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A Message from Michele
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Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: job] #2716013
11/14/16 02:40 PM
11/14/16 02:40 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 167
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srt Offline OP
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hey guys, I really do thank you for the reply.

re jumping in, that has been my thinking up to now but a few things have happened since that makes me wonder if what I'm doing is working or not.

W and I had a convo last weekend which resulted in me choosing to leave - she was being abusive and throwing insults and I realised I was getting sucked in to justify her behaviour. I simply said I was not going to be treated like that.

In this convo W complained at me that I never call her (which she has mentioned before), not even a "good morning". She also complained about me being awkward and difficult, I assume in relation to the lack of control she has when I have the kids. She has said she wonders what I am waiting for (???), and that she doesn't think the sitch has gone on long enough (meaning needing to D).
She has also brought me small gifts (food) and had increased her messaging to ask how we were and what we were doing when I had kids in recent hols.

I KNOW I mustn't exert pressure but I really don't know how to handle this - she seems incapable of figuring this out!!! I WANT to be with her, and sense she is not done with me.

I've gently asked if she wants to do anything (last week - to no success), and will repeat this week. I'll ensure my demeanour is calm etc and won't get worked up if it is not accepted. I really can't see any other option other than nothing - yes I know it is an option but I've been doing it for MONTHS.

I just can't see any change based on my current approach, yet it seems to be annoying W more than anything.
We are still courteous and pleasant to each other during exchanges, and she does seem to be hanging around for a little longer than usual.

I totally feel in a stalemate, where neither of us are equipped with the tools we nee to improve the sitch. I'm trying the hardest I can to just get on, stay positive, GAL etc. I'm also very apprehensive about going back to MC since I feel we will just get the death certificate of our M.

I don't suppose I have much more to say other than I'm keeping a log of interactions with W. Whether this is useful or not I'll see but it is useful to reflect back on.


M 10, T 18
M: 36, W: 35, D: 8, S: 6
EA: Oct 12
ILYBINILWY: Jan 15
BD: Aug 15
Separated: Sep 15
Miss you: Jun 16
Aug 16: Dating (!)
Oct 16: Selfishness returns...
currently: disgusted
Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: srt] #2716017
11/14/16 02:52 PM
11/14/16 02:52 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 27,455
Southern Maryland
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She may not be done w/you...but she's very confused right now and even though she's complaining about you not calling her, the best thing you can do is just leave her alone. She has to figure things out on her own and if you are around and she's focusing on you and what you want to do, etc., she can't focus on her own issues and grow up.

Keep your conversations on the kids and the holidays. I wouldn't ask her if she wants to do anything w/you...however, you can rephrase it to ask if she would like to join you and the children in going to the movies, to a museum, hike, etc. Make it more about "family" and not about "you" solely. You may not realize it, but you are putting entirely too much pressure on her to be w/you.

Please step back and allow her to come to you when she's ready. When something isn't working, you need to try something different and always remember...actions speak louder than words.

Keep the focus on you and your family. Leave your wife in God's hands for now.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: job] #2716022
11/14/16 03:08 PM
11/14/16 03:08 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 167
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srt Offline OP
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Hi job, thanks again, this has given me some things to mull over. I'll be sure to post here before I do anything though

regarding "family" time, I'm unsure about this. Where do I draw the line at cake-eating? I know she hates missing out and feels "punished", but equally I wanted her to know exactly what a D would look like (this was before I was sure W was/had been in MLC)

with an MLCer is it ok to do "family" stuff or not? Should I only do if she reciprocates at some point? confused...


M 10, T 18
M: 36, W: 35, D: 8, S: 6
EA: Oct 12
ILYBINILWY: Jan 15
BD: Aug 15
Separated: Sep 15
Miss you: Jun 16
Aug 16: Dating (!)
Oct 16: Selfishness returns...
currently: disgusted
Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: srt] #2716026
11/14/16 03:15 PM
11/14/16 03:15 PM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 27,455
Southern Maryland
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Posts: 27,455
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If you are doing family things, I would invite her along once in a while. It would give her a sense of what she's missing when she's not around you and the kids (as a family unit). You could phrase your invite as: "wife, the children are going to see a movie, would you like to join us?" This gives her the option to say yes or no. It's whatever you feel comfortable in doing. I don't see once in a while as cake eating and you would have to keep your expectations at zero.

Check out Kyh's thread. You might get some good info from his threads.


Sit quietly, the answers will reveal themselves when you least expect them to.
The past is gone, the present is a gift and you need to focus on today, allow the future to reveal itself when it is ready.
Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: job] #2716113
11/14/16 11:10 PM
11/14/16 11:10 PM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 568
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Thanks for stopping by my thread, I'm learning as I go but I hope it can help you.

As always, Job has given you some great advice, especially keeping your expectations at zero. Fake it for now if you have to. From what I've read, if our spouses ever come out of this it will be a slow lifting of the fog, not them waking up to sunshine one morning so no use expecting them to suddenly come around. Also, if and when she declines be sure to go and have a great time with whatever you're doing, it's about the kids/family and her loss!

Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: Kyh] #2716233
11/15/16 11:46 AM
11/15/16 11:46 AM
Joined: Feb 2016
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srt Offline OP
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arghhh - just back from an invite which W initiated to an evening meal with W and kids at her condo.

I managed it well, and had a great time, kids loved it too. W I'm not sure, she seems wary of ever being physically close to me? I made sure I didn't do or push anything but strange all the less.

Got 2 quick questions about how folks cope with these kind of events

How do you manage your expectations at these things and afterwards. It's what I've been waiting on happening for over a year now but you always come back on a downer when you have to leave frown

Secondly, I've had a dilemma of how "tough" to be all through my sitch. How can I make sure I'm not being friend-zoned, yet equally not causing undue aggravation? Is it a case of I know my W best? Or be as tough as I can manage. I've been reading threads where people are saying if she is in crisis I need to be there to support her, but she has moved out so it's obviously harder.

Didn't do any R talk or pressure tonight, just thanked her for tea and said it was nice thing to do.


M 10, T 18
M: 36, W: 35, D: 8, S: 6
EA: Oct 12
ILYBINILWY: Jan 15
BD: Aug 15
Separated: Sep 15
Miss you: Jun 16
Aug 16: Dating (!)
Oct 16: Selfishness returns...
currently: disgusted
Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: srt] #2716297
11/15/16 11:21 PM
11/15/16 11:21 PM
Joined: Dec 2015
Posts: 568
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Kyh Offline
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Originally Posted By: srt


How do you manage your expectations at these things and afterwards. It's what I've been waiting on happening for over a year now but you always come back on a downer when you have to leave frown
.


The advice I got that helped me with this was to just enjoy the time and have no expectations. I haven't mastered this but I'm trying and keep trying.

Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: Kyh] #2717494
11/23/16 03:35 PM
11/23/16 03:35 PM
Joined: Feb 2016
Posts: 167
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srt Offline OP
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feel like I need to update things again for this week.

No further news really!
W continues to just be businesslike at changeovers, however she is staying a little longer than usual. She has had a worrying health problem this week which has affected her looks and it is showing. We asked her to tea at weekend but she refused on basis of having food needing to be eaten, medical problem and feeling not too great - seems to be struggling with her health (or that's what she tells me!)

I also asked her if she wanted to do something this week - to the reply "I've not really thought about that". Kind of getting the point of DB now, they won't want to until they want to! I'm going to ask a couple more times in the next week or two and if no positive response I'm going to take it as W is unable to do any meaningful work to sort out the R, and just withdraw back to focus on me and the kids.

I know I should be doing this anyway but her recent comments that I never this and never that have pissed me off. Doing it this way I can be confident and clear of conscience that I made it plain clear I was willing to do MY part. Until she is willing to step up I'm getting myself in order to move forward.

I suppose my change in attitude has been brought about by several things.
1. Duration of events currently, and her token efforts at R/"dating"
2. discussions with family/friends about her selfishness/entitlement issues
3. Some information I discovered on another site * more about this below
4. An acknowledgement from myself that the current "me" is not sustainable

So that's it, I suppose I'm finally thinking about dropping the rope, not so much because I want to, but because I realise there is no point hanging onto something that doesn't want to come back. No matter how strong I am it won't affect the outcome. I know I am good, worthy and will be an excellent partner and father. It will be her loss.

* the website I have been on I won't name. All I will say is it places the blame for cheating VERY firmly at he foot of the WW/WAW. Through this site I have been able to start the work required to fix me, but as the saying goes I cannot fix them. They have to WANT to fix themselves and WANT an R for it to be worthwhile. So I will DB like a pro to show I am not shutting her out, but equally I'm not doing anything to pull her back in - she must own her issues and live within the life and restrictions her choices have created for her - no more control of me and cake eating.

I'd be very interested to hear thoughts on all this. The biggest ???? that was on this other site was there is no such thing as MLC (!!!), only a selfish, narcissistic, self-entitled [censored]..............


M 10, T 18
M: 36, W: 35, D: 8, S: 6
EA: Oct 12
ILYBINILWY: Jan 15
BD: Aug 15
Separated: Sep 15
Miss you: Jun 16
Aug 16: Dating (!)
Oct 16: Selfishness returns...
currently: disgusted
Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: srt] #2717573
11/24/16 07:33 AM
11/24/16 07:33 AM
Joined: Jan 2000
Posts: 27,455
Southern Maryland
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Posts: 27,455
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srt,

Don't ask her again if she wants to do something w/you. You need to allow her to come to you. Asking her to do things is putting pressure on her and she's not ready to commit herself to doing things w/you. Remember...in her mind, you are the enemy who has made her very unhappy and don't forget...she fired you as her h. Step way, way back and just leave her be. When she's ready, she'll suggest things to do.

I wouldn't have any discussions w/family and friends about your situation or what she's doing or not doing. The more you talk to family and friends about the situation, the more likely some of that chatter will get back to her and it will make it more difficult for her to reconcile (if and when) w/you at some later date. It may be too much for her when she wakes up and she may opt to just move on w/o working on reconciling w/you. If someone inquires about your situation, keep the response short and sweet. You could respond "Things are about the same" and let it go. No one needs to know your business except your wife, lawyer and God.

MLC is not a recognized health issue in the medical society. Depression and grief are. Depression and grief can cause people to do a lot of things that they normally wouldn't do. Midlife comes from the age that we see most of the odd behavior happening. Hormones, health issues, old age, etc. can also create some odd behavior in people because mortality is looking them squarely between the eyes.

Of course, we also have the Quarter Life Crisis, whereby we have some odd behaviors going on w/those at 20, 30 and early 40's.

Each and every person, author, doctor and forum has their own beliefs about MLC and life in general. It's all in what you take from reading the material and how you apply it to your own unique situation. Take what you can use to help you better understand your spouse and what he/she is going through, but also what can help you move forward w/your own life.

Just my two cents.

Re: Feeling Lost 3 [Re: job] #2717591
11/24/16 10:29 AM
11/24/16 10:29 AM
Joined: Aug 2016
Posts: 433
West is the best
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West is the best
Srt,
My IC doesn't buy MLC as a "thing". But, this doesn't matter to me because in this forum I've seen the same words said to me, the same actions, the same scenarios. So for me the label doesn't matter- could be depression, could be MLC/QLC, both, neither. I do think some people here are dealing with Narcissists-- another tricky term-- and others are just dealing with people in crisis who have become very selfish.
The most important take-away from reading all others stories is even though it was said to be 100% my fault, that can't be true. That's helped me weather the storm.


me 42 H 32
T 7yr
M 6yr
BD 5/2016 ILYBNILWY
Separated 7/2016
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