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Doc,
Yes, my W and I are still dancing. It's not perfect, and we do fuss a lot, and my W doesn't always validate my efforts, but the positives outweigh the negatives. We're going on over two years with our current ballroom studio.

CL


CL 53 W 54
M 20 yrs.
03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL
10-14' Piecing

"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."

----Tao Te Ching
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I get plenty of practice with self-validated intimacy--holding onto myself when my W is not validating me for whatever reason (lack of sleep, anxiety, something else). She didn't get up in time for class on Friday, so was complaining that I once again haven't been a good enough dance partner over the years (failure to retain moves, failure to practice enough, and so on). I chose to attend the lesson by myself, for my own benefit. She came late and wasn't herself for most of the evening. Her sleep schedule is inconsistent. I tolerated my dances with my W, who picked at me for any flaw she could find. I danced with a lot of women, who validated my skills. I was considering possibly suggesting to her that we not renew for another year with the studio if she's that unhappy with our progress. I'll cross that bridge when I come to it. I'll need to remember that what's important to me is also a part of that decision.

I'm trying hard not to get overly worked up when she's irritable, not validating, or provocative. I'm not immune to it, but I'm getting better. I also try to realize there's more going on that's beyond me, so try not to take it personally.

I keep thinking about how the author of Passionate Marriage states that intimacy is not always comfortable.

CL


CL 53 W 54
M 20 yrs.
03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL
10-14' Piecing

"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."

----Tao Te Ching
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CL,

Just remember, that "holding onto oneself" and "self-validating" doesn't mean "no boundary-setting." You need to mix your self-validation and self-soothing with an occasional reminder to your wife that you're not going to put up with her CB (crap behavior), in my opinion.


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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Originally Posted By: Starsky309


Just remember, that "holding onto oneself" and "self-validating" doesn't mean "no boundary-setting." You need to mix your self-validation and self-soothing with an occasional reminder to your wife that you're not going to put up with her CB (crap behavior), in my opinion.


Starsky


I think self-validation is boundary-setting, because you're speaking-up and holding onto what's important to you, respectfully reminding my W of that, and then behaving consistently with that. I chose to attend the lesson without my W, because I didn't want to miss the opportunity to miss new moves, because she failed to get up on time. She was running late, was taking it out on me. I chose not to stay and participate. I had a great time, and she had to drive herself. My fear with a confrontive approach, is that it will escalate a situation, not get the result I'm looking for, and put her focus on me.

Last night, when our teachers cancelled our dance party, I spoke up and told her I was not interested in going for another late evening of dancing. There was a 10PM dance she was proposing. We were out till 1AM the night before at two venues. She and I took a day trip downtown to a local food market, and had a great time eating ethnic food, and buying some items for home. It lifts her spirits to eat well and have food at home to eat and cook. I suggested we cook some of the items, instead of going out. We had a nice evening together. I think the food market trip will become something regular, as it gets us out of our routines, and allows us to nurture our budding interest in cooking. I think need we to diversify activities beyond dancing, which can become a chore with lessons and practice.

CL


CL 53 W 54
M 20 yrs.
03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL
10-14' Piecing

"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."

----Tao Te Ching
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,778
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I continue to practice the concepts from "The Passionate Marriage." It's about learning to be close to someone while holdling onto oneself. It points out how my means of soothing myself was to maintain distance, and we know the problems that causes in a M. I've begun breaking that longstanding pattern. We seem to be getting along for the most part.

The next step is "Hugging While Relaxed." I'm not a hugger in general and probably hold a hug for about a second with people. He recommends increasing the duration of hugs with one's spouse and others. This will pave the way for improved sex.

I've resumed church attendance this year. I've been exploring Christian spirituality. I consider seeking God as helping me to aspire to be the finest version of who I can be on a daily basis.

My W and I have been visiting the downtown farmer's market weekly, which has improved both of our moods. My W cooks more often, and the refrigerator is more often filled with an array of food.

CL


CL 53 W 54
M 20 yrs.
03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL
10-14' Piecing

"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."

----Tao Te Ching
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
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Good to hear from you, CL, and get an update on how you're applying the PM concepts. Try to post more often!


Starsky


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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The theme of my W's feedback during conflict is that I don't give enough praise, and that I'm too fussy and critical. She gets frustrated cooking for me because I'm too honest about what I think, or look for what I don't like and don't appreciate the person who did the cooking. She threatens to quit cooking for me.

I'm also trying to hold onto myself with our dancing conflict. I prefer ballroom and she prefers salsa. They are two different dance communities. The ballroom community is more couple oriented and the men are less skilled. The salsa community is more open to mixing, so my W gets more dances. I think we need both communities to nourish our dance partnership. She threatens to quit ballroom when she has a slow night. I'm applying the concept of "hold onto yourself", doing what I can to keep her happy at the ballroom events, and giving her space to work some of it out on her own, rather than feeling like it's completely my responsibility to solve her problems. A change I've made is to agree to go to late night Salsa venues on the weekends, even after an evening of ballroom dancing.

She has been cooking for me more often, which I think is a good sign that the R is improving. We both have been pushing ourselves more often to get out to constructive activies, even when we're tired or have been fussing, and have been rewarded everytime.

CL


CL 53 W 54
M 20 yrs.
03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL
10-14' Piecing

"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."

----Tao Te Ching
Joined: Apr 2007
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Quote:
The theme of my W's feedback during conflict is that I don't give enough praise

Did we not speak about words of affirmation being one of her love languages? I believe we agreed this is the case and here, she is even telling you as much.

Speak her love language and things will improve.


Me 44 She 46
S13 D9
M18 T23
3 years DB'ing
Successfully busted
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Fussing continues around dancing, yet it seems like we're striving for connection. She got upset with me last night at the ballroom venue, because I wasn't being receptive to her feedback. I admit that I'm not always open to it. She stated that I wasn't treating her well so left the event about an hour into it to get a bite to eat. I chose to "hold onto myself" and stayed to finish the evening. I told her that I needed to stay for a minimum of two hours to get enough instruction, practice and our money's worth. It also keeps her from abruptly ending the evening on a whim and balances her power.

When we got home later that night, she told me that our partnership is more important to her than dancing with other people. I've never heard this before. My impression was that she rated her evenings by the number of dances she got. She wants to be able to give me feedback, and for me to be responsive to that. Now that she's made that clear, it's up to me to figure out how to work with it.

I've told her that I have to practice ballroom dancing at least weekly, otherwise it's a waste of time and money to take lessons. She can make whatever arrangements she wants to make that evening work for her (separate cars, take a night off). I go to Salsa venues two nights per week with her. I'm starting to reconnect with that communiity, and improve my Salsa. I want to maintain a balance between Salsa and ballroom, and it's only going to happen if I take the lead.

CL


CL 53 W 54
M 20 yrs.
03'-09' Separation + Old Patterns + GAL
10-14' Piecing

"The Master allows things to happen. She shapes events as they come."

----Tao Te Ching
Joined: Oct 2010
Posts: 6,810
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Originally Posted By: Concerned_Listener
Fussing continues around dancing, yet it seems like we're striving for connection. She got upset with me last night at the ballroom venue, because I wasn't being receptive to her feedback. I admit that I'm not always open to it. She stated that I wasn't treating her well so left the event about an hour into it to get a bite to eat. I chose to "hold onto myself" and stayed to finish the evening. I told her that I needed to stay for a minimum of two hours to get enough instruction, practice and our money's worth. It also keeps her from abruptly ending the evening on a whim and balances her power.

When we got home later that night, she told me that our partnership is more important to her than dancing with other people. I've never heard this before. My impression was that she rated her evenings by the number of dances she got. She wants to be able to give me feedback, and for me to be responsive to that. Now that she's made that clear, it's up to me to figure out how to work with it.

I've told her that I have to practice ballroom dancing at least weekly, otherwise it's a waste of time and money to take lessons. She can make whatever arrangements she wants to make that evening work for her (separate cars, take a night off). I go to Salsa venues two nights per week with her. I'm starting to reconnect with that communiity, and improve my Salsa. I want to maintain a balance between Salsa and ballroom, and it's only going to happen if I take the lead.

CL


CL, this is just about the strongest post I've ever read from you. Kind (but firm) boundary-setting, living your own life and not allowing your wife's "fussiness" to ruin your evening and sidetrack your goals, yet maintain good communication with her without "eggshell walking."

Nicely done, sir!!! whistle


Starsky

P.S. I bet she found the way you handled the evening very attractive.


M57 W 57; D30 D28 S24 S20 GD7 GD2 GD1 GD5m GD1m
BD 5/07; W's affair 5/07-8/07

At the end of every hard-earned day, people gotta find some reason to believe. (Bruce Springsteen)
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