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I was the High Desire spouse in my relationsihp with my wife before the affair started... there was conflict on sex as much as in any household from what I can read...

Then later the affair hit, I got a LOT of PERSPECTIVE on marriage VERY QUICKLY...

I am NOT advocating a sexless marriage, I Do understand how painful that can be... But in the context of infidelity or divorce having a committed spouse beside you each night without that horrible feeling of being violated by a predator on a regular basis in your home can't be compared to from my experience.

Let me put it this way ...

As a HD spouse would you be willing to exchange

a. More sex with your partner for
b. An open marriage such that they will be pursuing sex elsewhere as well?

In order to have (a) would any HD person here be willing to offer up (b) as a negotiating item?

I would think most would BALK at the suggestion... This puts things into perspective quite quickly...

If I could have a more fullfilling sex life would I be willing to have an open marriage?

Hell no, I enjoy my companion, my commitment, my partnership MUCH MORE than sex and I am in no way going to do damage to that partnership in order to have a more fullfilling sex life... It's not worth it.

Again I am NOT dismissing negotiation here, but one of the first rules on negotiations is to NOT EXPECT to get what YOU WANT gonig in...

Be prepared to negotiate.. that means to GIVE GROUND such that you can GAIN some...

Explore alternatives, look for hope, opportunity, and consensus from your partner...

Your sex life is important, but your marriage is important too... remember the battleground for the sex life IS your marriage...

Tread LIGHTLY there or face the consequences...

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Allen,

If sex is important to your wife you are doing damage to your marriage if you deny her sex.

I'll leave the issues of an open marriage to others as it just appears to be a straw man argument and I don't have time for that.

The emotional needs of your partner matter in a marriage. And her needs aren't open to negotiation. Her needs just are. The same applies to your needs. You can certainly discuss how the needs get met, but not if the need itself is valid.

Last edited by Esox; 06/04/10 07:31 PM. Reason: Added a bit

I'm a man . . .
But I can change . . .
If I have to . . .
I guess . . .

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Originally Posted By: Esox
Allen,

If sex is important to your wife you are doing damage to your marriage if you deny her sex.

I'll leave the issues of an open marriage to others as it just appears to be a straw man argument and I don't have time for that.

The emotional needs of your partner matter in a marriage. And her needs aren't open to negotiation. Her needs just are. The same applies to your needs. You can certainly discuss how the needs get met, but not if the need itself is valid.


It's not a straw man at all, but more importantly you missed the point - the suggestion of the open marriage negotiation item was to put the need in perspective.

I am not denying my wife anything... you aren't reading these posts very carefully... You have the situations quite mixed up I'm afraid.

And who on earth suggested that anyone declare someone's needs invalid?

Did I mis a post someplace? This is getting way off thread here... I have no idea where you are getting this stuff...

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Take care Allen.


I'm a man . . .
But I can change . . .
If I have to . . .
I guess . . .

The Man's Prayer - Red Green
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Didi,

I have been thinking about your sitch and the fact that there was never any 'spark' there. It suddenly struck me that in that way it is a bit like an arranged M.....but many of those are very successful. Why is that?

Well, mostly I think is because to begin with the two people learn mutual respect for one another, and then out of that comes love and a protective caring feeling for one another.....and eventually passion.

People that go into arranged M's often come from close knit family units....where the family unit is sacreed and comes before anything - I believe that privately a lot of affection is generally shown.

Now most 'western' M's are not like that.

Leaving the A behind, ( apart from to question if you think your H has truly been able to forgive - as it is much easier said than done, don't you think LBSs?), I think the thing that is lacking in your M is mutual respect. It also strikes me that it is hard for your H to respect another person when he seems to have little respect for himself.

He doesn't sound stupid, he must know that he is not 'quite right' in that he isn't able to spontaneously show affection - probably due to his family background. But hey, he is having therapy for this, no?

I learned in my M that it was easy when I was upset to be very negative about my H, and would talk about him that way to my friends....but that in itself breeds more negativity. At one point I made a concerted effort to stop that.....and gradually my attitude changed and I started seeing more of the good things in him.

I would say,(and I DO know you have tried doing this already), be as positive as you can about his therapy. When he will let you , explore his past family issues re upbringing and what has made him the man he is today, (FOO).

Try and look at it as an arranged M and instead of focusing on the fact that there was never a spark there, see if you can make one from bolstering your H's confidence in his abilities.

Personally, I wouldn't look at 'specifics', I think you are letting yourself get ready for being let down that way. I would look at fostering a respectful caring environment, and see what can blossom from that. Mix with other couples that are loving and caring and have strong family units,so that your H can learn what that entails: and hard though it may be, be supportive of your H, even if sometimes you think he is wrong. Let the little things go so that you can work on the big issues.

Does any of this make sense?


Saffie
me 46
H 46
M in 1986
D20,D18,S16,D13
H's A 01/05 to 07/06
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renewed vows 09/06
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Excellent point Saffie... I do get the sense whatami that you are losing respect for your H... Which is a shame...

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^^^^^^^


Saffie
me 46
H 46
M in 1986
D20,D18,S16,D13
H's A 01/05 to 07/06
H recommitted to M 07/06
renewed vows 09/06
Going from strength to strength
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Quote:
That's just it....I don't know if there is anything he CAN do specifically to bring those things out in me....I tend to lean toward the fact that sometimes things just need to be there.


Your thread is striking a deep chord with me.

The above is a problem I am having during our MC sessions, as well. The counselor asked me just today (again) what exactly it is that I want and the answer is (again), "I don't know." I just know what I don't want, but I can't make a list of X,Y,Z that would suddenly make me certain we can recover.

Sex is also a huge issue for us. Well, me. The counselor likes to ask me why, if I want sex, I have a problem initiating. It's not so much a problem initiating... heaven knows I've done plenty of that and been turned down plenty. But even when he doesn't turn me down, it's not fulfilling the need I have to feel desired by my husband. No matter how much he tells me he wants me or enjoys it when we're together, his never bothering to reach out to me for sex does not back that up. And it's not an unexpressed need, there is no ambiguity that this is important to me-- it just isn't to him.

So no list that says "Make love once a week" is going to solve the problem when, at best, I'm a to-do to get checked off to be sure he gets his Good Husband Gold Star for the week. Desiring me is just one of those things that needs to "be there" and isn't.

Sex is just a component, though, it's everything, and I'm quite afraid I'm going to finish MC realizing that this really is just as good as it's ever going to get, even once we get the hurts/conflicts resolved.

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(((Didi)))

Hey darlin', I was just on today and saw this. I'm sorry that its come to this, but it sounds like you are still willing to try and fight.

Saffie I can say that I did the same thing with my H. I would be mad or irritated and then vent to my friends and just created a lot of negativity and resentment towards my H, without him even being aware.

No matter what, a R based on respect and caring with the father of your child can't ever be a bad thing.

((((hugs)))) and prayers.


M:39
H:39
K:S14;D8
T:22yr
M:15yrs
S:12/28/07 EA/PA
3/14/08 OW preg
11/17/08 born
12/12/08 his
~~~~~~~
Never allow someone to be your priority while allowing yourself to be their option


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I'm bumping this back up for me. I haven't been able to think or do what people have suggested so I haven't responded yet. Our 15th anniversary was this week....no cards no nothing from either of us.


M 39
H 39
1 son, 7

Multiple affairs before/during/and after separation, came clean, went to Retrouvaille, forgave each other, Piecing for over a year, same problems exist, back to counseling

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