melissa, continued . . .

[Brian in Hville]

The difference is that anger Wonka. He has already shown he will put the kids in the middle to get his way. Once the emotions are gone, then 50/50 should be discussed.

[Wonka]

M,

The reason for not having 50/50 parenting time NOW, is because it is a major disruption for the kids, and can be very stressful for them. I am saying this not just based on my Mom instincts, but on my discussions with child psychologists, my own C, and my L. When my kids start to see a C as well, her opinion will of course be paramount.

That makes sense. Just make sure not to prolong this indefinitely. I am wondering if this has been communicated with H in some shape, manner, and form. As you know, he's been agitating for this and may not have heard your reasons here. Has he?

Kids are not an asset to be divided. They are people who have feelings, and neither my nor my H's desires or feelings are relevant at all. What is relevant is making sure that the kids are happy, healthy and well adjusted.

Absolutely bang on here. Yet we do need to face the reality that the kids will be splitting their time with you and Dad. That is what a D does to families...unfortunately so.

Not at all. I want my kids to have a good R with their Dad. It is very important to me

What can YOU do to facilitate this? What you can do is your own part and the rest is up to H.

Yep. And I don't say a word about the way my H parents them when it is his time with the kids.

And I am sure you've done your share of eye rolling at some of H's parenting style. Tough to bite your tongue here, isn't it?

I have delved very deeply and I know that I am doing what is right for my kids. It is not a selfish endeavor on my part. I am very comfortable with this.

Sounds like you've weighed this carefully and thought through some posters' questions here. Ok. It's on! Be prepared for some real tough battles going forward...I don't think H will be letting this one go easy.

Have you communicated your desires to your L? I mean the not "now" 50/50. Ask her, in addition to the child psychologist, how this can be handled from a legal standpoint of view?

[Wonka]

The difference is that anger Wonka. He has already shown he will put the kids in the middle to get his way. Once the emotions are gone, then 50/50 should be discussed.

Anger or not...still their Dad.

[melissag]

As you would agree, all of my questions are to nudge M into digging deeper and delving into her thought patterns. These questions are valid and reasonable to bring up here. You cannot ignore the fact that H is their Dad even if he is being a dickwad.

The one thing we all agree here is that H is being a "dickwad" to borrow from one of Bets' gems. That doesn't change the fact that he is the childrens' father. Not one iota.

I'm with you on this, Wonka. He is their Dad. Honestly, I don't give a sh!t about whether he needs them or wants them or is entitled to them. But I do give a sh!t (a lot of sh!ts actually) about my kids. I would NOT keep them from their Dad, no matter how much of a dickwad he is to me.

Just so you all know, right now, my H has the kids overnight twice a week, and sees them two other nights a week for TKD. He could see them the third night of TKD, but chose to quit coming to that night of TKD because he wanted to sign up for a rowing class at his gym instead. Also, when he asks for extra time with them (like last weekend), I almost always say yes. And, when he has asked to take them out of town to see family or whatever, I have always said yes.
I have already offered to give them an extra overnight with H every other week, which I think will be good for them. I am hardly keeping my kids from their Dad.

Yes, it is uncomfortable to ask difficult questions here and I am not about to handle M with kid gloves just because I am firmly on her side. I am all the way.

I appreciate the difficult questions. These, I know in my heart I have already answered.

And thank you for being on my side!

[melissag]

Thanks for the lively discussion this morning, you guys!

Here's what I would love some practical advice on.

I don't want my H to think that I am trying to bully him or take his kids or whatever. And I would like to be able to agree to do what is in the best interest of the kids, and to talk about that with him. I would like to have a rational discussion with him.

That said, I think the odds of that happening on our own are nil. He can't even write a "nice" email without blame and assumptions and false accusations.

Thus far, what that means is that I ignore him. I am not convinced this is best.

The only thing I can think of to do, is agree to talk with him with some ground rules and a referee (i.e,. counselor of some sort).

What do you guys think? Should I try to do this? I am not convinced that he is capable of this convo even with a C there, but I am willing to try. Or am I just setting myself up for more agony?

[melissag]

I fully believe she has the best interest of her kids at heart, not what is in the best interest of herself. And her ex has only proved to have the best interest of himself at hand.

Thanks, Gineen. This is exactly where things are.

No, my H may not pose a physical threat to the kids. But, if we do end up getting a CFI or PRE, they will care about whether my H is putting the kids above himself. They will look at the broken promises he makes to the kids, the fact that he had the D convo with the kids alone after a child psych told us not to and after we agreed to have it together, the fact that he doesn't show up to things like TKD when they are expecting him to, that he chose a swank two bedroom apartment in a high rise downtown, etc. That stuff does matter.

[quoteI think 50/50 right off the bat is not a good idea, but she should plan for it to happen within a year over a gradual transition if ex can handle it and it's best for the kids.[/quote]

This is where my thinking is right now. But i am not putting a timeline on any of it. I am willing to agree to the next few months and let's see what happens. Right now, I don't know whether my H can handle 50/50, or whether it's best for the kids. We will see.

[Wonka]

M,

As you can tell, you are WAY too much fun that I'm ignoring my stomach bug to post here today. [can you tell that I'm not actively working here]

If I were you, I wouldn't talk with H based on his past track record in spewing, twisting, and what not at you.

I'd approach the L about the legal aspect and try to set up a family counseling with the psychologist. Get all of your ducks in a row FIRST before they are presented to H.

The most ideal way would be for the child psychologist to open up the first session in addressing co-parenting between the pair of you. If I recall correctly, Bets had something similar set up for her family and it was when Mr. Wonderful begun to see the effects of HIS choice. Then Mr. Wonderful stepped up the place as a Dad. We can only hope that your H does the same.

Only one way to find out...call the child psychologist for her input.

I'm sure Bets, Bug, and 25 will all chime in for some additional suggestions in due course. I'm gonna bow out of this one and let the vets with kids guide you here.

[Wonka]

And Gineen too! She's been wonderful in chiming in too...

[labug]

Thanks for the lively discussion this morning, you guys!

Here's what I would love some practical advice on.

I don't want my H to think that I am trying to bully him or take his kids or whatever. And I would like to be able to agree to do what is in the best interest of the kids, and to talk about that with him. I would like to have a rational discussion with him.

That said, I think the odds of that happening on our own are nil. He can't even write a "nice" email without blame and assumptions and false accusations.

Thus far, what that means is that I ignore him. I am not convinced this is best.

The only thing I can think of to do, is agree to talk with him with some ground rules and a referee (i.e,. counselor of some sort).

What do you guys think? Should I try to do this? I am not convinced that he is capable of this convo even with a C there, but I am willing to try. Or am I just setting myself up for more agony?

I already weighed in on this but I think it got lost in the other posts.

Yes, you should not just try, you should make it happen.

I am not convinced that he is capable of this convo even with a C there, drop that expectation, go in open and with the intent to do a lot of listening. If you both go in stony-faced and unmoveable you can bet nothing will happen. Please note, I am not saying you give anything up, just listen openly.

If he can't hold his temper or attempts to manipulate, a good C who deals with this on a daily basis will see right through that and it will be in the report.

Don't expect a lot of movement without several meetings. More precisely, expect nothing.

Be a new Melissa he's never seen.

[3boymom]

M - I fully believe that you have the best interest of your kids at heart. You have taken the time to sit down with your kids and actually ask them what they would like and how they feel about the situation. You have contacted a child psychologist to ensure that you are acting in the best interest of your children and to make sure that their emotional needs are met.

The thing that makes me suspicious of your H's intentions is the timing of when his demands changed. Up until the time that you filed for S, he was not requesting 50/50. Maybe your H is a changed man and really is willing to sacrifice his work and lifestyle to have the kids 50/50, but I think that he needs to show that over time.

I think that it would be really helpful if all four of you could meet with the child psychologist/counselor. If you can get a third party involved who does not have a vested interest, maybe your H will listen and come up with a realistic plan.