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Dude, I think I am deep, deep, deep in the friend zone. frown


M: 37 H: 36
M: 13 T: 18
D: 7
Bomb: 6/30/14
Separation: 8/11/14

Be strong enough to let go and wise enough to wait for what you deserve.
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As 25years has said to me, several times, "stop that stinkin' thinkin'!"

Reread your recent post noticing all the positives. Friend zone is not where you want to be in the long term, but a) it is a step towards that, and b) certainly better than the "enemy" or "ignore" zone, right?

Stay focused on YOU and the positives.

Your post about how DB has helped you really resonated with me. Everyone here told me when I first got here that DB was for me. And you know what? It has changed my life.

Focusing on what I CAN control, and committing to becoming a better person for ME and my D, has been an amazing benefit to come out of this. That's huge.

Hang in there!


Me 38 H 40
D 3
T 8 M 6
BD 10/2013

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Keep going ss. I have faith in u!!!

Also, hijack alert. Claire.... could u look at my thread :-)


M 35 W 31
D 10
Married 3 years
Together 11
Single since Nov 13
Moved out Dec 13
ILYBNILWY, 'I don't want to be a boring housewife, 'I don't fancy you any more'
OM confirmed Jun 14
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Thanks Claire, bashy. I appreciate the encouragement. Stinking thinking gets me no where. It's clear I'm afraid. Afraid my efforts are going unnoticed and/or being misinterpreted which is an old way of thinking of mine. I used to stop making progress on change because I thought "well he doesn't notice anyway or appreciate how hard this is so who cares?!" but 1) that clearly didn't work, 2) credit for the work only happens in school, this is life and sometimes the RESULTS from the hard work is all you're measured on, I need to put on my big girl panties, 3) *I* am noticing the work and the results and that really matters, 4) he is probably totally noticing but not trusting that they're real and meaningful and substantive and permanent. Whew. No more expecting credit for the work. The work is for ME. ::sigh:: Onward.

I took d out yesterday with friends and we had an insanely good time. H got some alone time to be lazy and that's something he never used to get. Not being resentful while he's chilling on the couch and I'm dealing with a spastic 6 year old is new for me. I was completely in the moment, enjoyed every second and felt no jealousy, resentment or frustration. This is good. I'm not keeping score. Gotta make that habitual!

H and I also spoke this morning on how to advocate for our daughter's education as a team. She's going into second grade but is bored out of her mind. I've been supplementing at home with more advanced work but I'm no teacher. I'm doing the best I can but h and I feel the school could do more. She was recently tested at reading WAY above her grade level and we want the school to better support her with that. This is something I would normally fight alone but h asked me to make an appointment with the principal on a day that he could also attend. I expressed my thoughts and fears (her being bored, that leading to class disruption and behavior problems, the severe lack of challenge, not more work but deeper work for her, etc) and he agrees wholeheartedly. He suggested he take the lead (which I always did) and will allow him to do because he and I are on the same page!! This is HUGE for us and I want to show him that I trust his words and methods by letting him take the lead. What a great feeling! Here's hoping it's a productive conversation and the principal doesn't stalemate us.

Last night h told me he thinks he found an apartment. Hearing that didn't feel good but it didn't send me into a tailspin like it did last week or the week before. Small victories, right? He said it's very local and expensive but that it allows for shorter term leases like 3 or 6 months. I'm taking that as a good sign, that he's not looking for 1 year leases on a condo. Is that me in denial? Maybe he's looking for shorter leases because he's planning to still go through with the d? Ugh. Overthinking. It's hard to not analyze all of this and wonder if the positive signs I'm looking for are actually there or am I making them appear because I'm looking so hard for them. Oy. If I wasn't crazy before, DBing has gotten me there, but I'm still grateful.

One day at a time. ::sigh::


M: 37 H: 36
M: 13 T: 18
D: 7
Bomb: 6/30/14
Separation: 8/11/14

Be strong enough to let go and wise enough to wait for what you deserve.
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I could really use some feedback here.

It think I'm doing a fair job of following Sandi's rules and being a woman anyone would be a fool to leave. H and I have gotten along wonderfully lately and that feels great. I guess I just keep doing what I'm doing?

He'll be moving out soon. Today we talked about what furniture he plans to take with him and where he'll find a bed for d. He did say he was preferring to rent this one place that already had a washer/dryer and fridge because he'd hate to spend big money on appliances if he could be back after 3-6 months. We talked about what we'd tell d, too, and maybe I paid too much attention but what he wants to say now is completely different than what he wanted to say 1-2 weeks ago.

I'm scared because I've made some changes and I know he notices but doesn't trust them or their longevity, I get that, but I feel like it's not going to get much better, you know? My outward behavior is significantly different and I've noticed his has changed significantly too. He is MUCH less negative (though I wouldn't say he's positive), he's listening more, respectful, and hilarious (he's always been hilarious though). I guess it comes down to my changes radiating so he can see that they're real and not lip service and in the mean time I'll dig deeper, do more 180s, GAL and try super hard to be more patient through this separation transition.

Am I on the right track here? I need some reassurance. I'm not needy with h but apparently I'm needy with your feedback. Gah!


M: 37 H: 36
M: 13 T: 18
D: 7
Bomb: 6/30/14
Separation: 8/11/14

Be strong enough to let go and wise enough to wait for what you deserve.
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Right now if he is acting that way towards you, then keep going with what you are doing. Im telling you from experience that my W was saying things along the same lines, making plans for the future that didnt include me. The best thing you can do is put on your happy face, even offer some minor suggestions on things that he is doing. Its good that he is leaving the door open, the 3-6 months comment. Dont overreact to that though, just brush it off. You are calm and cool and youre planning on living without him right now.

He notices your changes Im sure. Dont worry about that feeling that it isnt going to get any better. The more you stay consistent with the changes, the more he will be able to trust them. Just continue on with them. If he is making some noticeable changes also then it is possible that those are driven by your changes that he sees. You know the answer to all of this, but I think you just wanted some reassurances. Youre doing it right, keep going!


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S: 5/28/14
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All i can say is that I've been at it for 9 months. My H still (usually) wears his ring, at least in front of me, we are still married on Fb, all our finances are still joint.

Not one word about a possible reconciliation, but moving pretty slowly towards D. I will take that as a positive.

It is a marathon, not a sprint. Maybe an iron man marathon, in some cases!


Me 38 H 40
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T 8 M 6
BD 10/2013

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Originally Posted By: ss06
I could really use some feedback here.

It think I'm doing a fair job of following Sandi's rules and being a woman anyone would be a fool to leave. H and I have gotten along wonderfully lately and that feels great. I guess I just keep doing what I'm doing?


The alternative is to do what, go back to what we know does NOT work?

Think about the implication of your question. Either you want to quit now b/c it's too hard, or---what I fear you are asking is--

"when can I ask/push him to come home? When can I make him do what I want him to do?"

And the answer to that is "YOU don't".

You let him come to you when HE trusts that your changes are real, and permanent AND when he feels he can retrieve his feelings for you....

you have ALMOST no control over that...I say "almost" b/c we do know ways you can wreck your chances...don't we?

So the short answer is you do not push for more -- and you keep doing what is working,

which is being kind and NOT criticizing him and being in the moment too, not maneuvering to get your way or trying to control the outcome, not forcing him to parent the way you parent, or to order what you'd order,

and letting him be a father, not an accessory to the mother.

So, You Stay the course. Make sense?



He'll be moving out soon. Today we talked about what furniture he plans to take with him and where he'll find a bed for d. He did say he was preferring to rent this one place that already had a washer/dryer and fridge because he'd hate to spend big money on appliances if he could be back after 3-6 months. We talked about what we'd tell d, too, and maybe I paid too much attention but what he wants to say now is completely different than what he wanted to say 1-2 weeks ago.

I'm scared because I've made some changes and I know he notices but doesn't trust them or their longevity, I get that, but I feel like it's not going to get much better, you know? My outward behavior is significantly different and I've noticed his has changed significantly too.

And so, you think with TIME it won't make any difference? You think a week or two of decent behavior is enough to know what he'll want? I do not agree.
Remember the 'math' of it? Do the math...

consistent change + sufficient time = change HE can believe in....


Keep on with the changes. In TIME you'll see if his heart softens but it will take TIME. A general "rule" (which means it'[s a ball park IDEA of time) is that about a month of new contrasting behavior is needed, to counter every year of mistreatment you had.

So if you were married for 10 years and treated him poorly the whole time, that means you don't even bother looking for a softened manner in him, for 10 months...a month for every year, of behavior that you want to "un-do".

This means you must be as patient as you have ever been, and THEN, you must multiply your patience by 1064 times...and then maybe you'll be patient enough.

Okay? I hope things keep solidifying and improving. IT's not a linear process, so remember that too.


He is MUCH less negative (though I wouldn't say he's positive), he's listening more, respectful, and hilarious (he's always been hilarious though).

Wow, this is great...but notice, notice....You begin well with the observations but then, Note the negative caveats above^^...

you can just say "he's less negative" or "he's more positive"

rather than Though I wouldn't say he[s positive"...do you see that? And he's hilarious does not need to be followed by a comment that says "though he was already hilarious"....See, you are lessening/negating the praise even as you give it.


So, just be MINDFUL of that little stuff -b/c it adds up to big stuff.

The term "mindfulness" is very in vogue lately. I think it's a great word.

To me, Being "mindful" helps us live life with more clarity and intention

, not just falling over factors, ('in love'), or into a new life or job or home or relationship, but to live on an intentional course we lay out for ourselves and follow.

That's how we need to live. Now you are more mindful of being in the moment, feeling some JOY- and that's huge.

You could really pull this off if you can stay the course.


I guess it comes down to my changes radiating so he can see that they're real and not lip service

Yes absolutely AND also b/c you are showing him, you are modeling for him, some

"TO DO" beliefs, some GOOD positive attitudes and behaviors...and he may be starting to trust that you are really changing.

But it'[s SO EARLY right now that I would not trust HIM - Changing his mind on anything at this point.

If he said "Oh, you have changed w and now I'm fine and will stay"---

I would NOT trust ^^that!
I would know he just caved in from fear, and would leave home again, soon...as soon as the next conflict comes. And you will have conflict...

He cannot change back that fast, and mean it.

So don't rush him b/c of your fears, or you will do that at your own peril.

Get yourself some conflict resolution skills and new tools for communication ASAP. And

Let HIM take his time, let him have the space and distance to SEE who you are becoming and what he'll be missing...

so you can both be sure of what you are doing. D

o not rush this or he'll bolt, and then it'll be a lot more likely to be over.



and in the mean time I'll dig deeper, do more 180s, GAL and try super hard to be more patient through this separation transition.

Are you seeing a good solution based Therapist? You need to, and you need some conflict resolution skills. Those are big items but without them, no marriage will last, let alone with your history.

You need new positive role models for you to handle so when you next feel stress you do not revert to your old ways IT's one thing to know what NOT to do, but in times of crisis it's so easy to revert, you must get replacement models for what TO DO in crisis or stress. What do healthy happy people do when they are furious?

Things like that are key for you to get while you are calm and relatively happy.

Am I on the right track here? I need some reassurance. I'm not needy with h but apparently I'm needy with your feedback. Gah!


You are on the right track and surely you know it. grin


But stay the course. Your option would be, what, to ruin things by demanding more? You wanted to say "hey, I changed for a whole week.So forget the past 5 years and STAY NOW!!"

I mean, is that what you'd propose? I thought not...so stay the course and get those tools while you have this gift of time.

And detach. BTW, How are your GAL?

We hammer them b/c they work and you need to focus on something and someone OTHER than your h and marriage.

Later on I'll post some GAL that helped me and they were NOT easy but they sure paid off.

make sense?


M: 57 H: 60
M: 35 yrs
S30,D28,D19
H off to Alaska 2006
Recon 7/07- 8/08
*2016*
X = "ALASKA 2.0"
GROUND HOG DAY
I File D 10/16
OW
DIV 2/26/2018
X marries OW 5/2016

= CLOSURE 4 ME
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In the time between Clair and you posted, 25, I went and did some serious thinking. Patience. Patience is a big weak spot with me. You knew that long before I did, huh? Well, I'm figuring that out. I'm good at one day at a time as long as I don't have to do it for too long. Lol. Big realization. The fact is, I could use patience in every aspect of my life right now and long into perpetuity. I'm waiting to hear about 8 jobs I've submitted my resume on, bring on the patience. My daughter, bring on the patience. This separation, bring on patience. Myself, patience. Other relationships, patience. I need it and this is the opportunity to learn how to get it.

Detaching is tough. I have a habit of going cold upon detachment. I need to learn to lovingly detach. Any advice in that department? I'm GAL but admittedly it's not enough. I made a list tonight of things to look into (calligraphy classes, to teach a photography class and photo editing class, cooking classes, book club, maybe a mommy and me book club,). Most of my friends are mothers so getting out is hard for them. I get to yoga about twice a week but I need to take more evening classes instead of h seeing me sit on the couch on my iPad while I'm on divorcebusting.com (he doesn't see the screen but still). I'm going to visit my BFF in SF next week. She just had her first baby and I'm photographing the baby and family so that week away will be some good GAL. What else? I'm sitting at home and reading too much. I'd LOVE to hear your suggestions for GAL. I need all the help in that department I can get.

Patience. Detaching with love. That's what I'm working on. As always 25, I appreciate you dropping by. You help keep me calm and on my path. I need to learn how to do that myself. Again, patience.


M: 37 H: 36
M: 13 T: 18
D: 7
Bomb: 6/30/14
Separation: 8/11/14

Be strong enough to let go and wise enough to wait for what you deserve.
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hi ss06, I've just read your thread, and though I don't have much to add, I see a lot of similarities of myself in you, and I'm learning too that one of my biggest lessons in this journey is patience, I'm terrible at it, but getting better each day, and stopping the negative self talk, if I let that nasty negative voice take over, it throws me for a loop.

you're doing great and we're all here for you, big hugs, and also 25mlc is awesome!! smile

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