[Angels]

anyone have advise for the above? Im really afraid that there is a potential we are both GAL'ing right now and its putting a further wedge between is. I kind of did that before without knowing it, and when she pushed more, i was stupid and oblivious... i feel she is doing it to me, so should i also be DBing right now? i feel that's important to add to my horrible and confusing stich...?

[Cadet]

anyone have advise for the above? Im really afraid that there is a potential we are both GAL'ing right now and its putting a further wedge between is. I kind of did that before without knowing it, and when she pushed more, i was stupid and oblivious... i feel she is doing it to me, so should i also be DBing right now? i feel that's important to add to my horrible and confusing stich...?

Yes you should be DB'ing

Trust the Process.

As Mr. Bond says read the books.

Are you thinking that something magical is going to turn this around?

[Angels]

anyone have advise for the above? Im really afraid that there is a potential we are both GAL'ing right now and its putting a further wedge between is. I kind of did that before without knowing it, and when she pushed more, i was stupid and oblivious... i feel she is doing it to me, so should i also be DBing right now? i feel that's important to add to my horrible and confusing stich...?

Yes you should be DB'ing

Trust the Process.

As Mr. Bond says read the books.

Are you thinking that something magical is going to turn this around?

OK, i am continuing to apply the DB's. in my post on the last page, i just wanted to share that because part of me thinks i did this, it worked and i was too stupid to see that and missed the chance. Now she is doing it and obviously entranced in the A. Thanks for being honest though, that's why i joined here, i want to save my M and i need people to help and tell me if im delusional over thinking or just wrong...

can you please look at my other post about the intimacy question? i am not sure how to handle that...

also the fact she is basically mocking my 'stupidity' of not knowing about the A and believing she is getting away with it. Any advice to look past this? isn't that being a doormat? Im not arguing, im just trying to wrap my head around this and what to do. Obviously i know im not able to rationalize completely with my actions but im making sure i think everything though and do not speak when im upset...

[Matt777]

Let's start here:
Why do you WANT to be intimate with her while you know she's in an A?

[LisaB]

also the fact she is basically mocking my 'stupidity' of not knowing about the A and believing she is getting away with it. Any advice to look past this? isn't that being a doormat? Im not arguing, im just trying to wrap my head around this and what to do. Obviously i know im not able to rationalize completely with my actions but im making sure i think everything though and do not speak when im upset...

Hey Angels, Sorry you are in this crap situation.

That part about mocking your stupidity really made me feel badly for you. Because I know exactly what you mean and how awful that is. In fact it is one of the worst parts of the affair to me, the fact that they think they tricked me.

I know how awful it is but maybe think of it this way. You are NOT stupid. They think they tricked you and you don't know. But you do. So who's stupid now? ha.

You don't need to confront her and tell her you know and that you are not stupid. At this point the smart thing for you to do is focus on yourself.

As some others said, right now is not the time to confront her. She is in the deep fog of the affair. She doesn't give a rat's arse about you. It doesn't matter how much you try to guilt her or reason with her. It won't work.

Take steps to protect yourself and focus on you.

Good luck!

[Angels]

Let's start here:
Why do you WANT to be intimate with her while you know she's in an A?

Because as i felt her going away from me, this was an area that was never an issue for us, even when we would fight we would connect intimately. Even while she was basically GAL or ignoring me, this intimacy kept me going, and gave me the strength to keep DBing myself and live with the nagging and pure hurtfulness or hatred she is pushing on me. This lack of intimacy is new and only the last month which is exactly the timeline i know now when she turned physical. However, since im the only one that knows this, im conflicted if it helps her ease her guilt, so by sleeping with me, im kind of enabling her to continue the A? Is this a correct mindset?

my question though, since lack of affection was a big issues she identified before (stuff other then sex), wouldn't rejecting to sleep with her (without saying the reason), basically just push her away faster to the OM? Why would she have any reason stop then? Again, im just trying to learn the methodology behind what im trying to do?

i think ive posted to much in the last 2 pages, perhaps i should let other chime in also. I am sorry for the long posts, being a fast typer and a racing mind has many cons

[sandi2]

1. I do not want her to leave, i love my wife, i have made that known and want to work on things. I just read other place if the A is still ongoing, there can be no improvement to the M until that stops. I do not want her to leave, and you are probably right, i would have even more pain because at least when she is here, i know where she is so my mind can calm down and not be dreading.

I understand. I agree that the A needs to end. I was responding to your question about having her to leave. Make sure you know what it is that you want, before jumping off the ledge.

i am able to control my emotions, i do have moments and fall apart when im alone, which i thought was healthy

?

Sure, as long as it's not in front of her, or she can hear you.

you are correct about my 'fear', i would be lying if i said i am not terrified of everything happening right now. i saw in your other 'newbie' thread and i def match the part of how i feel very 'i cant do anything right', or the 'damned if you do, damned if you dont'. Its like when she wants to leave to go home and i now know where she is going, should i stop her or just let her go, knowing where she is going? following the DB approach, i should just let her go... but how can that be rationalized and not considered enabling?

There may be times you will think you can't do anything right here, too. It's b/c there are so many threads and we get to posting in shorter clip note versions. Can't cover everything in a post or two, and sometimes we forget to say what you did right. But we do have some who are gifted in that area.

I think you were referring to not doing anything right with your WW, and that's very true. To her, you are what's wrong in her life and she's not wanting to see the good parts. She will resist it with all her might. That's why talking about good memories, showing pictures, or another person praising you will set off her anger. So, forget about doing something right in her viewpoint. Instead, focus on what you believe to be the "right" thing to do. That includes your values and standards. It includes your personal boundaries.

Okay, about her leaving under the guise of seeing her foks. Here is my question........what could you do to stop her from leaving? If she knows you know about her meeting OM, then you can refuse to finance the trip in any way, but otherwise, what could you do? Just be prepared for her to play you up as the bad guy to her parents (b/c she will lie to them).

My advice is to not place any focus on those trips. Don't ask her questions, b/c that gives it attention and focus. Don't show that you are upset. Don't say anything about her contacting you when she gets there or calling the kids every night, etc. And never contact her if it's not a matter of life & death. No guilt messages, no trick questions, etc. You set her free to make her own choices. You focus on what it means to DB detach and GAL. This is very key for the LBS.

I have noticed if im quite, like last night after i saw the true evidence of the A, she does act very nice and start talking and questioning like "is everything ok" or why are you just staring at the tv and not talking, or you didn't come see me when i came in the door (last night). She almost looks upset when i do this and i can see the concern grow, so is that why i need to keep trying to force from her? make that feeling of her grow more? or is that also just a game and it basically means nothing...

Right now, she may be a little on edge and watching you for signs that you know about the A. She sees you being too quite and not paying her attention, so her alarm bell sounds off. If she's upset, I assure you it's not b/c she is concerned about how you feel........but she wants everything to continue on as it has, with her secret A and her H never the wiser.

There have been many women who continue this scenario even after the A is out in the open. As if to say, "What's wrong, why aren't you happy"? . Crazy! Shows how removed they are from reality.

She is currently getting groceries, getting dinner and renting a movie for us. Even with the A she still acts so normal with day to day stuff, im so confused how she can do this...?

But you see, that's what she does to throw you off track about her secret. She knows the minute she stops with the normal routine of the day, you are going to suspect something. This is one of the reasons a H can be so deceived by a WW. He trusts her and doesn't see anything he can't cover with an excuse for her. Eventually, she gets more careless as her H seems to turn a b,ind eye, and that's usually when she hangs herself.

That is why I wanted you to get more DB and information under your belt before you decide to make any big steps. These things need to be thought out......beyond simply confronting her. You need to think what you will say if she says she wants to D you and M OM....or she flatly dismisses it, or she insists you move out. You have to have a p,an beyond simply letting her know that you are aware of her A. And btw, never reveal everything you know.......or the source. The first thing she would want to know is how you found out.

[NDY]

There have been many women who continue this scenario even after the A is out in the open. As if to say, "What's wrong, why aren't you happy"? smirk. Crazy! Shows how removed they are from reality.

This is my life.

[Angels]

Thanks Sandi for helping me understand what is happening inside her head right now. I understand what your saying, and why she is being so resentful now. I'm trying to act normal, but obviously it is so hard to be 'happy' when we do so much together, even now...

This also happens when her BFF (my old mutual friend who was 'helping' until i found out she was actually not helping but just making us both happen and actually supporting my wife to be 'happy', 'you only live once' and have the A). She has a TON of influence on my wife and they are so close i thought as first they had something going on to be honest. Since me and her BFF's fallout which my wife knows about, she will now also call me out or ask "why don't you smile, or joke with me anymore when she comes over, of course in front of my wife). Since i know she helps plan this, and cover or lie to my face previously, it has put me in a extremely hard spot of playing 'nice'.

[Vanilla]

Angels

Jim has a word for that type of friend Poisonous Friend PF. I like that because a BFF wouldn't encourage WW away from her M and into an A. Don't pick up the poison cup and drink, avoid contact if you can; pleasantries as you would with the work gossip.

Please stop mind reading WW. It would help if you accept that an A is an absorbing thing whilst in its first stages and that WW will do anything to continue to get her hormonal fix. Apparent normality is part of the game that some WW play. Frankly that is good because the covertness means concern at least for their own sitch. I would be more concerned if WW was brazen like say Schermans WW, as in saying "I am in an A, I like it and won't stop." Sneaky stuff implies an issue requiring covertness and possible impediment. Good news. There is also "he is only a friend" strategy too, denial rules.

At this stage although it appears to be awful and hurtful, see WW being absent as a positive thing for your PMA. Have plans for that space solid GAL plans. Take GAL action for you Angels.

In house S is very tough, I managed it for 15 months and it's really hard going, see this short break as a breathing space for you. You are standing for your M and making change. Good for you. When the time is right you will set your boundaries on OM, when you are stronger. I can see baby steps plus you are reading the wise words of Sandi and she is on your team.

Peace and stillness

V