like he needs to be in a safe zone when with me. And maybe that is exactly what he wants now, a safe zone.

By other hand, doing the safe zone, is also pushing me away somehow. I wish it didn't and I would just take what has been offered and let go, enjoy the moment. But I am not doing it. I am not over thinking, but I don't see any beauty on what is going on. There is no magic, no butterfly in my stomach. There is no feeling of mystery, desire.

I don't understand well what is going on inside of me, but I wish we could just try to hang with each other as I would do with a different guy that is just trying to know me right now. But there is this new with the old environment, what for me gets complicated.

Oh well, when you can't let it be, let it GOD. And that is all what I can do for now, let it all in God's hands and see what will happen.

And there is the Thanksgiving again. XH asked me what we will be doing since this year I have the Thanksgiving week. I said we would just hang out with each other at the house. I asked what he would be doing and he said that I know he doesn't really have a life, but he would stop by the old lady he used to live at her house, and that he didn't know what he would do later.

I don't know. Maybe it would be good to spend some more time together. Or, maybe I will just be giving him this family time and it is convenient for him to keep things were they are.

I was thinking that maybe I can invite him to spend the Thanksgiving with me. And say it very clear that it is to spend with me, not the kids, but me. That he would inevitably to spend time with his kids too, but the purpose was to spend time with me. But I don't know.

Sometimes I feel like doing the easy stuff, the easy way out, and just give up on it all. Just let go and don't really be there for him anymore. Anyway, this is what he wants since long, is to be single, have his own life and be away from me. Then it is like doing him a favor.

I am writing all this even if it is like reading a book. But, sometimes I look around to read something that tells me how it was to get together again or to give up in it all and I can't really find the details that took people to their last straw.

I just hope this hopeless feeling is coming from my Flu, otherwise I will be telling here very soon, that I fell out of love for my XH. We will see.

Thanks to all of you,
Pink


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I think letting things unfold and not pushing them is the way to go here. In your post above, you want to press forward into reconciliation, romance even. Much better to gently build a friendship and keep any expectations very low. Why? Because MLCers tend to grow warm towards you and then cool, then warm etc. They are still cycling and until they settle down, you risk being pulled along by that and then getting so fed up you walk away completely.

You so want to be wanted by him and I think that need within yourself is for you to address, not for him to meet. If you want to invite him for Thanksgiving, I would do so as you would a friend and welcome him into your home for a meal and to spend time with his family - not insisting he be there for you.

JMHO of course Pink and I hope this helps my lovely xx


T 13 M 7
Me 48 H 46
SS 15
BD 7.14 PA
D final 5.16 (H filed)

We receive & we lose, and must try to achieve gratitude & embrace with whole hearts whatever of life that remains after the losses - Dubus
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Hey Pink, I like the fact gag he asked you to watch the film to put across how he feels. I might check if out, I don't think I see ever seen it before.

I completely understand about wanting to feel important and to know that H is there for you and not just the kids. When my H first left he used to come over once a week for family evening. At first he would just come in sit down eat and then leave. He actually told me not to think coming over was another 'rung on the ladder' in our relationship. I was devastated but I soon realised that I was using this time as an opportunity to be close to him but it did not make me feel good as I knew he was there to see my D and not me. After a small discussion about the fact that he made no effort when he came over he started bringing take out food and a bottle of wine for me. Again I so wanted that to be because he wanted to see me but alas it was just him being nice.

After a few 2x4s on here I stopped family time altogether and left him and my and my D to sort out whatever relationship they wanted but without me. After going dark for seven weeks I invited him out for coffee and we are now going out for coffee for the third time. I know everyone says he should be doing all the chasing but I know he just isn't like that but he does seem happy to meet me so I am taking that as a positive sign and hoping we can take some baby steps and see where they takes us.

What I'm trying to say that you are right about needing to separate your relationship with H as a parent and as a partner. It is easy to confuse spending time as a family as a way to get closer. I think this can only happen once you are further down the line. Have you thought of asking H to go for coffee or go out for something to eat?


Me - 47
H - 45
D-16
M - 6 years
Separated - May 16

Don't leave me behind can't you see me I'm shining... (Years & Years - 'Shine')
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