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Originally Posted By: pinhead
I'm getting nothing I need out of this relationship...


And go back to the paragraph you wrote before this, read, think, re-read, and re-think.


Me 35/XW 33
S13 & S12
M: 10/17/98
OM & S: 07/08
D final 06/09/09
12/03/09 - 06/13/10 "Piercing"
06/13/10: Engaged to Re-marry 10/17/10
06/25/10: Expecting baby #3 2/14/11
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I understand that, but this isn't an isolated event where she shuts down. It's the story of our marriage, and breaking out of this pattern doesn't seem to be something we can get past right now.

It's as if she's putting in the minimum effort required to keep things from getting out of control.

Patience patience patience...

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Yes, patience is key.

I'm not overly familiar with your situation, however, there are only but a few reasons that all of us got here in the first place.

In reading that one post, I get the impression your W is wanting more of the family man type from you?

If this is true, and it's not being done, then yah, her response effort won't be as hig either.

Another thing I notice here, not only is patience ever so important, but having expectations is the root of all failure in this 'business'.


Me 35/XW 33
S13 & S12
M: 10/17/98
OM & S: 07/08
D final 06/09/09
12/03/09 - 06/13/10 "Piercing"
06/13/10: Engaged to Re-marry 10/17/10
06/25/10: Expecting baby #3 2/14/11
Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 2,246
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Oh, I'm Mr. Mom with our daughters. I'm probably more involved with them than W is. I get them up and dressed, feed them breakfast, then drop them off at school. W picks them up, and when I get home, I usually cook dinner for the family. I do most of the shopping, laundry, etc. Plus any chores/repairs around the house.

I know expectations are dangerous, but so is just stumbling along. Life is short.

It's as if she's fine with me as long as there's no deep emotional talks etc, or physical affection involved. Then she can't handle it.

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Originally Posted By: pinhead
I understand that, but this isn't an isolated event where she shuts down. It's the story of our marriage, and breaking out of this pattern doesn't seem to be something we can get past right now.

Pinhead, I don't know about a lot of things like affairs and stuff, but I do know about shut-down and distance. That was all my marriage & relationship was for years (M-13; T-18) So I know - it's insulting and hurtful and takes a lot of really hard work to change your roll in those communication patterns like you just had. I'm going to babble here... sorry, but this is so important. You guys are just starting to break through ... don't give up!!! Okay, so patterns... what have I learned about patterns...

Tell me - what pattern did you see in this:

Originally Posted By: pinhead
Turns out that she was upset that while she was gone, I didn't tell her much about what the girls were doing. She called every night to say goodnight, but I didn't talk too much; she had gone on the trip to figure out what she wanted in our relationship, so I was trying to give her space.

Here's the pattern I see:

You: I know you had great intentions in not wanting to 'talk too much' and 'give her space'. But I'd bet she felt that come across as you being withdrawn and not wanting to share. Which likely reinforced her position of not sharing what she wanted/needed to hear.

Your W: doesn't sound like she shared with you what she WANTED to hear when she was talking with you. This is pretty typical of women around my age. However, if we don't tell our Hs, they don't know, so they don't share. So her position reinforced you not sharing.

Keep trying pinhead - don't give up. Communication patterns - are just BEHAVIORAL, so CAN be changed. AND you can start changing them by changing your half of it! That's what I've been doing for the last 7 months and it's hard as h&ll but it's slowly working. Have you read any of Harriet Lerner's work? She deals a lot with these communication patterns and how to break out of them. Don't give up pinhead!

PS - by the way, She called YOU. And EVERY night at that. I'd have given my left boob for my H to have called me every night while he was away on week-long trips for most of our M. But your W WANTED to talk with you... every day! Wow! See I look at that and think 'that's progress!' Don't give up NOW! I know I know the DB stuff says to give them space. But I think at this point you have to start reaching through all that. Don't give up pinhead.


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Originally Posted By: pinhead

It's as if she's fine with me as long as there's no deep emotional talks etc, or physical affection involved. Then she can't handle it.

Good god. We've had the same marriage just flipped. Oh pinhead... don't give up...


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Originally Posted By: FindingMyVoice
[quote=pinhead]
PS - by the way, She called YOU. And EVERY night at that. I'd have given my left boob for my H to have called me every night while he was away on week-long trips for most of our M. But your W WANTED to talk with you... every day!


Not really. She wanted to talk to our daughters, and find out from me what our daughters had done during the day.

Then again, if I had talked to her more, I might have found that she wanted to know how I was doing. But she can't just come out and ask me that...

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Originally Posted By: FindingMyVoice
Originally Posted By: pinhead

It's as if she's fine with me as long as there's no deep emotional talks etc, or physical affection involved. Then she can't handle it.

Good god. We've had the same marriage just flipped. Oh pinhead... don't give up...


Her money quote last night was "Why can't we just have a normal conversation?" It's as if she'd just like to pretend nothing is wrong between us. I can't live that way, at least not for long.

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Originally Posted By: pinhead
But she can't just come out and ask me that...

I know I know... it must be really frustrating for you guys. I'm sure my H would have said just the same thing. It took me ages just to learn that I WASN'T asking my H for what I wanted. And then ages again after that to learn HOW to.

I know you think she just wanted to talk to and about your daughters, but I'm very very skeptical. I think she wants to talk to you too, she just doesn't know how because she's as entrenched in those patterns as you are.


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Originally Posted By: pinhead

Her money quote last night was "Why can't we just have a normal conversation?"

What was this in reply to?


I cannot complain for not receiving from others, that which I've never asked them for.
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